Gerry Down Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 8 hours ago, Jean Ceulemans said: Is an Argentine bolt action rifle a better assassination weapon does anyone know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Butler Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 The Argentine rifle was a Mauser variant wasn't it and not a Carcano ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Krome Posted November 16, 2023 Author Share Posted November 16, 2023 19 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said: And what about this fellow that Rider says might be associated with Oswald? He brought in an Argentine rifle to have a scope mounted. Presumably an Argentine rifle is not the same as a Carcano. Exactly!! An Argentine Mauser is not a Carcano. Look for shifts in the narrative. Look to why Ryder's repair tag and Whitworth at the furniture store were sidelined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Down Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 All this is interesting. Did Oswald have a second rifle we don't know about? Though if he's taking it to get repaired, it sounds like a rifle in bad condition. Was there something about a bad firing pin on this rifle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Krome Posted November 16, 2023 Author Share Posted November 16, 2023 8 minutes ago, David Butler said: The Argentine rifle was a Mauser variant wasn't it and not a Carcano ? Now we're talking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 8 minutes ago, Gerry Down said: All this is interesting. Did Oswald have a second rifle we don't know about? Though if he's taking it to get repaired, it sounds like a rifle in bad condition. Was there something about a bad firing pin on this rifle? From what I've seen, both the Carcano and the Mauser were taken in to have scopes mounted. (Not that the Carcano was really taken in.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Krome Posted November 16, 2023 Author Share Posted November 16, 2023 Dial Ryder mentions the Argentine rifle both to authorities early in the investigation, and to CBS on Thanksgiving evening 1963 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean Ceulemans Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 (edited) The Ryder story is the cause of a few headaches I have every now and then... In first, Dial Ryder was sure about not having done work on the Italian rifle. But on 11/25/63 het states to the FBI that "he has no recollection of mounting a side mount of the type on the gun used to assassinate President Kennedy but pointed out that during the past few weeks he had attached a tremendous number of scopes; therefore,it is possible he did mount this scope and does not have any recollection of it at this time.. To Liebeler in the Hearing ” Like I continue to say all the way through on their investigation both that Secret Service man and from the FBI that he could have been in the shop I could have talked to him but to say I had definitely I couldn't say I have really talked to him. And so... my headache is back... PS his boss Greener was on vacation and the only other employee was a woman that didn't work on rifles I believe. Just mentioning this because Green has also made some statements in the press, a Hearing, but he wasn't there that day. Greg Doudna has all the references in his essay (FBI statements, hearing, etc ), I find myself using that a lot to find a reference to something about Ryder (the pdf can be saved, later on simply run a search by CTRL+F) Edited November 16, 2023 by Jean Ceulemans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Down Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 (edited) Could Oswald have been in there simply to buy ammunition for the carcano or his pistol? Would there have been any tax reasons for the rifle store, in a situation where LHO bought ammunition rather than repair the rifle, that the store clerks there put down in writing on the receipt that a rifle was repaired rather than tell the truth and that ammunition had actually been bought, so as to make the transaction more favorable to them from a tax point of view? Edited November 16, 2023 by Gerry Down Grammar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Krome Posted November 17, 2023 Author Share Posted November 17, 2023 (edited) Special thanks to David Von Pein for revealing a rifle Ryder mentioned re; the Argentine Mauser hours after the assassination. Video below starts at the correct time; Edited November 17, 2023 by Tony Krome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Von Pein Posted November 17, 2023 Share Posted November 17, 2023 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Tony Krome said: Special thanks to David Von Pein for revealing Ryder's Argentine Mauser hours after the assassination. Tony's post above was then edited 5 minutes later to this revised version.... 37 minutes ago, Tony Krome said: Special thanks to David Von Pein for revealing a rifle Ryder mentioned re; the Argentine Mauser hours after the assassination. And that same 6th-floor assassination weapon was ALSO described (at various times on Nov. 22 and 23) as a German Mauser, a 30-30 rifle, and a Japanese weapon (and possibly even more inaccurate descriptions). They can't ALL be the right description, can they? So if you have a desire to cling to bad information based on the early media errors, then, yes, you can easily "create" your own conspiracy theory. It's easy to do that kind of CT "creating". All you need to do is pick one of these many media mistakes and run with it as if it were the unvarnished 100% truth. But why anybody would want to do something so foolish is beyond me... Edited November 17, 2023 by David Von Pein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Krome Posted November 17, 2023 Author Share Posted November 17, 2023 3 minutes ago, David Von Pein said: They can't ALL be the right description, can they? I matched up one of those descriptions (Argentine) with the name of a rifle (Argentine) that a gunsmith with a "Oswald" repair tag mentioned a few days later. That's all, Dave, I'm sure its all a big mix up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Von Pein Posted November 17, 2023 Share Posted November 17, 2023 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Tony Krome said: I'm sure it's all a big mix up. Indeed, it is. Because.... We know that "Oswald" did not own an "Argentine Mauser". And.... We know that CE139 is not an "Argentine Mauser" either. I'm sure that many CTers, though, think it was merely a case of the Oswald Patsy Framers just being idiots and morons when they decided to plant an ARGENTINE MAUSER at the crime scene, even though those plotters had to know that the Oswald they were framing owned a MANNLICHER-CARCANO. A brilliant strategy indeed. Edited November 17, 2023 by David Von Pein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Cohen Posted November 17, 2023 Share Posted November 17, 2023 1 hour ago, David Von Pein said: Indeed, it is. Because.... We know that "Oswald" did not own an "Argentine Mauser". And.... We know that CE139 is not an "Argentine Mauser" either. I'm sure that many CTers, though, think it was merely a case of the Oswald Patsy Framers just being idiots and morons when they decided to plant an ARGENTINE MAUSER at the crime scene, even though those plotters had to know that the Oswald they were framing owned a MANNLICHER-CARCANO. David, although I often disagree with you on details of this case, I think you raise a very valid point here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Bulman Posted November 17, 2023 Share Posted November 17, 2023 1 hour ago, David Von Pein said: of the Oswald Patsy Framers just being idiots and morons when they decided to plant an ARGENTINE MAUSER at the crime scene, even though those plotters had to know that the Oswald they were framing owned a MANNLICHER-CARCANO. A brilliant strategy indeed. Oswald wasn't framed by conspiracy theorist's. That was done by others. Thus a lone nutter theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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