David Josephs

Point made Thx.

It helps if you can recognize an overt verifiable fact in the first place

Gonna have to disagree with you Steve... The list of stuff taken from 2515 on the 22nd was pretty substantial. How else could DRAIN take so much back to the FBI that night? On the other page I posted mentions the 23rd... Mr. STOVALL. At that time we told her that we wanted to search the house. We explained to her that we did not have a search warrant but if she wanted us to get one we would, and she said, "That won't be necessary"--for us to come right on in, so we went on in the house and started to search out the house, and the part of the house that I searched was the front bedroom where Marina Oswald was staying. There are quite a few items on the list of property I have--I believe you have a copy of it. There are two that were taken out of that bedroom there---a bunch of camera equipment, for one thing.

Agreed Jason.... While you and I reason based on existing information and reasonable theories... Others have no qualms throwing in everything including the kitchen sink trying to find a foothold to support a theory. So far, and on numerous thread, wants us to believe his POV that the KBG was connected at every turn... While it's an intriguing theory... the complete lack of corroboration stalls the discussion to the point where now it's just repetitive and ultimately not very interesting... at least from my vantage point

Jason... not too far off... while would like everything to relate to the KGB... it doesn't. (notice the lack of supporting ANYTHING? for these theories?) the homosexual aspect of this crime is not to be understated... Shaw, Ferrie, Banister(?), Oswald, Ruby, Senator and more... Check the "evaluation". Now we'll get the gay KGB angle from our man of wit and wisdom...

THEY REMOVED THE 30 PLUS FEET PAST Z313 TO THE 3RD SHOT BY MOVING THE ACTUAL Z161 BACK TO Z131 SHANEYFELT REPEATEDLY TALKS OF THE START OF THE SEQUENCE, THE EARLIEST FILM THEY HAVE STARTING AT Z161. AS WE'VE SAID ALL ALONG...NPIC STARTED WITH Z312 AND WORKED BACKWARD AS BEST THEY COULD... THE FRAME NUMBERS HAVE ALWAYS BEEN ARBITRARY SIONCE WE HAVE A SPLICED FILM... AFTER THE 131 OR 161 SPLICE TO REMOVE THOSE 30 FRAMES, WE HAVE NO IDEA ANYMORE THE ACTUAL FRAME NUMBERS

File Name Doc Date To Name From Name Title DOCID-32289285.pdf 05/12/1961 DIRECTOR, FBI LEGAT, ROME 104-10183-10040.pdf 06/08/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE: SMITHAM REF AMWHIP/1 ON 6 AND 7 JUNE 104-10183-10036.pdf 06/21/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE RE: LETTER NOT SENT YET. AMWHIP PLANNING FIRST CONTACT 104-10183-10034.pdf 06/24/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE RE: AMWHIP 1 (IDEN A) LONG TIME KUBARK ASSET FOR PBRUMEN 104-10183-10035.pdf 06/24/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE: IDEN A. IDEN B JOSE VENEGAS CUBAN CITIZEN ALLEGED STUDENT 104-10183-10028.pdf 07/17/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE RE: AFTER TELLING US OF INTENT, AMWHIP/1 TELEPHONED 104-10265-10040.pdf 09/17/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE: JOSE IGNACIO RASCO, FIRST PRESIDENT MOVIMIENTO DEMOCRATA 104-10220-10094.pdf 10/12/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE- CONNECTION GENERAL SUBJECT REF HAVE NO INDICATION SMALL CUBAN COLONY ITALY ACTIVELY ENGAGED MILITARY PEVOLUTIONARY ACTIVITY AIMED AT FIDEL. DOCID-32354088.PDF 10/24/1963 MEXICO CITY DIRECTOR, ROME CABLE:ADVISE TRUE NAME AND LANGUAGE ABILITIES 104-10015-10425.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR CIA ROME CABLE - NO TRACES, LIAISON WILL FOLLOW. 104-10103-10285.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR ROME TRACES ON LEE HARVEY OSWALD 104-10132-10161.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR ROME "CABLE RE: LEE HARVEY OSWALD." 104-10213-10036.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE:NO STATION TRACES. LIAISON WILL FOLLOW. 104-10300-10192.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR CIA ROME CABLE -- NO TRACES, LIAISON WILL FOLLOW. 104-10422-10109.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE:NO STATION TRACES. LIAISON WILL FOLLOW. 104-10422-10347.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE: NO STATION TRACES (RE OSWALD). 104-10422-10434.pdf 11/27/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE: NO STATION TRACES 104-10015-10225.pdf 11/29/1963 DIRECTOR, CIA ROME CABLE - NO ( (DELETION) ) TRACES. 104-10213-10025.pdf 11/29/1963 DIRECTOR INFO SEVERAL OTHERS ROME CABLE: NO TRACES SUBJECT REFS 104-10422-10119.pdf 11/29/1963 DIRECTOR ROME TRACES DEVIGIL 104-10422-10219.pdf 11/29/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE: NO TRACES SUBJECT REFS. 104-10422-10417.pdf 11/29/1963 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE: NO TRACES RE OSWALD 104-10112-10183.pdf 12/11/1963 CHIEF, SPECIAL ACTIVITIES BRANCH GABRIEL, JEROME A. WITHHELD 104-10433-10041.pdf 01/17/1964 CHIEF,WE/4 CHIEF OF STATION,ROME DISPATCH:SUPPORT PCI PUBLICATION OF ARTICLES BY MARTIN LUTHER KING DOCID-32292135.pdf 07/20/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, ROME DOCID-32299487.pdf 07/23/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, ROME 104-10192-10088.pdf 09/17/1964 DIRECTOR ROME CABLE RE: JOSE IGNACIO RASCO, FIRST PRESIDENT MOVIMIENTO DEMOCRATA CRISTIANA DE CUBA (MDC) 104-10433-10039.pdf 10/20/1964 CHIEF,WE/4 CHIEF OF STATION,ROME DISPATCH:MEETING OF DR.MARTIN LUTHER KING 104-10433-10172.pdf 11/09/1964 USIA Washington USIS Rome Weisberg FOIA Request: Joint Embassy/USIS Message:Article in "Vie Nouve" Attributed to Martin 104-10216-10117.pdf 03/25/1965 CHIEF, WE COS, ROME DISPATCH: AMWHIP/1 AND AMLASH/1 DOCID-32289411.pdf 10/08/1971 DIRECTOR, FBI LEGAT, ROME

File Name Doc Date To Name From Name 104-10185-10051.pdf 03/23/1961 ROME WASHINGTON 104-10185-10048.pdf 06/07/1961 TRIESTE INFO ROME DIRECTOR 104-10185-10045.pdf 06/08/1961 COS ROME CHIEF, KUTUBE/D 104-10185-10046.pdf 06/08/1961 COS ROME CHIEF KUTUBE/D 104-10183-10044.pdf 06/03/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10043.pdf 06/04/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10039.pdf 06/14/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10037.pdf 06/18/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10215-10188.pdf 06/18/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10027.pdf 07/17/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10022.pdf 08/21/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10020.pdf 08/26/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10021.pdf 08/28/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10019.pdf 09/25/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10011.pdf 10/14/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10010.pdf 10/15/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10215-10238.pdf 10/15/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10215-10236.pdf 10/18/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10100-10258.pdf 10/22/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10077-10137.pdf 11/26/1963 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10422-10343.pdf 11/26/1963 PARIS, ROME, MADRID DIRECTOR 144-10001-10377.pdf 01/03/1964 ROMEO/CHARLIE USM-701 104-10183-10243.pdf 04/10/1964 ROME INFO GNVA, BERN, MADR DIRECTOR 104-10183-10240.pdf 04/17/1964 GNVA INFO BERN,MADR,ROME,PARI DIRECTOR 104-10183-10241.pdf 04/17/1964 GNVA INFO BERN, MADR, ROME, PARI DIRECTOR 104-10183-10239.pdf 04/23/1964 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10233.pdf 04/30/1964 PARIS INFO ROME, FRAN DIRECTOR 104-10225-10052.pdf 05/12/1964 ROME DIRECTOR 104-10183-10222.pdf 05/22/1964 ROME INFO GNVA, BERN DIRECTOR 104-10183-10188.pdf 09/14/1964 ROME INFORMATION MADRID DIRECTOR 104-10234-10432.pdf 09/14/1964 ROME, MADRID DIRECTOR 144-10001-10269.pdf 10/10/1968 ROMEO SEVEN/GOLF USM-620K

Paz, Here is a list of the recent docs which come FROM ROME... followed by one TO ROME I have yet to go thru them all, maybe there are some gems... DJ File Name Doc Date To Name From Name DOCID-32290226.pdf 06/13/1961 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292853.pdf 08/29/1961 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292254.pdf 10/23/1961 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32307551.pdf 11/27/1961 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292306.pdf 12/21/1961 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305475.pdf 10/30/1962 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305519.pdf 12/06/1962 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32290009.pdf 01/28/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32303414.pdf 04/18/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32303417.pdf 04/26/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32303448.pdf 06/13/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32297818.pdf 08/13/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295452.pdf 08/19/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32297832.pdf 08/21/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295488.pdf 09/26/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295509.pdf 10/02/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295506.pdf 10/03/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295516.pdf 10/03/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295513.pdf 10/04/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295521.pdf 10/08/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32294121.pdf 10/21/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32294129.pdf 10/28/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299687.pdf 11/06/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32294141.pdf 11/07/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299690.pdf 11/15/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32294144.pdf 11/20/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32294150.pdf 12/05/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32291143.pdf 12/27/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32116640.pdf 12/30/1963 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32291131.pdf 01/17/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32166332.pdf 01/24/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32286065.pdf 01/27/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292385.pdf 02/14/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32146893.pdf 03/04/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32304684.pdf 03/04/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32304703.pdf 03/23/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32293565.pdf 04/01/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32304706.pdf 04/03/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32138496.pdf 04/06/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32129537.pdf 04/10/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32304712.pdf 04/20/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32304726.pdf 04/27/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305085.pdf 06/12/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305093.pdf 06/18/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305116.pdf 07/13/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292135.pdf 07/20/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, ROME DOCID-32166494.pdf 07/21/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299487.pdf 07/23/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, ROME DOCID-32299504.pdf 08/03/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32157091.pdf 08/11/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306488.pdf 08/11/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32297542.pdf 08/17/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295348.pdf 09/30/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295423.pdf 09/30/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32301538.pdf 09/30/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32302795.pdf 09/30/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295360.pdf 11/13/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32302803.pdf 11/13/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32297664.pdf 12/11/1964 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295374.pdf 01/27/1965 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32296903.pdf 01/27/1965 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32302810.pdf 01/27/1965 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32295376.pdf 02/01/1965 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32302813.pdf 02/01/1965 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305566.pdf 05/21/1965 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292534.pdf 06/15/1966 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292537.pdf 07/07/1966 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292542.pdf 07/19/1966 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32292544.pdf 08/01/1966 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306367.pdf 05/26/1967 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305218.pdf 06/01/1967 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305235.pdf 07/24/1967 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32307929.pdf 09/28/1967 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32286441.pdf 10/27/1967 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306084.pdf 12/08/1967 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32286450.pdf 12/28/1967 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32286451.pdf 01/08/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306114.pdf 01/08/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32290459.pdf 02/01/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32286461.pdf 02/19/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306725.pdf 02/28/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306726.pdf 02/29/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305826.pdf 04/18/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305840.pdf 04/22/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305853.pdf 05/22/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299885.pdf 05/29/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299889.pdf 06/14/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299891.pdf 07/03/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299899.pdf 07/03/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32299903.pdf 07/30/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305799.pdf 09/16/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32305803.pdf 09/25/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32307895.pdf 11/25/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32307898.pdf 11/27/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306823.pdf 12/27/1968 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306847.pdf 01/20/1969 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32308966.pdf 03/20/1969 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32308957.pdf 03/25/1969 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287440.pdf 07/07/1969 LEG, RO DOCID-32287444.pdf 09/10/1969 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287454.pdf 08/31/1970 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287456.pdf 11/24/1970 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287473.pdf 04/24/1972 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287475.pdf 08/04/1972 ACTING DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287541.pdf 08/16/1973 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287544.pdf 10/24/1973 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32286159.pdf 07/26/1974 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287581.pdf 02/06/1975 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32287560.pdf 04/01/1975 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32306805.pdf 06/06/1975 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO DOCID-32290308.pdf 06/17/1976 DIRECTOR, FBI LEG, RO

https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/104-10103-10149.pdf 17-page report on DeMohrenschildt Comments on "Reputed Former CIA Agent" George DeM DJ

Except take a look at the HOSTY report on that Suitcase and compare it with what is listed above... https://www.maryferrell.org/archive/docs/010/10477/images/img_10477_704_300.png https://www.maryferrell.org/archive/docs/010/10477/images/img_10477_705_300.png https://www.maryferrell.org/archive/docs/010/10477/images/img_10477_706_300.png CD75 page 700.

... the typewriter letter of 11/9 mailed 11/2, the Backyard photos and negatives, the rifle blanket and string and they went back on the 23rd... They find negatives (AND photos) of Oswald holding a rifle and a pistol... probably the most important thing found on the 23rd... Do we see that on here? of course not....

One must wonder how Liebeler has the BUS TICKET for his return trip from Marina 2 weeks prior to the note he writes below... " I do not think there is "convincing evidence" that Oswald was on the buses as stated" HSCA Hearing and Volumes V11 p236 JFK Exhibit No. 37 [Memorandum] SEPTEMBER 14, 1964. To: Mr. Willens. From: Mr. Liebeler. e. The paragraph on bus transportation starting "There is no firm evidence" should be completely rewritten. I do not think there is "convincing evidence" that Oswald was on the buses as stated. One sentence says he was apparently one of four passengers bound for a point beyond Texas. The next suggests that lie bought a ticket in Houston for Laredo, which is in Texas. The McFarland testimony is given too much weight. I don't think Mexican immigration records show the time of day he crossed the border. Slawson told me he got the time of crossing from the scheduled arrival of the bus. Now we are using it to show that since he crossed at that time he had to be on the bus. f . Since we have no direct evidence that Oswald boarded bus 5133 in Houston, the first sentence of the next paragraph ("Hence, the only time . . .") should be changed. That also obviates the necessity that he had to go from New Orleans to Dallas and thence too Houston. There really is almost no evidence at all that he left Houston on that bus and there is really no reason why we should suggest there is . The point can be made without saying that and to seem to rely on really weak evidence is to invite trouble. g. Again-later in the same paragraph-more reliance on the McFarlands. Their affidavit is very weak-we should not fight it. h. Then the single ticket from Houston to Laredo again-which probably could not have been Oswald if he were one of the four heading for points beyond Laredo. i. Also, the assumption that the Twiford call was a local call. Why speculate, make the arguments-he probably would not have called at all if he were not in Houston or going to be in Houston. j. The conclusion that the evidence is persuasive that Oswald was not in Dallas on September 25 is too strong. Mr. LIEBELER. I did not ask the FBI for an explanation and they never offered me one. Mr. CORNWELL. The reason I ask the question is I suppose there might be some chance that the evidence had been fabricated and did not even exist in November 1963. Is that correct? Did you even ask to see if they had checked this location earlier and found nothing? Mr. LIEBELER. I don't recall making that request. you mean evidence was .... created??

Data begins with Station C and Position A... and z168. Mr. McCLOY. Where is that point? What significance is that point? The first point? Mr. SPECTER. This frame 161. Mr. McCLOY. Yes. Mr. SPECTER. Is the first frame we have on the Zapruder film. Really? Mr. SHANEYFELT. This is an album that I prepared of black and white photographs made of the majority of the frames in the Zapruder film---- Mr. SPECTER. Starting with what frame number? Mr. SHANEYFELT. Starting with frame 171, going through frame 334. Mr. SPECTER. And why did you start with frame 171? Mr. SHANEYFELT. This is the frame that the slides start from. This was an arbitrary frame number that was decided on as being far enough back to include the area that we wanted to study. 334 - 171 = 163 334 - 166 = 168 168 thru 171 becomes 161 to 166.

2+50 = elevation 429.7 .... Shot #2 at 419.7 (not 419.07) is 10 feet lower in elevation 313 - 183 = 130... just about the splice for the limo cut...

I understand it Steve... The report is from the ROME CIA station (William Harvey) after a report was compiled for Giulio Andreotti. I have to assume that the CIA and Italian "XXXX Service" would share info... Couple things of note... I am still not convinced the rifle DAY carries from the TSBD is CE139... the markings are not there... The problem with the MAUSER designation and the scope... is that the scope covers where the rifle markings are... and the MAUSER designation was used to account for there NOT being a clip... since it uses a stripper clip... and not a full metal clip...

Thanks Larry.. Yes, everyone was..is better at it than we are.. It seems.

Page 2 and 3.... ?

I understood these to be from Rome...

I have the rest... Space probs...

Having trouble... On a tablet. But will post asap....

They also knew about the planted rifle from what I read... I have the report from Rome CIA station....

the defense rests... next he'll be offering McAdams a quickie...

You might consider lying down and getting some medication ... And I'm 100% sure those authors do not want you representing their work in any manner... if you could even begin to understand any of it You really don't get it. you're the proverbial gnat ...