Steve Thomas

On 1/1/2017 at 7:22 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

03:00  Gloria Calvery arrives at steps. Informs them of Kennedy's wounds.

 

Do you think Gloria Calvery could be the woman who shouted to Joe Marshall Smith that "they are shooting the President from the bushes"?

Mr. SMITH. Yes, sir.; and this woman came up to me and she was just in hysterics. She told me, "They are shooting the President from the bushes".

Was Calvery "in hysterics"? I don't know, I was just asking.

Steve Thomas

9 hours ago, David Butler said:

Maurice McDonald ? (aka Nick McDonald)

David and Bart,

I think M.M. is Marilyn Moody. She was a civilian employee stenographer in the Forgery Bureau.

See Batchelor Exhibit 5002  Page 147 of the Exhibit (page 30 0f Batchelor's List)

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh19/pdf/WH19_Batchelor_Ex_5002.pdf

Steve Thomas

On 1/2/2017 at 3:34 AM, Steve Thomas said:

 

I have run across six versions of this Interrogation. I explore this, but it's too long to be inserted here, so I put it up on a web site here:

http://myjfksite.weebly.com/

look at the bottom of the page

 

I have come to suspect that Fritz and Kelley were the only ones there and that either:

a) Oswald was being questioned about the pictures before they had officially been found; or,
The 12:35 Interview had nothing to do with the pictures, but was about something else.

 

 

An effort has been made to eliminate references to the 12:35 Interrogation. They succeeded in some places, but failed in others.

The tipping point for me was the jail checkout card.

 

Steve Thomas

I found another copy in Box 5 of the DPD Archives, so that makes 7 copies.

Why would someone go into the DPD Archives and alter this Report in Boxes 5 and 15 after the Warren Report, and CE 2003 of the 26 volume Hearings had been published?

CE 2003 pp 268+

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1140#relPageId=286&tab=page

Warren Report Appendix XI pp 607+

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=946#relPageId=631&tab=page

DPD Archives Box 15, Folder# 1, Item# 111, pp 9+

http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/box15.htm

The Federal Government documents were already a matter of public record.  What good would it have accomplished?

Steve Thomas

On 12/28/2016 at 4:29 PM, David Josephs said:

This is Box 1 Folder 15 where the archives say the rest of the "typed draft"   Steve, do we know where the final report is?

 

David,

You asked where the final report is. I believe that the version in Box 15, Folder# 1, Item# 111 is the final version. You can see the same version in

CD 81 AG Texas Letter with attachments dated 07 Jan 1964 beginning on page 452.

CE 2003 (24H) p. 268

Appendix XI of the Warren Report. On page 607

The version in Box 1 is the original, you can see where Fritz went over this with a stenographer, and indicated where he wanted to break with new paragraphs. These changes are reflected in the version in Box 15. The anomaly here, is that someone, at some point,  went back in and changed the Box 15 version. I think it was after the Warren Report came out in September, 1964, and Thomas Kelley's Report showed up in Appendix XI.

I have run across six versions of this Interrogation. I explore this, but it's too long to be inserted here, so I put it up on a web site here:

http://myjfksite.weebly.com/

look at the bottom of the page

If, for some reason you can't pull it up, let me know and I'll post it here.

In a later post on this thread, you said that Fritz probably *** a brick when he realized that the finding of the rifle photo did not match the 12:35 Interrogation.

Somebody did, I just don't know if it was Fritz. I am finding differences between the DPD Case file in the DPD Archives, with what's in CD 81 - which is also supposed to be the DPD Case File. Things have been removed.

I have come to suspect that Fritz and Kelley were the only ones there and that either:

a) Oswald was being questioned about the pictures before they had officially been found; or,
The 12:35 Interview had nothing to do with the pictures, but was about something else.

An effort has been made to eliminate references to the 12:35 Interrogation. They succeeded in some places, but failed in others.

The tipping point for me was the jail checkout card.

Steve Thomas

11 minutes ago, Alistair Briggs said:

I agree with David, it looks like 3rd interview.

Both that and the '4th' interview on page 11 looks like the number has been written on top of something else.

The scribbled out bit underneath 3rd int (on page 9) looks to me like it original said 4th interview and has been scored out! Perhaps on looking over the notes he wrote 4th int. there and then realising it was wrong scored it out and put 3rd int. above it and perhaps the scoring out of the time (12.35) and writing the 6pm above it was  his way of saying that was when the 4th one actually was.

On page 10 at the time 6pm he seems to have at first written 3rd int then scored that out and written over it 4th interview (although when I view that it looks to me like the 3 is on top of the 4, but the 'th' is on top of the 'rd') and then on page 11 at the end of that interview has also placed 4th int to mark the end point...

Regards
Oh, just noticed Steve responded as I typed this.

Alistair,

To my eye, on page 10 the note originally said 4th, and Fritz wrote 3rd over the top of it to reflect what he had written on the page before it, page 9.

By changing the time from 12:35 to 6:00 PM and re-numbering the Interrogations, Fritz is making an attempt to hide the 12:35 Interrogation.

Steve Thomas

39 minutes ago, David Butler said:

Looks like 3rd Int ? 

On the page 11 there is a 4th Int I believe so it's like he was keeping tracks of the numbers ? 

David,

Thank you. I believe you're right.

Steve Thomas

To anyone,

In Box 15 of the DPD Archives Box 15, Folder# 1, Item# 111.

Interrogation, by J. W. Fritz. Draft of the interrogation of Lee Harvey Oswald, (Photocopy) Poor Quality), date unknown DPD Archives, Box 15, Folder# 1, Item# 111. This consists of 13 pages.

http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/box15.htm

On page 9 of this Report, the 12:35 time has been crossed out, and 6:00 PM has been written in.

There is an additional note written in that I can't make out. (Brd Int?/Bnd Intv?) Is Intv an abbreviation for Interview?

Can anyone hazard a guess what this writing stands for?

Steve Thomas

10 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:

David,

 

I'm not ready to knowledgeably (is that a real word?) discuss this yet, because I'm still researching it, but for what it's worth, I've come to believe that the Fritz Interrogation notes are a fraud. Not so much a fraud, as fraudulent; because I believe that a page has been removed between pp. 4 and 5 of those notes in an effort to hide the Interview at 12:35.

What do you make of the bottom on page 5 of Fritz's Interrogation notes where he says that Oswald was complaining on Saturday night about wanting a jacket for a lineup? There was no lineup on Saturday night.

in the DPD Archives Box 6, Folder# 1, Item# 73, there is a list of the lineups and when they took place. The only line-up on Saturday took place at 2:15 in the afternoon. If Oswald was complaining about wanting a jacket, he couldn't have been doing that at 6:30 in the evening.

http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/box6.htm

Steve Thomas

I'm sorry, I forgot to include the bibliographic citation for this. I was referring to his Interrogation notes Here:

http://www.jfklancer.com/Fritzdocs.html

Steve Thomas

42 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

Considering we know that no SS agents were in the TSBD at this time either they are reassigning someone to the SS who they do not want to name, someone NOT SS pretended to be with credentials via Holt's story, or there really was a SS agent there... again, it seems to me that anyone who could cause a problem later had their name conveniently forgotten and by officers who appear to know the names of just about everyone else.

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=946#relPageId=631&tab=page 
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=29104#relPageId=9&tab=page

Both of these state the time for the 3rd interview as 12:35pm so if these are the corrected version they dropped the 6pm 3rd interview time... OR those with the corrections were done well after the fact.  Fritz's notes reflect a 6:35pm time as I posted yet I feel that the 11:25 scratched out would have been to account for the hour before he was questioned again.

Do you know if anything is recorded for what happened between 11:30 and 12:30 on Saturday?

 

 

 

 

 

 

David,

Thanks for discussing this with me. I've learned a lot.

I'm not ready to knowledgeably (is that a real word?) discuss this yet, because I'm still researching it, but for what it's worth, I've come to believe that the Fritz Interrogation notes are a fraud. Not so much a fraud, as fraudulent; because I believe that a page has been removed between pp. 4 and 5 of those notes in an effort to hide the Interview at 12:35. I can't say positively what was discussed, but from what I surmise, only Fritz and Thomas Kelley were there. For example, the two DPD Detectives who were supposed to be there, Senkel and Turner, make no mention of attending an Interrogation on the 23rd in their after-action Reports. Neither does James Bookhout of the FBI. I'll be writing more about this later.

You mentioned Nat Pinkston of the FBI getting information about Kleins. Turner's after-action Report makes interesting reading. Look at the bottom of page 4 and the top of page 5 about him receiving an anonymous phone call about Kleins.

DPD Archives Box 15, Folder# 2, Item# 55

http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/box15.htm

Somebody was pushing Kleins pretty hard that day.

I don't know what was going on between 11:30 and 12:35. Maybe Fritz was out in the hall giving interviews?

What do you make of the bottom on page 5 of Fritz's Interrogation notes where he says that Oswald was complaining on Saturday night about wanting a jacket for a lineup? There was no lineup on Saturday night.

in the DPD Archives Box 6, Folder# 1, Item# 73, there is a list of the lineups and when they took place. The only line-up on Saturday took place at 2:15 in the afternoon. If Oswald was complaining about wanting a jacket, he couldn't have been doing that at 6:30 in the evening.

http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/box6.htm

PS. BTW, this list of the lineups that you find in Box 6 is the only place you will find Howard Brennan listed.

Steve Thomas

12 hours ago, David Josephs said:

 

 

 

#3 then ...  I've read that the ATF men would be considered Secret Service men to many who they showed ID

Maybe to many, but not to Sims and Boyd of the DPD.

Following the assassination, Detectives Richard M. Sims and Elmer L. Boyd of the Homicide and Robbery Bureau filed a joint after-action report with Police Chief Jesse Curry. In their undated report, Sims and Boyd wrote, “Detective Studebaker and Lieutenant Day took pictures of the rifle. Mr. Pinkston of the F.B.I. and a Secret Service Agent were there at the time the pictures were being made. We don’t know the Secret Service agent’s name. Mr. Ellsworth and another officer from Alcohol Tax Department were also there.

They knew enough to distinguish between the FBI, Secret Service and ATTU.

"Report on Officer's Duty in Regard to the President's Murder, R. M. Sims. No. 629, and E. L. Boyd, No, 840. Dallas Police archives Box 3 Folder # 4, as cited in the City of Dallas Archives – JFK Collection, http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/box3.htm

11 hours ago, David Josephs said:

 

 

This is Box 1 Folder 15 where the archives say the rest of the "typed draft"   Steve, do we know where the final report is?

David,

You can find one copy in Volume XI of the Warren Report itself here:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=946#relPageId=623&tab=page

and another copy in the Papers of Will Fritz here:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=29104

I have not sat down and compared these line by line to what you find in Box 15 Folder@ 1, Item#111 of the DPD Archives.

Steve Thomas

On 11/28/2011 at 7:16 PM, David Josephs said:

In his notes of Oswald's interrogation, Fritz had his notes typed up and then it SEEMS as if he edited them with a stenographer who added text as needed..

I found this page of notes from Fritz' report in the Dallas Archives and had someone finally transcribe the shorthand... it is virtually verbatim of the final reports typed text...

"

...when the picture was made of him holding the rifle...."

Box 1: Folder 15

1. Interrogation, by an unknown author. Typed rough draft with handwritten corrections pertaining to the interrogation of Lee Harvey Oswald, (Original), date unknown. 12 pages 00000412 01 15 001 0412-001.gif 0412-002.gif 0412-003.gif 0412-004.gif 0412-005.gif 0412-006.gif 0412-007.gif 0412-008.gif 0412-009.gif 0412-010.gif 0412-011.gif 0412-012.gif

To me this proves that Fritz had the opportunity to think about what he was writing and make additions... he decides to add the fact that he asked Oswald about where he lived SPECIFICALLY to find out where the photo(s) were made... at the 12:35 interrogation.

Strange thing though is that the next page of the rough draft INCLUDES the shorthand written passage? I STILL think this whole little "episode" is very strange indeed.

DJ

David,

You can also find this interrogation report rough draft in Box 15, Folder# 1, Item# 111. This version is before the corrections and stenogropher's writing.

http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/box15.htm

It wasn't unusual for the police officers (and probably representatives of other other government agencies like the FBI and Secret Service) to review and correct their statements multiple times before submitting them. As Kenneth Croy told the Warren Commission in his testimony regarding his Report to Curry on his duties on the 24th:

http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/croy.htm

Mr. CROY. No; well, I will put it this way, that it took us 8 hours to get that up. That is how interested they were.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You talked with them for 8 hours?
Mr. CROY. On 2 different occasions. That day and the next day, for 4 hours each day. That is pretty interesting.

Mr. CROY. No; we talked the entire thing over, and after we talked everything over and they brought the stenographer in and we went back over it again, then I left and she typed it up, and I came in the next day and we went back over it again and back over it and so on.

I found three things in Fritz's Interrogation Report that were interesting to me:

1) On page 4 of the Notes, he wrote that Tippit was arraigned before Judge Johnston at 7:10 PM. What was interesting is that Fritz didn't catch that in the Report in Box 15 when he corrected and changed the Report that you find in Box 1.

2) On Page 2 of that Report, Fritz said he got a call from Shanklin that Shanklin wanted Hosty in on the interview, because Hosty "knew about these people and had had been investigating them before".

What's that all about?

3) Also on Page 2, Fritz wrote that in addition to Sims and Boyd of the Homicide Bureau being present at Oswald's first interrogation, there were also "possibly some Secret Service men". This was corroborated by Sims, Boyd, M.W. Stevenson, and Chief Curry of the DPD. I have searched for this Secret Service agent, or agents and I don't know who this could be. I wrote a piece on this a while back called, Secret Service, On the Knoll and Beyond that you can find here if you're interested:

Steve Thomas

6 hours ago, Robin Unger said:

Muchmore Film part 3 ( 2 -GIFS )

 

http://quaneeri.blogspot.com.au/2016/12/muchmore-film-part-3-2-gifs.html

 

Robin,

Thanks for these. The gifs you provide in Part 3 definitely show that white car behind Johnson's car driving down Houston with its back door open.

Is that Johnson's Secret Service follow-up car?

I wonder why they did that?

Steve Thomas

On 12/13/2010 at 6:15 AM, Greg Parker said:

If someone can come up with a better explanation for the Elsbeth address than that Oswald himself gave it, I'd be happy to see it - preferably supported by some type of evidence.

I know that this a response to a post that's over 10 years old, but in his WC testimony, Hosty said that he had the Elsbeth St. address as early as March, 1963.

Mr. HOSTY. This was March 4, 1963, when I began my inquiry as to her present whereabouts. I determined on March 4, 1963, through the Immigration and Naturalization Service records that she had moved from Fort Worth to the Dallas area. She was living on a street called Elsbeth Street in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas.

On March 11, 1963, I made inquiry at this Elsbeth address

Steve Thomas

Hosty says, " I requested that the case be reopened. I requested the supervisor in Dallas to reopen the case to me. "

Mr. STERN. Was that in writing or verbally?
Mr. HOSTY. Actually, it was, it would appear in writing. I did this by sending a letter to the Bureau, to the FBI headquarters in Washington

I made a request that this case be reopened

Belmont says, " In March 1963 Agent Hosty received information in Dallas to the effect that Oswald had been in communication with The Worker, the east coast Communist newspaper. He therefore re-instituted the case..."

So that the case was revived in Dallas by Hosty. 

And he learned that Oswald had left Dallas, the residence was then picked up in New Orleans, and the case was revived. So that actually there was a joint revival of the case

Hosty says he made a request. Belmont says he did it on his own. 

I don't know............... something doesn't feel right here. I don't think Hosty would have had that authority. From what I've been able to glean in reading through FBI reports on other things, Hoover didn't want his agents chasing their tails.

Steve Thomas

44 minutes ago, Larry Hancock said:

Larry,

 

Steve, you are making me feel old. 

I was very surprised by the comment below:

"Paper documents were microfilmed and then the pages were scanned and input into IBM punch cards. The cards were keyword searchable."

It sounds like paper documents were microfilmed and separately somehow scanned to put on IBM punch cards.

All of which is irrelevant other than the fact that you took me back in time several decades...grin.

 

I could have mis-read the Wikipedia entry I cited.

That's not un-heard of. *grin*

Glad I could take you for a stroll down memory lane. I've got a line on walkers if you need one. :-)

Steve

This really isn't apropos to anything special. It's just an observation of an aspect of the JFK assassination that I don't think has been explored much. For example, I wonder how much info on Oswald might be found in the old Walnut files?

You can see a reference to this system on page 6 in the document entitled: “DCI John McCone and the Assassination of President John F. Kennedy”

http://nsarchive.gwu.edu/NSAEBB/NSAEBB493/docs/intell_ebb_026.PDF

that Douglas Caddy referred to in his thread, “CIA report concluded director led JFK assassination coverup

According to Wikipedia, Walnut used an IBM 1360 data retrieval and name trace system employing IBM punch cards and microfilm. Paper documents were microfilmed and then the pages were scanned and input into IBM punch cards. The cards were keyword searchable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_1360

I had been doing some reading on the 507^th Army Security Agency Group in Germany in the 1950's and 60's. The soldiers talked about using IBM punch cards in their work. Several said that there was a job waiting for them at IBM when their hitch was over.

(Source: Email from John O'Neil)

My next duty station (after Vint Hill Farms) was with the 507th USASA Group (Field Army) at Heilbronn am Neckar. We had 4 -2½ ton trucks with expandable sides that held all our IBM equipment that ran off portable diesel generators (one per truck).

Jim Campbell in his email said “(When I was in, no 206 had ever re-enlisted - IBM had a job ready for them when they got out.)” When I got out I went to the IBM office in San Francisco, showed them my diploma with TJ Watson’s signature and asked for a job, they asked me what I knew about computers, so I told them I’d seen one in Germany. I got the hint when they said ‘Goodbye, thanks for stopping in”.

"Late in 1962 was not the time to look for a job repairing the soon to be obsolete IBM punched card machines! It all turned out for the best. I worked as a tab operator while I taught myself computer programming and all that stuff and lived happily ever after. My wife, our three children and I moved to Australia 40 years ago."

Hielbronn was where Dennis Ofstein of Jaggers-Chiles-Stovall fame and Thomas H. Crigler of the 507th were stationed.

The CIA used IBM computers and so did Army intelligence. The CIA report cited above says, "In his appearance before the Warren Commission, McCone encouraged other federal agencies to computerize their records to facilitate investigations." I wonder if the FBI's databases were computerized.

Steve Thomas

5 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Paul,

Steve,

In my reading, the answer to your question was given in the WC testimony of FBI Assistant Director Alan Belmont.   IIRC, Alan Belmont said that in February, 1963, James Hosty requested that the FBI re-open the file on Lee Harvey Oswald, because Oswald had subscribed to "The Worker" newspaper, printed by the Communists. 

But Alan Belmont personally decided against it -- because it was no crime to subscribe to "The Worker" newspaper, and the FBI could not open a file on everybody who had a subscription to "The Worker."
--Paul Trejo

From Hosty's WC testimony:

On the 14th of March, I verified that Oswalds were residing at this address when I found the mailbox with the name of Lee and Marina Oswald at this address, 214 Neely Street.

So I then checked Lee Oswald's file, at which time I determined that he had a contact with the New York Daily Worker.
Mr. STERN. How did you learn that?
Mr. HOSTY. From our New York office. Our New York office sent a letter through to the Dallas office. This was the first time I had seen this letter.
Mr. STERN. This appeared in his file?
Mr. HOSTY. In his file; yes, sir.
Mr. STERN. Even if the case was closed, the file would continue to accumulate?
Mr. HOSTY. That is correct, and they are periodically rechecked for things of this nature.
I noticed it, and then because of the domestic difficulty and the fact that I knew I would be interviewing his wife in the near future, I requested that the case be reopened. I requested the supervisor in Dallas to reopen the case to me.

Mr. STERN. Was that in writing or verbally?
Mr. HOSTY. Actually, it was, it would appear in writing. I did this by sending a letter to the Bureau, to the FBI headquarters in Washington, setting forth the information I had developed, and then on our office copy I made a request that this case be reopened. This is a normal procedure that we go through when we open cases, or reopen cases.

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Hosty, did the letter from your New York office say what the nature of the con, tact with the Daily Worker was?
Mr. HOSTY. It said he was on the mailing list, sir, of the Daily Worker.
The CHAIRMAN. On the mailing list?
Mr. HOSTY. Yes, sir.

So, what you are saying I think, is that the FBI Headquarters allowed Hosty to re-open a closed case, just because he had subscribed to a newspaper, even though it was not their policy to do so.

Just out of curiosity. have you ever seen this letter from the New York Office? Or the request Hosty made to Headquarters, and their response?

Steve Thomas

4 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Paul,

 

What was James Hosty doing there?   He tells us in detail in his 1996 book:

"My caseload in the four-man counter-intelligence squad in the Dallas office was domninated by right-wingers.  I spent much of my time tracking the movements and actions of both Klan members and members of former US Army General Edwin Walker's radical militia group, known as the Minutemen...In the eyes of the Minutemen, Kennedy was at best a dupe of the Communists, at worst a Communist collaborator."  (James Hosty, Assignment Oswald, 1996, p. 4)
--Paul Trejo

 

This is the part that I've never understood, because in his WC testimony, Hosty said,

" I noticed it, and then because of the domestic difficulty and the fact that I knew I would be interviewing his wife in the near future, (this was in March, 1963) I requested that the case be reopened. I requested the supervisor in Dallas to reopen the case to me.
Mr. STERN. Was that in writing or verbally?
Mr. HOSTY. Actually, it was, it would appear in writing. I did this by sending a letter to the Bureau, to the FBI headquarters in Washington, setting forth the information I had developed, and then on our office copy I made a request that this case be reopened.

Hosty's emphasis was on the right wing, but it appears from this that he went out of his way to be given control of a case involving a Russian (de-facto, Communist) immigrant. This seemingly would not be his area of expertise. And yes, the impression I get from reading through the FBI's Subject Files on the Minutemen, etc. is that a lot of them were located in the Fort Worth area - even more so than in Dallas.

Are you aware of any other communists Hosty was monitoring?

Steve Thomas

On 12/18/2016 at 4:34 AM, Steve Thomas said:

November 1^st::

Mr. STERN. You say the interview started at about 2:30?
Mr. HOSTY. Approximately 2:30; yes, sir.
Mr. STERN. About how long did it last?
Mr. HOSTY. At the very most 20-25 minutes.

Mr. HOSTY. Oh, yes, sir. This occurred on the 1st. This was a Friday. I returned to the Dallas office. I covered a couple of other leads on the way back. I got in shortly after 5 o'clock...

What "leads" did he cover, and why did it take him two hours to go from Irving to Dallas?

On 12/14/2016 at 2:40 AM, Chris Newton said:

CE103 Original Oswald Draft:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=60459

I wonder why CE 103 is in English?

Oswald knew how to write in Russian (see here for example: https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth340234/m1/1/

Why write the Russian Embassy a letter that is not in Russian?

Steve Thomas

On 12/14/2016 at 1:04 AM, Chris Newton said:

Thanks Tommy.

 

Speaking of good police work. FBI Dallas was told by FBI new Orleans that the Oswalds had apparently left New Orleans in a two tone station wagon driven by a woman who spoke Russian.

...based on this scant information that Hosty had at the time, how did he actually find out it was Ruth Paine?

Chris,

Hosty said that he stopped in Irving on his way back from Fort Worth. Has he ever said what he was actually doing in Fort Worth?

Isn't that where George DeMohrenschildt, George Bouhe and Max Clark all lived? Max Clark who first approached Oswald on his return from Russia, George DeMohrenschildt who shepherded Marina around everywhere, and George Bouhe who had "files on everybody"?

Steve Thomas

2 hours ago, Chris Newton said:

I haven't seen any statements from Ruth Paine that didn't agree with the Hosty story that there only two visits, Nov. 1st and Nov. 5th, which leads me to believe that this was what they agreed on. Marina's statement in front of the Secret Service and Postal Inspector Kelley and Hosty's acknowledgement that Ruth Paine had acted as interpreter on Oct. 27th indicates Marina wasn't on the same page. I'm not absolving Marina of any shenanigans, I just don't know at the moment.

If Ruth was "playing" Hosty that might elevate Ruth to being an asset of someone like DAP.

Chris,

page 1 of CE 830 says that there was a "pretext" interview of Ruth Paine on October 29th. You can see it here:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1134#relPageId=802&tab=page

It doesn't say who conducted the interview, and the fact that it says it's a Report by Special Agent Fain dated September 10, 1963 has me scratching my head.

Steve Thomas

1 hour ago, Mark Knight said:

So Mrs. Payne TWICE testified that LHO WAS at her home in Irving on the weekend of November 9-11. And she testified that the birthday party was the following weekend, when LHO did NOT come to Irving.

Mark,

I guess you're right. I find her testimony confusing at times.

Steve Thomas

10 hours ago, Thomas Graves said:

"I was unable to remain in Mexico indefinitely because of my Mexican visa restrictions which was for 15 days only. I could not take a chance on requesting a new visa unless I used my real name, so I returned to the United States.

Thomas,

This part has always confused me. It implies that his original visa was in a fake name. Has a visa ever turned up for Oswald in a fake name, and what was the name he used? Would he have had fake documents to prove who he said he was?

Steve Thomas