Denny Zartman

It is a little confusing. The title of the two hour version is "JFK Revisited: Through The Looking Glass." The title of the four hour version is "JFK: Destiny Betrayed - Season 01". It's four hour long chapters/episodes.

Try typing in "jfk destiny betrayed" and selecting the autocomplete version that says "jfk destiny betrayed in prime video".

http://22november1963.org.uk/jfk-parkland-hospital-press-conference

I noticed the two car horn honks for the first time in, of all places, the Sixth Floor Museum. They had the audio only, and listening to the audio divorced from the video, the two horns were clear as day. I had never noticed them before. Either they had been removed from the videos I had seen or that the drama of the killing distracted me. I believe it was exactly as it appears to be: an observer in a nearby car giving Ruby a signal.

While I'm sure the military has tried mind control, I don't believe there was any hypnotism involved with Ruby or Oswald. Just my opinion. Threats to Ruby's life probably would have been enough motivation. There is also the possibility that if Oswald ratted, Ruby would have been one of the first names named. Looking at the official account of Oswald's post assassination movements, a strong argument could be made that he was heading toward the direction of Ruby's home when he crossed paths with Officer Tippit.

I've heard that the Militant and the Worker were political opposites, much like trying to portray a coherent ideology by holding up a copy of The Nation and a copy of National Review. I'd be curious if the two papers were indeed identified by their names on the television broadcast, because there is no way she would have been able to tell their names just by looking at the television. Either way, destroying his mail before he was dead was 1. A crime, and 2. Proves that Ruth Paine judged him as guilty before Oswald even had a lawyer, much less had his day in court. And Paine as Oswald's acquaintance knew Lee had not expressed any antipathy toward President Kennedy. Wouldn't that alone cause any fair minded person to at least withhold judgement until more information was in? But she either judged him guilty (would that not be a sin on her part on top of being openly contemptuous of the law and Lee's rights?) or she suspected he would never return to collect his mail.

I just finished the final chapter, which was also excellent. It was an effective summation of Kennedy's vision of a peaceful world contrasting with the reality of escalating war. Overall, I think it's an impressive achievement and will probably stand as the best JFK documentary for many years to come. It's very thorough, even though four hours still only scratches the surface of the many mysteries and incongruities that surround the case. Credit is due for tackling a case of this magnitude at all. It's important work, even though I suspect at times it seems to be a thankless task considering the amount of misinformation still being fed today. I think breaking it down into episodes was wise. It helped me to digest the information. I always worry that the sheer amount of names and places thrown at the viewer will become confusing for people unfamiliar with the times. A lot of comprehending the case means having a basic understanding all these complex geopolitics and their history. "JFK: Destiny Betrayed" uses expertly assembled news footage and graphics to make this all understandable as possible.

It's because the mob did not have the power to go into the Bethesda autopsy room. Period. What is it going to take for you to understand that basic fact?

@Greg Doudna .

It's no trick to blame a shooting on the person who pulled the trigger. Please cite some examples when the Mob set up a fall guy in advance in multiple states and multiple countries? And is Hoover leading that cover up today? Of course not. To believe the mob did it means believing that the U.S. Government assisted in setting up the scapegoat in advance; leapt immediately into action to cover it up after the assassination and protect the mob; and then kept that cover up going for 58 years and counting. Lucky. That's what all successful criminals rely on to get away with their crimes, right? Luck.

This forum is going downhill fast. The mob didn't set up fall guys in advance in multiple states and multiple countries. That was not their M.O. Revealing that Marcello had JFK killed in 1963 could not possibly affect United States national security in 2022.

I've watched the first three chapters of "JFK: Destiny Betrayed" so far and hope to watch the final chapter later this evening. It's very well done. Remarkably thorough and compelling. I think I enjoy it more than the two hour version. There's more time to breathe. The geopolitics sometimes threatens to become information overload, but is presented in as comprehensible a way as these complex historical situations can be. Cyril Wecht is one of my all time favorite JFK experts. I really don't ever get tired of hearing him talk. Chapter 3, at :56:41 there's an illustration of the Bethesda autopsy room that I don't remember ever seeing before. That was fascinating to view. More thoughts later after I've finished it. Great work @James DiEugenio and Oliver Stone.

Thanks, James. I just purchased the film on Amazon, and am really looking forward to watching it.

I'm not seeing that Destiny Betrayed is available on Amazon yet.

That's part of what keeps me coming back to the case; no matter how much I read, there's always something new to learn.

Congratulations, Vince. It's well earned. You already hold a place as the foremost civilian researcher on the Secret Service, and you still contribute much to our understanding of the case with your books and YouTube videos. I wish you even more success in the future. We all appreciate your tireless work on this important subject.

From my understanding, reading what emergency room technicians have said, is that once a bullet enters a body it can go in practically any direction and will not always continue on the previous trajectory.

Were these patsies actually guilty of the shooting or the killing in question? Were these patsies the subject of multiple pre-assassination impersonations in multiple states and/or multiple countries to set them up to take the blame on advance, like Oswald was?

When did "patsy" become defined as "actual killer that can't be traced back to their boss" instead of "fall guy set up to take the blame"? When Oswald said "I'm just a patsy", was he confessing to being a shooter but a shooter that was following someone else's orders? He had already denied shooting anyone and the nitrates test on his cheek came back negative, according to Mark Lane court admissible evidence that he did not fire a rifle that day. And again, how does telling the world that Carlos Marcello killed JFK in 1963 endanger national security in 2022?

I am confused about what definition of "patsy" both of you are using. Could you clarify? I'm talking about someone who didn't do it being set up intentionally to take the blame in order for the real perpetrator to get away with it. Oswald wasn't confessing to the crime when he said "I'm a patsy", was he? He had already denied shooting anyone that day.

When has the mob ever felt the need to use patsies when executing a hit? When has the mob ever set up patsies in advance of a murder? There are still documents relating to the JFK assassination that are kept secret today. The stated reasoning is that they pose a threat to national security. How could revealing Carlos Marcello had JFK murdered in 1963 jeopardize national security in 2022?

I would be interested in hearing Jim Marrs speak. In my opinion he was thorough and level headed. Both editions of "Crossfire" are still among the first books I use for reference. I'm agnostic on JVB. Like with Beverly Oliver, I don't explicitly disbelieve her for any specific reason. But recognizing the level of controversy surrounding them, I typically just leave them both out of the mix whenever I am evaluating the case. James Files I don't believe at all.

I'm completely confused on this one. Sorry. Tomlinson couldn't say for sure that CE 399 was the same bullet because he did not mark it. Tomlinson allegedly did not have much experience with and/or knowledge of weapons and ammunition. The bottom line is: was CE 399 ever positively identified by Tomlinson as the same bullet he handled on November 22, 1963? The answer is no. According to Josiah Thompson, Wright, who, as I understand it did have experience and knowledge of weapons and ammo, was crystal clear that the bullet he handled that day had a pointed tip, unlike CE 399.

Thanks for bumping this thread @Jamey Flanagan . It was thought provoking to read. I've been fascinated by the Coley blood pool mystery in particular for a while. I did my own transcript of the Black Ops interview, and I believe his story. You may find this tidbit interesting: In @Vince Palamara's 2015 book "JFK - From Parkland To Bethesda" Pg. 46, Vince quotes a passage from 21 H 213-215. Parkland nurse Bertha L. Lozano - "A technician came to the desk and asked me to expect a private patient who was bleeding... blood technicians came to ask me who 'Mr. X' was who did not have an ER number. Hematology also came with the same problem and was told the same thing."

No one can. CE 399 has so many unbelievable things about it, but, in my opinion, this is the easiest to understand and the most convincing. The bullet that was found had a pointed tip. CE 399 has a rounded tip. For anyone rational, the question should end there.