Mr. and Mrs. Hester...who were they

[William Kelly]

The bottom line is that even if what Jack White says is true and it is an unexplainable anamolly in the Z-film, other than tampering, it still isn't what is necessary to prove there was a conspiracy to kill the president.

There's no sense in trying to use any anomalies in the Z-film as proof of conspiracy when the Z-film itself, even if untampered with, is evidence of conspiracy.

And certainly, if those who killed JFK had enough power and control over the situation to know the real assassins would get away no matter what happened, could nail Oswald as the Patsy, control the body, AF1, the autopsy, the official government response and the Warren Report, then it shouldn't be surprising that they certainly could have gotten control of and tampered with the Z-film, if only because they could, and needed to, because it was and is positive proof evidence of conspiracy, whether tampered with or not.

So the reasons to tamper with the Z-film would be to eleminate the turn - for some reason I can't yet fathom - eleminate the stop - as a tip of the hat to Stand Up Guy Greer, and block out the blow out in the back of the head and add the frontal blob - to eleminate evidence of a frontal shot - then all the annomalies like the Moorman in the street, the Stemmons Sign corner, the impossible Greer doubletake, etc. - were accidential traces of the cover-up handiwork, and not intentional.

They weren't just sitting back under Walt Disney's workbench and saying, ha ha, now that we've blocked out the back spray and put the blob in the front, why don't we move Mooreman on the grass, change the color of Jean's shoes, clip off the corner of the Stemmons Freeway sign, and put Mickey Mouse in the window.

The only way to positively determine if the extant Z-film was filmed in Zapruder's camera is to forensically and microscopically compare the Archives original with the two copies known to have been shot through Zapruder's camera. Until that test is undertaken, all the talk about annamolies is just talk.

There's much to be learned from the photographic record of the assassination, but determning whether or not Moorman was in the steet when she took her picture doesn't take us a step further in coming to understand what really happened at Dealey Plaza, but detracts from other angles that really do.

Oh, and I'd like to know more about the Hesters too.

BK

Edited February 18, 2010 by William Kelly

[David Andrews]

Not only should we wonder why that nicely-dressed young business type jumped up and ran to the window openings when he saw camera lenses pointing at him, we should wonder why he was apparently the only "gent" who jumped up and left his wife in the kill zone - so unlike that darling Mr. Newman, just below him and closer to the target. What a doll he was, girls!

Maybe Hester's heart was driven toward purity by the shock - maybe he had heard shots and conspiratorial noises behind the pergola, and needed to bear witness and direct the minions of justice?

Or were the Hesters another intel fun couple - like the Paines and the Hunts?

But, the Oswalds - now there was a mixed marriage...

Edited February 18, 2010 by David Andrews

[Bernice Moore]

Jack.

I have been looking at Beatrice Hester in Bronson.

I beleive that the white object she is holding in Bronson, which can also be seen lying on the ground in Weigman and Bell may be a white coat.

If you look at the clearer frame i posted from the start of the Zapruder film, there appears to be a coat behind Beatrice thrown across the back of the park bench.

coat in the shadow on her left, coat seen in sunlight on her right.

Also Sitzmans large black hand back can be seen sitting on the bench in front of Beatrice's right hand.

IN THE GIF AS MARILYN TURNS HER BLACK BAG IS ON HER LEFT ARM..RIGHT ON JACK..B

Sitzman's handbag is hanging on her arm.

Jack

[Bernice Moore]

I have been off the web since last friday, in trying to play catch up,and going through files, i have found this copy of a bell frame..david you poise some good thoughts why there is so little known and the why of charles actions that day all in relation to the zapruder film being taken , that immediate area also including in relation to the little known marilyn sitzman from the researchers the investigations and so on..one wonders why...jack this frame copy from bell i have found reminds me of the pergolaman in some ways...i must say i do not know where it came from sorry bout that if anyone recognizes it as their work please step up...whatever or whomever it is,or if anything...please have a go all,with your thoughts.someone is already in the pergola awaiting the others it would appear...if.....thanks b...

Edited February 18, 2010 by Bernice Moore

[Chris Davidson]

Thanks Bernice,

That would be my work.

As I have stated many times before, the same photo method which brought Charles Hester out of the shadows (or whoever it is) in Bell, shows this stranger inside the pergola.

chris

[Bernice Moore]

Thanks Bernice,

That would be my work.

As I have stated many times before, the same photo method which brought Charles Hester out of the shadows (or whoever it is) in Bell, shows this stranger inside the pergola.

chris

thanks chris appreciated i almost mentioned your name again but thought i should not too often for all that comes up, but i shall now will mark it...it appears there may have been something serious to that old pergolman research, that thread may still be on here, i shall have a look many thanks again...b

Edited February 18, 2010 by Bernice Moore

[Bernice Moore]

CHRIS HERE IS THE NIX PERGOLAMAN.FWIW.I HAVE NOT FOUND THE THREAD SO FAR...EXCUSE CAPS THANKS THAT TIME OF NIGHT.IN NIX HE'S PERHAPS ON HIS WAY IN YOUR BELL HE'S THERE.....BEST B

Edited February 18, 2010 by Bernice Moore

[Todd W. Vaughan]

Not only should we wonder why that nicely-dressed young business type jumped up and ran to the window openings when he saw camera lenses pointing at him, we should wonder why he was apparently the only "gent" who jumped up and left his wife in the kill zone - so unlike that darling Mr. Newman, just below him and closer to the target. What a doll he was, girls!

Maybe Hester's heart was driven toward purity by the shock - maybe he had heard shots and conspiratorial noises behind the pergola, and needed to bear witness and direct the minions of justice?

Or were the Hesters another intel fun couple - like the Paines and the Hunts?

But, the Oswalds - now there was a mixed marriage...

Utterly absurd!

Mr Hester didn't "(jump) up and (leave) his wife in the kill zone" until some 25 seconds after Z313.

Exactly how long should he have stayed down on the ground with her for him to qualify as a gentleman?

[John Dolva]

I think the newmans were asked to stay put by photographers fo a time. Hester seems to make sure his wife stayed down then moved, she then sat up. Maybr he felt a need to make sure. Down on the ground is a classic oft used military maneuver when the direction of incomings is unknown. Maybe he did have his suspicions and acted on them? It kinda looks cowarldy, but is it really?

[Todd W. Vaughan]

I think the newmans were asked to stay put by photographers fo a time. Hester seems to make sure his wife stayed down then moved, she then sat up. Maybr he felt a need to make sure. Down on the ground is a classic oft used military maneuver when the direction of incomings is unknown. Maybe he did have his suspicions and acted on them? It kinda looks cowarldy, but is it really?

Of course not. He covered his wife's body with his own for upwards of 25 seconds after the last shot.

[David Andrews]

I think the newmans were asked to stay put by photographers fo a time. Hester seems to make sure his wife stayed down then moved, she then sat up. Maybr he felt a need to make sure. Down on the ground is a classic oft used military maneuver when the direction of incomings is unknown. Maybe he did have his suspicions and acted on them? It kinda looks cowarldy, but is it really?

Of course not. He covered his wife's body with his own for upwards of 25 seconds after the last shot.

OK - I didn't know that the Newmans were asked to stay put so their pix could be snapped; they look damned frightened. Knowing about the photographers' request changes appearances.

Is there a stabilized Wiegman film I can look at before further comment? I had a link to one but it's lost, as my computer's in the shop and I'm working with a loaner.

Edited February 25, 2010 by David Andrews

[Todd W. Vaughan]

I think the newmans were asked to stay put by photographers fo a time. Hester seems to make sure his wife stayed down then moved, she then sat up. Maybr he felt a need to make sure. Down on the ground is a classic oft used military maneuver when the direction of incomings is unknown. Maybe he did have his suspicions and acted on them? It kinda looks cowarldy, but is it really?

Of course not. He covered his wife's body with his own for upwards of 25 seconds after the last shot.

OK - I didn't know that the Newmans were asked to stay put so their pix could be snapped; they look damned frightened. Knowing about the photographers' request changes appearances.

Is there a stabilized Wiegman film I can look at before further comment? I had a link to one but it's lost, as my computer's in the shop and I'm working with a loaner.

I don't know of any request on Wiegman's part for them to stay put why he filmed.

[David Andrews]

I think the newmans were asked to stay put by photographers fo a time. Hester seems to make sure his wife stayed down then moved, she then sat up. Maybr he felt a need to make sure. Down on the ground is a classic oft used military maneuver when the direction of incomings is unknown. Maybe he did have his suspicions and acted on them? It kinda looks cowarldy, but is it really?

Of course not. He covered his wife's body with his own for upwards of 25 seconds after the last shot.

OK - I didn't know that the Newmans were asked to stay put so their pix could be snapped; they look damned frightened. Knowing about the photographers' request changes appearances.

Is there a stabilized Wiegman film I can look at before further comment? I had a link to one but it's lost, as my computer's in the shop and I'm working with a loaner.

I don't know of any request on Wiegman's part for them to stay put why he filmed.

It's implied in John's post that it was Cancellare's request, or just his presence standing over the Newmans, that kept them down on the lawn. Wiegman was filming moving footage on the run, and then (I'm assuming from the Wiegman film editing) got the Newmans while Cancellare had them in place.

Edited February 25, 2010 by David Andrews

[Jack White]

The Newmans WERE NOT POSING FOR PHOTOGRAPHERS. They were frightened out of their wits. They were in the line of fire.

Oddly, Ike Altgens stood over them, AND DID NOT TAKE A PHOTO, if we are to believe the official story.

[Todd W. Vaughan]

I think the newmans were asked to stay put by photographers fo a time. Hester seems to make sure his wife stayed down then moved, she then sat up. Maybr he felt a need to make sure. Down on the ground is a classic oft used military maneuver when the direction of incomings is unknown. Maybe he did have his suspicions and acted on them? It kinda looks cowarldy, but is it really?

Of course not. He covered his wife's body with his own for upwards of 25 seconds after the last shot.

OK - I didn't know that the Newmans were asked to stay put so their pix could be snapped; they look damned frightened. Knowing about the photographers' request changes appearances.

Is there a stabilized Wiegman film I can look at before further comment? I had a link to one but it's lost, as my computer's in the shop and I'm working with a loaner.

I don't know of any request on Wiegman's part for them to stay put why he filmed.

It's implied in John's post that it was Cancellare's request, or just his presence standing over the Newmans, that kept them down on the lawn. Wiegman was filming moving footage on the run, and then (I'm assuming from the Wiegman film editing) got the Newmans while Cancellare had them in place.

I understand that, but I think it's just a surmise in Johns part. What I'm saysing is, I don't know of anything in the record that indicates that Cancellare (or anyone) suggested they stay put while he filmed.

Weigman was already filming the Newmans when Canceallare took his first photo. By the time of Cancellares 2nd photo, close up of the Newmans, Weigman had already left.