Review of Joan Mellen's new book on LBJ

[Chris Newton]

She also devotes a chapter to the USS Liberty incident. She did several face to face interviews with some of the survivors.

I am not an expert on this issue. But her interpretation of the events is that this was supposed to be a false flag operation: once the Liberty was sunk, with no survivors, the USA was going to blame the attack on Egypt, and then America would attack Cairo to expand the war.

Was this what Operation Cyanide was as outlined by James Angleton on that BBC special?

I've been following the Liberty incident for years. I first became interested when I learned the Liberty's Capt. was the only modern CMOH recipient not to be awarded his medal by the President at the Whitehouse.

[James DiEugenio]

Thanks Vince, I would have to agree with that list and I would also add to it that the assertions of the late Madeleine Brown have not stood up well either.

Chris: Since you have been following it, do you agree with her conclusions?

I have also heard that the Liberty was monitoring the Israeli invasion of Syria which the USA was against--that this was the reasons for the attack.

[Thomas Graves]

Dear Jim,

Syria?

Really?

Or is it more likely that Liberty was monitoring the massing of Israeli soldiers and tanks, etc, as Israel prepared to secretly invade Sinai, the Golan Heights (Syria), and that Israel was afraid Liberty's transmissions would be intercepted by the Soviets and forwarded to the Egyptians.

-- Tommy

(edited 10/12/16)

Edited October 12, 2016 by Thomas Graves

[Sandy Larsen]

Outstanding review, Jim. It would seem the LBJ-did-it theory was dealt a mortal blow by Joan's book. LBJ didn't duck in the car, the fingerprint is NOT Wallace's, Wallace was not in or near Dallas in any case, and Estes seems like a big prevaricator. The essential underpinnings of the LBJ-did-it theory have crumbled. Other than the "who benefits" notion, there is no "there" there.

Sorry Vince, the fingerprint indeed is Mac Wallace's. As I will be showing when I can find the time.

Joan Mellen's print examiner was given an altered fingerprint.

[Pat Speer]

Dear Jim,

Syria?

Really?

Or is it more likely that Liberty was monitoring the massing of Israeli soldiers and tanks, etc, as Israel prepared to secretly invade Sinai, and that Israel was afraid Liberty's transmissions would be intercepted by the Soviets and forwarded to the Egyptians?

-- Tommy

Don't you mean

Syria?

Syria-sly?

As far as the Liberty, I've read a number of accounts--including some accounts from the sailors on the Liberty. From these it was quite clear that the Israelis did indeed make an awful mistake in the heat of battle. The Liberty we should recall, was at the mercy of the Israelis, just sitting there waiting to be sunk. But the Israelis didn't finish it off. It seems likely from this that the israelis attacked and then said "Oh, crap, what do we do now?" Perhaps they even asked their higher-ups for permission to finish it off so they could blame the sinking on Egypt. But the higher-ups said no.

And no, that's not a whitewash of LBJ's role in the incident. It's not a coincidence that the same president who used a nearly non-existent naval run-in with North Vietnam as an excuse to start a major war, swept a far-more aggressive naval attack by Israel under the carpet. I mean, you would think we would cut-off funding for a year or some such thing. But no, we let Israel pay something like 20 mil in damages--which is a joke when you consider they paid this out of the billions we were giving them at the time.

[Larry Hancock]

Pat, I'm afraid the Israeli's did not make a simple mistake....and once they were aware of the vessel as flagged U.S. they kept on attacking...and attacking....the Israeli ID was was even monitored on SIGNET by U.S. intel aircraft. I'm not going into this here further since I wrote about it in some detail in Surprise Attack, including the latest research done on the intercepts and who knew what as well as Johnson's despicable orders to call back carrier aircraft on their way to repel attacks that were still in progress on the ship. Why the Israeli's did what they did, with full knowledge of the identity of the ship has been discussed...including what the ship itself may well have picked up in terms of a war crime in progress. Anyway, anyone who has Surprise Attack can see the story I pieced together from some really good and relatively recent investigative work by others. As to LBJ, he should have been prosecuted and jailed for his actions on this alone...

[Dawn Meredith]

Outstanding review, Jim. It would seem the LBJ-did-it theory was dealt a mortal blow by Joan's book. LBJ didn't duck in the car, the fingerprint is NOT Wallace's, Wallace was not in or near Dallas in any case, and Estes seems like a big prevaricator. The essential underpinnings of the LBJ-did-it theory have crumbled. Other than the "who benefits" notion, there is no "there" there.

Sorry Vince, the fingerprint indeed is Mac Wallace's. As I will be showing when I can find the time.

Joan Mellen's print examiner was given an altered fingerprint.

Another person who no longer comments on JFK assassination issues, and who was a long time friend of J's (from the 50's) and is very well known in the critical community told me years ago that he had independent info on this to prove the match. I messaged him on fb two days ago but he said he is done with all of this, that "authors" just twist things to make their point.

Yup Mac Wallace was a good guy who only murdered one time.

J Harrison was a bad researcher because he never wrote a book or posted here.

I did read the review when it was posted on my fb page and commented there.

Life is too short to try to argue with those with an agenda.

Joan should try living here in TX for awhile.

[Douglas Caddy]

Joan Mellen has requested that I post her comment below and I am privileged to do so:

I am a firm believer in the First Amendment, which includes protection of lies. One point, however, should be corrected since there is not a shred of evidence as to its validity. That is that the US Navy fingerprints of Mac Wallace were altered or tampered with in any way. I did not request these prints of the Navy. I requested from the National Archives Mac Wallace's military file. Included in that file, along with many other documents, were the fingerprints taken when Wallace joined the U.S. Marines in 1939. (J Harrison never was able to access these prints; they were not floating around; they were not part of his files). That these prints matched the Austin prints, were of "the same person" according to Robert Garrett, is further evidence that the Navy prints were Mac Wallace's.

[James DiEugenio]

Tommy:

The Golan Heights were taken from Syria by Israel during the Six Day War. Which, in retrospect, is looking more and more like a land grab.

Pat:

I do not for two minutes think that the attack on the Liberty was a mistake. Having read the excuses, to me they are a combination of outright lies, and half truths. A "mistake" does not go on for two hours, while two American flags are flying, the communication antennas are the first targets, and the attack is by both land and sea, plus the Israelis were almost on board the ship.

Let me add this: What LBJ did here was simply a conclusion to his sweeping reversal of Kennedy's foreign policy in almost every major aspect of the world and every theater of conflict. Kennedy's plan for the Middle East was:

1. Stop either side from attaining atomic weapons, but especially Israel.

2. Cure the split Eisenhower and Dulles had made with Nasser.

3. Try and democratize the monarchies in the Arab world, as in Iran.

4. Stop the Dulles alliance with Saudi Arabia.

5. In a second administration, begin to approach the Palestinian problem.

All of the above was either halted or reversed by Johnson--which is why Nasser threatened to break relations with the USA in 1966. And then did so in 1967. LBJ was firmly in the Israeli camp and was pro Shah because of his friendship with the Rockefellers. This reversal was continued by Nixon and Kissinger. And the end result is what we have today.

Chris: So after your years of study, what is your take on the Liberty.

Edited October 12, 2016 by James DiEugenio

[Pat Speer]

Tommy:

The Golan Heights were taken from Syria by Israel during the Six Day War. Which, in retrospect, is looking more and more like a land grab.

Pat:

I do not for two minutes think that the attack on the Liberty was a mistake. Having read the excuses, to me they are a combination of outright lies, and half truths. A "mistake" does not go on for two hours, while two American flags are flying, and the communication antennas are the first targets.

And let me add this: What LBJ did here was simply a conclusion to his sweeping reversal of Kennedy's foreign policy in almost every major aspect of the world and every theater of conflict. Kennedy's plan for the Middle East was:

1. Stop either side from attaining atomic weapons, but especially Israel.

2. Cure the split Eisenhower and Dulles had made with Nasser.

3. Try and democratize the monarchies in the Arab world, as in Iran.

4. Stop the Dulles alliance with Saudi Arabia.

5. In a second administration, begin to approach the Palestinian problem.

All of the above was either halted or reversed by Johnson who was firmly in the Israel camp and was pro Shah because of his friendship with the Rockefellers. And that was continued by Nixon and Kissinger.

Chris: So after your years of study, what is your take on the Liberty.

Of course it was a mistake. After the attack, the Israelis sat there wondering what to do. They then sent a signal offering help. If they'd wanted to sink the Liberty, they could have done so quite easily.

As far as all these theories that they were trying to stop us from figuring out such and such, and decided not to sink the ship once their objective had been met, these presuppose that the U.S. would have interfered with Israel's doing what it wanted to do--something none of us have ever seen in our lifetimes...or are likely to see in what remains of our lives...

Saying Israel attacked the U.S. to stop it from interfering with their plans in the mideast is like saying a guard dog bit its owner so it wouldn't help the burglar. It makes a heckuva lot more sense to think the dog bit its owner by mistake, IMO.

P.S. I consider Israel's attacking the U.S. by mistake to be a far worse "war crime" than if they'd attacked us on purpose. It's like a cop shooting a kid. If you shoot a kid because he has a toy gun and you think it's real, that's one thing. But if you shoot a kid because you fail to take the time to realize he's an unarmed kid, and instead convince yourself he's an adult in the process of charging you, that's something else altogether. The Liberty was clearly marked, and in international waters, but got attacked anyhow. In the middle of a hectic war, the Israelis screwed up and attacked their closest ally. In the many reviews of the incident, it came out that they miscalculated the speed at which the Liberty was approaching and that they incorrectly matched the profile of the ship to an Egyptian ship that looked nothing like it. These were colossal blunders, reflective of poor training and a "shoot first, ask questions later" attitude. While this may not sit well with many Americans' deluded impression of Israeli military brilliance, it sits perfectly well with the more sober reality of a nation so bent on self-preservation that they shoot children who throw rocks, and sit by while camps of civilians get massacred.

Edited October 12, 2016 by Pat Speer

[Roger DeLaria]

Outstanding review, Jim. It would seem the LBJ-did-it theory was dealt a mortal blow by Joan's book. LBJ didn't duck in the car, the fingerprint is NOT Wallace's, Wallace was not in or near Dallas in any case, and Estes seems like a big prevaricator. The essential underpinnings of the LBJ-did-it theory have crumbled. Other than the "who benefits" notion, there is no "there" there.

Sorry Vince, the fingerprint indeed is Mac Wallace's. As I will be showing when I can find the time.

Joan Mellen's print examiner was given an altered fingerprint.

Another person who no longer comments on JFK assassination issues, and who was a long time friend of J's (from the 50's) and is very well known in the critical community told me years ago that he had independent info on this to prove the match. I messaged him on fb two days ago but he said he is done with all of this, that "authors" just twist things to make their point.

Yup Mac Wallace was a good guy who only murdered one time.

J Harrison was a bad researcher because he never wrote a book or posted here.

I did read the review when it was posted on my fb page and commented there.

Life is too short to try to argue with those with an agenda.

Joan should try living here in TX for awhile.

Agreed there, Dawn. I'm not here to argue and convince anyone, I've got other things to do.

Sandy,

Sounds great. Thanks for your efforts, I look forward to seeing what you present.

[James DiEugenio]

Pat:

The Liberty was not a battleship, it was not a destroyer. Anyone with any military experience would know it was a communications vessel since it had so many antennae on it. And these were the first target of the Israeli fighter planes.

The idea that the Israeli Air Force mistook it for an Egyptian ship is ridiculous. For starters, the Egyptian ship Israel said they mistook it for was less than half the size of the Liberty, and was in port at Alexandria. Here are some more reasons: Liberty was flying an American flag, it was numerically marked with the Jane's ships code for a communications vessel, Israeli reconnaissance flights monitored the ship from the early morning of the day of the attack, so they had to have seen both. Even after the Liberty sent out an SOS signal, the attack continued with the Israeli commander saying, "You have your orders." (Mellen, p. 197) When the Israeli fighters' cannon ripped apart the first flag, the surviving sailors put up a second flag. (ibid)

At this point, a second set of Israeli jets started a second round of sorties, with napalm. And the torpedo boats moved in. The first torpedo hit the ship killing 26. (ibid p. 198) When the Sixth Fleet responded to the SOS, and sent jet planes to intercede, LBJ called them back. (p. 202) Are you going to say that neither Johnson nor McNamara knew that the Liberty was an American ship?

According to Mellen, no American relief arrived until 17 hours after the attack. (p. 204) Which is simply unbelievable if it was all a mistake.

Edited October 12, 2016 by James DiEugenio

[Glenn Nall]

"Anyone with any military experience would know it was a communications vessel since it had so many antennas on it."

really, Jim? kind of a "strong" statement there, man.

I was US Navy. USS Forrestal, CV59. That's an aircraft carrier, Viet Nam era. In all my military experience I never once sat through any training on any of the lesser boats. I wouldn't know a destroyer from a frigate.

perhaps I have once again failed to rise to a certain, acceptable standard. I shall try harder.

what branch were you in...?

[Sandy Larsen]

Joan Mellen has requested that I post her comment below and I am privileged to do so:

I am a firm believer in the First Amendment, which includes protection of lies. One point, however, should be corrected since there is not a shred of evidence as to its validity. That is that the US Navy fingerprints of Mac Wallace were altered or tampered with in any way. I did not request these prints of the Navy. I requested from the National Archives Mac Wallace's military file. Included in that file, along with many other documents, were the fingerprints taken when Wallace joined the U.S. Marines in 1939. (J Harrison never was able to access these prints; they were not floating around; they were not part of his files). That these prints matched the Austin prints, were of "the same person" according to Robert Garrett, is further evidence that the Navy prints were Mac Wallace's.

There is indeed evidence that the alleged Navy prints were tampered with. Either that or Mac Wallace's pinky print changed fairly significantly over time. I am in the process of preparing the evidence so that it can be understood by folks without their having to do a great deal of studying.

Actually, the proof is there for anybody to see. Just compare the Navy prints to the Austin prints. Focus on the area where Garrett has labeled 8 mismatches A thru H. The alterations flipped 6 matches into 5 mismatches as counted by Garrett.

Garrett was correct about three mismatches. And Darby was undoubtedly aware of them.

I am not accusing any particular person of doing this. I don't know who did.

[James DiEugenio]

Dawn and Roger:

It was in 1984 that Billy Sol Estes accused LBJ and Wallace of killing all those people, including Josefa Johnson. Thirty two years later, outside of Estes' accusations, what is the evidence for Wallace performing those murders? Especially now since the fingerprint evidence is rendered dubious?

Jay Harrison never wrote, not just a book, but to my knowledge he never wrote an essay. Beyond that, where had he ever posted anything? So how do we know what kind of researcher he was, and what was the quality of his judgment? As far as I can see, there isn't any way to do so.

As per Sandy, evidently he still has not read Joan's book. Garrett concluded that the Austin prints and the Navy print belonged to the same person. (See p. 259)

But neither matched the WC box print. (ibid)

Edited October 12, 2016 by James DiEugenio