Yes, Oswald was an Intelligence agent

[Paul Trejo]

Naw...just because some young Marine knew about some spy stuff -- that, all by itself, doesn't make him a "spook."

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited October 28, 2016 by Paul Trejo

[Jim Hargrove]

Oswald's Spy Camera…

The FBI tried to pull a vanishing act because… well… owning an expensive “spy camera” when you’re supposedly as poor as a church mouse might just make you seem to be a spy! Wouldn't want people to get the wrong idea!

A "small German camera" was listed on the Dallas Police Department’s handwritten inventory list as well as the DPD typewritten list. Three days later the "small German camera" was listed as "Minox Camera" (item #375) on the joint DPD/FBI inventory list. When the DPD film of Oswald's possessions was developed at the FBI laboratory in Washington, DC a few days later, the Minox camera had disappeared. The FBI then announced they had received a "Minox light meter" instead of a "Minox camera" and pressured the Dallas Police to change their inventory list from a camera to a light meter. To their credit, the Dallas Police refused.

John Armstrong reports that the Minox camera may have disappeared while at the FBI, but it is still among “Lee Harvey Oswald’s” so-called possessions at the National Archives. John examined the camera and reported that it was much heavier than it should have been, as if it had been filled with glue or something heavy. The camera could also not be opened, which is required to see the serial number.

Remember folks... LEE HARVEY OSWALD WAS NOT A SPY. NO SIRREE!!

[Paul Trejo]

Actually -- spy cameras were not impossible to obtain. Any spy wannabe could get one.

As for LHO's income -- we haven't seen his Tax Returns yet.

But LHO got lots of income from outside sources. One rumor says he was a local informer for the FBI. That's not impossible -- but that doesn't make him an "Intelligence Agent," only a snitch.

Also, LHO got money from Clay Shaw in New Orleans. I believe Jim Garrison demonstrated that, and it was confirmed by LHO's New Orleans buddy, Ron Lewis (1993). So, money was not the obstacle.

Just knowing the word, "microdots" doesn't prove that person was a CIA Agent. Also, owning a spy camera doesn't prove it either.

Actually -- Jim Hargrove and John Armstrong never show real proof that LHO was a CIA Agent.

Actually -- all the evidence goes to show that LHO, this 23-year old high-school dropout who could hardly spell and who couldn't drive a car, was just one more ambitious Marine who wanted to be hired by the CIA. He tried and failed.

Instead, LHO got involved with soldiers of fortune in New Orleans, and got himself patsified.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited October 28, 2016 by Paul Trejo

[Chris Newton]

Megathanks to Chris Newton for finding the Richard Mosk interview

I can't take any credit for finding it, that was Gary Murr in this thread:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=23151&p=335996

[Jim Hargrove]

Just knowing the word, "microdots" doesn't prove that person was a CIA Agent. Also, owning a spy camera doesn't prove it either.

Actually -- Jim Hargrove and John Armstrong never show real proof that LHO was a CIA Agent.

ALLEN DULLES: There is a terribly hard thing to disprove, you

know. How do you disprove a fellow was not your agent: How do

you disprove it?

CONG. HALE BOGGS (Dem. La): You could disprove it, couldn't you?

DULLES: No ...

BOGGS: ...Did you have agents about whom you had no record

whatsoever?

DULLES: The record might not be on paper. But on paper would

have hieroglyphics that only two people knew what they meant, and

nobody outside of the agency would know and you could say this

meant the agent and somebody else could say this meant another

agent...

BOGGS: ...Let's say [u-2 pilot Francis Gary] Powers did not have

a signed contract, but he was recruited by someone in CIA. The

man who recruited him would know, wouldn't he?

DULLES, Yes, but he wouldn't. tell.

CHIEF JUSTICE EARL WARREN: Wouldn't tell it under oath?

DULLES: I wouldn't think he would tell it under oath, no..

WARREN: Why?

DULLES: He ought not tell it under oath. Maybe not tell it to

his own government, but wouldn't tell it any other way.

COMMISSIONER JOHN McCLOY: Wouldn't he tell it to his own chief?

DULLES: He might or might nut. If he was a bad one, then he

wouldn't.

For someone who bases his research on the veracity of Marina's testimony, this demand for iron-clad documentation from the CIA is rather laughable.

[Paul Trejo]

For someone who bases his research on the veracity of Marina's testimony, this demand for iron-clad documentation from the CIA is rather laughable.

Jim,

The fact that the CIA is sworn to secrecy regarding their International missions is merely exploited by the CIA-did-it CTers.

Because of this silence on the part of the CIA, these CTers claim they can just insert any old fiction they want, and then claim that the CIA silence about it, and their lack of evidence, is their proof that it's true.

That nonsense has been going on for 50 years now. It's old and tired.

You don't believe Marina Oswald, but all you have to contradict her are guesswork and spooky fiction. It's a new generation. People want solid evidence. John Armstrong provides guesswork and science fiction. Marina Oswald and Ruth Paine provided sworn testimony. But you disregard it for fiction.

John Armstrong would rather exploit dozens of cases of "mistaken identity" with regard to Lee Harvey Oswald, and capitalize on the mystique begun by Mark Lane and Jim Garrison a half-century ago.

Not me. The 21st century reader enjoys the writings of Larry Hancock, the Lopez-Hardway Report (2003), Bill Simpich's free eBook, State Secret: Wiretapping in Mexico City (2014), and Jeff Caufield's, General Walker and the Murder of President Kennedy (2015). These writers use 21st century FOIA documents to show that blaming the CIA for the JFK murder is just lazy thinking.

Blaming the CIA is just too easy -- too pat. There was no "coup-d-etat". That's drama-queen nonsense.

The silliest argument (courtesy CTKA) that Ruth Paine was in the CIA is that her mother-in-law had a childhood friend who later became the lover of Allen Dulles. Talk about lazy thinking!

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited October 28, 2016 by Paul Trejo

[Chris Newton]

Not me. The 21st century reader enjoys the writings of Larry Hancock, the Lopez-Hardway Report (2003), Bill Simpich's free eBook, State Secret: Wiretapping in Mexico City (2014), and Jeff Caufield's, General Walker and the Murder of President Kennedy (2015). These writers use 21st century FOIA documents to show that blaming the CIA for the JFK murder is just lazy thinking.

I've read all the works you cited above, except the book by Caufield, so I'm pretty sure 4 out of 5 of those authors are NOT on board with this statement:

There was no "coup-d-etat".

...unless they've taken your quote literally and disagree with your spelling:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coup_d%27%C3%A9tat

[Paul Brancato]

It's the books you leave out that are so telling. I'm not going to enumerate, because unlike you I am just exchanging with the folks here, not trying to outsmart them, or convince some invisible audience that I'm right.

[Jim Hargrove]

U-2, Brute?

Strikes me as downright silly to find nothing wrong with a radar technician operating near U-2 spy flights defecting to Russia, telling the U.S. embassy in Moscow he would tell the Russians everything he knows, and not being charged with treason on his return to the U.S. This was the height of the Cold War! Francis Gary Powers, who was shot down in a U-2 over Russia while Oswald was there, thought our boy was responsible.

Lt. John Donovan said Oswald knew all kinds of things, including squadron radio frequencies, range of units’ radio and radar, and much more. Powers said Oswald had access to all the equipment, knew the altitudes the planes could reach, flight durations, and the directions the flight went.

Of course, high-level U.S. officials didn’t seem to be worried about any of this when Oswald “defected.” I wonder why.

When Oswald returned, we’re supposed to believe the CIA had no contact with him whatsoever. Like, they wouldn’t even be interested in what kinds of questions the Russkies asked him when he was in Moscow. Seriously?

Edited October 28, 2016 by Jim Hargrove

[Thomas Graves]

U-2, Brute?

Strikes me as downright silly to find nothing wrong with a radar technician operating near U-2 spy flights defecting to Russia, telling the U.S. embassy in Moscow he would tell the Russians everything he knows, and not being charged with treason on his return to the U.S. This was the height of the Cold War! Francis Gary Powers, who was shot down in a U-2 over Russia while Oswald was there, thought our boy was responsible.

Lt. John Donovan said Oswald knew all kinds of things, including squadron radio frequencies, range of units’ radio and radar, and much more. Powers said Oswald had access to all the equipment, knew the altitudes the planes could reach, flight durations, and the directions the flight went.

Of course, high-level U.S. officials didn’t seem to be worried about any of this when Oswald “defected.” I wonder why.

When Oswald returned, we’re supposed to believe the CIA had no contact with him whatsoever. Like, they wouldn’t even be interested in what kinds of questions the Russkies asked him when he was in Moscow. Seriously?

Dear Jim,

Hasn't it been shown that Oswald was interviewed / debriefed by the CIA upon his return to the U.S.?

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=6237

-- Tommy

Edited October 28, 2016 by Thomas Graves

[Jim Hargrove]

Tommy,

Phil Melanson (Spy Saga) speculated that Oswald was debriefed by CIA during a two-day stay in Amsterdam on his way back home, but I don't think anyone in the USG has confirmed or denied that. If anyone knows otherwise I'd love to hear about it.

The official denials have been going on for decades.

Edited October 28, 2016 by Jim Hargrove

[Thomas Graves]

U-2, Brute?

Strikes me as downright silly to find nothing wrong with a radar technician operating near U-2 spy flights defecting to Russia, telling the U.S. embassy in Moscow he would tell the Russians everything he knows, and not being charged with treason on his return to the U.S. This was the height of the Cold War! Francis Gary Powers, who was shot down in a U-2 over Russia while Oswald was there, thought our boy was responsible.

Lt. John Donovan said Oswald knew all kinds of things, including squadron radio frequencies, range of units’ radio and radar, and much more. Powers said Oswald had access to all the equipment, knew the altitudes the planes could reach, flight durations, and the directions the flight went.

Of course, high-level U.S. officials didn’t seem to be worried about any of this when Oswald “defected.” I wonder why.

When Oswald returned, we’re supposed to believe the CIA had no contact with him whatsoever. Like, they wouldn’t even be interested in what kinds of questions the Russkies asked him when he was in Moscow. Seriously?

Dear Jim,

Hasn't it been shown that Oswald was interviewed / debriefed by the CIA upon his return to the U.S.?

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=6237

-- Tommy

PS Do intelligence agencies normally tell the public who they have or haven't debriefed?

Edited October 28, 2016 by Thomas Graves

[Jim Hargrove]

I imagine the CIA doesn't normally tell the public who they have or haven't debriefed.

But this is not a normal case.

They told everyone for ages that they had NEVER contacted Oswald. We all assume that's not true, but it is what we're supposed to believe.

[Jim Hargrove]

Tommy….

Why would the USG have allowed “Lee Harvey Oswald” to “defect” to the Soviet Union with all his knowledge of the U-2, etc?

The Russkies might have pulled out his toenails and crushed his scrotum in a vice. Can YOU resist that kind of questioning??

HINT: Was the LHO in Japan the same LHO as was in the Philippines? I know you’re a Greg Parker surrogate here. Why not just open up and talk?

[Jim Hargrove]

QUESTION: Why did our government not care a bit when “Lee Harvey Oswald,” U-2 radar technician, “defected” to Russia?

ANSWER: Because he was NOT the same “Lee Harvey Oswald” who “defected” to Russia in 1959! See HarveyandLee.net!