Greg Parker sums up the Warren Commission's case perfectly

[Sandy Larsen]

5 hours ago, Bill Brown said:

8 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Oswald was arrested at the Texas Theater on suspicion he did not pay for a ticket.

5 hours ago, Bill Brown said:

Only a person completely unfamiliar with the events surrounding Tippit's death and the Dallas Police Department's frantic search for the killer would make a comment like this one above.

 

Well, what do you think Julia Postal said to the police when she called them?

 

[James DiEugenio]

At the risk of being strangled if I ever get to Indiana, to go through all the problems with Julia Postal as a witness, I mean whew.

According to Jones Harris, when he questioned her on this matter, she broke down and cried.  Could not continue.

You can make all kinds of excuses for the police being a mile or so away etc.

But people forget, that is not the first place the cops went to, is it?  They first went to the Jefferson Branch Library.  

It was that phone call that got them to the Texas Theater.  And she said that somehow this guy was acting suspiciously and hiding in the balcony.

The 1:46 police dispatch said  that a suspect was in the theater supposedly hiding in the balcony.

[Charles Blackmon]

3 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

 And she said that somehow this guy was acting suspiciously and hiding in the balcony.

The 1:46 police dispatch said  that a suspect was in the theater supposedly hiding in the balcony.

The balcony-lurker was most likely the same cat who killed Tippit, and was later whisked out the back door after Oswald was led out the front door. Greg Doudna has written extensively about the theater escapade.

[James DiEugenio]

John Armstrong wrote about Bernard Haire, who had a shop with an alley in the back where you could see the rear of the theater.

Until about 1991, he thought the suspect came out the back of the theater.

And there is more than one police report that says the suspect was arrested in the balcony.

[Sandy Larsen]

12 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

The 1:46 police dispatch said  that a suspect was in the theater supposedly hiding in the balcony.

 

Given that that Johnny Brewer told Julia Postal that the guy was behaving suspiciously, it seems reasonable to me for Postal to call the police if she had heard about the president's killing.

What doesn't seem reasonable to me is for a large number of squad cars to respond when so little was known at the time.

 

[James DiEugenio]

Sandy:

If you go through Postal's testimony, its very difficult to make the case that she ever saw Oswald.

Was Oswald ever in the balcony?  I don't think so.

And let us not not even get into Butch Burroughs.  Talk about a can of worms.

 

 

 

[Bob Ness]

7 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

You're ohhhhhhh so right here, Bill.

I get so tired of hearing CTers confront me with that tired old canard/myth/red herring, in which the CTer is trying to tell me that the ONLY reason the police went to the Texas Theater on November 22nd was because somebody didn't pay for a theater ticket. I just want to strangle the person who has the gall to say that to me (such as the CTer I was talking to in 2016 at the link below):

DVP's JFK Archives / The Real Reason The Cops Swarmed The Texas Theater On 11-22-63

 

Not very convincing retort. I For one am surprised this clown show avoided a twelve car pile up ala Keystone Cops outside the theater. You'd think at least a few of the 26 would be out looking for the assassin of the President except it was a foregone conclusion decided well before their response that he was at the theater. Because of a description of a medium height guy in a brown suit? Aren't we supposed to swallow whole the idea of how unreliable eyewitnesses are even when they're two feet away from a murder?

Of course I'm not going into the undeniable fact that these same people can't figure out how to close a door. This portion of the entire response is just another wormy fish in a hold full of them. Hope ya like the metaphor.

[David Von Pein]

4 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

What doesn't seem reasonable to me is for a large number of squad cars to respond when so little was known at the time.

You and I argued about that very thing at this forum seven years ago. The reasonable (and obvious) answer is the same now as it was then....

 

SANDY LARSEN SAID:

Police cars swarmed in as though they had a positive identification on Oswald, when all they really had was a report of suspicious activity by some guy.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

A policeman had just been gunned down in the general area of the theater in Oak Cliff, and the police get a call very shortly after that shooting from a citizen who told them that a person in the theater (who generally matches the description of Officer Tippit's killer) is "running from them for some reason" and is also ducking the sirens....

And you think the police should have dispatched just--what?--one patrol car to investigate?

That's funny, Sandy.


SANDY LARSEN SAID:

The movie theater is a mile from where Tippit was shot. Not exactly nearby.

Nevertheless....

I would expect the police to send two squad cars with four officers to check it out. One car for out front and the other for out back.

Certainly NOT 15 squad cars and 26 officers! How ridiculous!


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

So, Sandy, are you actually suggesting that those "26 officers" were part of some plot to frame Oswald as of 1:45 PM CST on November 22nd? Is that what you're saying?

To use your own words --- How ridiculous!

IMO / FWIW....

The Dallas Police Department, of course, was certainly not privy to any advanced information as to the whereabouts of Lee Harvey Oswald in the Texas Theater on November 22, 1963. That notion is a tremendously ludicrous one, in my view.

But as far as the mindset of the Dallas Police at the time when many police cars were dispatched to the Texas Theater in Oak Cliff on that Friday in 1963, I think it's quite likely that many of those police officers did make a possible connection in their minds (even if they didn't want to admit it later on) between President Kennedy's assassination and the murder of the policeman.

After all, the police knew the President had been shot just 45 minutes before a police officer was also shot and killed. And the two shootings occurred just a few miles apart. And the DPD also knew that the description they had of the suspect in the Presidential shooting was "similar" to the description they had of the suspect who had just shot the policeman. Here's one of the radio transmissions that was made over the DPD radio system at 1:28 PM Dallas time on November 22:

Dispatcher -- "Notify 1 that officer involved in this shooting, Officer J.D. Tippit, we believe, was pronounced DOA at Methodist. 1:28 p.m."

Deputy Chief of Police N.T. Fisher -- "Is there any indication that it has any connection with this other shooting?"

Dispatcher -- "Well, the descriptions on the suspect are similar and it is possible."

----------

Given these circumstances, Sandy, what would YOU have done if you had been the Dallas Police Department's dispatcher on 11/22/63?

More....

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2016/02/jfk-assassination-arguments-part-1106.html

 

Edited June 8, 2023 by David Von Pein

[Matt Allison]

I don't have a horse in this race, but I just want to point out a bit of factual info based on my experience living in Chicago and having a few cops as friends:

You will not find a more numerous in numbers reaction, or level of intensity during response, from the police than when a fellow cop has been murdered.

They travel in large numbers in those scenarios, and unless there was another place a suspect had been reported to be, every cop that was able, likely tried to get to the Texas Theater at that moment.

[Sandy Larsen]

5 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

10 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

What doesn't seem reasonable to me is for a large number of squad cars to respond when so little was known at the time.

5 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

You and I argued about that very thing at this forum seven years ago. The reasonable (and obvious) answer is the same now as it was then....

 

SANDY LARSEN SAID:

Police cars swarmed in as though they had a positive identification on Oswald, when all they really had was a report of suspicious activity by some guy.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

A policeman had just been gunned down in the general area of the theater in Oak Cliff, and the police get a call very shortly after that shooting from a citizen who told them that a person in the theater (who generally matches the description of Officer Tippit's killer) is "running from them for some reason" and is also ducking the sirens....

And you think the police should have dispatched just--what?--one patrol car to investigate?

That's funny, Sandy.


SANDY LARSEN SAID:

The movie theater is a mile from where Tippit was shot. Not exactly nearby.

Nevertheless....

I would expect the police to send two squad cars with four officers to check it out. One car for out front and the other for out back.

Certainly NOT 15 squad cars and 26 officers! How ridiculous!


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

So, Sandy, are you actually suggesting that those "26 officers" were part of some plot to frame Oswald as of 1:45 PM CST on November 22nd? Is that what you're saying?

To use your own words --- How ridiculous!

IMO / FWIW....

The Dallas Police Department, of course, was certainly not privy to any advanced information as to the whereabouts of Lee Harvey Oswald in the Texas Theater on November 22, 1963. That notion is a tremendously ludicrous one, in my view.

But as far as the mindset of the Dallas Police at the time when many police cars were dispatched to the Texas Theater in Oak Cliff on that Friday in 1963, I think it's quite likely that many of those police officers did make a possible connection in their minds (even if they didn't want to admit it later on) between President Kennedy's assassination and the murder of the policeman.

After all, the police knew the President had been shot just 45 minutes before a police officer was also shot and killed. And the two shootings occurred just a few miles apart. And the DPD also knew that the description they had of the suspect in the Presidential shooting was "similar" to the description they had of the suspect who had just shot the policeman. Here's one of the radio transmissions that was made over the DPD radio system at 1:28 PM Dallas time on November 22:

Dispatcher -- "Notify 1 that officer involved in this shooting, Officer J.D. Tippit, we believe, was pronounced DOA at Methodist. 1:28 p.m."

Deputy Chief of Police N.T. Fisher -- "Is there any indication that it has any connection with this other shooting?"

Dispatcher -- "Well, the descriptions on the suspect are similar and it is possible."

----------

 

5 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

Given these circumstances, Sandy, what would YOU have done if you had been the Dallas Police Department's dispatcher on 11/22/63?

 

I would expect the dispatcher to send two squad cars with four officers to check it out. One car for out front and the other for out back.

Certainly NOT 15 squad cars and 26 officers! How ridiculous!

The fact that so many squad cars showed up IMO indicates that the dispatcher radioed that the suspect had been positively identified. And that this was later scrubbed from the dictabelt.

 

[Bob Ness]

4 hours ago, Matt Allison said:

I don't have a horse in this race, but I just want to point out a bit of factual info based on my experience living in Chicago and having a few cops as friends:

You will not find a more numerous in numbers reaction, or level of intensity during response, from the police than when a fellow cop has been murdered.

They travel in large numbers in those scenarios, and unless there was another place a suspect had been reported to be, every cop that was able, likely tried to get to the Texas Theater at that moment.

Fair enough but how many COULD be available in a large city already responding to an assissination of POTUS? I can't imagine there weren't already dozens of helpful citizens calling in all manner of sightings - or was that the only one? I don't know but per DVPs post the identification of the suspect seems threadbare enough to call into question a major response to the sighting while everyone is supposed to be after an assassin.

Throw in the undeniable bungling and outright corruption of every other aspect of the DPD and it all doesn't add up. It's too pat. And it doesn't take everyone to be in on it as DVP tries to infer while speculating about the reasons behind the response.

Edited June 8, 2023 by Bob Ness

[Jonathan Cohen]

1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:

I would expect the dispatcher to send two squad cars with four officers to check it out. One car for out front and the other for out back.

Certainly NOT 15 squad cars and 26 officers! How ridiculous!

The fact that so many squad cars showed up IMO indicates that the dispatcher radioed that the suspect had been positively identified. And that this was later scrubbed from the dictabelt.

 

Just because YOU expect something to happen doesn't mean that expectation is any way based in reality. And naturally, you append your evidence-free speculation with yet another claim that all the evidence is fake. Does it ever end?

[Sandy Larsen]

21 minutes ago, Jonathan Cohen said:

Just because YOU expect something to happen doesn't mean that expectation is any way based in reality. And naturally, you append your evidence-free speculation with yet another claim that all the evidence is fake. Does it ever end?

 

The Warren Commission speculated, so why can't I? Especially since DVP asked me to. (When he asked me "what would YOU have done.)

P.S. Go annoy somebody else.

 

[Steve Thomas]

I don't blame the police too much for the massive response. A fellow officer had been gunned down, and the last reports were that the subject was on foot.

The distance from 10th and Patton to the Texas Theater is roughly .5 or (1/2) a mile'

The average walking speed is 3 miles per hour, or 20 minutes a mile. Oswald should have been able to cover that half a mile in 10 minutes.

The question for me is, if Tippit was shot at 1:16 and the first radio call on the suspect at the Theater came in at 1:45, where was Oswald in that half an hour?

Steve Thomas

[Paul Cummings]

1 hour ago, Steve Thomas said:

I don't blame the police too much for the massive response. A fellow officer had been gunned down, and the last reports were that the subject was on foot.

The distance from 10th and Patton to the Texas Theater is roughly .5 or (1/2) a mile'

The average walking speed is 3 miles per hour, or 20 minutes a mile. Oswald should have been able to cover that half a mile in 10 minutes.

The question for me is, if Tippit was shot at 1:16 and the first radio call on the suspect at the Theater came in at 1:45, where was Oswald in that half an hour?

Steve Thomas

Where was Oswald once he got in the Rambler? Looking around a 20 minute gap from about 12:40PM till TT.