Why Nobody Whose Anybody Wants to kill RFK Jr. RFK on the issues

[Kirk Gallaway]

What I really want to do here is highlight RFK Jr. on the issues.

 

We have to get out of personalities and bloodlines and evaluate candidates because of their stands on the issues of the day. You have to figure out what you want, be aware of current issues, and demand your candidate wants that, not give in completely because of someone's family ties that you have compassion for.

 

This is a good interview with RFK Jr. on "Breaking Points" because the hosts are well versed politically  and there's enough time to pin the candidate down. We''l leave the hot vaccine issue out.

On the border issue RFK' Jrs  characteristically vague on actual  policy but I like his sentiments. But we'll focus on the topics given major emphasis here, health care,energy policy and environmental issues..

 

14:00: Krystal Ball. Do you believe in universal healthcare, whether it's a Medicare for all program?

RFK Jr.-My highest ambition is to have a single payer system where others can have private insurance, but I don't know how realistic that would be.

 

What about your Father's "I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

That response is so ill prepared and it ends up being corporate in that it professes good intentions but maintains the status quo. Has he not been listening for the last decade? or is he so entrenched with the people who would oppose it? He's down on the vaccine companies but actually favors pharma,  he goes off on a long lament about how people in the U.S.take too many drugs, which I agree, but proposes no public option to big pharma prices. Bottom line, pharmacy  profits in tact!

 

.

RFK---"I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

RFK Jr. is really saying I can't imagine a system where there''s not rampant price gouging.  I can't imagine a system without an unnecessary middleman who screws the whole system up. He doesn't offer a hint of imagination!

But then he goes on to enumerate the nation's health problems, but he doesn't address any substantive solution despite being prodded to by Krystal Ball.

 

Then this erroneous claim that there are so many more people with chronic diseases now because of big  pharma, pushing drugs on us. But part of that is because more chronic disease that has always existed has now been diagnosed. You can disagree and say there's over diagnosis, but that's not what RFK Jr. is saying. Again, it's true, we're way over medicated. But what do you propose  to do about it?

 

17:00--About Energy, he's reminded from Saagar that his family was into big public initiatives that never had the chance to bear fruit. Is there a place now for such initiatives with the energy market and investment into alternative energy?

Rfk Jr. says no, let the government get out, it's too regulated. RFK Jr: "A true free market promotes efficiency and efficiency eliminates waste and pollution is waste!" 

What kind of corporate libertarian garbage is this?  Pollution is the result of the unfettered free market!

RFK Jr. "In a true energy market you can't get rich without making your neighbors rich". 

WTF is he talking about? Does he even know?.'

 

28:00 RFK JR on the environment: "I believe climate crisis is an existential threat but I don't insist others believe that." Then he goes on with a list to try to show he's aware of what "99% of climate scientists" believe. Then cites that Exon and major industry people back in the 70's did tests and proved to themselves that climate change, as result of burning fossil fuels was real. But ends by saying, he's not going to be making climate change an issue in his campaign! He's not going to do anything because evil totalitarian forces like the people at Davos have used climate for totalitarian purposes! But the translation is, he's not really going to do anything because he feels he doesn't have the right to ask industry to curtail their profits!  Even though he'll always end up winding  on a long litany of complaints to let you know he knows the problems. He doesn't propose solutions! He really doesn't want to compel anyone to do anything!

 

He is the absolute opposite of his father. If you really want someone whose milquetoast and won't twist arms. I hate to say it, but you might as well keep someone, without any wacky views to damage his credibility,  who has 30 years of negotiating skill , for piece meal change over time and wait for "28"  and hopefully more younger voters..

I personally don't want that, but somebody better has got to come on the scene.

 

This is why nobody whose anybody wants to kill RFK Jr.

 

 

 

*I've been a good boy and called attention to the recent RFK Jr. spamming and with previous other topics, I always tried to respect the rules involving bringing up politics on the JFKA side. But when I've gotten involved it was to call attention to the political spamming and in some cases, as last resort to offer a counterbalance so the dominant narrative that was being repetitively pounded out might stop.

But after so much abuse of the rules by others. I think I'm entitled to at least 24 hours with this thread. I plan to add to it.

 

 

 

[Joe Bauer]

Robert Kennedy was much easier to get as far as his core ideological beliefs and goals than RFK Jr. imo.

We knew in spades that he considered Organized Crime in the United States a much more powerful, influential and dangerous threat to our society than the average American could even imagine.

His book "The Enemy Within" detailing this threat was a wake up call he felt the American people needed to hear and heed.

He took on Organized Crime like no top American leader had ever done.

He went after Sam Giancana. He went after Carlos Marcello. He went after Jimmy Hoffa.

And RFK took on J. Edgar Hoover who until RFK became AG really didn't go after OG ... for who knows what reasons.

RFK was a pit bull in that fight arena. Fearless. JFK himself wasn't near as committed. JFK even enjoyed some perks from some mob people, at least in regards to Judith Campell Exner.

I also think RFK was clearer about his stance on race relations and the disparity of wealth versus poverty that was just as real in the early 60's as it is today.

RFK certainly also shared his brother's mistrust over the beyond mandate power accumulation of the intelligence agencies by 1962 that had reached constitutional balance of power threat levels.

RFK also hated LBJ and knew what a ruthless and corrupt person he really was. Include in that LBJ and Hoover's "like brothers" nefarious bond.

Speaking of our "free market" system, imo it is one that needs constant and serious vigilance in oversite that the corporate elite are constantly trying to undermine and weaken. Too often we fail in that responsibility.

The term "free market" is one that is constantly manipulated to grossly perverted degrees whenever it is needed to justify the gains of the wealthiest minority class at the losing expense of the rest of society.

In that context, this corporate wealthy class benefitting free market system has brought us to the following state of societal stresses:

Basic need costs in this country have exploded to levels that are so insanely high they are financially stressing half our citizenry to unprecedented degrees.

Full time jobs don't even pay the rent now.

50 years ago the government advised Americans that 1/3rd of their incomes should go for housing.

Now, for over 50% of Americans, rent takes 100% of their one full time job take home pay!

Here are the incomes needed to rent a 2 bedroom "apartment" in the highest rent areas of California:

 

 

KRON San Francisco

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This California county is most expensive in U.S. for renters, and it’s not SF

Story by Amy Larson • Yesterday 5:10 PM

 

 

 

IN THIS ARTICLE

Hourly wage necessary to afford a two-bedroom apartment

• Santa Cruz – $63.33
• San Francisco – $61.31
• San Jose and Sunnyvale and Santa Clara – $56.56
• Oakland and Fremont – $46.25
• Napa – $45.92
• Santa Rosa – $43.31
• Vallejo – $37.75

 

 

 

Annual income necessary to afford a two-bedroom apartment

• Santa Cruz – $131,720
• San Francisco – $127,520
• San Jose and Sunnyvale and Santa Clara – $117,640
• Oakland and Fremont – $96,200
• Napa – $95,520
• Santa Rosa – $90,080
• Vallejo and Fairfield – $78,520

And throw in highest ever gas prices, food prices, health care, car care, you name it...it's out of control ( and it's been this way for over 20 years ) and the fact is this minority wealthy class benefitting "Free Market" price gouging is so crushing...millions ( tens of millions) of young Americans are holding off on marriage, having children, you name it. This is fact.

We've never seen such a society changing dynamic like this in my 70 year long lifetime.

Young people with 4 year college degrees can't make it on their own anymore.

Throw in growing homeless populations.

And yet, when the hyper-inflated nationwide mortgage pyramid scam collapsed during George Bush's second term...the corporate elite ran to Obama and demanded "too big to fail" bailouts to cover their losses. A massive corporate welfare bail out...and they got it!

That unprecedented massive corporate welfare give away was "the opposite" of the "Free Market" economic model precepts the wealthy class always cry out we must have to keep our nation economically safe and vibrant.

RFK Jr. is a good America caring person imo.

Yet, I hope someone else becomes the Democratic party candidate.

And I pray RFK Jr. doesn't turn to a third party candidacy. Doing so will guarantee the Republicans a victory in 2024.

 

Edited June 28, 2023 by Joe Bauer

[Matt Allison]

2 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

And I pray RFK Jr. doesn't turn to a third party candidacy. Doing so will guarantee the Republicans a victory in 2024.

Once again, there is no love on the Dem side for RFK Jr.; he will not be the Dem nominee.

He is exclusively speaking to and courting MAGA types.

He is only siphoning support from Trump and DeSantis.

[Benjamin Cole]

7 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

What I really want to do here is highlight RFK Jr. on the issues.

 

We have to get out of personalities and bloodlines and evaluate candidates because of their stands on the issues of the day. You have to figure out what you want, be aware of current issues, and demand your candidate wants that, not give in completely because of someone's family ties that you have compassion for.

 

This is a good interview with RFK Jr. on "Breaking Points" because the hosts are well versed politically  and there's enough time to pin the candidate down. We''l leave the hot vaccine issue out.

On the border issue RFK' Jrs  characteristically vague on actual  policy but I like his sentiments. But we'll focus on the topics given major emphasis here, health care,energy policy and environmental issues..

 

14:00: Krystal Ball. Do you believe in universal healthcare, whether it's a Medicare for all program?

RFK Jr.-My highest ambition is to have a single payer system where others can have private insurance, but I don't know how realistic that would be.

 

What about your Father's "I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

That response is so ill prepared and it ends up being corporate in that it professes good intentions but maintains the status quo. Has he not been listening for the last decade? or is he so entrenched with the people who would oppose it? He's down on the vaccine companies but actually favors pharma,  he goes off on a long lament about how people in the U.S.take too many drugs, which I agree, but proposes no public option to big pharma prices. Bottom line, pharmacy  profits in tact!

 

.

RFK---"I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

RFK Jr. is really saying I can't imagine a system where there''s not rampant price gouging.  I can't imagine a system without an unnecessary middleman who screws the whole system up. He doesn't offer a hint of imagination!

But then he goes on to enumerate the nation's health problems, but he doesn't address any substantive solution despite being prodded to by Krystal Ball.

 

Then this erroneous claim that there are so many more people with chronic diseases now because of big  pharma, pushing drugs on us. But part of that is because more chronic disease that has always existed has now been diagnosed. You can disagree and say there's over diagnosis, but that's not what RFK Jr. is saying. Again, it's true, we're way over medicated. But what do you propose  to do about it?

 

17:00--About Energy, he's reminded from Saagar that his family was into big public initiatives that never had the chance to bear fruit. Is there a place now for such initiatives with the energy market and investment into alternative energy?

Rfk Jr. says no, let the government get out, it's too regulated. RFK Jr: "A true free market promotes efficiency and efficiency eliminates waste and pollution is waste!" 

What kind of corporate libertarian garbage is this?  Pollution is the result of the unfettered free market!

RFK Jr. "In a true energy market you can't get rich without making your neighbors rich". 

WTF is he talking about? Does he even know?.'

 

28:00 RFK JR on the environment: "I believe climate crisis is an existential threat but I don't insist others believe that." Then he goes on with a list to try to show he's aware of what "99% of climate scientists" believe. Then cites that Exon and major industry people back in the 70's did tests and proved to themselves that climate change, as result of burning fossil fuels was real. But ends by saying, he's not going to be making climate change an issue in his campaign! He's not going to do anything because evil totalitarian forces like the people at Davos have used climate for totalitarian purposes! But the translation is, he's not really going to do anything because he feels he doesn't have the right to ask industry to curtail their profits!  Even though he'll always end up winding  on a long litany of complaints to let you know he knows the problems. He doesn't propose solutions! He really doesn't want to compel anyone to do anything!

 

He is the absolute opposite of his father. If you really want someone whose milquetoast and won't twist arms. I hate to say it, but you might as well keep someone, without any wacky views to damage his credibility,  who has 30 years of negotiating skill , for piece meal change over time and wait for "28"  and hopefully more younger voters..

I personally don't want that, but somebody better has got to come on the scene.

 

This is why nobody whose anybody wants to kill RFK Jr.

 

 

 

*I've been a good boy and called attention to the recent RFK Jr. spamming and with previous other topics, I always tried to respect the rules involving bringing up politics on the JFKA side. But when I've gotten involved it was to call attention to the political spamming and in some cases, as last resort to offer a counterbalance so the dominant narrative that was being repetitively pounded out might stop.

But after so much abuse of the rules by others. I think I'm entitled to at least 24 hours with this thread. I plan to add to it.

 

 

 

If you read CIA-mouthpieces such as The Rolling Stone, or The Daily Beast, the vitriol, the feculent invective surely suggests lethal intent.

In the US, we are accustomed to thinking of the right-wing as affiliated with security-state apparatus and media witch-hunts. There is a sordid history along those lines (see the JFKA). 

Now the left-wing (or what passes for the left-wing, hollowed out by ID politics) has decided fascism is the way to go. 

If the fascist-state cannot murder RFK Jr's campaign and keep the incapacitated, compliant Biden in place...then what is the next step? 

[W. Niederhut]

Kirk,

     This interview really covers some of the good, the bad, and the ugly about RFK, Jr.

     The Good.  Endorsing single-payer healthcare, (insurance corporations siphon roughly one-third of every U.S. healthcare dollar away from healthcare goods and services) de-funding America's "forever wars," and the endorsing the scientific validity of the existential crisis of climate change.

     The Bad.   Limiting the role of government in regulating the destructive profiteering of oil industry moguls?  Huh?  When climate change is an existential threat to humanity?  This makes no sense at all.  If climate change is an existential threat, government has to intervene.  There is no "invisible hand" in free market capitalism to promote clean energy as a necessary alternative to burning fossil fuels and destroying the planet.  Duh.

     Declining to criticize Trump's unprecedented, historic assault on American democracy, or Trump's massive tax cuts for corporations and billionaires?

     Declining to criticize the Trump/Reagan/GOP Starve-the-Beast paradigm for undermining Social Security and Medicare?

     Come on RFK, Jr....  Are you really a Kennedy, or have you simply been living in Malibu too long?

     The Ugly.  Bragging about his grandfather's opposition to Western intervention against Hitler prior to 1943?  Then, in a similar vein, RFK, Jr. tries to both sides the Russian invasion of Ukraine, admitting that Putin has been atrocious, but intervention is not worth the sacrifice?  This makes no sense.

     RFK, Jr. is confused about the difference between our misguided, imperialist "forever wars" and the necessary defense of democracy and international law.

     

Edited June 26, 2023 by W. Niederhut

[Benjamin Cole]

5 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

Robert Kennedy was much easier to get as far as his core ideological beliefs and goals than RFK Jr. imo.

We knew in spades that he considered Organized Crime in the United States a much more powerful, influential and dangerous threat to our society than the average American could even imagine.

His book "The Enemy Within" detailing this threat was a wake up call he felt the American people needed to hear and heed.

He took on Organized Crime like no top American leader had ever done.

He went after Sam Giancana. He went after Carlos Marcello. He went after Jimmy Hoffa.

And RFK took on J. Edgar Hoover who until RFK became AG really didn't go after OG ... for who knows what reasons.

RFK was a pit bull in that fight arena. Fearless. JFK himself wasn't near as committed. JFK even enjoyed some perks from some mob people, at least in regards to Judith Campell Exner.

I also think RFK was clearer about his stance on race relations and the disparity of wealth versus poverty that was just as real in the early 60's as it is today.

RFK certainly also shared his brother's mistrust over the beyond mandate power accumulation of the intelligence agencies by 1962 that had reached constitutional balance of power threat levels.

RFK also hated LBJ and knew what a ruthless and corrupt person he really was. Include in that LBJ and Hoover's "like brothers" nefarious bond.

Speaking of our "free market" system, imo it is one that needs constant and serious vigilance in oversite that the corporate elite are constantly trying to undermine and weaken. Too often we fail in that responsibility.

The term "free market" is one that is constantly manipulated to grossly perverted degrees whenever it is needed to justify the gains of the wealthiest minority class at the losing expense of the rest of society.

Basic need costs in this country for over half our population have exploded to levels that are stressing everyone to unprecedented degrees.

Full time jobs don't even pay the rent now.

50 years ago the government advised Americans that 1/3rd of their incomes should go for housing.

Now, for over 50% of Americans, rent takes 100% of their one full time job take home pay!

And throw in highest ever gas prices, food prices, health care, car care, you name it...it's out of control ( and it's been this way for over 20 years ) and the fact is this "Free Market" price gouging in so crushing...millions ( tens of millions) of young Americans are holding off on marriage, having children, you name it.

Young people with 4 year college degrees can make it on their own anymore.

Throw in growing homeless populations.

And yet, when the hyper-inflated nationwide mortgage pyramid scam collapsed during George Bush's second term...the corporate elite ran to Obama and demanded "too big to fail" bailouts to cover their losses. A massive corporate welfare bail out...and they got it!

That unprecedented massive corporate welfare give away was the opposite of the "Free Market" economic model precepts.

RFK Jr. is a good America caring person imo.

Yet, I hope someone else becomes the Democratic party candidate.

And I pray RFK Jr. doesn't turn to a third party candidacy. Doing so will guarantee the Republicans a victory in 2024.

 

I enjoy your non-jaundiced non-partisan commentary. 

RFK Jr is certainly the man to back for the White House, IMHO. 

 

[W. Niederhut]

4 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Kirk,

     This interview really covers some of the good, the bad, and the ugly about RFK, Jr.

     The Good.  Endorsing single-payer healthcare, (insurance corporations siphon roughly one-third of every U.S. healthcare dollar away from healthcare goods and services) de-funding America's "forever wars," and the endorsing the scientific validity of the existential crisis of climate change.

     The Bad.   Limiting the role of government in regulating the destructive profiteering of oil industry moguls?  Huh?  When climate change is an existential threat to humanity?  This makes no sense at all.  If climate change is an existential threat, government has to intervene.  There is no "invisible hand" in free market capitalism to promote clean energy as a necessary alternative to burning fossil fuels and destroying the planet.  Duh.

     Declining to criticize Trump's unprecedented, historic assault on American democracy, or Trump's massive tax cuts for corporations and billionaires?

     Declining to criticize the Trump/Reagan/GOP Starve-the-Beast paradigm for undermining Social Security and Medicare?

     Come on RFK, Jr....  Are you really a Kennedy, or have you simply been living in Malibu too long?

     The Ugly.  Bragging about his grandfather's opposition to Western intervention against Hitler prior to 1943?  Then, in a similar vein, RFK, Jr. tries to both sides the Russian invasion of Ukraine, admitting that Putin has been atrocious, but intervention is not worth the sacrifice?  This makes no sense.

     RFK, Jr. is confused about the difference between our misguided, imperialist "forever wars" and the necessary defense of democracy and international law.

     

Addendum:  Here's hoping that MAGA Ben Cole won't hijack this thread about RFK, Jr.'s controversial positions on progressive issues with more of his moronic, redundant spam about Donks and the "Deep State."

Edited June 26, 2023 by W. Niederhut

[Benjamin Cole]

Kirk:

Are you ever concerned that what what used to be the D-Party has become coopted in by Big Defense, Big Pharma, Wall Street, Silicon Valley, the globalists and affiliated media and security state? 

The Donks are not really left wing anymore (they fly the rainbow flag, but that is about it)---but is left-wing state fascism what we are witnessing now? 

The Niagara of feculent invective poured onto RFK Jr. so early in his campaign...what is the genesis of this? The Daily Beast and Rolling Stone are CIA mouthpieces. But Donks are hopping on the CIA character assassination of RFK Jr., the best hope for the rancid carcass of party in a generation. 

In the US, due to historical circumstance, we tend to think of right-wing fascism.

But now..seems like Donk-state fascism is taking hold or perhaps even ascendent. 

See the CCP for how that works out. 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Benjamin Cole

[Kirk Gallaway]

7 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Kirk,

     This interview really covers some of the good, the bad, and the ugly about RFK, Jr.

     The Good.  Endorsing single-payer healthcare, (insurance corporations siphon roughly one-third of every U.S. healthcare dollar away from healthcare goods and services) de-funding America's "forever wars," and the endorsing the scientific validity of the existential crisis of climate change.

Just to be clear W.. RFK Jr. thinks single payer health, (while allowing others to choose their insurance) is an impossible dream.

14 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

RFK Jr.-My highest ambition is to have a single payer system where others can have private insurance, but I don't know how realistic that would be.

 

But it's not at all impossible. That's what prompted me to invoke his Father. "I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

He's just been listening to his insurance industry cronies. With RFK JR's 's  thinking,, nothing will ever get done.

 

W. _endorsing the scientific validity of the existential crisis of climate change.

RFK JR.--"I believe climate crisis is an existential threat but I don't insist others believe that."

and ends by saying, he's not going to be making climate change an issue in his campaign!

So what good does it do to endlessly recite climate scientists if he doesn't have the courage  to even make it an issue in his campaign!

W. de-funding America's "forever wars,"

I'll go with you on that. But others will point out here ,we both disagree about his judgment concerning the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

So even  2/3rds of the "good" premise is false. He will fight for neither single payer health care or the climate.

But I completely agree with you about the "bad" and the "ugly" but  in fairness, they didn't ask him about tax cuts and Social Security. But we know RFK's sort of milquetoast on Trump. He actually more recently called Trump a "great debater" and doubted Biden could hold a candle in a debate with Trump.

What RFK Jr. actually seems to have forgot. Trump and Biden did debate ....in 2020.  We know in the first debate when Trump was thrashing around like a child that he was coming on to covid infection, and possibly could have infected Biden! I honestly wondered how Biden would hold up in that debate, and Trump did exactly what I expected a bully to do. He tried from the onset to intimidate Biden and make him stutter and he failed. Chris Wallace couldn't keep any order, and Biden held his own, looked more mature and Presidential and won the debate.

When RFK Jr. complemented Trump as a great debater, he said he'd be able to beat him in a debate. Obviously none of us want to pick on RFK's speech problem. But his voice already drops out in interviews like this. Imagine him being on a 10  month campaign giving stump speeches several times every day!

But on the other hand, I was sort of impressed with the Fetterman phenomena, that people do have sympathy and will vote for people who have a disability.

I  would say RFK's manager Dennis Kucinich would probably be a much more hands on candidate than RFK Jr. but doesn't have the blood and the background story.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Kirk Gallaway

[Benjamin Cole]

22 minutes ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Just to be clear W.. RFK Jr. thinks single payer health, (while allowing others to choose their insurance) is an impossible dream.

But it's not at all impossible. That's what prompted me to invoke his Father. "I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

He's just been listening to his insurance industry cronies. With RFK JR's 's  thinking,, nothing will ever get done.

 

W. _endorsing the scientific validity of the existential crisis of climate change.

RFK JR.--"I believe climate crisis is an existential threat but I don't insist others believe that."

and ends by saying, he's not going to be making climate change an issue in his campaign!

So what good does it do to endlessly recite climate scientists if he doesn't have the courage  to even make it an issue in his campaign!

W. de-funding America's "forever wars,"

I'll go with you on that. But others will point out here ,we both disagree about his judgment concerning the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

So even  2/3rds of the "good" premise is false. He will fight for neither single payer health care or the climate.

But I completely agree with you about the "bad" and the "ugly" but  in fairness, they didn't ask him about tax cuts and Social Security. But we know RFK's sort of milquetoast on Trump. He actually more recently called Trump a "great debater" and doubted Biden could hold a candle in a debate with Trump.

What RFK Jr. actually seems to have forgot. Trump and Biden did debate ....in 2020.  We know in the first debate when Trump was thrashing around like a child that he was coming on to covid infection, and possibly could have infected Biden! I honestly wondered how Biden would hold up in that debate, and Trump did exactly what I expected a bully to do. He tried from the onset to intimidate Biden and make him stutter and he failed. Chris Wallace couldn't keep any order, and Biden held his own, looked more mature and Presidential and won the debate.

When RFK Jr. complemented Trump as a great debater, he said he'd be able to beat him in a debate. Obviously none of us want to pick on RFK's speech problem. But his voice already drops out in interviews like this. Imagine him being on a 10  month campaign giving stump speeches several times every day!

But on the other hand, I was sort of impressed with the Fetterman phenomena, that people do have sympathy and will vote for people who have a disability.

I  would say RFK's manager Dennis Kucinich would probably be a much more hands on candidate than RFK Jr. but doesn't have the blood and the background story.

 

 

 

 

 

People will vote for Feinstein or Biden.  Even senility is not a barrier to holding office. 

Trump may have to move the White House into Sing-Sing, if he is elected. 

What options to do the American people have? 

Well, RFK Jr.

But he is a white supremacist, conspiracy nut and a threat to democracy...according to modern media. 

[Kirk Gallaway]

As evidenced by the hysteric response of the last couple of weeks. For years, asking tough questions about JFK  and now   RFK Jr. have always been met with a rather cultish response here  ignoring all substantive arguments and then blaming the mere asking of those questions  on the "MSM Deep State" who of course are out to get the Kennedys!

If you can't talk substance. Stop making villains of the people who can.

 

Excuse me but although I don't agree much with Saagar, these people are not "Deep State"!

You can tell both Saagar and Ball  have great respect for the Kennedy family and the sacrifices they've made.

You can also tell both Saagar who is to the right and Ball who is to the  left are often  left scratching their heads. They'd come back once and sometimes twice with their questions and were  disappointed in Rfk Jr's responses.

But we all think he's a sincere guy, but unfortunately he comes off as a corporate candidate masquerading as  a populist, or with his climate stand, just outright corporate.

 

But where is RFK Jr. really at? I don't think he knows. But he can easily be captivated by people he hangs around with and a few of them, are corporate billionaires.

 

I can tell you even if  Corporate America doesn't overwhelmingly endorse Elon Musk,  they love the fact that RFK Jr. interviews both Elon Musk and Twitter founder and CEO of Square, Jack Dorsey and loves  that RFK Jr said of Musk that he's "rescuing democracy and free speech in America".*  Even if they don't especially agree with that statement.  They take comfort that Jr's no Bernie Sanders, ( a remote killable prospect) and some of their ilk has power to the throne! 

 

You can see the same cycle over and over again in the interview. He enumerates many problems and wants you to know he understands all the them.

But regarding policy, he appears looking for a consensus within himself and............. will end up saying................  I don't know.

 

It is ok for a candidate involving very complex questions to sometimes say he doesn't know. But once you're running for President those issues should be at a minimum. But for example saying climate change will not be an issue in his campaign because he doesn't want to ruffle feathers is just  abdication.

 

 

 

*Yeah tell that to my twitter feed that was interrupted when Musk took over and I had to wade through about 2 weeks of Glenn Greenwald! Who I would only occasionally read previously!

 

[Joe Bauer]

Just viewed a video of a shirtless RFK Jr. doing pushups and flexing his pecs.

 

RFK Jr Shirtless Push-ups Makes Some Internet Users Hot - The …

Web21 hours ago · Posted on Jun 26, 2023 A shirtless, be-denimed Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is all over Twitter, trying to prove he is fit to be the next president. The 2024 Democratic …

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Edited June 29, 2023 by Joe Bauer

[W. Niederhut]

Mods,

     Can we do something about Ben Cole's MAGA spam (e.g., repeating the endless Trump/Fox tropes about Biden's alleged "senility") on these threads where we are trying to discuss RFK, Jr.'s positions on a number of key foreign and domestic policy issues?

     Ben has a long history of spamming forum discussions of history and politics with redundant Trump/Fox tropes.

     In fact, Ben's redundant MAGA spam played a major role in ruining the 56 Years thread.

     Subsequently, Ben refused to post his MAGA spam at the MAGA Water Cooler echo chamber.  Instead, he continues to post it here on the JFKA board.

[Roger Odisio]

13 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Just to be clear W.. RFK Jr. thinks single payer health, (while allowing others to choose their insurance) is an impossible dream.

But it's not at all impossible. That's what prompted me to invoke his Father. "I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

He's just been listening to his insurance industry cronies. With RFK JR's 's  thinking,, nothing will ever get done.

 

W. _endorsing the scientific validity of the existential crisis of climate change.

RFK JR.--"I believe climate crisis is an existential threat but I don't insist others believe that."

and ends by saying, he's not going to be making climate change an issue in his campaign!

So what good does it do to endlessly recite climate scientists if he doesn't have the courage  to even make it an issue in his campaign!

W. de-funding America's "forever wars,"

I'll go with you on that. But others will point out here ,we both disagree about his judgment concerning the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

So even  2/3rds of the "good" premise is false. He will fight for neither single payer health care or the climate.

But I completely agree with you about the "bad" and the "ugly" but  in fairness, they didn't ask him about tax cuts and Social Security. But we know RFK's sort of milquetoast on Trump. He actually more recently called Trump a "great debater" and doubted Biden could hold a candle in a debate with Trump.

What RFK Jr. actually seems to have forgot. Trump and Biden did debate ....in 2020.  We know in the first debate when Trump was thrashing around like a child that he was coming on to covid infection, and possibly could have infected Biden! I honestly wondered how Biden would hold up in that debate, and Trump did exactly what I expected a bully to do. He tried from the onset to intimidate Biden and make him stutter and he failed. Chris Wallace couldn't keep any order, and Biden held his own, looked more mature and Presidential and won the debate.

When RFK Jr. complemented Trump as a great debater, he said he'd be able to beat him in a debate. Obviously none of us want to pick on RFK's speech problem. But his voice already drops out in interviews like this. Imagine him being on a 10  month campaign giving stump speeches several times every day!

But on the other hand, I was sort of impressed with the Fetterman phenomena, that people do have sympathy and will vote for people who have a disability.

I  would say RFK's manager Dennis Kucinich would probably be a much more hands on candidate than RFK Jr. but doesn't have the blood and the background story.

 

 

 

 

 

Just to be clear W.. RFK Jr. thinks single payer health, (while allowing others to choose their insurance) is an impossible dream.

 

RO:  I'm going to respond to this one argument of yours because it is such a blatant distortion.  That's not what Junior said. Here is what he did say: "My highest ambition would be to have a single payer program with people who want to have private programs able to do so."  IOW that's what he would want to do as President.

 

He then added: "I don't know how politically realistic that is, but if I would design a system from the beginning that is what I would do."    Junior knows a lot about the broken health system we now have. He knows a lot about the stranglehold the insurance companies and pharma have on Congress. Single payer has been around since Truman and has never come close to passage despite the fact that every other advanced country has some form of it.

 

It's a fact that it will be difficult to achieve.  

 

But to claim he said is was impossible as if it is some kind of bait and switch promise so common with politicians, is blatantly false

 

  On 6/26/2023 at 12:08 PM, Kirk Gallaway said:

RFK Jr.-My highest ambition is to have a single payer system where others can have private insurance, but I don't know how realistic that would be.

 

But it's not at all impossible. That's what prompted me to invoke his Father. "I ask about things that never were and ask why not?

 

He's just been listening to his insurance industry cronies. With RFK JR's 's  thinking,, nothing will ever get done.

 

RO:  Oh look.  You actually used part of Junior's quote which shows you changed "I don't know how possible that would be" to he said it was impossible. Odd.  How did you think you would get away with that?

 

"Insurance industry cronies".  Who?  Characterizing Junior as "corporate".  Ludicrous. Have you listened to what Junior is saying (he's already said a lot) beyond looking for something to cherry pick?

 

 

 

[Greg Doudna]

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2023/06/robert-f-kennedy-jr-presidential-campaign-misinformation-maga-support/674490/ .

Edited June 28, 2023 by Greg Doudna