Rob Reiner And Soledad O'Brien Aim To Reveal JFK's Real Killers

[James DiEugenio]

I was working with Rob for some months.

I was supposed to be the researcher on the docudrama. 

But the docudrama fell through.

Dave Hoffman is an actor and writer.  He was going to be the screenwriter of the docudrama.

He wrote the first installment, which was actually  good.

But there was nothing about Tosh Plumlee in the draft I saw.

BTW was not Plumlee part of the Bob Vernon package--you know James Files-- and before that he was promoted by Peter Lemkin?

I repeat: there are two major biographies of Rosselli. By Rappleye and Becker, and by Lee Server.

As I recall, neither places him in Dallas on the 22nd.

 

Edited November 12, 2023 by James DiEugenio

[James DiEugenio]

BTW, this version of Johnny R will differ from the Mamet/Collozi version.

In that one Rosselli is in Chicago on the instructions of Giancana.

[Larry Hancock]

Gosh, I think this is about the first time I've seen someone reject doing research on a source making such spectacular claims.  On the other hand a quick Google search shows a lot of contemporary stories which just take Tosh at face value so I suppose that's just where we are these days; its amazing how little fact checking is in any of them.

Still, you might want to check this out since it harks back earlier days on this same forum and brings back several names from the past who used to frequent it - and the depth of the exchanges that were pretty routine back then.

https://groups.google.com/g/alt.conspiracy.jfk/c/gQ_b49XNSuE

 

 

[Jonathan Cohen]

3 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:

Gosh, I think this is about the first time I've seen someone reject doing research on a source making such spectacular claims.

Unfortunately, an alarming number of regular posters on this forum treat the concept of research this way on a daily basis. There is no conspiracy theory too loony for folks here to accept at face value, and it makes the community at large look extremely foolish.

[James DiEugenio]

He can't recall which airport it was Roselli landed at?

What does the goodbye part refer to Larry?

[Larry Hancock]

Jim, I have no idea about the goodby part, I primarily posted this as an example of how long the Plumlee story  had been going on and how it had been discussed in regard to the Ed Forum.  It is important to recall that Bob Vernon originated a good bit of the discussion of both Files and Plumlee and that by the time it was all done admitted that he had arrived at the conclusion that both were making up things regarding their assassination related experiences - he admitted that in posts and personally to me in several related emails.

As I recall that was after Vernon had essentially sold his rights on the whole thing to William D.

The thread I posted also illustrates how the Files and Plumlee stories became "entangled" over time.  It would be interesting to see when and in what fashion Plumlee first introduced Roselli as being on his flight and find out if it was after Vernon had released his video tapes on Files (and for transparency  I rushed to the store to buy the Files tape myself, it was hugely sensational at the time).

In any event I've issued my caution on Plumlee so I will leave it at that.

 

 

 

[Pamela Brown]

On 11/10/2023 at 11:10 AM, S.T. Patrick said:

I'll believe this when I hear it. Maybe I'm shell-shocked by 30 years of History Channel documentaries where they spend 55 minutes laying out a wonderful case for conspiracy only to have the final five minutes be dedicated to "But here's why LHO acting alone is still the most plausible explanation." No matter how good Reiner's episodes are, the one that matters most is the final one of the series. That's it. That's the one. It's the final five minutes of the History Channel doc.

Trolling conspiracy and then ending with 'that silly little Communist', was the main theme of the 2013 coverage of the JFK assassination.  Why should we expect anything different this time around?

[Larry Hancock]

Seems I just can't help myself, what I had posted earlier reminded me about Vernon and a further search on he and Plumlee produced the following, with documents on Plumlee, from Carmine's research.

https://www.tpaak.com/the-abort-team-story

[James DiEugenio]

Let us not forget, in the many years--at times decades-- people are involved in the JFK case; sometimes weeks, and months are spent going down what ends up a false path.

After it is discarded, its not unusual to forget the details, especially when its years later.

Again, as this link shows, it was originally Johnny R but in the current version, its now Johnny and Hunt?

And Plumlee is on the record as saying he had no contact with Johnny from 1963-68? 

[James DiEugenio]

On 11/11/2023 at 1:28 AM, John Deignan said:

At the 15:50 mark of episode 1 Rob Reiner says “ We met with CIA asset named Tosh Plumlee who flew CIA agent E Howard Hunt and mobster Johnny Roselli to Dallas that day…”

Repeat, when did Hunt get added to the mix?

Hunt was on an abort mission?

As I said, Rosselli here does not match to Mamet/Colozzi.

And the Hunt story here does not match to Hemming.

 

Edited November 12, 2023 by James DiEugenio

[John Deignan]

1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

Repeat, when did Hunt get added to the mix?

Hunt was on an abort mission?

As I said, Rosselli here does not match to Mamet/Colozzi.

And the Hunt story here does not match to Hemming.

 

In the podcast Reiner says when he was filming LBJ in 2015  he got introduced Dick Russel and from there met with Plumlee. Never heard about Hunt on the plane before. Can't recall Plumlee ever saying this before or at all for that matter.

[James DiEugenio]

Thanks for that John.

And I do not recall Hunt either.

[Benjamin Cole]

In general, when anyone makes fantastic claims about any topic, including the JFKA, the onus is on the claim to prove itself out. 

Earnest researchers know and honor this reality, and try to provide enough evidence to back up their claims. For example, in science the idea replicable experiments is honored. 

History is a bit more challenging, but the basic premise holds: If you have a claim to make, be prepared to provide enough evidence so that a detached observer has a reason to believe you. 

Do not begrudge an audience for wanting to see evidence. That is a necessity. 

[Robin Finn]

Via the Wayback Machine, a defunct site with documents on Plumlee can be viewed at :

http://web.archive.org/web/20120309064142/http://toshplumlee.info/

Reading these reveals that Plumlee claimed to have seen Roselli in Nicaragua in 1961 at a training camp for the Bay of Pigs, to have piloted a P-51 fighter in the Bay of Pigs invasion, to have participated in the Bayo-Pawley mission into Cuba, and to have flown Marita Lorenz from New York to Tampa in 1963 as part of a Castro assassination plot.

[Pat Speer]

I haven't listened to the podcast, but met Tosh in Dealey Plaza once. He was with Sherry Fiester, who had come to believe the fatal shot was fired from the South knoll. Tosh was telling her she was correct, and claimed he was on the south knoll at the time but didn't see who fired the shot or some such thing. 

in any event, my point is that Reiner, should he be pushing parts of Plumlee's story, but ignoring his claims about the South knoll, is guilty as heck of cherry-picking dubious crap to sell a sensational story. Shame.