Daily Mail and Rob Reiner

[Charles Blackmon]

This has been debated ad nauseum on this forum probably more than any other JFKA subject. The "magic bullet" theory is a bunch of nonsense.

[Paul Brancato]

Does no one see that Rob Reiner is putting his own reputation on the line? You think he’s doing this for money? I can relate to his story because I share it. He is a year older than me, 16 at the time. Both of us witnessed the Oswald murder, and paid close attention to Mark Lane as he almost single-handedly fought for the truth. And it was Mort Sahl who got Reiner’s ear when they were both working in standup. If Reiner gets things wrong I am certain he would be open to correction. That’s the thing about podcast - it’s live. So if our resident experts feel that Reiner could use some further education why not approach him? I’m going to be searching for a way to contact him. Let’s get on board.

[David Von Pein]

40 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said:

That’s the thing about podcast - it’s live.

Rob Reiner's 10-part podcast is most certainly not a "live" podcast. It's obviously been scripted and heavily edited prior to being broadcast. There is nothing "live" about it.

 

Edited November 25, 2023 by David Von Pein

[Joe Bauer]

49 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said:

Does no one see that Rob Reiner is putting his own reputation on the line? You think he’s doing this for money? I can relate to his story because I share it. He is a year older than me, 16 at the time. Both of us witnessed the Oswald murder, and paid close attention to Mark Lane as he almost single-handedly fought for the truth. And it was Mort Sahl who got Reiner’s ear when they were both working in standup. If Reiner gets things wrong I am certain he would be open to correction. That’s the thing about podcast - it’s live. So if our resident experts feel that Reiner could use some further education why not approach him? I’m going to be searching for a way to contact him. Let’s get on board.

Count me in regards your Reiner bandwagon support crusade Paul.

We could call ourselves the "Paul Brancato Possy!"

Providing our hero with Paul Revere type warning advice and encouragement.

I deeply bonded with Rob Reiner's lovable Archie Bunker infuriating liberal character "Meat Head" in the "All In The Family" TV show throughout the 1970's. As well as being infatuated with Archie's beautiful blond daughter Gloria.

To me Reiner will always be "Meat Head."

Just like Jeff Bridges will always be "The Great Lebowski."

And Jim Carrey and Jeff Daniels will always be Floyd and Harry.

You go Rob Reiner!

Edited November 25, 2023 by Joe Bauer

[Richard Booth]

On 11/24/2023 at 6:08 AM, Charles Blackmon said:

So why did the first bullet miss so badly? An intentional miss maybe?

He is going to say that Oswald fired the first shot, that it was an intentional miss, that Oswald thought he was participating in a staged assassination attempt (that was meant to fail) where he would flee to Cuba and the attempt would be linked to Castro. This theory has been around for awhile and surely this is how Reiner will explain all the breadcrumbs linking Oswald to Castro and explain Oswald's role in the plot and how he was setup.

Reiner says he's going to name the shooters. I think he will name Herminio Diaz Garcia and Jean Rene Souetre. 

My .02 on what Reiner will say.

There is also a "CIA official" he suposedly has and I think that is going to be Rolf Mowat-Larsson. I believe he will attribute the assassination to "rogues" in the CIA, with Tracy Barnes at the top, to the exclusion of James Angleton and Allen Dulles.

[Joe Bauer]

5 minutes ago, Richard Booth said:

I believe he will attribute the assassination to "rogues" in the CIA, with Tracy Barnes at the top, to the exclusion of James Angleton and Allen Dulles.

Can't leave out Bill Harvey and E. Howard Hunt.

[Richard Booth]

My notes on episode 3 in case anyone wants to decide if they want to listen. I just opened up Notepad and took notes as I listened:

Forensics episode (3)

1. Humes burned the autopsy draft
2. Humes and Boswell not qualified (Doug Horne) to conduct gunshot autopsies
3. HSCA: George Joannides compromised investigation, says that Joannides "oversaw the special ops program that recruited Oswald" (extremely problematic statement. Saying 'recruited' is not accurate. He should have said "Joannides oversaw the psychological warfare program that tried to connect Oswald to Castro on the day of the assassination' - Reiner's total mischaracterization shows he either does not understand what Joannides actually did or he's intentionally being misleading)*
4. Forensic evidence is critical. The forensic evidence from the bullets to the gun to the photographs--all heavily disputed
5. Cyril Wecht talks about the WC conclusion of 1 shooter, says wrong
6. Reiner describes how the WC concluded there were 3 shots, says from Z-film
7. David Mantik talks about James Tague. Explains how him being struck + JFK head shot + the conclusion of 3 shots requires that all of JFK and Connally's wounds come from a single bullet
8. Wecht talks again, explains Arlen Spector's "Single Bullet Theory"
9. Reiner says shot to the back could not have come out of JFK's throat, clip of Wecht played saying same
10. Dick Russell says Connally and JFK hit by separate bullets
11. Reiner asks "how did the bullet look?" - Wecht comments on CE399 - Reiner says "looks pristine"
12. Reiner asks "Where did they find the magic bullet?" - Wecht says found on a stretcher
13. Reiner talks about Paul Landis (Secret Service) and plays clips of newsmedia talking about Landis
14. Reiner interviews Paul Landis. Asks "how far away were you?" - "15 to 20 feet"
15. Landis says "shortly after the second shot I heard the third shot" - says this was the head shot
16. Landis says when they got to Parkland he looked in the limo, saw pool of blood where JFK was sitting next to Jackie. Says he looked and saw 'a pristine bullet' there. Says "I picked it up"
17. Landis says the bullet he picked up was CE399. Says it was pristine but had striations on it
18. Landis talks about how the bullet was important evidence so he put bullet in his pocket
19. Landis then says he reached into his pocket, removed the bullet, and placed it next to JFK's "left shoe" in the ER of Parkland. So much for "important evidence" huh?
20. Reiner says there had to be a 4th shot, says Landis picked up a bullet that had broken no bones
21. Landis says he never said anything about this until now because "nobody ever asked" (so much for important evidence)
22. Reiner again talks about the number of shots. Plays clip of Wecht describing how it takes 2.3 seconds to chamber a round in the MC rifle
23. Reiner says timing of shots shows more than 1 shooter. Doesn't do a very good job at emphasizing this, only the Wecht clip is played without any follow-up emphasis nor any description of how the shots were much closer together than 2.3 seconds: e.g. shots 3-4 being "almost simultaneous" as described by S.M. Holland. He should have played audio of S.M. Holland saying this after the Wecht clip.
24. Reiner talks about the Parkland doctors and what they saw. Talks about Perry, says later that day he talked to the press and described shot in the throat (Reiner said 'neck') was an entrance wound. A transcript of Perry is read by Soledad O'Brien.
25. Reiner talks about a notebook kept by Martin Stedman's notebook, clip of Mantik is played talking about it. Says a week after assassination Perry was asked about the neck wound, asked "what do you really believe? Was it an entrance wound?" and Perry said 'absolutely' an entry wound. Perry told Stedman he was called several times by Bethesda doctors that evening, says they threatened to take away his medical license if he said the throat wound was a wound of entry. 
26. Reiner asks "why would Perry change his mind?"
27. Dick Russell talks about Elmer Moore intimidating Perry 
28. Dick Russell & Wecht talk about massive headwound in rear of head
29. Dick Russell talks about Dr. Kemp Clark saying a massive wound in rear of head
30. Reiner and Russell talk about McClelland having seen a hole in back of the head
31. David Mantik talks about a hole the size of an orange in back of the head
32. Reiner says "shot that killed the President came from the front"
33. Doug Horne talks about the Dallas doctors: big blowout in right rear portion of the head
34. 29 minutes into a 39 minute episode and Reiner hasn't covered the x-rays or autopsy photos
35. Doug Horne talks about the autopsy photos at 30 minutes in. 
36. Mantik talks about the autopsy photos, talks about how there is barely any blood looks like the hair has been washed
37. Dick Russell talks about Sonda Spencer, plays audio/narrates her ARRB interview where she says the autopsy photos are not the photos she developed
38. Mantik says the actual authentic autopsy photos would show a massive hole in the back of the head, says we have people who have seen those photos (presumably same photos Spencer developed)
39. Doug Horne talks about how Perry was threatened, Bethesda constantly calling him trying to get him to change his mind about the throat wound
40. Horne talks about Humes and Boswell meeting at 10:00 the next morning to discuss the autopsy
41. 34 of 39 minutes: Reiner provides a summary of what was talked about in the episode
42. Reiner says "All of this points to shooters in other locations" and "Oswald did not do it alone" 
43. Reiner says "the evidence is going to show that Oswald was part of a narrative" that "he didn't know"
44. Outro talks about "next time on Who Killed JFK" ...

In the very first episode Reiner says that Tosh Plumlee "flew CIA agent E. Howard Hunt into Dallas" that day. Then here in episode 3 he says that Joannides oversaw a "special ops" program that "recruited Oswald"

In both instances, Reiner is totally mischaracterizing or otherwise muddying waters as it relates to the CIA. And that's a bad thing to be wrong about, especially for those of us who believe the CIA was involved.

[Richard Booth]

1 minute ago, Joe Bauer said:

Can't leave out Bill Harvey and E. Howard Hunt.

Well, my own opinion is one thing (I do include those two) but I was speaking to who I think that Rolf Mowat-Larssen will implicate. As I recall, Mowat-Larssen shills this theory that 'CIA rogues' did it and he names all the usual suspects yet leaves out Angleton and Dulles. So Mowat-Larssen's theory seems to be a limited hangout where he names a dozen CIA officers but keeps Angleton and Dulles out of it. 

[Joe Bauer]

14 minutes ago, Richard Booth said:

As I recall, Mowat-Larssen shills this theory that 'CIA rogues' did it

Isn't that exactly what E. Howard Hunt said?

And LBJ to his long-time mistress Madeline Brown?

[Paul Brancato]

5 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

Rob Reiner's 10-part podcast is most certainly not a "live" podcast. It's obviously been scripted and heavily edited prior to being broadcast. There is nothing "live" about it.

 

Yes David, I’m sure. What I meant is that it could be easily added to, not necessarily written in stone. There are 7 episodes to come I think. 

[Charles Blackmon]

7 hours ago, Richard Booth said:

He is going to say that Oswald fired the first shot, that it was an intentional miss, that Oswald thought he was participating in a staged assassination attempt (that was meant to fail) where he would flee to Cuba and the attempt would be linked to Castro.

Actually this theory makes more sense than just about any other I have heard.

[Benjamin Cole]

12 minutes ago, Charles Blackmon said:

Actually this theory makes more sense than just about any other I have heard.

I happen to agree, but I am uneasy when relative novices start making grand pronouncements about the JFKA, and in great detail. 

Rob Reiner may be a nice guy, but as an entertainer, he may have concluded that "another show that is inconclusive is not a good show." 

Or, Reiner may think the political need to frame a narrative supersedes the need for verifiable truth. That is, the political truth trumps historical truth. 

Reiner won't be the first to go down that road.

[Paul Brancato]

53 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

I happen to agree, but I am uneasy when relative novices start making grand pronouncements about the JFKA, and in great detail. 

Rob Reiner may be a nice guy, but as an entertainer, he may have concluded that "another show that is inconclusive is not a good show." 

Or, Reiner may think the political need to frame a narrative supersedes the need for verifiable truth. That is, the political truth trumps historical truth. 

Reiner won't be the first to go down that road.

Reiner has been at this since the 1960’s. A newby? So was I when I wrote the trading cards. 
why are most of you so anxious to cast aspersions? 

[Cliff Varnell]

I’ll buy Cory Santos a brat and a brew at a future Oakland Athletics of Las Vegas game if Reiner ever refers to the genuine physical evidence in the JFKA — the bullet holes in JFK’s clothes.

[Kirk Gallaway]

Some good deduction Richard!

I thought I'd mention what I thought was most noteworthy of what Reiner said that I wouldn't expect others to mention.

 

Jeff Morley does a good job of letting  Reiner talk and Reiner willfully obliges.

 

I like a lot of Reiner's politics but I do find him sometimes pompous and self righteous. True,  He does rely on his own instincts and his own his group of conspiracy heroes and witnesses that he deems important. But that could be said of this forum as well. I share some of them, and not others.

 

Ben:Or, Reiner may think the political need to frame a narrative supersedes the need for verifiable truth. That is, the political truth trumps historical truth. 

 

I knew Reiner's interest in Russiagate would incite jeers. We won't open that can of worms for now..

. 

But if there are people here, Maga or otherwise who still think that members of the CIA know who killed JFK and are desperately seeking to keep that information secret. I would think at least the Maga wing would allege that former CIA director John Brennan 2013-2017 would be one of "the gatekeepers" as Trump , when he took away his security clearance called him "the worst CIA director in history." I don't tend to be a big fan of any CIA Director.

 

Reiner in his Russia gate investigation accounts having dinner with Brennan and at first doesn't want to bother him with his JFKA notions but Brennan then asks him" So what are you working on". Reiner then tells him, and asks if he ever heard about Richard  Nagle, and Brennan asks him "what do you know about Richard   Nagel?" When Reiner tells him, Brennan's wife asked if he has any problems with Reiner's pursuing the JFKA.  Brennan says no, "it's a good idea to revisit history."

Then  a couple of weeks later Brennan connects Reiner with former  Moscow bureau chief Rolfe Larsen, who also speculates CIA involvement.

Apparently Brennan isn't worried about the JFKA secret getting out and a massive defunding of the CIA!

 

Ok,I know,  limited hang out now? So I hope we're not saying Brennan and Larsen  positively deliberately mislead Reiner down the wrong path and any answer that doesn't point at Dulles and Angleton is a limited hang out. Larsen just may believe it was a rogue CIA operation. Charles and Ben don't have a problem with it and while part of me may feel a letdown because I cling to a "focus of evil"-  Dulles/ Angleton Grand Slam nailing! I don't have a problem with it either.

 

But like Ben, after so many people have spent so many years investigating it. The idea that Rob Reiner comes in and cracks the case is a bit hard to swallow!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 26, 2023 by Kirk Gallaway