Trygve V. Jensen

( Published May 2nd. - 2018 . ) " The President John F. Kennedy Assassination Records Collection Act of 1992 mandated that by October 26, 2017, the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) must release all withheld government files pertaining to the 1963 assassination of President John F. Kennedy. What will be revealed as these documents are examined? Will the contents provide answers or create more questions? The Sixth Floor Museum at Dealey Plaza presented an engaging program featuring best-selling authors Dr. Larry Sabato of the University of Virginia’s Center for Politics and Philip Shenon, former New York Times reporter, who discussed the ramifications and revelations of this final release of the records with moderator Dave Davies, host of NPR’s “Fresh Air.” This presentation took place at the Museum on November 18, 2017. To see related films, photos, documents and oral histories from The Sixth Floor Museum's collection, visit our online collections database (http://emuseum.jfk.org). Or make a research appointment to explore the books, DVDs and other materials available in the Museum's Reading Room (http://www.jfk.org/the-collections/re...). "

Would be entertaining / interesting to be able to view as far westwards as possible also. To my knowledge the furthest panning of the camera, --- to the left/west, from the "official" film : -------------------------------------------------------------- Can see further westwards in this one, - from this unnamed documentary: ----------------------------------------------------------------- Sprocket :

Just asking quickly for curiosity, - maybe it has been addressed already. Haven't gotten time to search / read. To those skilled within the field (I'm afraid I'm not even skilled enough to convey my question in this somewhat technical English, but still,); For instance, - I remember, was it MPI ? ; the restoration, enhancement of the Zapruder film etc., - where one could view the information in between the sprocket - holes (For the first time ? ) . Suddenly one had more to work with. (The Norwegian magazine I have, published Dec 7th. 63' have slides from the Z-film, where this information is visible. They purchased the rights from LIFE, - and was available of course back then, when LIFE published beforehand. ) Is there by now, a version of the Robert Hughes - film , - in which the information in between the sprocket - holes is visible ? If not, - does it depend on type of camera he used,- or what. Would just be interesting to at least view the best copy out there. Bear with my ignorance. I ridicule myself on a daily basis,- but that is just aye okay.

Surely asking questions/mentioning curiosities that have already been answered elsewhere by now, in the numerous threads here, - and research done elsewhere, - so apologies in advance (it is just such an intriguing issue, with the three (allegedly) very closest witnesses to a very crucial matter); Affidavits, statements to the FBI, and WC - testimonies must be considered, but of course so, - also this: CD 87 : Secret Service - report Jan 8th. 1964 (CO-2-34030, (Covering period: 12.02.1963 - 12.06.1963)) (Assassination of President Kennedy - Texas School Book Depository) By: SA Arthur W. Blake, SA William N. Carter, & SA Elmer W. Moore https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10490&search="Bonnie_Ray+Williams"#relPageId=775&tab=page --------------------------------------------- "Attendance and employment records had been seized by the FBI, and were not available for examination". --------------------------------------------- https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10490&search="Bonnie_Ray+Williams"#relPageId=783&tab=page Norman : - Can be interpreted like Norman describes himself, Jarman and Williams going together to the fifth floor (from the 1st floor), - while Williams states he was alone, eating his lunch on the sixth floor. - From their location while standing, looking out the west windows, - wouldn't they be very close to the stairway, - in danger of encountering the assassin(s) they had just heard shooting ? ( Williams apparently saw a policeman near the stairway before they went down. (Officers in the affidavit) ). - Things happen fast. I have trouble understanding that they ran towards the windows at the west side, in order to look what happened to the President. The limo must have been long gone. If for any reason, - wouldn't it be because all the people outside, ran westwards towards the parking lot ? They did the same as the majority at the Plaza. They followed the crowd, - as Norman describing them running, as they just have seen so many people running in that direction. Like R. Craig said; "People are just that way". But; doing this, with apparently no concern of the shooter coming down the stairs. Is it not somewhat strange if none of their attention was directed to what just happened upstairs ? (Jarman mentiones this a week and a half after stating he was out on the street with Williams , Givens etc. ) Imagine sitting, watching the President go by, and suddenly hearing shots fired from the floor above, - hearing the ejected shells hit the floor, - and seeing dust falling from the roof above you, caused by this, ---- then running to the windows, in order to see outside. People do not necessarily think/act in a rational way, in a situation like this, - but one should think that this was a matter of concern. I.e. acting boldly/curious and run upstairs, to see what/who it was, - or in fear, just flee downstairs at once, instead of standing around for five minutes. And he states he did not see anyone else on the stairway, "while on the way down". One should think he would to the Secret Service, - mention seeing anyone else on the stairway, before going down. If he did so. ------------------------------ Williams: To the Secret Service between Dec. 2nd, and December 6th. (Policeman, lunch at sixth floor, went down to meet Hank and Junior, etc.) - Can't remember where, - but I've read him being placed , if not in, - then at least very close to the "sniper's nest", - as late as 12:25pm. Eating his lunch. The scheduled time of the motorcade passing by, - or ? - Some of you must be tired of answering this, - but is it "correct" ? And the bag with chicken - bones, and the soda bottle, found so close, if not at the spot. And of course, the somewhat remarkable issue of him not noticing anyone else up there. Heard no one, saw no one. ( Maybe the assassin / Oswald just lucked out ? ) - As he was still at the fifth floor, - could the policeman he saw, (that apparently did not see him), have been Baker, who I understand it took the elevator up to the seventh floor, together with Truly ? From the perspective of the official timeline. - If he did not know if the policeman was going up, or down the stairway, was he just standing there transfixed or ? His affidavit, dated Nov. 22nd; - Williams says "Charles was outside and couldn't get in, so I guess he went home". But Givens was there at the so - called, roll - call, if it ever happened ?. - Williams says they (the floor - crew), went down to the first floor and got their lunches before noon. And that he went back to the fifth floor, together with "Hank and Junior". Not the sixth floor. - Saw the President come by, just after they got to the fifth floor. They ran to the west side of the building, and saw no one, except people outside, running and hollering. A little while after, - officers came up. When the officers left, - he, Jarman, and Norman, took the elevator one floor down; to the fourth floor. Stayed there a while, - then went "on out". Why take the elevator one floor down, - stay for a while, then go down. Were they caught up in the commotion or what ? ---------------------------------------- James E. Jarman affidavit Nov. 22nd: - "At about 11:45am, all of the employees who were working on the sixth floor came downstairs, and we were all out on the street at about 12:00 o'clock noon. These employees were: Bill Shelley, Charles Givens, Billy Lovelady, Bonnie Ray (last name not known), and a Spanish boy (his name I cannot remember). To my knowledge, Lee Oswald was not with us while we were watching the parade." So they (including Givens who were purportedly blocks away, visiting a friend), - and excluding Norman) were out on the street, watching the parade. Jarman in the Secret Service - report, recollected this, one and a half week later to the agents (CO-2-34030): - "After eating lunch, Jarman went with Williams and Norman to the fifth floor to watch the President pass by. Heard three shots. Then after going to the windows on the west side of the building, - he, Norman, and Williams went down the stairway to the first floor. "Did not see any police officer on the stairway". But saw a woman looking out a window on the fourth floor. (Edna Case, who did not hear any shots, for some reason ?) - Jarman now addresses one of the questions, stating he and the others decided it would be "too dangerous" for them to go to the sixth floor. One and a half week after he said he, Williams and the other in the floor-laying-crew had been outside watching the parade. -------------------------------------------- I'm sorry for the outdated questions/remarks, - but so many things just does not seem to add up. Yes, some would argue the changing of recollections over time, - some perhaps because of the race - issue. That they (the three of them) acted like they did, - in fear of being accused of the thing they had just apparently registered as happening, immediately above them. Or that they more easily were persuaded to change their statements, - because of just this. It has become a habit, trying in vain, to puzzle together pieces, - for then just discovering the pieces are mixed even more. If anyone can assist in de-mixing (if that's a word) them, - it would be interesting / appreciated. There are so many factors to take account for, - and multiple perspectives things can be viewed from. It's overwhelming. Why did they say what they said, -- or did they say these things at all, - the statements correctly taken down ? Why did the statements change ? Were they true at one, or several points in time, - or were they false, - and for what reasons if the latter ? -------------------------- The "ultimate" conspiracy -theorist, could even (when refusing all the witnesses, seeing a shooter at the sixth floor,( or simply say it was actually the fifth floor, that they witnessed the commotion at)) propose they were involved; i.e. them racing westwards at once, having "five minutes" to run upstairs, - plant the empty shells, the rifle, - forgetting the chichen-lunch-bag, and the soda bottle, in the hurry of getting downstairs again. (Not stating such, - well knowing it is "outlandish", - so not stribing for being an object of mockery, etc.) I'm not proposing such a version of the events, - just an example, of puzzle-mixing. Trying to view everything from all possible aspects / perspectives, - while the concentration as usual succumbs to fatigue, as well as the puzzlement of conflicting statements. One has to think; what if. In all matters. Like: - Is he, or is he not visible in the Dillard - photo ? Were they there, all three of them, - at the 5th floor ? James Jarman : Or simply come to terms that Lee O. dodged the attention of all of them, the girl(s) in the stairs, and who knows who else, ---- in his preparations, executing of action, - and escape down. ------------------------------- Bonnie Ray Williams : Harold Norman : ------------------------------- Sidenote : Charles Givens : Maybe naive, - but when so many areas are covered by renowned and skilled researchers, - one can do an amateuristic attempt to be creative, - like in search - processes. If not for anything else, - than for personal satisfaction, - having perhaps, an illusion of thinking outside the box, - and trying to see what is not focused on, but yet still in front of our eyes. Contributing, would be ideal though. Yesterday, many hours was spent on searching (in Russian, Japanese, and French ) for newspaper - articles, or videos , relevant. As usual this turned out to be a soup of nonsense. But that is just what all this issue, in itself does; not make sense. At least it is interesting from a hobby-speculator's view.

Just copying and pasting my old post: "I was taught the values of politeness, courtesy, respect, - to be fair, and so forth. So I do absolutely not want to talk in a negative way about people in general, - and not either when they are not present, - when they can not defend themselves. I managed, by mobilizing will, -- to not say anything in the last thread, - where people were endorsing his videos. But as it is mentioned yet again, I just can not - not express my own view on this. ----------------- He has 2.4k subscribers, - videos with nearly 100% "thumbs up", - receiving donations, - and has comments disabled. Promoting his book multiple times. Saying: "Other researchers don't show their research." "I'll answer any questions." "We are going to go in to reality now." "Not fantasy world." "Like others." "I'm gonna show you facts, and I'm gonna show you real images." "What I'm gonna present here is pure facts, - and pure evidence". "Matching with timeline".' Etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. ----------------- My thought, is that it is anything but fair, - to anyone wanting to find the truth; - not the people here, - people watching his videos, --- and especially not to the ones making donations to him (who at the same time are prohibited to comment) , -------- to make money on videos that contain so many errors, - that I lost count after a couple of minutes. While making erroneous and contradicting statements, - the way he does. One example is him, in his colorized photos and films, - having two assassins inside the Pergola - shelter, - "proven" by an animated Darnell - snapshot, -- where the alleged assassins are visible,- one still aiming, - as he just have taken "the shot to Gov. Connally". So the assassin is transfixed, in his aiming position "just having fired his shot" - in the Darnell - snapshot, - which in the real reality, was taken 30++ seconds after the shots occurred. People running by , only a few feet from two men with rifles, - (one still aiming, 30 seconds after he took his shot.....) , ---- ignoring them.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCNfPdCgDL0#t=16m45s The assassin inside the shelter, - managed to get into this position , as he is standing on top of another person's back. A human - table. ------------------------------------------- I wish this person well, - - but I myself, - cannot understand, anyone, - including himself, - actually believing what he says." ---------------------------------------- Just try to watch a minute or two.....

Btw. According to Commision Document 87 , - Secret Service report re: Oswald ( Jan. 8th. '64 ) , - the lunch - period for the employees at the TSBD, was 45 minutes.

If his statements depict what happened, - he must have went back to work at least 10 minutes prior to 12:45pm. In his affidavit from Nov 22nd, - he contradicts himself. Saying he went back to work at 12:45pm. Then in the very next sentence, - the well known description of him already having returned to work, - and had just come down to the fifth floor to get some stock (being one of the six guys who were laying floor, - at the sixth floor, all morning), ----- when he heard one shot. Went down to the first floor,- then "back" to the sixth floor, - not seeing anyone, "except the people I named". (Lovelady, Shelley, Arce, Williams, and Givens.) So he had come down to the fifth floor, - from the sixth floor. When hearing the one shot . Apparently laying floor, - and then walking down the stairs one floor, - all while the assassin prepared to take the shots. What a mix - up. Don't know if it is any point in trying to make some sense of it. Maybe he thought that the time was 12:45pm, when he went back to work, - and the shot that he heard, was fired (shortly) after that. Being wrong what the clock said. ------- Going back to work, - laying floor, - instead of watching the President go by.

Yes, it was fascinating, stumbling upon it. The site as well. They give some descriptions, - but not the source(s) of the footage. Euins also is visible coming around the corner. Even when downloaded a 2GB 1920x1080 - version of it, - it still seem that some of this footage is clearer in "The Lost JFK - Tapes : The Assassination". ---- Memory fades this late , - I think that was the one, where some of this footage is used. Either that , or the 1hr 24m - special - aired at CNN. I find these individuals (who you mention above) just too interesting. For too many reasons. Especially Bonnie Ray, and Danny Arce. Without insinuating anything. I've seen the interviews of Williams, Jarman, Norman , and Givens. Were there no interviews filmed, of Arce ? Him being outside the TSBD , viewing the motorcade as it went by, - has been established without doubt, yes ? (The later it gets, - the more I derail / ramble, - and should really just go get some much needed sleep.) Just frustrating at times, - Arce , and Dougherty , being somewhat seemingly elusive in general. )

I am not sure. He is visible for less than one second, -- approx. half a second , - in this clip : (at about : 00:45) Camera zooming in at that door, and away from the individual. http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675033711_Texas-School-Book-Depository_officials_policemen-and-dignitaries_men-take-pictures (low resolution preview) . Inside. Depository ? The footage is mostly from the outside of it, - from Houston, and from Elm, - and seemingly a short snippet from outside Parkland Hospital, - even though the description does not mention it.

Tremendous work by Dennis Morissette at that site.

Any idea ?

Being part of a different culture and society, - in a city/town where it would be published as breaking news, if anyone was spotted with some kind of weapon, - I personally have close to no knowledge about the different types of firearms . Distinguishing a rifle from a shotgun is challenging for instance. As ridiculous as it may sound. But because of my interest of this case of the assassination, - I at least have read a bit. In the aftermath, media identified the rifle used in the assassination, as an English Enfield .303 (the type Police confiscated from B.W. Frazier) , - a Mauser 7.65, - a Winchester, - a 30/30, - a japanese rifle, etc. , -- and finally the Italian Mannlicher Carcano. There were a lot of shotguns/rifles/firearms at Dealey Plaza , and in the Depository that day. Carried (in and out) by Police - officers etc.

Fatigue. Did not notice until now, that the officer with the shotgun was identified as Paul Wilkins. Thanks again Jessica ! So much out there is mislabeled. As this one was labeled H. Weatherford.

My memory often fails this late in the evening. It says that I recently read an FBI - report , regarding the T.C.Dillard - photograph (perhaps from the records released last fall), - where it was stated that two black men was visible in a set of windows above the window where the shots were fired from. Either I misread, - or they mixed it up.

Overslept, - and in a terrible hurry, - just wanted to share my appreciation for the input. Thanks for the information. Snacks for tonight !

Thanks, - Could look like a different type - weapon here. And chin. I wouldn't know. What would the left-lower-arm - mark / symbol / badge / insignia , - - be for that matter.

Thank you, - appreciate it. 1 : Yes, - was wondering about who the other person is. 3: I was wondering if to include the word "purportedly", - as I recognize a very similar looking young boy, from very familiar footage from outside Parkland Hospital. (The source of the images, - just never include Parkland, in the description of whereabouts. It does say TSBD. ) 4: Thanks. The policeman being H.W. I do not know, - if correct information. 5: Was curious about this one. Only appears very very briefly, - seemingly knocking at a door, (Camera zooming in, and away). 6: Yes I saw this footage the other day (him being led out (it seems), - in the middle of a big crowd), - as well as footage looking down on a police-officer (alone, (do not know if it is westwards/northwards or what)) the other day. Will check out the link, as well as DM. ( Without checking, - I am sure, some people have opinions of the identity of nr 6 ) . But the identity of the officer must be known ?

Instead of derailing a different thread; Just out of curiosity, - I was wondering if anyone have input on the identity (or specific points of interest / significance if any) of individuals (both familiar, and less familiar), in following images from the immediate aftermath of the assassination: 1: ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 3: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4: ( Labeled as Harry Weatherford ) . ( I've read about the roof - story, - as well as the not-on-roof-story ) . ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 5: --------------------------------------------------------------------- 6 :

Appreciate your input here Steve. And your input elsewhere, - which I encountered several times, - in the search - frenzy, you now initiated. The result is that it contributed to a much more interesting evening for me personally, - at the same time as reading some articles/postings etc. , -- I can not recall ever having read before. So I thank you. Again. Nothing to contribute with as of now. The same thing happened, - as the other day , regarding Orcaberrio. Started taking notes, - searching at quintuple arenas. Trying to do it in a somewhat creative way. Mostly name / identity - searches. But one finds that so much has been covered. Results, just initiate other searching - processes. The notes themselves may be of value some day. It started with your post, - and ended indirectly with a post from you. Me searching for a, - for some obscure reason, unknown location in Germany called Metz. -- as you said. How can someone be transferred from Metz , ---- to Metz ? As names of individuals, are translated, - some names of cities / towns / locations are also translated in different languages. Wish I had a better German vocabulary, - as well as knowing French, Portuguese, Italian, and Chinese for that matter. So the complexity of it all, -- once more became overwhelming. - - - - At times, so many of these different issues, - if segmenting, --- may seem intertwined with eachother. Bugliosi : " It's now the most complex murder case by far; – nothing even comes close – in world history. " It is easy to feel that the more one know, - the less one know. So then it may be best to do as the wise man: ---- "Once , - a wise man said nothing".

Thanks for the input, - will take a look. Just wish one could just magically pull up unlimited time and energy, from some hat.

Semi-on-topic/relevant/irrelevant; (Just taken from the ancient disk). 1: Just posting since some of these names are mentioned in this thread. As well as old attachments being gone / links not working etc. 2: I did not make these composites. Maybe it was James Richards, - I have no idea. Just a faint sound of a bell ringing. But time makes me not trust the sounds. 3: They might very well be speculating / false / mislabeled , etc. 4: Most probably already posted at this forum,- and I suspect I got them from here also. -------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------- (J.A.Lawrence). ------------------------------------------------------------

I have of course forgotten where I got these,- but they were "out there" - then. If I were to guess on one of those two, it would for sure be MFF. Spent quite some time there. It is interview - like. Not a presentation. Short clip, - (Nagell 2m10s). Quote: "....the question then becomes; what did Nagell say at a given time, and could he have known that, - and was there any reason why he would have expanded, or said something different - a different time, --- which leads you into an obnoxiously long study of a whole 20 year period in their life, and what they were saying on the record to whom and when...." "....has his own personal agenda at different points in time". ("for example : lost custody of his children, when he went into jail for a bank robbery, that obviously wasn't a bank robbery.." ------> (later statements , reflecting certain knowledge, - perhaps just made to gain leverage over people that would help him get his children back....which he did) etc. I shouldn't transcribe just snippets, - as people could read it out of context. Don't have time right now to transcribe it all. Interesting yes. Seems like outtakes , as they are short in duration. You're wearing a light/yellowish shirt. Vertical-striped wall in the background.

That alone must be time-and-energy-consuming in itself. Thanks again for the effort.

Hope I get the opportunity to listen to this. :- ) I'm sure you made a great contribution. PS: Was scanning further through my ancient hard-disk (it takes time) , --- in order to locate any "new" (which are currently not at the channel) --- clips to upload to Youtube. Many uploads have also been removed, -- all those years it was neglected. One folder , I for some reason just named "Comments" - is short clips/comments on different aspects, --- coming from several reseachers. I haven't seen that folder in 12 years. None of those clips were ever uploaded, - but I guess they are out there somewhere , --- now. To my joy, - I see there are three clips with you Larry, - called "Martino", - "Nagell", - and "Tiers". Can't remember anything about those. Just wanted to mention it. I somewhat feel it may be wrong to upload these files to Youtube. Perhaps the people commenting wouldn't want that. (D.Wrone, J.Morley, J.Thompson, L.Waldron, M.Blunt, Griggs, W. Law), ----- and you

Now you made me smile twice in one day. Make that three. New record! Thanks. Have a great day !