Joe Bauer

I just viewed again a few versions of the Zapruder film on You Tube for the 3,000th time. I wanted to once again view Kennedy being hit with the last two of 3 shots on Elm street and especially the 2nd shot that according to the Warren Report, went through JFK and struck John Connally in the upper right back just left of his right arm pit. As always, my sense of geometric dynamics tells me that there is no way that a bullet could enter JFK's upper back...come out his neck next to his Adams Apple ... and then hit John Connally in his right upper back and have originated from the 6th floor window of the Texas School Book Depository building commonly referred to as "the Sniper's Nest." The directional line of such a bullet entering JFK where his autopsy photos depict, exiting through his neck and then entering John Connally shows a line of flight on a much more level plane than a 6th floor firing would have come in from. And since the JFK back shot supposedly did not traverse through any bone and instead only encountered much softer tissue in it's through and through path, the question of deflection downward as a result of hard bone obstruction such as Connally's bullet injury path effected by such isn't plausible. What I see on the Zapruder film seems obvious to me in this regard.

Just a quick search of at least one Dennis Wilson bio reveals Wilson handed money out like water at times to friends, acquaintances, etc. He reportedly gave Manson a good amount at least once. How much ? Reportedly thousands. When Manson and his girls stayed at Wilson's home it sounds as if sex with them was open and easy as it was at the Ranch. Asking for a little donation from visitors now and then sounds like Manson's style.

Did Marina have any clue about her husband Lee's extreme political beliefs ( including any hint of an inclination toward violence ) at any time when she and Lee were in Russia? Did Lee ever talk crazy at all during that time as he did after she and Lee moved back to America where he admitted taking a pot shot at Walker, wanting her to help him hijack a plane and struggling with her when she noticed he was taking a hand gun to the Nixon visit to Dallas? Or how about Oswald's acquisition of a rifle and pistol here and taking target practice and provocative pictures of himself holding these weapons and copies of Communist party publications? Then there is Oswald's provocative political activity in New Orleans which ended up in a sidewalk brawl where he was arrested and jailed and ended up being interviewed on the radio there as some type of commie? Did Lee's political actions in New Orleans shock Marina in their unnecessary risks and with Lee putting more time into this "no pay" endeavor than working for pay and helping with her and her baby's immediate needs? Did Oswald show this extreme political activist yet family neglecting behavior at any time in Russia? And what nut case picks the hottest hot bed of hot headed Castro hating Cubans ( New Orleans ) to hand out leaflets on downtown NO public streets promoting pro-Cuba relations !? Oswald knew New Orleans was a dangerous den of anti-Castro fanaticism because of the huge number of raging angry Cubans that had been thrown out by Castro living there. Oswald's pro-Cuba leaflet project in downtown New Orleans in August of 1963 made about as much sense as handing out "Join The Marines" buttons on the U.C. Berkeley campus in the late 60's and early 70's. The only sensible explanation for Oswald's pro-Cuba leaflet event in a city like New Orleans in August 1963 seems to have been to provoke a confrontational event...for whatever reasons. But most likely to get Oswald's name in the media as a pro-Castro nut?

Since almost every poll taken in the last 55 years shows a noticeable to solid to huge majority of Americans not believing the official WC government finding of Oswald as a guilty party "Lone Gunman" in the assassination of JFK, you would think that Google would consider this reality in determining domain authority priority and placing websites that expand upon and legitimize the majority belief (with massively well documented research) way behind those that only reflect the clear minority view of the WC finding or semi-support it with a so-called (but conspiracy theory diminishing) "neutral" take? By doing so, they clearly promote this 55 year long minority view.

I can't find it at all. Did it really happen? If it did, why has it been buried as it seems to be?

Doug, what was Bannister like? Was he really a fanatical anti-communist who was surveilling those he thought were sympathizers when you worked with him? What in the world did you do for him? Do you believe Bannister hired Oswald? To publicly hand out those Fair Play For Cuba leaflets among other duties?

Not to drop names ( well I actually am ) but this thread compels me to recall and mention two brief personal encounters with a couple of well known people who were part of the Manson/Hollywood horror story. The interactions themselves were brief and innocuous and therefore not very meaningful in this Manson context, however in a celebrity status way, hopefully will allow me just enough entree into this subject (as superficial as it may be ) to share some speculative thoughts about a few small parts of the whole affair. I met Terry Melcher in my work place the Cypress Inn in Carmel, Ca. in the early 2000's. He was one of the owners. He would come up to Carmel from L.A. occasionally and even less often actually come into the hotel to see whoever he may have known there or simply to mingle with a guest or two in the lounge. The lounge is now named "Terry's Lounge" in memory honor of Terry. I was an employee at the hotel and being somewhat new had never met Terry Melcher. One day when he was visiting the hotel he came up to me and introduced himself. He was extremely friendly and in a very down to Earth and non-pretentious way. He was like his mother in this way. He invited me to sit with him in the lounge for a brief first introduction. We talked about what I did at the hotel, my background before I worked there and my lifetime residency on the Monterey Peninsula. We talked about our kids a little. We discovered both our boys had gone to the same private high school locally. We visited and talked for no more than 10 or 15 minutes but what a warm and pleasant chat it was. I was very impressed by Melcher's sincerely kind and thoughtful manner. We parted. Never personally spoke again. The reason I mention this encounter was to lead into something someone close to Melcher told me later after I mentioned my personal visit with him. And this was just a spontaneous off-the-cuff comment of advice by this person. He advised me not to "ever, ever, ever" mention "Charles Manson" in any possible future social contact with Terry. I didn't ask why. Never talked about this comment again to anyone. And I never talked to or with Melcher again. He just didn't visit the hotel except rarely. Looking back however, I assumed that whatever interaction Melcher may have had with Manson must have been extremely unpleasant, even traumatic and frightening. Another time years earlier I was sitting on some outdoor seating waiting for the arrival of a Los Angeles bound Greyhound bus at the Monterey, CA bus station. Before the bus arrived a couple of rough edged fellows straggled out from the nearby beach area next to the station and came up to us small already seated group. This was before similarly rough edged homeless people were everywhere here in California like today. So back then they stood out and even seemed moderately intimidating. These two fellows were bearded with tousled hair and dressed in slept-in clothes with weathered P-coats. They seemed slightly drunk and were very loud with gravely voices. One of them approached and boldly asked me for change ( which I gave him ) so he could "call someone in L.A." from the pay phone a few feet away. I could hear him actually talking on the phone but didn't pay any attention to what he was saying. I don't remember if these two boarded the L.A. bus that finally came. I assumed they did. If so they probably already had their tickets when I first encountered them However, I couldn't help remembering the face of the fellow who approached me. He was a strong facial boned person. Strong physical build as well. A few weeks later there was an article in one of our papers ( San Jose Mercury, San Francisco Chronicle or Monterey Herald ? ) reporting that Dennis Wilson of Beach Boy fame had drowned in the water off of Newport Beach. ( correction: Marina Del Rey.) This article was accompanied by a recent photo of Dennis Wilson. The picture was of the same bearded man who had approached me in the Monterey Greyhound Station. The man who needed to call L.A. Later, I found out through some basic researching that in the last years of his life, Dennis Wilson apparently lived an itinerant existence at times which included traveling around and hanging out with similar type folks who drank and did who knows what other activities that vagabonds engage in. I could easily see someone in Wilson's rough edged later years life style coming into contact with people like the Manson family at some drug party location in the L.A. area. So, we know that Manson, the ultimate opportunity seeking manipulator, weaseled his way into a small part of the Hollywood music scene, probably by indulging certain connected persons with drugs and free sex. Dennis Wilson reportedly was a person in this milieu Manson was in contact with. And it was here that Manson started indulging his own delusional fantasy that he really was a talented song writer and singer from his years of prison guitar strumming and writing with an audience of one. We also know that Manson actually got close enough in this rock star dream fantasy chase, that someone arranged for him and his music to be heard by someone on the higher inside track of the industry. Soon enough however, Manson's crazy make up and work became all to obvious as delusional and he was dismissed, probably through the cold and complete cut off of any more contact or expected call returns. Manson was the embodiment of blind rage and injustice retribution. Brought out by the slightest violation of his lifetime prison code of "one's word" which in his world of incarceration ethics meant a shank or some other form of extremely brutal justice. And so the story goes that this was the genesis of the eventual Tate/LaBianca murder spree. Was there any secret agency manipulation into the creation of the Manson family and their eventual killing spree madness? We know there was some in the larger drug, hippie, free love culture movement. My guess is that with Manson and Watson etal there wasn't. Manson was a lone wolf. An extremely cunning, ravenous and ruthless one. He ravaged and terrified and ruined a lot of victims lives ( including his young manipulated flock ) before he was finally stopped. There are always ruthless manipulators born and unleashed in every generation. Jim Jones and Jonestown was worse than Manson! Any film of the Manson story can't help be a mainly warning one in this regards, whether or not any secret agenda secret agencies were involved.

No need to worry about anything here being "off topic." I am just as intrigued and enthralled with commentary such as yours, J. McBride, and others no matter where it leads in the over-all picture of JFK's assassination. I'm not an educated student of American and foreign film history yet I have always had a common man fascination for the medium including it's power to effect the collective consciousness ... and my own. Look at the power and effect of so many of our films ... including Oliver Stone's JFK.

The circle on the rear view mirror. What is that highlighting? A dent on the back of this? Also we are told that the crack with webbing on the windshield was made from the inside by a bullet fragment. If so, it was a remarkable path for this fragment. It had to have exited JFK's skull on an almost straight forward plane, gone slightly over the Connally's heads yet just under the bubble top support bar then barely missed hitting the rear view mirror head on and/or hitting the back of driver Bill Greer's head. And did the second fragment make the dent with upraised metal edges on the windshield frame facing inward? Just wanted to understand the basics about these cracks, dents and the JFK skull exiting fragments.

No.

Hunt feeling JFK was a traitor as one can be sure Morales, Harvey, Sturgis, Phillips and so many others in their milieu also felt about JFK. And throw in "scum" as Harvey's wife described regarding her and her husband's feelings about JFK and even his wife. Yet, to Harvey at least, mafioso John Roselli ( affectionately remembered as "Johnny" by Mrs. Harvey ) was considered a "real patriot." What a sick and perverse sense of patriotism. Having these powerful people and groups hating you to a murder wishing degree shouts suspicion.

Has G Dubya Bush ever mentioned in any recorded interview or print where he was when JFK was shot? He was 17 at the time. That teen age boy in the photo above looks to be right at that age. The teen boy's hair color, texture, style cut and hair part side match. Same chipmunk puffy cheeks. Ear size, shape, location, lobe type matches. Nose shape, length and recess below brow match. Eye brow match. Facial expression seems generally the same. Could a facial recognition comparison be done on the Dealey Plaza teen against other known photos of G Dubya at close to that age? Fascinating thing this facial recognition technology. I found another pic of a young G Dubya that looks even more like the DP teen. The DP teen has the exact same "side burn" style and cut and location at a mid-line point of the ear behind as Bush's military swearing pic. Check the military service swearing in pic on the bottom right. 2856 × 1747Images may be subject to copyright. Learn More

Jim, could you possibly use this app to compare the N.O. Oswald leaflet holding man who looks like Shelley to one or two of the pics of Shelley in Dealey Plaza on 11,22,1963? I don't even own an I-phone. I haven't asked my friend with this app to do so as I don't share my JFK interests with close friends. None of whom share this interest. To them if I did bring this up it would be the equivalent of asking them about UFO's.

The resemblance between the man next to Oswald in New Orleans and Shelley in Dallas is uncanny. This would be a rich facial study project to present to experts in the field of facial recognition technology. I was visiting a friend last night who just had to show me his latest feature on his new I phone. It was a facial recognition one. He had done some study on how advanced and accurate this technology has become. It's available to anyone now. I wonder when someone is going to use this to compare facial pictures of people like Shelly and Joseph Milteer to see whether controversial ones match. Could some one use this recognition on the photos of Shelley in Dallas and compare it to the picture of the men around Oswald in New Orleans as shown in this thread?

Doug, I just listened to the interview of Brian Edwards. His summary of Dealey Plaza from a tactical operation standpoint makes so much sense it should be a solid cornerstone of any argument for conspiracy.

It's ominous that JFK, MLK and RFK were all killed in cities where they were greatly hated by the highest influence establishments ( Dallas =Texas oil, Mayor, D.A. ? ) and for sure police departments of those cities. I'll never forget listening to an audio tape of one of the managers of the Ambassador Hotel making the first call in to the L.A. police to report the shooting late evening June 6th. 1968. This caller was a women and the police dispatcher was a man. The manager first mentioned the shooting and then added that Robert Kennedy was staying at the hotel. The male policeman then immediately responded to the mention of Robert Kennedy's name with this coldly contemptuous comment ... "BIG DEAL!" The L.A. police department at that time was known to be generally very right wing...almost as much as the Dallas PD in 1963. I am sure the same hierarchy in Memphis felt that same way about MLK in April of 1968. I think JFK, RFK and MLK really didn't believe that the forces they threatened would actually go so far as to have them murdered. Tragically they were wrong. Well, when the Mafia became partners with the agencies...what would one expect? The truth that we as a society haven't come to terms with yet ... America is a very dangerous country ( and was in the 1960's ) if you truly threaten the real powers to be.

The Secret Service and FBI got JFK's body, the limo and many other items of evidence out of Dallas as quickly as they could. The one crucial thing they left behind in the hands of the Dallas PD was the most important of all - Lee Harvey Oswald himself. And it couldn't have turned out any worse for Oswald than if they had turned him over to a screaming murderous lynch mob on the street outside.

I would consider myself lucky to have met and interacted with such an innocently kind, thoughtful, generous and respectful person like Buell Wesley Frazier at any point in my life, especially in a time of low income rough times on my part. Here is a guy who never said no to Lee Harvey Oswald whenever Oswald needed a ride and it seems never showed one ounce of resentment for doing so, nor ever asked Oswald for one dime in shared gas costs. Frazier also showed this same kindly and giving nature in his training of Oswald in the position of book order filler at the Texas School Book Depository. What a good person! If America was full of Buell Wesley Fraziers we'd have a heck of a lot better country imo. My favorite Frazier story is how he stood up to Captain Will Fritz who ordered Frazier to sign a confession in regards to a possible involvement with Lee Harvey Oswald in the charge of killing JFK. Fritz was red faced angry and brought his arm up to perhaps strike Frazier for refusing to sign the confession which Frazier deemed was "ridiculous." Whereupon Frazier told Fritz he'd be in for one hell of a fight if he did so! Fritz walked out. That took guts! Right On Buell!

Robert, your offer to help fund a trip to Dealey Plaza for me wasn't ill-thought-out at all imo. It was one of the most kind and thoughtful acts of generosity I've ever had bestowed upon me and I will never forget it. Especially since this beneficent gift was offered to me by someone I've never personally met and whom didn't owe me a thing. When I read your offer here on the forum, I felt like one of those people on the old TV show "The Millionaire" when they were contacted by "Michael Anthony" and presented with a cashiers check for a MILLION DOLLARS for no reason but the humanitarian interests of Anthony's billionaire benefactor boss "John Beresford Tipton Jr." ! Of course however, I couldn't accept it for several reasons, none of which diminished it's greatly good and super appreciated intentions. Thank you for donating $100 to the forum. Yours, Joe B. P.S. It looks like the fund is growing well!

Exactly.

A couple of other observations. Admittedly not born out of any scientific background knowledge. But, I have been looking at each man's shirt collars in the New Orleans picture. How they sit and fit around their necks. Although the differences are slight they are still noticeable. Look at each man's collar and you will see them. Oswald's shirt collar sits more level from back to front around his thicker neck than the possible Shelley's thinner neck. The Shelley man's collar sits higher up in back and curves noticeably downward toward the front. The photo of Shelley in Dallas shows the same higher up in back and dropping lower in front white shirt collar setting and fit, again around a quite thin neck. And curiously, the possible Shelley person in the New Orleans leaflet passing pick is the only one not dressed in just a shirt on that obviously hot and muggy August N.O. day. Does that mean this person was not part of the leaflet passing team and just a passerby who came in close to read the leaflet himself? And if the Shelley look-a-like person in the New Orleans picture is not part of Oswald's team, would Thomas Beckham appear on the scene as simply a curious suit and tie wearing passerby? Strange days, characters and doings in New Orleans in August of 1963. Strange too that Guy Bannister's business address ( same building - different entrance ) happened to be on Oswald's first pamphlets and Clay Shaw's Trade Mart address just happened to be Oswald's second choice of leaflet passing location.

Thomas Beckham? IMO ... no. His hair is too dark. His cheeks aren't as sunken and the cheek bone in the N.O. picture is more pronounced. The orbital brow bones are more protruding with the N.O. man. Notice the space between the eye brows are different with Beckham versus the N.O. man. More space in the N.O. picture and a different furling. The N.O. man's nose flattens out on the bridge and the tip. Beckham's nose has a noticeably more defined, narrow, sharper and straighter bridge with a defined and thinner and outward pointing tip. This difference is obvious. David, imo the nose of the fellow in the New Orleans picture versus Beckham is the easiest give-away feature to spot in eliminating Beckham as this fellow. Notice how much flatter the New Orleans fellow's nose is? And how much shorter in length it is versus Beckham's? These differences are so obvious. And how old was Beckham in August of 1963? The New Orleans Oswald co-leafleteer is not as young looking as the picture we see here of Beckham.

Thomas Beckham? IMO ... no. Beckham's hair is too dark. Beckham's cheeks aren't as sunken in and the cheek bone in the N.O. picture is more pronounced. The orbital brow bones are more protruding with the N.O. man. Notice the space between the eye brows are different with Beckham versus the N.O. man. More space in the N.O. picture and a different furling. The N.O. man's nose flattens out on the bridge and the tip. Beckham's nose is longer than than N.O. man's and has a noticeably more defined, narrow, sharper and straighter bridge with a defined, thinner and outward pointing tip. This difference is obvious. Beckham's ears seem farther back ( although slightly ) than the Oswald companion man. The hair line in the right temple area is wrong. Beckham's hair line in that area is farther back. In this photo Beckham is wearing casual clothing. I just don't see this guy in a suit and tie. Beckham seems younger than the N.O. man.

It doesn't add up in any rational or logical or even scientific way.