W. Niederhut

No Labels Skirts Disclosure Laws July 17, 2023 at 3:17 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 69 Comments Mother Jones: “No Labels, the self-professed centrist group that is preparing to possibly run its own presidential candidate in 2024, says it is not a political party. That means it does not have to reveal the donors that have pumped tens of millions of dollars in recent years into its coffers. Parties must disclose their funders; nonprofit outfits, as No Labels claims to be, do not.” “But in several states, No Labels has established an affiliate that explicitly declares it is a political party, and some of these groups, particularly the party it set up in Florida, have deep Republican roots.”

Robert, You're mistaken. I haven't attacked you personally on this thread. Every point and question I have raised pertains directly to your claims and theories about Prouty-- including your notion that he was possibly covering up aspects of the JFK murder plot. On the contrary, Prouty was one of the few JFK "Deep State" insiders who ever tried to expose aspects of the murder conspiracy with which he was familiar -- as Gerry Patrick Hemming told Greg Burnham. As for my unanswered question for you about how Skorzeny and these Operation Bloodstone Nazis fit into the JFK murder plot, (with the CIA and the anti-Castro Cubans) it looks like I'll need to study the subject. I haven't read Leslie Sharp's book on the subject yet. I do appreciate reading your observations about these Bloodstone files. Thanks for sharing. P.S. Michael Griffith's latest claim that Prouty was "erratic" is complete bunk, like all of Griffith's defamatory nonsense on the subject.

Adam, RFK, Jr. isn't going to win any support from American liberals by pretending that Trump and his right wing cult aren't a serious problem in the U.S. At present, RFK, Jr.'s support and media promotion is mainly coming from right wingers.* As for Biden's age, it's a liability but a lesser evil than the right wing GOP plutocracy. * GOP Donors Fuel RFK Jr.’s Presidential Campaign July 17, 2023 at 6:57 am EDT By Taegan Goddard 35 Comments According to a Popular Information analysis of Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s first FEC filing, the lion’s share of Kennedy’s biggest donors have previously only donated to Republicans.

Robert, What you said in your lead post on this thread is that you believed that Prouty knew who "the real murderers of President Kennedy were," and may have "taken that information to his grave" -- implying that Prouty was, at least, complicit in a cover up. That's quite defamatory. But, if true, why would Prouty have gone to such lengths to debunk the WCR narrative (in his contacts with Garrison and Oliver Stone?) The theory makes no sense.

Robert, You never answered any of the key questions I posted in response to your lead posts here this morning. You have simply rephrased and repeated your illogical, dubious theses about Prouty. 1) You have accused Prouty of some sort of unacknowledged complicity in the JFK assassination op-- apparently with the Operation Paper Clip Nazis he was tasked by his superiors with transporting to the U.S. after WWII. Unanswered question for Montenegro #1 1) If Prouty had been involved in the JFK assassination op, why would he have contacted investigators like Jim Garrison (and Oliver Stone) to debunk the WCR/Lone Nut narrative? That makes no sense. Unanswered question for Montenegro #2 2) What relationship/involvement did Skorzeny and the CIA Operation Paper Clip Nazis have with the CIA/Anti-Castro Cubans who have been implicated in the JFK assassination op by the research of Larry Hancock, et.al.?

Newsflash, Ben. The dictator-puppet in the White House was voted out in November of 2020.

It's complicated, Adam. Many of us would prefer to see a younger, qualified liberal Democratic torch bearer, like California Governor Gavin Newsom, emerge in 2024. That said, it's critically important for American liberals to prevent a further regression toward reactionary, plutocratic, right wing governance in the U.S.-- the GOP suppression of voting, of women's rights, LGBT rights, environmental protection, and their "trickle down" tax cuts for billionaires and corporations. The right wing propaganda focus on Biden's age has been relentless, and it obscures Biden's effective record of governance since January of 2021. His knowledge of policy issues dwarfs Trump's abysmal ignorance and ineptitude. As for RFK, Jr., he has had no experience in governance, and he has exhibited a series of flawed judgments, especially in matters of science and public health. He's not our guy, and has mainly been promoted by the right wing Aussie propaganda mogul Rupert Murdoch. What is especially off-putting about RFK,Jr., to date, is his reluctance to criticize Donald Trump and his destructive, white supremacist MAGA cult. These are the guys who attacked the U.S. Congress on January 6, 2021, to block the certification of Biden's election-- an unprecedented crime against American democracy.

Robert, Would you be so kind as to answer my questions (above?) For example, if Prouty had been involved in a nefarious Nazi plot to murder JFK, why would he have contacted Jim Garrison (and Oliver Stone) in order to debunk the WCR Lone Nut narrative, and educate people about LBJ's reversal of JFK's NSAM263 policy in Vietnam (which Prouty had worked on, with General Krulak?) Your theory makes no sense. P.S. Technically, I'm Dr. Niederhut. Mr. Niederhut was my father.

Geez... Not this John McAdams/Michael Griffith Liberty Lobby BS again... 🙄 We need Len Osanic's expertise to straighten out the pseudo-historical nonsense here. Robert Montenegro's illogical, half-baked "theory" here about Prouty possibly being involved in the JFK assassination conspiracy is contradicted by a vast array of historical facts. And it raises a number of obvious questions. (See below.) Robert appears to be the latest Prouty critic around here (along with Michael Griffith, Mark Stevens, Keyvan Sharder, et.al.) who has never studied or understood Prouty's work. (Naturally, Michael Griffith and the U.S. government-affiliated Prouty defamers are more than happen to jump on Montenegro's latest Prouty defamation bandwagon.) Et tu, Paul Brancato? Questions 1) What was Prouty's position in the post-WWII military hierarchy, and his relationship with the U.S. military and Allen Dulles era CIA command structures? Hint: He never worked on Dulles' "Secret Team." He was a USAF man for the duration of his government career-- ending in December of 1963. During his career, Prouty was primarily tasked with organizing transportation and air support for military and CIA ops, including Operation Paper Clip. The CIA black ops people (including Lansdale at Saigon Station) relied on Prouty and the U.S. military for transportation and supplies. 2) Does anyone who has studied Prouty's work seriously believe that Prouty was involved in formulating CIA plans and black ops-- e.g., Operation Paperclip, Lansdale's ops at Saigon Station, or the JFK assassination-- as opposed to assisting the CIA with transportation and supplies for their ops? In the case of the JFK assassination, Prouty had no conceivable involvement in the Dealey Plaza murder op. He was in Antarctica, and only gradually tried to solve the puzzle of the evident CIA black op and psy op to murder JFK, reverse NSAM263, and orchestrate the Lone Nut alibi in the M$M. 3) If Prouty was involved in the JFK murder plot, why was he a key figure in exposing Deep State involvement in the plot-- and helping Jim Garrison and Oliver Stone debunk the WCR Lone Nut narrative? Wouldn't he have left the WCR/Lone Nut narrative prevail? 4) Finally, given what Larry Hancock, et.al. have uncovered about CIA/Anti-Castro Cuban involvement in the JFK assassination, where is this Otto Skorzeny/Paper Clip stuff supposed to fit into the historical framework of the Dealey Plaza assassination op?

We're all MAGAs now... 🙄 RFK Jr. says Trump ‘probably the most successful debater’ since Lincoln | The Hill This one floored me. I watched all of Donald Trump's Presidential debates with Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden, and I thought Trump came across like a feces-flinging baboon. Perhaps I wasn't picking up on Trump's primal, hominid appeal to his Caucasian MAGA tribe. Nor was the consensus at the time favorable for Trump-- who later lost the popular vote by 2% to Hillary, and by a wider margin to Biden. To compare Trump's debate performance to Abraham Lincoln's is, frankly, bizarre. "A house divided against itself cannot stand" "No Markers will be allowed in our cunny"

Don't get me wrong, Jonathan. There are a number of RFK, Jr.'s beliefs that I believe to be erroneous-- especially regarding infectious diseases and vaccines. I was merely pointing out that the possibility of bioweapons engineered to target genotypes seems, frighteningly, plausible.

For those who haven't seen the latest James Bond movie, No Time to Die, the plot centers on a villain who uses genomic data to create bioweapons targeting populations based on their genotypes-- precisely what RFK, Jr. is referring to here. Of course, it was fiction, but it occurred to me while watching that movie that some crazy bastards have probably been interested in the concept. I haven't seen any data-- most of which is top secret, I'm sure-- but it wouldn't surprise me to learn that someone is studying bioweapons that target particular genotypes. Homo lupus homini.

Keyvan, If you want to do a deep search of Prouty's opinions about JFK, the CIA, and Vietnam, try reading his book on the subject. And your GIGO search engine needs work. If this is the future of historiography, we're in trouble.

Kehvan, Your speculation about Prouty, "pushing for a conspiracy with Castro or Russians," is simply absurd. It's the precise opposite of Prouty's beliefs about the JFK assassination. He suspected that the assassination was a U.S. Deep State op. My recommendation is that you read his book on JFK, the CIA, and Vietnam to better understand his views on JFK, the CIA, and Vietnam. At least your new search engine thing-a-majig didn't credit Prouty with the authorship of LBJ--Mastermind of the JFK Assassination. At the rate things are going, I won't be surprised to learn that Ulysses S. Grant wrote Huckleberry Finn...

Robert, Thanks for sharing this very personal, tragic story about your experiences and fallen comrades in the Afghan War. It's difficult for those of us who have never experienced anything comparable to fully understand what you have been through, but I know that my own father experienced (untreated) PTSD and survivor's guilt from his combat experiences in WWII, and the loss of his comrades. Knowing your intellectual habits, I'm guessing that you have done a deep dive into the history of the U.S. Afghan War. I'd be interested in hearing your perspective, which is relevant to the general subject of U.S. "forever wars" following JFK's murder. I have tried, as a layman, to make sense of America's longest war (in Afghanistan) during the past 22 years-- but I have failed. My impression is that it all began as part of the implementation of the Wolfowitz Doctrine--that the U.S. was the sole world super power after the collapse of the USSR-- and the associated Project for a New American Century (PNAC) for U.S. military control of strategic resources in central Asia and the Middle East. The ostensible, proximal Bush/Cheney administration pretext for the carpet bombing and invasion of Afghanistan in 2001 was that the Taliban was harboring Osama Bin Laden and his "Al Qaeda" mujaheddin associates who were accused of carrying out the shocking 9/11 attacks on the WTC and Pentagon. If I understand the history correctly, the Taliban had asked the Bush administration in September of 2001 for the evidence that Bin Laden was responsible for the 9/11 attacks in the U.S., but had received none. Reportedly, Osama Bin Laden denied any involvement in 9/11 (to Al Jazeera and to a Pakistani journalist) but those stories were suppressed in the U.S. mainstream media, which repeatedly pushed the narrative (beginning within one hour of the first plane hitting the WTC) that Osama Bin Laden and "Al Qaeda" did 9/11.

Interesting, Ron. I had no idea that Paul McCartney wrote Yesterday as early as 1963. The song was released as a #1 single in the U.S. in September of 1965, and has been ranked by some critics and polls as the greatest pop song in history. Paul allegedly awoke one morning with the tune in his head, and he hummed a few bars for John Lennon and George Martin, asking them if they knew the tune. Needless to say, they didn't recognize the melody.

This sounds like an episode from the old television show, The Time Tunnel. Not knowing who all was involved in the plot, I'd probably try to contact someone in the Kennedy family, in addition to contacting the Secret Service. (During my psychiatric career, I once had to contact the Secret Service about a mentally ill man who wanted to kill Bill Clinton.) As a fall back, I'd probably try to create an obstruction to the motorcade procession into Dealey Plaza.

[Redacted] is a highly intelligent guy who has made some valuable contributions to this forum. I haven't always agreed with his opinions, but I have learned some things from him. He was the guy who first posted details about Dr. Brown's Sirhan interviews, and the "Manchurian candidate" hypnotic programming. In this latest "Guest" thread case, it sounds like [Redacted] has, perhaps, feared being anathematized for discussing the conflict between David Ben Gurion and JFK over Israel's Dimona nuclear reactor. It's a third rail in American political discourse, but it happened. If [Redacted] wants to rejoin the forum, I would say, "Bienvenidos, hombre," while reserving the right to make jokes about Nietzsche and Gustav LeBon's "The Crowd."

Interesting references, Anthony. Phillip Zelikow is, certainly, an interesting figure in 21st century American history. He was an associate of Bush/Cheney NSC advisor (and eventual SOS) Condoleezza Rice, before chairing the 9/11 Commission-- after Henry Kissinger turned down the job offer from George W. Bush. Zelikow approached the 9/11 Commission job with a pre-written narrative, and assiduously suppressed all contrary evidence debunking the official government narrative about 9/11-- in a manner quite similar to Allen Dulles's "Lone Nut" approach to the Warren Commission investigation.

Kirk, Reading this article reminded me of Michael Cohen's claim that Trump viewed his 2016 Presidential campaign as an "infomercial for the Trump Organization." Everything Trump did politically was motivated by greed, kick backs, and self-aggrandizement. Trump was interviewed by Maria Bartiromo on Fox after signing his December 2017 tax cut bill, and he openly bragged that he had "made a lot of people richer."

Damn. It's terrific to have you guys on this forum.

Which would, obviously, implicate Ben Cole's beloved Orange POTUS... 🤥 As for Meagher, she had a truly encyclopedic knowledge of the WCR-- debunking Allen Dulles' conviction that no one would ever read all of those tomes.

Thanks, Anthony. I'm more familiar with the scientific research on the explosive demolitions of the WTC. The piece of the 9/11 jigsaw puzzle relating to the arrest of five "dancing" Israelis, and the alleged Odigo warning, is interesting, but somewhat peripheral. Another major piece of the 9/11 jigsaw puzzle has to do with the PNAC actors in the Bush-Cheney administration, including Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Feith, Condolezza Rice, et.al. They, clearly, wanted a pretext for deposing Saddam Hussein and implementing the Wolfowitz Doctrine in the Middle East-- long before George W. Bush became the GOP Presidential nominee in 2000. George W. Bush's Secretary of the Treasury, Paul O'Neill, published an interesting memoir, The Price of Loyalty, after Dubya fired him for opposing Cheney's 2003 tax cuts. In the memoir, O'Neill reported that Rumsfeld was talking about invading Iraq as early as January of 2001, and was blathering about Saddam being involved in 9/11 immediately after the WTC demolition on 9/11. Rumsfeld also told a reporter, at the time, that he had "never heard" of WTC7-- which is strange, because Rumsfeld had been Chairman of the Board of Smith Barney, which had its headquarters in WTC7.

Larry and David, Didn't Wayne January say that a guy resembling Oswald visited Red Bird prior to the assassination? I had the impression (from Douglass's account) that Oswald was planning to fly out of Red Bird on 11/22/63.