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One Question re: Two Oswalds


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14 hours ago, Michael Clark said:

Mark, in the last 10:00 minutes of this video, during a Q&A, one can see that the consensus for two Oswald's is expanding, going back to his time in Russia.

 

That's very interesting, Michael.  Dr. Newman and Peter Dale Scott seem to take the two Oswald business seriously, though I don't think they have the particulars quite right.  Thank you for posting this.

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1 hour ago, Jim Hargrove said:

My personal opinion is that the man born as “Lee Harvey Oswald” probably didn’t live long after the assassination of JFK, probably not much longer than the Russian-speaking Oswald, but that is just a guess. 

 

1 hour ago, Steve Thomas said:

Jim,

 

There was also a rumor that he was flown to Mexico and killed down there. Something about the Yucatan? Sorry, I can't offer any specifics.

Like I said, it was just a rumor.

 

Steve Thomas

Steve,

From H&L, pp. 780-781:

On November 20 Harvey Oswald left his rooming house at 1026 N. Beckley,
boarded a city bus, and shortly thereafter arrived for work at the TSBD.

While Harvey was working at the TSBD a car with three passengers arrived at
Redbird Airport, five miles south of downtown Dallas on the west side of Highway 67.
The car stopped at American Aviation and a heavy-set young man and woman got out
of the car and approached the owner, Wayne January. They wanted to rent a Cessna
310, asked how fast the plane could fly, how far it could travel without refueling, and
they wanted to fly to the Yucatan Peninsula on the afternoon of November 22. [Nov,63-19]

While the man and woman were asking questions about the plane, January
noticed a third man sitting in the car. After the assassination January saw Lee Harvey
Oswald's photograph on TV and was certain that he was the man who sat in the car. But
January, like so many other people, mistook the man in the car (Lee Oswald) for Harvey
Oswald, who was busy filling orders at the TSBD.[168] Another indication that someone was
impersonating Oswald and making plans to escape after assassinating the President.

NOTE: Wayne January told the FBI on November 27, 1963 that the incident occurred
on November 20, only 7-days earlier. The FBI, however, ignored Mr. January and
reported that the incident occurred in JULY 1963, in an obvious attempt to lessen the
significance of his statement. The Bureau apparently forgot that in July 1963 Oswald
was not living in Dallas--he was living in New Orleans.

 

Cozumel.jpg


 

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I remember a bit of discussion on Donald ( P. and O.)Norton  years ago. This from Bill Kelly:

 

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Thanks for digging up that thread, Kathy.  The discussion is intriguing, but Donald O. Norton was probably born in 1949 and, if so, was too young to have been the man born as Lee Harvey Oswald.  He apparently formed a one-man advertising company and John found a flier with his picture on it.

Norton_Adv_CU.jpg


 

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9 hours ago, Paz Marverde said:

I remember an Italian newspaper showing discrepancies of height among some photos of LHO

Paz,

Paperwork from several Marine Corps examinations indicate Oswald was 71 inches tall (5 foot 11 inches), but on a slab in the Dallas morgue he was measured at 69 inches, two inches shorter.  There are more listings of his height at both 71 inches and 69 inches, but never at 70 inches, which you would think would happen if these were just sloppy measurements.
 

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Jim, Paz,

When I entered the military l was 5 feet 11 inches at 19 years old.  When l was 24 the same age as Oswald I was still 5 feet11 inches.

What I am trying to say is height doesn’t change that much in just a few years.

Harvey was shorter than that.  I think 5’ 9” or so.  The draft card James Alik Hiddell Oswald was even shorter than that.  At least in his Minsk photo with Marina.  Jack White did convincing measurements on that photo.

Some of Oswald’s Russian friends said about 5’ 3” or 5’ 4”.

This will give certain people fits.  This indicates 3 Oswald’s.

Edited by John Butler
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Maybe the Teamsters (and Jimmy Hoffa) disposed of Lee ... perhaps that's what he was hinting at in his interview with Ms. Kittrell.  And then both Hoffa and Lee were buried in Section 107, in the corner of the west end zone of Giants Stadium - per one Donald "Tony The Greek" Frankos

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9 hours ago, John Butler said:

Jim, Paz,

When I entered the military l was 5 feet 11 inches at 19 years old.  When l was 24 the same age as Oswald I was still 5 feet11 inches.

What I am trying to say is height doesn’t change that much in just a few years.

Harvey was shorter than that.  I think 5’ 9” or so.  The draft card James Alik Hiddell Oswald was even shorter than that.  At least in his Minsk photo with Marina.  Jack White did convincing measurements on that photo.

Some of Oswald’s Russian friends said about 5’ 3” or 5’ 4”.

This will give certain people fits.  This indicates 3 Oswald’s.

John,

That's interesting. Kerry Thornley described Oswald's height as 5'5" (WC XI:89), but LHO's height as listed on nineteen different documents currently in the National Archives is fairly evenly distributed between 5'9" and 5'11" (11 say 5'9", and 8 indicate 5'11"). Only one, a 4/28/60 notation by "Marguerite Oswald," lists his height at 5'10".

The incredibly detailed information from all those witnesses to LHO and family in and around Alice Texas also suggests more than two Oswalds.  Even John A. is mystified by those events.

Can you point me to any information about the much shorter LHO in Russia?  I'm totally unaware of this. 

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59f2660f2179b_63-11-221963v1959Oswald.thumb.jpg.54814dc6efe612f762f160c339ab3242.jpg

 

A number of the men who looked a bit like Oswald and were somehow involved....  the story of Vagaonov/Tippit and how much he looks like Oswald is quite interesting...

At the bottom right is Thomas Arthur Vallee....  of the Chicago Plot.

   5a280e6666cfe_oswaldlookalikesVallee-Craford-Vaganov-Lee.thumb.jpg.78bbf5109b2367a64f65ac94fc53b6b0.jpg

 

This takes the first image and mirrors each side to create the whole face...

59b8004b2ded4_OswaldDODphotobothsidesreversedandpasted.thumb.jpg.b8ddb3e17ea25b8387f39ae02b198333.jpg

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1 hour ago, Jim Hargrove said:

Can you point me to any information about the much shorter LHO in Russia?  I'm totally unaware of this.

Look at their feet... his right and her left are on the same elevation...

Using the image as a guide I estimate what a 5'11" man would look like in this image...

5ad75c9a121d8_OswaldandMarinainMinsk-heightissue-inserteda5foot11inchOswald.jpg.f64e6b799be71fea1481c6e5bae7ec8f.jpg

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Jim,

David Josephs has posted a knock out plece of work.  It explains the third Oswald very well.

The draft card James Alik Hidell Oswald is identifed in other photos as Lee Harvey Oswald in Minsk. 

I also did some photo work on this.  Its posted somewhere on this site.  I’m not certain the photo are still there due to dropping Photobucket.

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Editing this posting after seeing another photo of Oswald with Marina in Minsk.

First photo of Oswald and Marina shows them in heavy Winter coats.

Oswald in this Minsk photo with the 5'3" Marina is no more than two ( possibly 2 1/2? ) inches taller than her. 

In another Minsk photo ( maybe someone could post this? ) we see a shirt sleeved Oswald holding Marina ( again they are both standing I assume ) and he is much taller than Marina than 2 inches.

I assume this shirt sleeve Oswald pic is taken around the same time as the first photo excepting a different time of year?

The Oswald picture business has always been so conflicting.

 

Edited by Joe Bauer
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30 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

Look at their feet... his right and her left are on the same elevation...

Using the image as a guide I estimate what a 5'11" man would look like in this image...

5ad75c9a121d8_OswaldandMarinainMinsk-heightissue-inserteda5foot11inchOswald.jpg.f64e6b799be71fea1481c6e5bae7ec8f.jpg

 

David,

 

Here's a little something for your followers to consider.  

http://www.russianbooks.org/oswald/discrep.htm

 

(Do try to be nice, now.)

 

--  TG

 

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That's interesting.  I always preface this sort of thing with the statement that I'm not very good with faces, but the "Oswald" in this picture doesn't look to me much like either the Russian-speaking Oswald killed by Ruby or the American-born Oswald.  That's just me.

Otoh, from looking at the picture, "LHO's" left foot appears three or four--or maybe even a little more--inches below either of Marina's feet.  I don't see how you can take just his left foot into consideration.  The following web page tries to explain the above... though I'm not sure how successfully.

http://www.russianbooks.org/oswald/discrep.htm

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