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Lansdale in DP on 11/22/63?


Greg Wagner
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The officer bringing up the rear while Bass leads is Wise, as can be seen in two photos on page 551 in POTP. (One of these photos - altered to remove all the background - is also on page 143 in TKOAP.) Wise is also seen on page 582 in POTP, standing later with a traffic officer on the steps of the TSBD.

I see no mystery here, there are only two officers. For whatever reason they traded places with each other, Bass taking the lead (perhaps Wise paused to speak to someone in front of the TSBD), in the march of the tramps to the sheriff's office.

Ron

I'm amazed. I always thought that the policeman at the back was a third one. Oh well.

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Staged?

This is a broad term, my Australian friend...

Staged from scratch, for no purpose?

Were individuals "found" or in need of protection at the railyards?

I believe the Bum Walk was staged, in that it was a non-arrest,

it was more of a security escort for these three characters.

It could have been staged just for propaganda "grey" misinformation, but why?

It wasn't good law enforcement, it was a staged escort for some shady characters,

and "Lansdale" (not positively ID'd) was allowed to get very close to "Harrelson" (not positively ID'd) and the security of the process was very weak, as if these men were known to be know real threat.

I think Howard Hunt was in it up to his ears, but I tend to believe Chauncy Holt's

scenario.

I think the third "Bum" is an as yet unnamed French OAS mercenary assassin,

possibly an associate of the late Albert Spaggia ...

Edited by Shanet Clark
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Just as I think the possible presence of a Cuban intelligence officer in Dealey Plaza has sinister implications (see "Did Fidel Kill JFK" thread), so would the unexplained presence of an intelligence or military officer in Dealey Plaza raise suspicions.

We are all familiar with E. H. Hunt's inability to provide a consistent answer to where he was on November 22, 1963.

Query whether there is some way through official records to verify where people like Gen. Landsdale were on November 22, 1963. It may be more difficult re CIA personnel to obtain such records.

It seems to me the presence of people at "the scene of the crime" who had no apparent reason for being there is a very significant line of inquiry and I wonder if there is a way to "weed out" some of the possible suspects even if it requires FOIA requests.

Edited by Tim Gratz
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Just as I think the possible presence of a Cuban intelligence officer in Dealey Plaza has sinister implications (see "Did Fidel Kill JFK" thread), so would the unexplained presence of an intelligence or military officer in Dealey Plaza raise suspicions.

We are all familiar with E. H. Hunt's inability to provide a consistent answer to where he was on November 22, 1963.

Query whether there is some way through official records to verify where people like Gen. Landsdale were on November 22, 1963.  It may be more difficult re CIA personnel to obtain such records.

It seems to me the presence of people at "the scene of the crime" who had no apparent reason for being there is a very significant line of inquiry and I wonder if there is a way to "weed out" some of the possible suspects even if it requires FOIA requests.

That's an excellent suggestion Tim. Forgive my inexperience here, but how does one know what document(s) to request? Or is that the trick? I'd be interested in learning more about how to request documents through the FOIA. Is there perhaps an online resource that could help me? Any guidance would be appreciated. Thanks.

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Query whether there is some way through official records to verify where people like Gen. Landsdale were on November 22, 1963.

Lansdale retired from the Air Force on November 1, 1963, so probably no official records of his November 1963 travel exist. But his travel was indeed looked at in the research done for Oliver Stone's movie. On page 183 of JFK: The Book of the Film, is the following note:

"We decided to check on Lansdale's movements in November, 1963. What we found among Lansdale's papers at the Hoover Institute piqued our curiosity even more.

"Lansdale was 'retired' from the Air Force in October 1963. He then went to visit his son in Arizona, driving by way of Texas. He wrote to a friend in San Antonio, saying he'd stop by on the way; by November 14, he still hadn't arrived at the friend's house. Among his papers from this period was a claim check from the Hotel Texas in Fort Worth, the hotel that the presidential entourage stayed at the night before the assassination. There was no identifying mark on the claim check and we could not track down the guest records of the hotel (which has had many different owners since 1963) . . . but it is fascinating to find he was in Texas that very week."

Someone suggested a year or so ago on Lancer that it would be worthwhile to research Lansdale's travel and activity during the summer and fall of 1963, if he was busy at that time helping coordinate the conspiracy.

Ron

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Colonel Lansdale was the living model for "The Ugly American"

He was a counter-intelligence adviser in the Phillipines,

where quite a large number were killed in the 1950's and was

to use the expertise in political assassination and terror

that he learned in the Phillippines in the 1950's

in Vietnam and greater Southeast Asia in the 1960's.

As a colonel in Air Force intelligence, he was significant in the move toward

joint paramilitary operations involving multiple civilian and military agencies.

It was the coldest part of the Cold War, and Colonel Lansdale was implicated

in the assassination of JFK by his colleague and associate, Lt. Col. Fletcher Prouty.

It would tie in with a theory of joint paramilitary agency sanction on Kennedy.

Maxwell Taylor and McGeorge Bundy would escalate and greatly heighten

air, land, sea and signals efforts in Vietnam in the immediate aftermath of 11/63.

What Edwin Walker was to the Oswald frame, Lansdale was to the actual ambush team, or so it seems...

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  • 1 year later...
Hi Bill,

Is this the view you are thinking of? I'm not sure what to make of that image in the diamond...

Yea, that's it Greg,

Gut the frame is cropped too close to the man's right shoulder. The full shadow is cut out, including the face and the glasses, which are reflected on the diamond just above and to the right of the rifle stock.

I don't know if Lansdale wore glasses, but I think it might be helpful to know if this guy did in order to try to locate him in other pix.

BK

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Could be. That's a good observation Bill. It's intriguing, but hard to say for sure if that's what we are seeing.

Now I don't think it is. The closeup is too angular.

If that shadow isn't his head though, what is it?

I shouldn't do this after midnight on a Saturday night.

The Running Man is on TV.

Lawrence Harvey is in disquise in Spain, trying to outfox an insurance detective.

BK

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Re the photo of Lansdale, cropped. Note the ring on left hand. Part of Lansdales cover 'costume' as an Air Force Colonel and later, a General, was the 'ring knocker' accessory he wore to look the part. Prouty mentioned this in a conversation in Washington DC in 1995 at a COPA meeting where he was a guest speaker.

He also mentioned that sitting behind Lansdale at a desk in the Pentagon for three years convinced him that the man in the photo was, in fact, Lansdale.

Both men are now dead. But it is part of the Big Picture, like it or not.

Bests,

John

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