Jeff Sachs, an academic with a spine

[Kirk Gallaway]

Yeah, i love that Fox host who was wondering why they didn't ask Trump if he was going to open the files and get to the bottom of the U.S. moon landing !!!    hah hah hah!     That pretty much tells you the audience level!

I always thought Oliver used good judgment not being a guest on Alex Jones, unlike his son, who was a fixture on it for awhile. But now he's a guest on that Sly Stallone character Daniel Patrick David or whatever. That  guy in Miami who apparently got his millions from working an insurance Ponzi Scheme. That's really slumming it!

I have compassion for Stone that he had to phone his collaborator, Kiriakou to confirm that they actually together wrote the first chapter for a documentary he submitted to the History channel,  but I don't think Biden is slipping near  that bad and you'd think Stone would have a little more sympathy. But after voting for Biden,he   immediately became enraged at Biden for resisting Putin's invasion of Ukraine. ( even though I think both Biden and Trump would have done what Biden first did and offer asylum to Zelensky, which was to throw in the towel!) Still if Oliver knew anything about politics  it was a good bet that Biden hadn't watched Stone's pro Putin Ukraine film before the invasion! What was he thinking?

And we could argue how fair that  picture framing of Stone with Salma Hayek was! It's certainly more suggestive than anything you've seen Joe Biden get heat for!

heh heh

This is so superficial, looking for key words, like "America first" to compare Trump with JFK. JFK would be repelled with Trump!

Sorry, JFK was not a radical! His negative rating with the country at the time of his death was not one fiftieth of what Trump's currently is, (that's why it was received as such a shock!) and was largely confined to  one geographical area of the country (the South) and a relative handful of rabid anti communists.

  

 

 

[Joe Bauer]

2 minutes ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

This is so superficial, looking for key words, like "America first" to compare Trump with JFK. JFK would be repelled with Trump!

Sorry, JFK was not a radical! His negative rating with the country at the time of his death was not one fiftieth of what Trump's currently is, (that's why it was received as such a shock!) and was largely confined to one geographical area of the country (the South) and a relative handful of rabid anti-communists.

Exactly.

[Matthew Koch]

51 minutes ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

I always thought Oliver used good judgment not being a guest on Alex Jones, unlike his son, who was a fixture on it for awhile. But now he's a guest on that Sly Stallone character Daniel Patrick David or whatever. That  guy in Miami who apparently got his millions from working an insurance Ponzi Scheme. That's really slumming it!

I have compassion for Stone that he had to phone his collaborator, Kiriakou to confirm that they actually together wrote the first chapter for a documentary he submitted to the History channel,  but I don't think Biden is slipping near  that bad and you'd think Stone would have a little more sympathy. But after voting for Biden,he   immediately became enraged at Biden for resisting Putin's invasion of Ukraine. ( even though I think both Biden and Trump would have done what Biden first did and offer asylum to Zelensky, which was to throw in the towel!) Still if Oliver knew anything about politics  it was a good bet that Biden hadn't watched Stone's pro Putin Ukraine film before the invasion! What was he thinking?

And we could argue how fair that  picture framing of Stone with Salma Hayek was! It's certainly more suggestive than anything you've seen Joe Biden get heat for!

heh heh

This is so superficial, looking for key words, like "America first" to compare Trump with JFK. JFK would be repelled with Trump!

Sorry, JFK was not a radical! His negative rating with the country at the time of his death was not one fiftieth of what Trump's currently is, (that's why it was received as such a shock!) and was largely confined to  one geographical area of the country (the South) and a relative handful of rabid anti communists.

  

 

 

Superficial?!?! There is 5 pages of a case I've made maybe slither back to your water cooler or support your Ponzi scheme accusation! That would be almost as immoral as taking mental health patients money and selling them New Age Timithoy Leery psychedelic psychology therapy?!? [Emphasis added]

JFK says he is America First here: 

 

Now lets examine you and Stone's Radicals 

Here is Sal Alinsky The Godfather of Radicals 

The very first radical known to man who rebelled against the establishment and did it so effectively that he at least won his own kingdom -- Lucifer. (Saul Alinsky, Rules for Radicals)

 

 

Edited June 5 by Matthew Koch

[W. Niederhut]

What does Mateo Cocinero mean by "radical left?"

I'd like to propose a working definition.

Radical Left:  Loony lefties who support Civil Rights, (including voting rights) the rule of law, campaign finance reforms to limit dark money in U.S. elections, environmental protection, climate change mitigation, affordable healthcare, affordable education, and adequate funding of Social Security for working Americans.

A corollary is maintaining adequate taxation to support a healthy, educated society.

[Matthew Koch]

1 hour ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

I have compassion for Stone that he had to phone his collaborator, Kiriakou to confirm that they actually together wrote the first chapter for a documentary he submitted to the History channel,  but I don't think Biden is slipping near  that bad and you'd think Stone would have a little more sympathy. But after voting for Biden,he   immediately became enraged at Biden for resisting Putin's invasion of Ukraine. ( even though I think both Biden and Trump would have done what Biden first did and offer asylum to Zelensky, which was to throw in the towel!) Still if Oliver knew anything about politics  it was a good bet that Biden hadn't watched Stone's pro Putin Ukraine film before the invasion! What was he thinking?

And we could argue how fair that  picture framing of Stone with Salma Hayek was! It's certainly more suggestive than anything you've seen Joe Biden get heat for!

heh heh

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2205580/Oliver-Stone-gets-bit-touchy-feely-Salma-Hayek-London-photocall-Savages.html

Keep your hands off, Oli! Director Stone gets a tad too touchy-feely with Salma Hayek at the London photocall for Savages 

Touchy-feely: Oliver Stone seemed utterly enamoured by actress Salma Hayek as they attended a photocall for Savages on Wednesday afternoon

 

Enthralled: Stone couldn't seem to take his eyes off Hayek as they posed on the red carpet at London's Mandarin Oriental hotel

While the 46-year-old actress seemed to be laughing off the unwanted attention she was receiving from the film boss, there was more than a hint of awkwardness behind her smile. 

The legendary director, who has been married to wife Sun-jung Jung since 1997, seemed totally enamoured by the Hollywood star. 

https://www.newsweek.com/harvey-weinstein-oliver-stone-683933

Oliver Stone Defends Harvey Weinstein, Faces Allegations of His Own

Oliver Stone was working on a Guantanamo Bay Documentary with Harvey Weinstein before the scandal broke when it did Oliver defended Weinstein until Patricia Arquette made an accusation and then flipped on Weinstein look how funny he reacts to Weinstein's buddy Jeffery Epstein being brought up!

 On the first page I posted Jeffery Sachs and the "Progressive" Vatican has David Talbot calls it. Because Francis is involved with Reinstating Mario Rupnik https://apnews.com/article/vatican-jesuit-pope-abuse-rupnik-cb8e67c99fd8ecfb8517f6282765d70e

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/why-has-the-vatican-restored-father-rupnik/

Why Has the Vatican Restored Father Rupnik?

Pretty Funny how you guys love Jeffery Sachs and he works for the "Progressive'' Vatican which is partnering with the WEF and Klaus Schwab who is advocating for governments to run their countries like Canada. Which is the Saul Alinsky SF California Über Alles that conservatives call Woke. [Emphasis Added] 

[Cliff Varnell]

MAGAt hypocrisy in action. 

Convicted Felon Donald Trump was civilly convicted of rape. 

He was friends with Jeffrey Epstein for years until Trump's scumbaggery was too much even for Epstein. 

 

Edited June 5 by Cliff Varnell

[W. Niederhut]

1 hour ago, Cliff Varnell said:

MAGAt hypocrisy in action. 

Convicted Felon Donald Trump was civilly convicted of rape. 

He was friends with Jeffrey Epstein for years until Trump's scumbaggery was too much even for Epstein. 

 

Cliff,

    What Mathew K. (aka Mateo Cocinero) is telling us here is that, in the MAGA cult, only Great Leader is allowed to grab women by the p*ssy with impunity.

    It's similar to the situation with David Koresh and the Branch Davidians... 🙄

[Matthew Koch]

5 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

More from  Jeff Sachs, this time with Tucker Carlson.

He has the Neocons nailed. And Joe, I can tell you from experience that Patrick Bet is a Trumpster, who somehow equates him with JFK.

 

Too Bad James put me on "Ignore" or we could discuss his Cliché Guevara buddy Aaron Good's Texas Shooter thesis that I've basically sunk it's battle ship. The reason I say we could discuss is because I have it next to me and it's a doozy. 

Funny how you guys have been doing the Ice Cream debate since the 90's meanwhile in reality your politics don't represent JFK they Represent the World Economic Forum. 

 

[Matthew Koch]

7 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

Patrick Bet-David. Right wing shill.

I remember the "first thing" Bet-David said to Clint Hill to start off his interview of Hill regards Hill's book "Mrs. Kennedy And Me!"

After reading your book ... "It sounds to me like you were in love with Jackie Kennedy."

A view I agree with. One of only a few however.

I've watched so many of Bet-David's interviews. I used to believe he was a politically objective interviewer.

Yet, more and more he is expressing and interjecting his own point of views during his pod casts that clearly reveal his own leanings and imo they are clearly pro-Trump and all that embodies.

Hi Joe, hope you are doing well.. 

Can you point out some parts in this interview that are what you are referring to? 

My politics are similar to Patricks so he doesn't annoy me, like he does to you 

 

[Ron Bulman]

On 5/30/2024 at 11:13 PM, James DiEugenio said:

From his current column at Common Dreams.

 

Kennedy saved the world by coolly reasoning his way through the Cuban Missile Crisis, rather than following the advice of hothead advisors who called for war (for a detailed account, see Martin Sherwin’s magisterial Gambling with Armageddon, 2020). He then negotiated the Partial Nuclear Test Ban Treaty with Khrushchev in 1963. By the time of his death, which may well have been a government coup resulting from Kennedy’s peace initiative, JFK had pushed the clock back to 12 minutes to midnight, a magnificent and historic achievement.

This one paragraph started what has since become a mess.  I thought the title was inferring the author was courageous for saying this given saying such things has caused other authors and speakers to loose support or attention of the MSM.  Nothing in it about current politics. 

Now, unfortunately for Jim as it's his thread, it has become so.  Hijacked.  Bernie and Biden bashing.  Trump defense.  Retorts.  Sensationalism.  Pretty much all from one poster.  Who has a history of disruption, and, prior extreme foul verbal abuse of other members including moderators, before I was one (a moderator). 

As a result, Jim has put Matthew Koch aka Mateo Cocinero on ignore, giving up on it.  Since then, today Matthew/Mateo told Kirk to slither back to his water cooler.  Essentially calling him a snake.  This aside, for the moment.

Imho, this thread has become a perfect example of why the moderators have moved some such to the Political Discussions forum in recent times.  It has become necessary to prevent turmoil regarding the associated vitriol at times.

 In the interest of transparency in regards to current forum events I'm posting this here.  As Mark has noted in the past. this is not a Democracy.

However, I would be interested in this one case in particular, though every instance cannot and should not be necessitated to do so, would the other administrators/moderators or owner, Mark, Sandy, James, be willing to chime in, publicly for the sake of members.  Should this thread be moved to Political Discussions?

[James DiEugenio]

I never meant it as a political discussion.

And you acknowledge that.

I meant it as pointing out a major  figure in the media and academia who has the guts to call the JFK murder what it was, the overthrow of the government.  I think that was worthy of notice. And i still do. As I also noted elsewhere, Sachs did the same thing in a long interview he did with Carlson.

In other words, he is getting even more exposure with this message.  Somehow that is not good?

[Joe Bauer]

12 hours ago, Matthew Koch said:

Hi Joe, hope you are doing well.. 

Can you point out some parts in this interview that are what you are referring to? 

Thank you for the well wishes.

From here on out it is a matter of trying to adjust my mind in accepting certain physical and emotional set-back conditions as permanent and learning to live with them as best as I can. Not everyone who hits 70 is blessed with good health unfortunately.

Regards finding the Patrick Bet-David interview of Clint Hill where Bet-David asks Hill about his book "Mrs. Kennedy And Me" and starts off by saying "It looks to me like you were in love with Jackie Kennedy" I simply cannot find it anywhere.

I've spent the last 45 minutes scouring the internet for the interview with zero results. 

Kind of weird.

I KNOW I viewed that interview. I KNOW Bet-David said to Hill those exact words.

Hill was kind of speechless when asked the question. He stumbled a little and simply said..."No." The inferred subject was instantly dropped.

I speculated the same view of Hill feeling much more intimate toward Jackie Kennedy after being so physically close to her for years.

Jackie was just 31 when Hill was assigned to her. Hill just 28! Both in their physical beauty prime. Both were extremely athletic and good looking. Jackie was simply stunning.

Hill was so close to the family he at times had to play the part of fill-in father to Jackie's two children in a sense of protective closeness and even playfulness when JFK was off doing other things.

Hill seemed enamored by Jackie. His assignment to protect her included accompanying her at times side-by-side on many world-wide trips, often by themselves with JFK elsewhere.

Hill seemed to enjoy being close to that kind of exciting, first-class accommodations lifestyle himself.   Who wouldn't?

All I could reference to in my guess of Hill's affection for Jackie Kennedy was to put myself in many of the one-on-one scenes ( Jackie and himself ) he describes in his book.

The scene where Jackie and Hill are traveling somewhere together by chauffeured car and at some point Jackie asks Hill to get in the back seat with her, and then to give her a cigarette and then light it for her ... and obviously conversing about what? Jackie's personal feelings about who knows what?

I'm sorry, if I was just inches from sexy voiced Jackie Kennedy ( one of the most beautiful women on Earth at the time ) and sharing cigarettes and small but relaxed talk in that close of a space where I could smell her perfume...I couldn't help but be totally taken by her.

At 28 to 31 I was in heat all the time. Jackie was just 3 years older than Hill.

Jackie was no Maime Eisenhower. No Eleanor Roosevelt.

She was simply one of the most stunningly beautiful, classy and attractive women on Earth. And right in the middle of her still young adult prime of 31 to 34 when Hill was assigned to her.

It may very well be that Clint Hill was able to keep his inner feelings of attraction toward Jackie in check. And if so, good for him.

Personally I just know I couldn't have. 

Daily seeing Jackie's goddess beauty face, hearing her soft breathy voice, smelling her fabulous perfume ... I would had to have quit that assignment under tortured physical attraction and desire craving duress.

 

 

Edited June 6 by Joe Bauer

[Ron Bulman]

On 6/6/2024 at 3:15 AM, James DiEugenio said:

I never meant it as a political discussion.

And you acknowledge that.

I meant it as pointing out a major  figure in the media and academia who has the guts to call the JFK murder what it was, the overthrow of the government.  I think that was worthy of notice. And i still do. As I also noted elsewhere, Sachs did the same thing in a long interview he did with Carlson.

In other words, he is getting even more exposure with this message.  Somehow that is not good?

Yes, that's good I think, for what that's worth.

[James DiEugenio]

In fact, my next substack article is going to be about Jeff Sachs.

[Matthew Koch]

On 6/2/2024 at 11:20 PM, James DiEugenio said:

The reason that Sachs is not a Clint Eastwood HA on China is the same reason he wrote that book about Kennedy.

A recurrent refrain of JFK was that the USA should not be on the wrong side of history.

That is, America should not be a colonialist/imperialist country nor should we back nations that are, even if they were once our allies....

 

PS: Kennedy told Hilsman he wanted an opening to China in his second term.

 

 I just ordered Hillsman's book to further understand where this comment is coming from. 

Here is Hillsman on Kennedy and China "Although it was certainly true that United States policy needed to be more flexible than in the past, what everyone had to understand was that before increased flexibility would work there probably also had to e more firmness. So long as the Chinese felt that aggression would hardly turn to "Peaceful Coexistence." Basically, it was this policy that combined firmness with flexibility that had not only checked the expansionism of the Soviet Tunon but had done so without war." 

JFK: "I've always felt, and I think history will record, that the change of China from being a country friendly to us to a country which is unremittingly hostel affected very strongly the balance of power in the world. And while there were- there still is, of course, room for argument as t whether any United States actions would have hanged the course of events there, I think a greater effort would have been wiser. I said it in '49, so it isn't totally hindsight... These Chinese are tough. It isn't just what they say about us but what they say about the Russians. They are in the Stalinist phase, believe in class war and the use fo force, and seem prepared to sacrifice 300 million people if necessary to dominate Asia""

-Kennedy Public Papers 1961

 

James, what was Kennedy's policy regarding India and China border clash?