David Josephs

In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way. Franklin D. Roosevelt

Thanks Ron.

This is supposedly the same guy who picks up all the Carcano shells from the Shooting range each and every time... what puzzles me are the different makes of bullets... I mean if this is a setup then why confuse the issue? 1 box of ammo does the job... as opposed to a dozen loose bullets of different make. Any thoughts on that inconsistency?

Hadn't even considered that Richard... great point. {applause} Now that you mention it, McD and the others seem pretty casual after supposedly having a murder suspect with a gun try to shoot one of them... Amazing the things that can be overlooked.... that I can overlook thanks for this Richard... DJ

You might enjoy "None Dare Call it Conspiracy" which is where I got my exposure to that time period..... it's a free pdf online and a quick read... amazing stuff. A theory I've had for a while is that the Military helped to create the CIA to act as a buffer between Military intelligence (ONI and MID - the oldest of US intel agencies) and what the public saw. The CIA did their stonewalling while the Military proceeded with their intel activities virtually untouched... Hoover had the SIS doing the Eastern Hemisphere and was pitching to take over all foreign intel work... but FDR said no and the Truman went his own way - with guidance of course... Look at the first 4 Directors.... Navy, AF, Navy, Army..... then Allen Dulles. So maybe I see it more as an added layer of insulation for Military Intelligence... Interesting about Hamilton, didn't know that about him. And I don't know if you'd call it a coup from the inside but didn't Lincoln have the Treasury print money rather than borrow from the "banks" of the time...?? Yes, here it is.... a kind of a coup in that without that change the North might have had a lot more trouble.... History is great - Truth stranger than fiction Take care Chris DJ During the Civil War (1861-1865), President Lincoln needed money to finance the War from the North. The Bankers were going to charge him 24% to 36% interest. Lincoln was horrified and went away greatly distressed, for he was a man of principle and would not think of plunging his beloved country into a debt that the country would find impossible to pay back. Eventually President Lincoln was advised to get Congress to pass a law authorizing the printing of full legal tender Treasury notes to pay for the War effort. Lincoln recognized the great benefits of this issue. At one point he wrote: “... (we) gave the people of this Republic the greatest blessing they have ever had – their own paper money to pay their own debts...”

I honestly thought I had done that Richard. In posts on this thread and articles posted/linked at K&K. Here is mine again with John's as well. http://harveyandlee.net/Guns/Pistol.html is a short piece by Armstrong, a mentor and friend who has spent countless hours discussing these topics https://kennedysandking.com/images/pdf/JosephsPistol.pdf this is mine and takes things a bit further... Richard, It is not my intention to argue with you... trying to determine if there is something I was not aware of that led you to conclude he had a pistol on him when he entered the theater. DPD statements saying he did are, IMO, not enough. Their credibility is dodgy at best with regards to items that incriminate Oswald - I'd think we agree on that. You see I do know about the pistol... I do know what happened in Westbrook's office and did trace the travels of 2 pistols that day... and I agree with you on most of the points related to the Tippit murder and the staged reloading of the pistol in order to leave evidence... We agree it was not Oswald killing Tippit. So there would be little reason to go against all the evidence showing he never got a pistol, to put one in his hands now as he enters the theater. I am saying that the DPD planted "A" pistol on the man that surfaces during this scuffle which becomes "THE" pistol back at DPD in Westbrook's office. Everybody agrees on the "click" (like Baker claiming he climbed the stairs with Truly... ) so it must have happened. I am also saying that WESTBROOK planted a wallet at the Tippit crime scene to add the name HIDELL to the evidence which connects Oswald to the rifle and pistol orders... I am saying there is no evidence that Oswald had a pistol at any point in time after his return in June 1962. (Note: June 1962 is the month 700 Carcano FC rifles including 2766 arrive at Century Arms / Empire Wholesale and is the month on FELDSOTT's affidavit as to when that rifle was sold to Klein's - the connections are pervasive) On a previous post I discuss the Postcard that never existed, a shipment that never happened and the existence of a pistol that isn't here, there or anywhere to be found prior to 11/22. So that is why I see it highly unlikely that Oswald entered the Texas Theater with any pistol... It has even been postulated that the pistol is given to the DPD in the balcony of the theater (where the DPD was first directed and where a number of reports still place the arrest).. and then becomes part of the main floor scuffle... a pistol that supposedly just fired off 4 rounds killing a man - that now doesn't work. How convenient for the DPD is that? And finally the large number of loose bullets.... he shoots 4 times, reloads with 4-6 shells and still has 5 more shells in his pants pocket at the DPD.... he's walking around with 9 to 11 live shells and a pistol with 4-6 shells... Another thing to find "odd" considering he was searched 2 or 3 times before these bullets were found.... oh and the magic bus transfer but that's another article for another day.... Mr. BELIN. How many did you find?Mr. HILL. There were six in the chambers of the gun No offense intended at all Richard.... I'm sorry it came off that way. I learn new things about old subjects all the time... the main reason I come here... it's just that some things taken for granted, like honest police reports, can't be in this case... the pistol is no different than the paper bag or the rifle or the tramps... all props, at least as I see it. Take care DJ

Richard... sorry if it came across as "snarky" - If the only evidence comes from the DPD - and the pistol could not possibly have come to Oswald via REA... Why do you accept he entered the theater with it on him? ======= I am sincerely asking as I know the provenance of that pistol... it came from SEAPORT who got if from Century International Arms (CIA)/Empire Wholesale both owned at the time by William Sucher of Canada. Sucher had also received in June 1962 a rifle with serial No. "2766". All 700 rifles were listed without a leading letter, and there were 5 more rifles in his shipment that had the same serial "numbers" as Klein's 100 rifle order. Anyway, from what I can tell no one ever got an REA postcard, and there's no record of anyone ever picking up that pistol. and finally, bottom image, the COD charges were never paid to REA who I do believe was in the business to charge for shipping... not ship things free... So once again without the assumptions and attitude - when he walked into the Theater, what proves to you he had a weapon? Fritz saying he says he did? "y'know, like how boys do".... Or maybe look into explaining why every shell casing in evidence looks as if they were recently pulled from a police belt that holds bullets... and the pistol itself is the exact same as used by the DPD.... The conspiracy to implicate Oswald extends to every item of evidence, if it didn't implicate, it wasn't important. and then there's that nasty BALCONY business.... I'm simply looking for the sources that lead you to your conclusion.... when the preponderance of Authentic evidence shows Oswald and that pistol never came in contact.... DJ ps... we have no records from REA showing a deposit, no postcard like those shown below, and nothing to document the journey it needs to take to wind up - supposedly - at 1026 Beckley... Mr. JENNER - You didn't see any kind of weapon? Mrs. PAINE - No. Mr. JENNER - Firearm, rifle, pistol, or otherwise? Mrs. PAINE - No; I saw nothing of that nature. Mr. JENNER - Did you drive them to your home? Mrs. PAINE - Yes. Mr. JENNER - Were the materials and things in your station wagon unpacked and placed in your home? Mrs. PAINE - Yes; immediately. Mr. JENNER - Did you see that being done, were you present? Mrs. PAINE - I helped do it; yes. Mr. JENNER - Did you see any weapon on that occasion? Mrs. PAINE - No. Mr. JENNER - Whether a rifle, pistol or-- Mrs. PAINE - No. Mr. JENNER - Or any covering, any package, that looked as though it might have a weapon, pistol, or firearm? Mrs. PAINE - No.

For reference here is that Film Map done by Horne.... Still amazes me how anyone can say a film with 6 splices and too many feet is not "altered"

Going thru FONZI's HSCA notes and even he is starting to seriously wonder: I believe the person being referred to as stating the Cubans did not think it was our Oswald visiting in Mexico... is LITAMIL-9... bottom image. He also can't understand how the FBI could have heard tapes of Oswald when the CIA insists the tapes were destroyed... the photo is Mystery Man... So of course Hoover says there's a 2nd man down there... even though his agents spent all of November looking for any trace of Oswald being in Mexico... no luck. DJ

I wouldn't go that far... I think the white cap is McDonald yet there were plenty of other DPD on the scene... I thought I had read an account or two which said the pistol attributed to Oswald appears from somewhere else... I'll go check the reports... I'd suggest reading the Arrest reports of the men listed in this photo... DJ

Welcome to the forum John.... seems you've been here enough to chime in... hope you're enjoying your stay here.... What gets me about the whole jam thing.... far right image and others showed nothing protruding from the bottom and as you can see, the bolt is opened already The other 2 images show that protrusion... Below that is an overlay I just did showing the diagram of the clip system and a better image of the clip area of the rifle... Sure looks like it's in the right place.... but when does it go from not being there - as in this image to being there?

And I am, without sarcasm stating there is no definitive way to show he had a pistol on him when entering that theater. The subsequent finding of a holster supposedly hanging on a doorknob is absurd, and as many have shown, our Oswald didn't actually live at Beckley (some great thread here on that) The only reports placing a gun in his possession are those of the DPD, of course. Yet the pistol in evidence as well as the shells and extra ammo are all standard issue for police forces... this was no ordinary pistol with ordinary ammo.... What we do know is at some point Carroll gives a pistol to Hill... all of the identification markings for that pistol are engraved AFTER they all meet in WESTBROOK's office.... At the linked article in a previous post I trace the two different paths of the "pistol".... After all I've read and seen with DPD/FBI reports that are simply lies, there is no reason they would not report "Oswald with a pistol trying to kill a cop".... If you could help me understand what non-DPD evidence suggests to you he had a pistol of that type EVER in his possession, I sure would appreciate it. (I mean you got Bentley claiming he sees Oswald pull the pistol just as he entered the theater and 3-6 men are fighting with Oswald - Bentley had been in the BALCONY where most every DPD report places the location of the suspect - "as they were told" "we heard he was in the balcony".... etc. We've all seen STRINGFELLOW's report about the suspect being captured in the Balcony..... along with the boy taken out the back.... So, no... I do not believe the reports he had a pistol on him at any time.

IDK... we might consider what Colonel House did to Woodrow Wilson via the Wall Street/Banking Syndicate of the Rothschilds to get the Rederal Reserve Act of 1913 passed giving a private entity the forever contract to regulate our money supply and charge us trillions in the process... Kinda depends on how you define coup d'etat.... while so many include "violent overthrow" the "change in government" I believe is the essence of a coup... the change in where the power resides... With the Fed Res Act of 1917.... The US becomes part of the world-wide Rothschilds banking empire.... one of the last few hold outs as our history had warned us over and over to stay away from Central Banks... (side note: Aaron Burr kills Hamilton over whose banking interests would prevail and become the first attempt at a national bank.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhattan_Company “This [Federal Reserve Act] establishes the most gigantic trust on earth. When the President (Woodrow Wilson) signs this bill, the invisible government of the monetary power will be legalized....the worst legislative crime of the ages is perpetrated by this banking and currency bill.” ― Charles A. Lindbergh Sr., And before that, VP Johnson and Sec of State Seward among others were in on the killing of Lincoln conspiracy.... Before that, I wouldn't doubt it...

Great image... can you please post 1-2 frames before and after?

Definitely? Other than that afternoon, can you name one other time any pistol is connected to Oswald? or how that pistol gets from Magazine Street to Irving then to Beckley... let alone from SEAPORT to REA for pick-up. All I can think of are the Backyard Photos which I feel helps my case more than hurts it... With tongue in cheek Richard (and from my 1st ever article) Oswald needs to retrieve the bag with a disassembled rifle, bullets and clip rattling around; get to the 6th floor; assemble the rifle with a dime(?), hope the sight is still aligned, load in a partially filled clip and be at that window by a time he THINKS the motorcade would come by... 12:10-12:20 for a 12:30 luncheon. The only people on the 6th floor at this time - we know for sure - were Williams, a man seen in a jacket and glasses, and the person caught in Dillard at the far WEST end of the 6th floor.... The props dropped - IMO - were the props needed.... I've said it before - There is no way to underestimate the Hubris of Authority at the time. Just look how quickly the info from the DPD press conference was squashed by the FBI... Take care and always good chatting with you DJ

You've hit upon topics near and dear to my heart... and years of work. https://kennedysandking.com/images/pdf/JosephsPistol.pdf You'll be amazed at the 2 different and provable paths that pistol took... As to the rifle.... thanks Richard, John's work set the foundation as well as a good part of that structure... we just took it a little further.... We must remember that originally the rifle was a 7.65mm Mauser-type (Roger Craig said it was stamped on the top as shown below - top left) other stamp ID's included 7.35 and the 6.5 mm.... there is only 1 photo of what is said to be CE-137's caliber stamp, and it appears to have a "3" not "5" the story I had heard was that a Mauser uses a Stripper clip which does not go into the rifle when loading.. a missing clip would make the Carcano hand-loaded or give the Mauser even more credibility .... so a clip was invented/found for the Carcano which must have used one to shoot that quickly. Of note: SA ODUM of the FBI is the man who drives DAY back to his office with the rifle, shells, and "clip" Day's note seems to add the clip as an after thought and the CLIP would have fallen out when that bolt was opened.. Doesn't look like 6.5 to moi...

One of the things that always bothered me about that area was how JFK was blocked by the mirror making him look very distorted so I put him back in: if it helps your thought process. Below that is a reconstruction of where McHugh SHOULD have been sitting.... the windshield hole takes on a whole new perspective, no?

yet she claims not to have taken images of the assassination... How dat?

A "ghost" image of the BYP 133-C was found in DPD records... Taking the 1978 discovered 133-C and pasting him back in... uh, doesn't work. Additionally, I think we've all shown that Oswald never had a rifle in the states.... kinda makes the BYP moot by definition. I did a 4 part series on the rifle/pistol with 1 piece on the BYPs... the rest of the articles are also on K&K. Hope they shed some light DJ https://kennedysandking.com/images/pdf/JosephsBYP.pdf

Chris... once again great stuff... well done... A question comment.... Marie Muchmore insists she did not take any film of the shooting itself... The sync you did is wonderful.... any thoughts then where this amazingly clear portion of the Muchmore film comes from... as the rest of the film simply doesn't match... Even these 2 prints from that one frame doesn't seem possible it's the same original film....?? Thanks

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/frazierb1.htm (see excerpts below image) The magic self-supporting paper bag... Gary Mack sent me a transcript of Montgomery here claiming there was a curtain rod "or something" holding up the bag.... Mr. BALL. Where was the paper sack?Mr. MONTGOMERY. Let's see--the paper sack--I don't recall for sure if it was on the floor or on the box, but I know it was just there----one of those pictures might show exactly where it was.Mr. BALL. I don't have a picture of the paper sack. Mr. BALL. The larger one you mentioned that was in position 2.Mr. MONTGOMERY. Yes.Mr. BALL. You picked it up?Mr. MONTGOMERY. Wait just a minute no; I didn't pick it up. I believe Mr. Studebaker did. We left it laying right there so they could check it for prints. Mr. BALL. Did you question any witnesses that day?Mr. MONTGOMERY. Let's see----that particular day--no, sir; I don't believe I talked to a witness that day. (DJ !! - so what's he doing there besides carrying the paper bag that he never picked up? Didn't they wind up making a few extra bags that day and in subsequent days? Pat Speer does a great job with the bag info fwiw) Mr. BALL - What did the package look like?Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I will be frank with you, I would just, it is right as you get out of the grocery store, just more or less out of a package, you have seen some of these brown paper sacks you can obtain from any, most of the stores, some varieties, but it was a package just roughly about two feet long.Mr. BALL - It was, what part of the back seat was it in?Mr. FRAZIER - It was in his side over on his side in the far back.Mr. BALL - How much of that back seat, how much space did it take up?Mr. FRAZIER - I would say roughly around 2 feet of the seat.Mr. BALL - From the side of the seat over to the center, is that the way you would measure it?Mr. FRAZIER - If, if you were going to measure it that way from the end of the seat over toward the center, right. But I say like I said I just roughly estimate and that would be around two feet, give and take a few inches.Mr. BALL - How wide was the package?Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I would say the package was about that wide.Mr. BALL - How wide would you say that would be?Mr. FRAZIER - Oh, say, around 5 inches, something like that. 5, 6 inches or there. I don't--Mr. BALL - The paper, was the color of the paper, that you would get in a grocery store, is that it, a bag in a grocery store?Mr. FRAZIER - Right. You have seen, not a real light color but you know normally, the normal color about the same color, you have seen these kinds of heavy duty bags you know like you obtain from the grocery store, something like that, about the same color of that, paper sack you get there. Mrs. RANDLE. About this.Mr. BALL. Is that about right? That is 28 1/2 inches.Mrs. RANDLE. I measured 27 last time.Mr. BALL. You measured 27 once before?Mrs. RANDLE. Yes, sir.

Ok... so when the HSCA interviews AZCUE his recollection differs from the CIA story.... what a surprise, right? Again, the CIA LIENVOY kept tabs on a large number of telephone numbers... with the machinery "never missing a day" per the report on the man who cares for the equipment. AZCUE also says they close at 2 pm during the week... the Friday 9/27 calls all occur after 4 pm and on Saturday.... what a crock. Finally - like DURAN.... AZCUE was not shown the application photo until the HSCA...

Thanks again to Bart's scanning Malcolm's collection.... We learn that AZCUE called the Russian Consulate about Oswald on Sept 28th.... I was unaware of this... Like Oswald's calls, we should have tape and/or at least a transcript of this call as well.... (we have one of DORTICOS/ARMAS related to Oswald/Duran) Yet the passage from the report says otherwise: They don't know the specific content yet they know with whom he speaks and that there would be a 4 month delay.... this is part of what we understand to be the CIA chronology for Oswald in Mexico.... We also know that DURAN tells us the man calling himself OSWALD did not return after Friday.... despite the 9/28 transcripts of him and Duran. Seems to me this describes a call that was never made... but I'll go do some digging....

After DURAN's arrest in 1963 there was a call 11/26/63 which is transcribed by the CIA.... between President Dorticos in Cuba and Amb Armas here's page 1.... Their concern had to do with money being given to Oswald by Duran... (for context, Duran was believed by many a CIA asset - vague but close enough to help) The 1962 memo and discussion I had not followed up upon... just proved to me that 22 months before, the idea of tape fabrication within the LIENVOY program sounds lilke standard fare.... FWIW. oh... I usually name my files to help lead me back to the sources but did not on the 1962 one meaning I probably got it from someone as a one pager or found it in a larger unmarked pdf of reports. but I'll keep sniffing... unless one of our resident experts can lead the way... sorry I couldn't be more helpful with this one DJ

https://kennedysandking.com/images/pdf/JosephsFBIZ313.pdf Did this a while back, yet some is out of date now... but I do look into where the info comes from.... Enjoy... then read the Math Rules thread.