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Vince Palamara

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Posts posted by Vince Palamara

    Message from Abraham Bolden posted today on Facebook

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    4 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:

    Vince,

    In one of the docs you provided, it says,

    - QUOTE -

    image.png.9edb67384fc1d926cd92b820129809f4.png

    - ENDQUOTE -

    I was interested in this "tail car" I've never looked into that.  In the joint report filed with Curry by Batchelor, Lumpkin and Stevenson, it says:

    [Report from Charles Batchelor to Chief J. E. Curry, November 30, 1963]

    Page 21 of 70

    Portal to Texas History

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338584/m1/21/?q=Stevenson

    image.png.803dae4a782b0cd40182bc59c2434f0e.png

     

    On page 21 pf Batchelor's report, it says that Lawson asked for a police car to bring up the tail end of the motorcade. Lumpkin offered to have Captain Fritz ride in this car, and Lawson said, no, he wanted a police car with flashing red lights and uniformed officers.

    (For some reason, the Forum software will not let me copy and paste in little paragraph, but you can read it here:

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338584/m1/21/?q=Stevenson

     

    image.png.4ebf16057e38c4572d8cae255fec949d.png

     

    Ray Lunday was the Assistant Chief of Police for the Traffic Division, and was assigned the Security for Love Field.

     

    I don’t find a Report from Ray H. Lunday in the Portal to Texas History, so I don’t know who he assigned to that rear “tail car”, or whether a Secret Service Agent rode in it.

    He did not testify before the Warren Commission.

    Purdue Lawrence Deposition Exhibit# 2 only covers the motorcycle assignments. (20H489)

    https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1137#relPageId=509

     

    I had never heard about this "rear police vehicle", and whether it had a Secret Service Agent in it.

    I went through the Secret Service Reports in Volume XVIII of the Hearings and Exhibits, and I didn't find anyone who mentions it.

    There's a memo from Rowley that covers the White House Detail coverage of the motorcade, but that coverage seems to stop at the follow-up car behind the Vice-President's car.

    (18H810)

    https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1135#relPageId=824&search=lunday

    (18H810).

     

    Steve Thomas

     

     

    Yes. There was also usually a press photographers flatbed truck filming the motorcade right in front of the presidential limo; many more motorcycles; a second police car filled with armed detectives; in one-third of all of his motorcades, a bubble top (either partial or full, often in good weather); military and police lining the streets and facing the crowds; undercover detectives intermingled IN the crowds themselves; a military aide sitting between the driver and the agent in charge of the trip (usually SAIC Behn and ASAIC Boring); Main Press Secretary Pierre Salinger or his immediate assistant Andy Hatcher on the trip; building rooftops guarded, included the use of a police helicopter, as was done in San Antonio 11/21/63.

    Joe McBride in 1988

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    3 minutes ago, Joseph McBride said:

    Thanks for posting this, Vince. The story was

    big news for ten days until the CIA broke its

    rules and issued a (false) denial about Bush

    being in the CIA before he became its director.

    Then the MSM dropped the story, believing the lie.

    I knew the story would be vindicated eventually.

    Various book writers and others have expanded

    on it, including Russ Baker, who starts his

    book on the Bushes with my discovery of

    the Hoover memo. The Nation wouldn't print my

    third article on Bush, a well-documented article about his relationship with

    James Parrott; Victor Navasky advised me to avoid

    the Kennedy assassination because it is a "quagmire."

    So I wrote 35 pages on Bush and Parrott and the

    assassination in INTO THE NIGHTMARE.

    Your books and research are excellent!!

    Why does Mary Ferrell have such a bad rep?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    5 hours ago, Pat Speer said:

    Here's some more guesswork as to Ferrell's motivation. Ferrell was in her 40's when JFK was killed. Her children had either moved out or were on the verge of moving out. She  worked as a legal secretary. What may have started out as a personal obsession--witness the numerous chronologies she made that are now available on the MFF website--soon became the center of her social life. Researcher after researcher--many of them quite interesting people--came to visit her, and access her archives. She became a den mother to the research community. Whatever personal feelings she had about JFK prior to the assassination were by then beside the point. She had a new family, and being a part of this family gave her purpose. 

    It's not remotely surprising to me, and am shocked so many find it so surprising. 

    There's also this. Anyone who ever attended a Lancer conference--for which Ferrell provided the inspiration--heard statement after statement regarding JFK's greatness as president and as man. They poured it on a little thick, IMO. But the point is that these conferences served to deify Kennedy, and build up a desire within those attending to find the truth about who killed him. 

    If this was all part of some plot to make the case go away, it was the dumbest plot ever. 

    Excellent, Pat! I was at Lancer in 1997 (including on 11/22/97 as a speaker) and I agree with your assessment. Also, Mary was very nice to me.

    Why does Mary Ferrell have such a bad rep?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    3 minutes ago, Larry Hancock said:

    Vince,  not to jump in but I had some extended personal experience with Harry - who even  persuaded me to provide funding for Madeline Brown's book (back when I was new and eager and ...more than a little naive).   Based on many exchanges with Harry I can say that he was an emotional guy,  very committed to his own world view and very much suspicious of anyone who he perceived getting in the way of that.  I never saw any sign that he really played well with others although he did do some groundbreaking interviews and deserves credit for that work.  My take is that his response to Mary was very personal and consistent with his being very much an independent actor.  Anyone "connected" or having any sign of being part of an "establishment" of any sort just escalated his native skepticism - and Harry never kept those sorts of opinions to himself.

    Hi, Larry! Well said. Yes, I had several dealings with Harry. He was a tortured soul. George Michael Evica said "he needs a hug" and actually tried to befriend him, despite their differences. It worked for a time. Harry did some great work in the medical evidence field but a) his reputation overshadows his work and b) since his books came out before kindle and even Amazon hit in a major way, he is (in some respects) forgotten today, despite two best-sellers.

    Why does Mary Ferrell have such a bad rep?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    3 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

    I could barely read it. It was mostly paranoid nonsense. While I never met Harry, I know a few who have, and they all assured me the man had a screw loose. I mean, anyone who was written off as a nut by Lifton, Groden, Conway et al, was probably a nut. 

    There were signs of this, moreover, from early on. 

    From patspeer.com, Chapter 18c:

    A 6-11-80 article on Livingstone by Maureen Williams found in the Bangor Daily News suggests Livingstone was not a healthy camper. I know this seems a cheap shot, but stick with me here. This article was on Livingstone at a time virtually no one knew who he was, written in his local paper. The article, it follows, was his idea, or at least written with his full cooperation. And yet, look what it reveals: "The federal government has stipulated that certain sensitive material concerning the investigation of the assassination of President Kennedy in 1963 cannot be released to the public and media until the year 2039. One man who claims to be living in secrecy and fear for his life in eastern Maine, claims to have gotten some of that material through an underground source with connections in the Pentagon. Harrison Edward Livingstone, one of hundreds of private citizens who are involved in researching the assassination, carries his completed but rough manuscript of his book with him wherever he goes...He has kept on the move in recent years in several states, because he said he believes he's a 'hunted man.' In one of those states, he says, his car was fitted with an explosive device. In July 1979, a plane was to carry a team of reporters of the Baltimore Sun to Dallas, where they were to rendezvous with Livingstone. The plane was accidentally rammed by a jet fuel delivery truck on the airport apron. Livingstone says this was no accident. The incident caused the occupants to be confined in the plane for three hours, but what is stranger is that neither the newspaper or Livingstone could locate the investigative team for two days. In July and November 1979, the Baltimore Sun published two stories, containing purported new information and a lot of speculation, which Livingstone claims to have stimulated. 'But nobody read it...the wire services probably didn't pick it up, and one of the stories ran on a Sunday features page,' Livingstone said. Livingstone is convinced that some of the government's official autopsy photographs have been forged by an employee of the Central Intelligence Agency so they would be consistent with the so-called 'single-bullet, single-gunman' theory." 

    Yikes! Wow!

    Hickey might have fired his AR15 -- members survey.

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    Just now, Marjan Rynkiewicz said:

    That is what this survey is about -- i want to know how popular the Hickey theories are. I had seen a mention that 27% of jfkians reckon that Hickey fired at least one shot. But, such Hickeyists apparently dont bother to mix words with non-realists.

    I am inundated weekly with inquiries from strangers about Greer shooting JFK and Hickey shooting JFK. These theories are very popular with non-researchers. I suppose the "LBJ did it" theory would be third.

    Why does Mary Ferrell have such a bad rep?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    3 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

    Mary Ferrell was a conservative who had an interest in the assassination. People who failed to save up 1/10 as many documents as she, and failed to provide 1/10 as much help to their fellow researchers as she, found her insufficiently liberal, and insufficiently supportive of their pet theories, and thereby suspicious. 

    It's jealousy. It can be argued that the work of Mary Ferrell and the Mary Ferrell Foundation has done more to move the case forward than any one book, or any one author. The idea that she was a gate-keeper out to hold back the investigation doesn't hold water, or even make sense.

    Pat- I respect your opinion quite a bit. What is your take on Harry Livingstone AND his book KILLING THE TRUTH?

    The Worst US Secret Service Failure since Nov. 1963?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted · Edited by Vince Palamara

    2 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

    The thing I am really gratified about with this article is that they put in the front cover of the Douglass book, a link to the Black essay and the reference to Bolden.

    I am pretty sure no one else went that far although Carol L did mention the missing reports from 1963, but only in general.

    The Secret Service is a lawless agency.  I am sure Vince will agree that they should have been busted wide open in 1963.  They should not be allowed to do a repeat performance..

    Exactly, Jim. They got away with their horrible performance, drinking and carousing the night before and other misdeeds because 1963-1964 was a very naive time in America. They propped up Hill (one of the nine drinkers) and Youngblood as heroes in order to obfuscate their failings, plus they blamed the deceased president for their failure, a lie and a low-class move. Also, back then and even to this day, there is a sort of mental block when it comes to the Secret Service: they are viewed as the "good guys" (unlike the FBI and especially the CIA), so it is hard for many to grasp the idea that they were grossly incompetent or worse. The awards took everyone's eye off the ball.

    Why does Mary Ferrell have such a bad rep?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Sean Coleman said:

    Title self explanatory - why does she get dissed so much (by reputable researchers too) ? Thought she was a stalwart? 

    I know Harry Livingstone excoriated her in his third book KILLING THE TRUTH. I think Harry and others were suspicious of her, despite her impressive archive. As with Gary Mack, there were questions as to her beliefs and motive(s).

    The Most Popular Dumb JFK Assassination Theory

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    14 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

    It appears to be the Greer did it theory, holding that limo driver William Greer turned around and shot Kennedy in the head in front of dozens of witnesses, and no one noticed. 

    exactly!

    13 minutes ago, Ron Bulman said:

    It worked for me.  This one's about Greer.  By the title I figured it would be about Hickey.  Both are ridiculous. 

    Exactly-both are stupid! 

     

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