Ron Bulman

If Army is interpreted as Military overall and you step up a level from Lansdale to someone who Might be entrusted with knowledge to ensure that aspect was controlled for say a Harriman or David Rockefeller you might consider General Curtis Le May. Conveniently out of pocket, maybe out of the country over the border in Canada at the time of the assassination. Yet reportedly in Bethesda at the autopsy. Hated JFK. Had wanted a reason for a first strike nuclear attack on the ruskie's for years. He could have guaranteed any necessary air strikes world wide at a minimum. Dr. Strangelove meets Seven Day's in May. What ever happened regarding the missing Air force One tapes. Were they communicating with him? http://jfkfacts.org/a-note-on-curtis-lemays-actions-on-nov-22/ http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.com/2014/10/the-air-force-one-radio-tapes-update.html

If I may clarify the above. Just from what I've read that others have dug up. I don't think Morales would allow himself to be as close to the assassination site as the TSBD, he seems a bit above that operational level. That he might be involved in the set up and supervision of such an operation is at least conceivable given his area of expertise. As it is accepted by some that LHO didn't do it. A conspiracy that someone planned the physical operation of. Some have suggested, for example, Bill Harvey provided Corsican assassin's. Somebody provided them with, accommodation, transport, positioning, rehearsal (?), protection, escape??? Corsicans, Cubans, MIC. Somebody with expertise in such affairs would have walked Dealy Plaza and the surrounding area, maybe after normal working hours to attract less attention (?). They would have driven the route multiple times. They would have had after hours access to the Texas School Book Depository well in advance to inspect, plan, and set up. They might have even set up diversions (like a shot or two from the sixth floor?). If Morales participated in such and possibly watched the operation, maybe it was from a little further afar. Say the Postal Annex, all the way across Elm, Main and Continental, the whole of Dealy Plaza. Postal Inspector Holmes did so, with binoculars. If I remember right the building did house military offices in addition to other government offices (as did the Post office in New Orleans!). He did reportedly said "WE got hat SOB". Sometime later, he felt sick, went home to (?) Arizona(?), was taken to the hospital, no one was allowed to see him, and he died if memory serves me. Can anyone discredit or add to support of this supposition?

If the couch was on the East wall and the drapes were open Ruth would have seen the officers approaching the porch from the driveway and walkway and stepping up on it as she would have been looking South West at the TV front door closed or not. As it stands we have two officers, one from the DPD, one from the County Sherriff's Office saying Ruth met them at the open door and invited them in. But Ruth says she answered the closed door when the bell rang. Well, if she's lying about having Mikey and Ozzie move the couch she might be lying here too. I forget her comments on what she said when she opened the door about inviting them in / "been expecting you". Interesting that the questioning after answering the closed door changes to the lawn...

Larry, David and Ernie, Thank You.

Mr. Hancock, as I'm still new here... When you mention counter intelligence are you referring to Angleton and co. ? I've seen reference to Division 5 before but really know nothing about what you and Mr. Andrews are getting at. Is a brief synopsis too much to ask (any detail would be appreciated as well)? (I have SWHT and Nexus if they have any bearing I'm forgetting) P.S. Who's Ernie?

Imagery of the horror of the war for both sides was deeper than anything before or since. From taped video on the nightly news to Life and Time magazines pictures it changed public opinion. They and the newspaper were the only sources of information at the time for the few who cared to read. No IPhone or Internet, until the pictures and video tape, in magazines and on tv. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2441235/Historic-images-Vietnam-War-courageous-AP-photographers. http://time.com/3841060/iconic-vietnam-war-photos/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3zNJ9yTdJY Take the time to watch all 17 minutes of the last one in full screen. Only seen it myself for the first time tonight.

Outstanding picture, that at least I've never seen. Thank you sir. I counted what look like possibly 7 SSA's, maybe it's less, maybe I'm missing some. Could they have stopped a John Hinkley Jr in a crowd like that?

It didn't have to be Dulles setting up the Paine's personally per se. It is entirely possible, some might say probable, that he could have suggested their use given his knowledge of and about them. It is even more reasonable to think somebody in the CIA realized Ruth's sister worked for them, her dad had been in the OSS and worked for AID. That Michael's step dad in essence invented the most useful Bell helicopter and that he already had a security clearance working there. We already know that de Morenschildt had contact with CIA agent J Walton Moore in Dallas, documented. I believe I've read GDM said in later years he would never have contacted Oswald without Moore's authorization or (?) suggestion to do so. George later hands off the Oswasld's to the sister of a current Cia employee and daughter of a former OSS agent and gets the hell out of town. Might someone, Dulles influenced or not, have suggested to Moore that he, an associate or employee contact Ruth and or Michael in regards to helping the good old USA keep an eye on the activities of a recently returned Russian defector and his Russian wife? Especially such a woman who spoke Russian? This might help explain Michael's attendance of both left and right wing gatherings in Dallas. As well as Ruth's trip to see her sister and others in the summer of 63 them pick up Marina and (unknowingly) the rifle (?) in New Orleans. And those files in the garage on Castro reporters. Maybe the Paine's didn't have a "need to know" who was using them and how. By the time they "both knew who was really responsible" they realized it was time to only say what they were told to. Harvey deserves a separate post.

Point can be a bad place to be when your in a hot lz...or on patrol, so I infer from what I've read, thankfully not experienced. Thanks to those who have. Tom, facing the garage door entry from the kitchen looking South on the diagram the entryway (not door) to the living room is immediately to the left. In Chris latest picture the door to the garage is opened to the left obscuring the entryway to the living room. In an earlier picture it is evident there is no door on the entryway opening to the left from this view. One opening to the right from this perspective would interfere with the opening of the garage door to the left. They would bump unless both were closed when one was opened. An architect wouldn't design it that way. Pocket doors are not common in the single story tract houses like the Paines built in the 50's in the FW/D area. At least not the several I've been in. It's been nearly 24 years since I spent the evening in the kitchen. The one time I went into the garage to see where the rifle had supposedly been stored I don't remember a living room door having to be pulled back to at least half way open to open the garage entry door from the kitchen.

Joe and Paul maybe you can relate to this. I just finished reading an article in the latest issue of Rolling Stone on Greg Allman. "Greg also had no use for the Vietnam War. One night he got drunk and shot himself in the foot. He was then exempt from the selective service."

Every now and then I still stumble across something that that makes me go Huh? Most times it's ignorance, my lack of deeper knowledge of a subject. I've read somewhere that Dulles was in Dallas a month or so before the assassination promoting his book. That this was unusual in that he visited very few cities promoting his book (a half dozen?) and that he had been to Texas never or once or twice in his life. Now it turns out he was in Texas less than a month before the assassination and that he visited three of the cities JFK did on 11/22. What the hell was the erudite East Coast Establishment former director of the CIA fired by JFK doing in Cowtown promoting his book to the Friends of the Fort Worth Library? Other than the Basses, Richardson, Carters and a few other oil millionaires who would buy his book? Not many with privileges at the library would even read it if given to them. Did the Fort Wroth Star Telegram report on his visit? Did Dulles visit with his former subordinate General Cabell also fired by JFK or his brother the Mayor while in Dallas? Though I don't remember when he was there God Bless former Star Telegram reporter Jim Marrs for carrying on.

de Mohrenschildt probably spoke truthfully at least once in his life. When he begged CIA director George Bush (George Bush of the CIA, briefed by FBI director J. Edgar Hoover, 11/23/63) to get the spooks off his ass. Dear George... Were they not both members of the Dallas Petroleum Club. Attendee's of the Oil Barron's Ball?

It would be nice if it could be blown up a bit, as grainy as it is that might hurt more than help though. It looks like you can see a good bit more of the desk secretary to Ruth's left but it seems taller in this version. Is that Michael Paine on the right?

I think beyond helping the poor South Vietnamese "democracy" defend themselves from a communist takeover the main reason I remember reading, hearing or being taught we were there is the Domino Theory. I imagine most posters here are at least somewhat familiar with it. Maybe a younger newer reader or two is not. I did not realize that, at least according to this article, some US clandestine support went as far back as Truman. http://www.history.com/topics/cold-war/domino-theory

Or,

http://jfkfacts.org/two-different-views-antonio-veciana/

Thanks, I knew Shackley had been station chief at JMWAVE during the assassination period and slightly before. I thought I'd read that people like Phillips and Morales went around him some how regarding reporting and authorization of operations, maybe reporting directly to Helms? I did not realize he was Gehlen's interpreter or that he ran Phoenix. It all gets so deep. Throw in Joannides maintaining a residence in New Orleans in the summer of 63 and I read earlier somewhere on this site of another agent reportedly encountering Harvey on a flight to Dallas in November 63. I know the latter is not part of the BBH/Sullivan and Cromwell aspect, it goes in a different direction, yet it all seems to connect.

Whoosh. Right over my head. It's probably already been done on the forum but can either of you elaborate concisely (Cliff)? I've read none of Sheehan, a little of Ms. Brussels and have JFK by Prouty and read/watched from his website. R.E. "Shackley...". How did he play into all this?

The implications of the focus on the toppled bench, it's dimensions and the domino room are interesting. Why such by the FBI, obviously with Hoover's approval, but not even noted much less questioned by the Warren Omission? Was the FBI suspicious of Oswald or someone else hiding a gun under the bench, or were they possibly framing him? I'll note I'm just a reader and visitor of Dealy plaza, the Paine home, Hotel Texas, a few other places and I don't think of myself as a researcher. Some of them have reached a point that what actually happened in Dallas in detail is not that important anymore. Nothing further can ever be proven. The only answers to yet be found are in the big picture in Washington and the East Coast Establishment, the MIC, CIA if you will. I disagree, it's all important. The domino room bench, people cutting off power to the TSBD, and those seen leaving the back of it are all further nails in the coffin of the Warren Omission for future generations when exposed to them. I have seen the diagrams of the 2nd, 3d and 6th floors before as well as the picture of Fraisers car behind the TSBD I believe on reflection. Thanks again for the link to the FBI booklet. They did one on the Paine and Randle homes also. Thanks to of all people, Davey Von Pein for this link (and in turn Russ and MF herself): http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10897#relPageId=10&tab=page

Last fall I spent the night in Kilgore Texas on personal business in a hotel North of town. It and a hotel next door were the only business in that area except a tiny liquor store in the parking lot between them which looked much older than either hotel but still well kept. After the 250 mile drive in somewhat heavy traffic (heavy in the Dallas part) I thought I'm going to have one beer and kick back an hour before I look for something to eat. I was wearing the cap in my avatar, USS John F. Kennedy, CV-67, the only thing I found worthy of buying the last time I was in the sixth floor Owsald did it by himself museum souvenir shop other than a replica campaign refrigerator magnet. The place said open but the door didn't. I saw a man older than I behind the counter get up, heard a buzz and pushed the door open. He was wearing a NAVY cap. I said "I guess maybe you were really in the Navy, people ask me when I wear this one sometimes if I served on the ship but I have to tell them no, it's a souvenir from the TSBD in Dallas, but I had a couple of cousins in Vietnam, other family in other wars. As he handed me my change he looked me in the eye and said "I first went there in 1959". It took me 3-4 seconds to ask "Unacknowledged?". He told me "They told us if you get caught your on your own, we don't know you". I forget what I said but he also told me he had a buddy that got out before he did that told him when he was discharged he asked the officer "What about all that time in Asia, why isn't that on my record? The officer responded "That didn't happen, you weren't there". Several weeks later I had a thought. I wonder if JFK was ever fully apprised of what was going on in Vietnam. He knew about the "non combat" advisors but was he aware of what "his" CIA was doing? Did Dulles inform him of the full scope of their involvement? It's pretty well proven Dulles knew the Bay of Pigs was a plan to fail but JFK was led to believe otherwise by him and the Military as another example of their deceptiveness, so, I'd guess not.

http://standardnews.com/vietnam-war-quiz

Si, I didn't pay attention to the size of the inbound conduit or black lines in relation to the size/power needs of a building that size. Have others seen the FBI booklet before or anything on where the breaker boxes were located? BTW, the phone lines reportedly went dead at the same time as the power went off as others may have read.

Larry, I'm new here too. I've read the forum for years, along with a few others, googled "TSBD first floor diagram" many different ways but never found or seen this from the FBI. Thanks for the link. It's a gold mine for me for much more than the turned over domino room bench. Note to others, if you zoom in from the icon on the upper right you can actually read where Truly and Shelly's offices are for example. All this may have been seen by other members before but I have to ask. In the picture on page 9 does that look like the breaker boxes for the building right by the first floor door to the back loading dock. I.E., could some one hanging around this area at 12:30, while everyone else was out front watching the parade, have cut the power off to the freight elevators and in turn the building (as was reported), then turned it back on when contacted to do so or at a pre appointed time, then slipped out the back door and ran like hell and or jumped in a waiting car. Yes, I know, all speculation on my part. No proof available ever. Just part of something I've wondered about for years. Lambast my brainstorming as you will, by definition it's consideration of even the most outlandish of ideas. E.G I can't wrap my mind completely around what I've read about the Harvey and Lee story but parts seem to make sense (it's expensive to read and long/deep/time consuming to read). https://www.amazon.com/Harvey-Lee-John-Armstrong/dp/0974509701/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1497926843&sr=1-1&keywords=Harvey+and+lee There are potentially other nuggets in this FBI booklet.