Hillary blames FBI Director Comey for her loss

[Glenn Nall]

5 hours ago, Tom Wilson said:

The repugnant party is going to repeal Medicare in the first 100 days of the Orange man's term. Medicare will be replaced with a voucher program that will increase cost to seniors of up to $12K. Don't believe it? Look it up for yourself. This will cause civil unrest, millions of seniors taking g to the streets and a tsunami for Democrats in 2018 and 2020.

This part of Paul Ryan's " A Better Way " that they are pushing. Social Security will be next a few months later. I hear people say that they would never do this. It's already in the plan.

Deplorable, Tom.

Irredeemable. 

and THEN Repugnant.

get it right.

[Kirk Gallaway]

8 minutes ago, Glenn Nall said:

Cliff, by your picture I want to guess that you're at least 40 years old. Let me ask you this.

Have you complained about the Electoral College process EVERY election, or just the ones that don't go your way?

Glenn, Since we can guess Cliff's a Democrat, and in our lifetime, they've never gone to the Democrats so that's never happened. Cliff, I believe he said he'd always go by the popular vote. You might not believe him but I do because I feel the same way.(I'm registered  independent)

"what would be interesting to hear, from those who feel that the presidential election was a scam - or whatever they think -, is how the gubernatorial, congressional and senatorial majorities are ALL STILL Republican..."

Not arguing whether it was "scam" Glenn. But as a Republican you're seeing that the Republicans win the right to control both houses through "one man, one vote" and win the right to control the Presidency through the Electoral College which was setup at the beginning to ensure that the minority not have to suffer from the will of the majority, as Roger De Laria pointed out. That's a noble goal, but it clearly doesn't apply here  as both houses were already Republican and continue to be, but that ruling only serves to make the balanced completely for the Republicans. To me it's becoming sort of an entitlement.

You and Cliff obviously love to argue. But what is easy to miss in Cliff's zeal are a some facts.

I don't know about this election but in the previous election in 2014, did you know that in all the House and Senate Congressional elections,more people voted for Democrats, yet  Republicans took the House and Senate? How could be this be? It's because the state legislatures, that are controlled more by Republicans reapportion the districts to benefit Republican candidates. You've probably seen some of these contorted Congressional maps, particularly living near a big city. The map in this case is rigged so Republicans win in districts where they have somewhat of an advantage and Democrats win in districts where they have a big advantage. So many more Republicans can win while the overall vote count was for the Democrats. The Democrats do this too, they just don't control as many state legislatures.

One good thing I like that Trump says is the idea of term limits. We have that in California on a State level. I'm not sure how effective I think it is. But for California to do that on a national scale and have no other states do it would be stupid because because our representatives would never gain seniority on any of the big committee  posts because they wouldn't be around long enough to gain seniority. Trumps term limits could be good, but I think a better idea might be to just plug some bi partisan info into a computer and let it make the districts at random. Now the public hates Congress but always votes for their Congressman so there's no change. But scrambling up the districts would shake things up a lot and force some of these politicians in their "sacred cow districts" to actually face each other, and bring new blood in the process.

Congratulations, the ball is now completely in your court. I'm curious to see what these forgotten people in the rust belt feel after 4 years with Trump. Honestly, I don't think he'll do crap for them. But we'll see.

 

[Glenn Nall]

5 minutes ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Glenn, Since we can guess Cliff's a Democrat, and in our lifetime, they've never gone to the Democrats so that's never happened. Cliff, I believe he said he'd always go by the popular vote. You might not believe him but I do because I feel the same way.(I'm registered  independent)

I'm confused. what's never gone to the Democrats?

The Electoral College decides every election. NOT the Popular vote. I'm simply asking if Cliff has, in the past, had issues with this process. And now I'm wondering why he doesn't himself answer...

Congratulations, the ball is now completely in your court. I'm curious to see what these forgotten people in the rust belt feel after 4 years with Trump. Honestly, I don't think he'll do crap for them. But we'll see.

once again assumption rears its ugly head. I don't wish to argue. If you look through now the many pages of this one thread, you'll see that only one person has monopolized the dogma. I've responded to comparatively few, and am ashamed i've said this much. this thread is a load of drivel, inappropriate and fantastically unconstructive. It's become a soapbox - for about three people, all of cemented agenda and of clear misinformation.

the one thing I appreciate from your post is that at least you've left yourself open to being wrong.

 

 

[Kirk Gallaway]

31 minutes ago, Glenn Nall said:

 

Glenn, Since we can guess Cliff's a Democrat, and in our lifetime, they've never gone to the Democrats so that's never happened. 

 

All our elections are decided by one man- one vote except the Presidential Election. In our lifetime there's only been 2 times when a candidate has gotten the most votes but lost in the Electoral College, and that's happened twice in the last  16years. (Gore vs. Bush)  In the only 2 cases, they've gone to Republicans.

There are a lot of us on both sides that don't like the Electoral College. Donald Trump has said it's scam , but now that he's benefited from it, he's not complaining. And Georgian Newt Gingrich has said we should do away with it. What's the point in Cliff or any of us "complaining about it every election" when it's not an issue?

Edited November 18, 2016 by Kirk Gallaway

[Sandy Larsen]

2 hours ago, Glenn Nall said:

Sandy - I guess it's how someone defines "detestable," isn't it. And "gullible."

 

Some of the appalling things Trump said during his campaign.

 

• “If I were running ‘The View’, I’d fire Rosie O’Donnell. I mean, I’d look at her right in that fat, ugly face of hers, I’d say ‘Rosie, you’re fired.’”
   
• [John McCain's]  not a war hero... He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured." 
   
• “When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending the best. ... They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists… And some, I assume, are good people.”
   
• "Look at [Carly Fiorinas] face. Would anybody vote for that? Can you imagine that, the face of our next president? I mean, she's a woman, and I'm not supposed to say bad things, but really, folks, come on. Are we serious?"
   
• "I would bring back waterboarding and I'd bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding."
   
• "[Ford is] going to build a plant [in Mexico] and illegals are going drive those cars right over the border ... And they'll probably end up stealing the cars."
   
• "And, I would say the co-founder [of ISIS] would be crooked Hillary Clinton."
   
• Written statement from the Trump campaign: "Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on.

 

Not exactly presidential material.

 

de·test·a·ble

diˈtestəbəl/

adjective: detestable

1. deserving intense dislike.

    

Edited November 18, 2016 by Sandy Larsen

[Glenn Nall]

7 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Some of the things Trump has said during his campaign.

 

• “If I were running ‘The View’, I’d fire Rosie O’Donnell. I mean, I’d look at her right in that fat, ugly face of hers, I’d say ‘Rosie, you’re fired.’”
   
• [John McCain's]  not a war hero... He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured." 
   
• “When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending the best. ... They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists… And some, I assume, are good people.”
   
• "Look at [Carly Fiorinas] face. Would anybody vote for that? Can you imagine that, the face of our next president? I mean, she's a woman, and I'm not supposed to say bad things, but really, folks, come on. Are we serious?"
   
• "I would bring back waterboarding and I'd bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding."
   
• "[Ford is] going to build a plant [in Mexico] and illegals are going drive those cars right over the border ... And they'll probably end up stealing the cars."
   
• "And, I would say the co-founder [of ISIS] would be crooked Hillary Clinton."
   
• Written statement from the Trump campaign: "Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on.

 

Not exactly presidential material.

 

de·test·a·ble

diˈtestəbəl/

adjective: detestable

1. deserving intense dislike.

    

you've written this assuming that HFC hasn't said anything nearly as detestable. or worse.

is that what you're asserting?

(you really compare this to HFC's 30+ years of criminal investigations? but I'll go with the verbal comparisons, just as soon as you say that that is what you're asserting...  )

Edited November 18, 2016 by Glenn Nall

[Sandy Larsen]

4 minutes ago, Glenn Nall said:

 

10 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Some of the things Trump has said during his campaign.

 

• “If I were running ‘The View’, I’d fire Rosie O’Donnell. I mean, I’d look at her right in that fat, ugly face of hers, I’d say ‘Rosie, you’re fired.’”
   
• [John McCain's]  not a war hero... He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured." 
   
• “When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending the best. ... They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists… And some, I assume, are good people.”
   
• "Look at [Carly Fiorinas] face. Would anybody vote for that? Can you imagine that, the face of our next president? I mean, she's a woman, and I'm not supposed to say bad things, but really, folks, come on. Are we serious?"
   
• "I would bring back waterboarding and I'd bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding."
   
• "[Ford is] going to build a plant [in Mexico] and illegals are going drive those cars right over the border ... And they'll probably end up stealing the cars."
   
• "And, I would say the co-founder [of ISIS] would be crooked Hillary Clinton."
   
• Written statement from the Trump campaign: "Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on.

 

Not exactly presidential material.

 

de·test·a·ble

diˈtestəbəl/

adjective: detestable

1. deserving intense dislike.

    

you've written this assuming that HFC hasn't said anything nearly as detestable. or worse.

is that what you're asserting?

(you really compare this to HFC's 30+ years of criminal investigations? but I'll go with the verbal comparisons, just as soon as you say that that is what you're asserting...  )

 

 

You think Hillary was as bad or worse than Trump? Okay then, make up a list.

The criminal investigations against Hillary (which have been nowhere near 30 years) have all been politically driven Republican tactics. And she's never been found guilty of anything. So they're irrelevant.

[Glenn Nall]

1 minute ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

You think Hillary was as bad or worse than Trump? Okay then, make up a list.

The criminal investigations against Hillary (which have been nowhere near 30 years) have all been politically driven Republican tactics. And she's never been found guilty of anything. So they're irrelevant.

Sandy, you're one of the few in here whom (who?) I respect as a reasonable, logical researcher.

But, wrong, and wrong. I'll provide a list, but at the moment i'm busy as hell working (i can stop to drop a comment - organizing a list will take me a little bit). But please know that nothing is as it seems... surely you know that after all you've studied... ?

[Sandy Larsen]

7 minutes ago, Glenn Nall said:

 

14 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

You think Hillary was as bad or worse than Trump? Okay then, make up a list.

The criminal investigations against Hillary (which have been nowhere near 30 years) have all been politically driven Republican tactics. And she's never been found guilty of anything. So they're irrelevant.

Sandy, you're one of the few in here whom (who?) I respect as a reasonable, logical researcher.

But, wrong, and wrong. I'll provide a list, but at the moment i'm busy as hell working (i can stop to drop a comment - organizing a list will take me a little bit). But please know that nothing is as it seems... surely you know that after all you've studied... ?

 

Okay, take your time. And thanks for the complement.

[Ron Ecker]

There's a silver lining in this for Hillary. She already has a million-dollar advance for her next book, "The FBI Director Who Shagged Me."

 

 

[Cliff Varnell]

2 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Glenn, Since we can guess Cliff's a Democrat, and in our lifetime, they've never gone to the Democrats so that's never happened. 

 

All our elections are decided by one man- one vote except the Presidential Election. In our lifetime there's only been 2 times when a candidate has gotten the most votes but lost in the Electoral College, and that's happened twice in the last  16years. (Gore vs. Bush)  In the only 2 cases, they've gone to Republicans.

There are a lot of us on both sides that don't like the Electoral College. Donald Trump has said it's scam , but now that he's benefited from it, he's not complaining. And Georgian Newt Gingrich has said we should do away with it. What's the point in Cliff or any of us "complaining about it every election" when it's not an issue?

In 2000 the brother of one candidate forced 90,000 mostly Democrats off the voter rolls in Florida, thus insuring his brother's victory.

In 2016 the Republican head of the FBI announced a renewed investigation into a Presidential candidate even though he knew there was nothing to it.

These are two examples of egregious voter suppression.

Voter suppression is anti-democracy, and only one party engages in it.

[Glenn Nall]

22 minutes ago, Cliff Varnell said:

In 2000 the brother of one candidate forced 90,000 mostly Democrats off the voter rolls in Florida, thus insuring his brother's victory.

In 2016 the Republican head of the FBI announced a renewed investigation into a Presidential candidate even though he knew there was nothing to it.

These are two examples of egregious voter suppression.

Voter suppression is anti-democracy, and only one party engages in it.

"...only one party engages in it."

Cliff. really?

when you find yourself in a hole, the first rule is to stop digging.

And I'm waiting for your answer to my question: when was the last time you complained about the Electoral results?

when was the last time you complained about the Electoral College results, Cliff?

 

 

 

[Paul Brancato]

5 hours ago, Cliff Varnell said:

In 2000 the brother of one candidate forced 90,000 mostly Democrats off the voter rolls in Florida, thus insuring his brother's victory.

In 2016 the Republican head of the FBI announced a renewed investigation into a Presidential candidate even though he knew there was nothing to it.

These are two examples of egregious voter suppression.

Voter suppression is anti-democracy, and only one party engages in it.

Exactly right

 

[Ron Ecker]

I think 2016 was more a case of severe voter depression than voter suppression. A lot of would-be voters became Comeytose.

 

 

[Tom Hume]

In the last few elections, Investigative Reporter Greg Palast has specialized in voter suppression, and he has some interesting things to say about this one: 

 

http://www.gregpalast.com/election-stolen-heres/