Witten's report on Oswald in Mexico just released

[Paul Trejo]

On 11/18/2017 at 6:47 AM, Sandy Larsen said:

Paul,

Bill Simpich's mole hunt theory is apparently an alternative to the theory that I espouse, that Mexico City was all about creating the illusion that Cuba was behind the assassination.

Let me ask some questions:

1. Does Simpich's theory explain why Oswald was accused of taking a $6500 payment from the black man with red hair at the Cuban embassy? (The theory I believe DOES explain this.)
2. Does Simpich's theory explain why Oswald was reported by Elena Garro to have attended the infamous twist party, also attended by the Durans and the black man with red hair who had paid Oswald the $6500? (The theory I believe DOES explain this.)
3. Does Simpich's theory explain why Oswald was impersonated in those telephone calls? (The theory I believe DOES explain this.)
4. Does Simpich's theory explain why there were no surveillance photos of Oswald included in the set provided by the CIA, but there WAS a photo of a guy who looked like Nikolai Leonov, a senior KGB officer stationed at the Soviet Embassy? (The theory I believe DOES explain this.)
5. Does Simpich's theory explain why Win Scott indicated that J.C. King knew who was in photos he'd sent of Mystery Man, when he wrote in his memo to King, "a certain person who is known to you?" (The theory I believe DOES explain this.)

Sandy,

Here is my opinion by the numbers:

1.  Alverado's fib that Oswald took $6,500 from a red-headed Negro at the Cuban Embassy sounds like a fib because it's a fib.  Don't call it a fact, because Alverado himself finally admitted to the CIA that he made up the story.  

2.  Elena Garro's fib about a Mexico City "twist" party attended by Lee Harvey Oswald and Sylvia Duran (her cousin) was part of her attempt to write fiction -- because she was a professional fiction writer.  Mexican newspapers had no real freedom -- except to write National Enquirer-type scandals.   In the first two weeks after the JFK assassination, Mexican newspapers wrote TONS of fiction about Lee Harvey Oswald, and sex orgies with Sylvia Duran.   Hint: not every Mexican story about Lee Harvey Oswald was true.

3.  Bill Simpich's 2014 book offers the best explanation about why Oswald was impersonated in telephone calls from the Cuban Consulate to the Soviet Embassy in Mexico City on October 1, 1963.  The reason is that this very telephone was the single most wire-tapped telephone on the planet in the time.  The impersonator wanted to ensure that the name of Oswald would be linked with the name of Kostikov, the KGB assassin.   THE IMPERSONATOR FAILED TO ATTAIN THIS GOAL.  THE CIA KNEW RIGHT AWAY THAT THE CALL WAS AN IMPERSONATION.  That is why the CIA altered the Oswald 201 File and started a top secret CIA Mole Hunt.

4.  Bill Simpich's 2014 book offers the best explanation about why there were no surveillance photos of Oswald included in the set provided by the CIA, but there WAS a photo of this huge Russian dude.  The reason is that the CIA altered the Oswald 201 File and started a top secret CIA Mole Hunt.

5.  My interpretation of Bill Simpich's 2014 book offers the best explanation about why Win Scott told J.C. King that the photos of the Large Russian Dude were "known to you."   Since the top secret CIA Mole Hunt selected a photo at random for their alteration of the Oswald 201 file, it was an accident that this person happened to be known by J.C. King.  Win Scott was forewarning King so that he would not be surprised at this.

In conclusion -- Bill Simpich has the best documented CT about the Mexico City telephone impersonation of Oswald anywhere.  Everything else is just guesswork and fiction.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited November 21, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Paul Trejo]

On 11/18/2017 at 9:34 AM, Paul Brancato said:

...Angleton planted the mole hunt to provide cover in the future for the CIA operations in MC. 

Paul B., 

This makes no sense -- logically, grammatically, historically or in any other manner.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

[W. Tracy Parnell]

Just to set the record right, There were indeed redactions in Willcott's testimony as previously released. The new version is unredacted but what have we learned? Just about nothing. I just finished comparing both versions and all of the information was previously known or could be deduced as I did some time ago when I made a list of the Toyko CIA employees Wilcott refers to using other HSCA documents. One name that was redacted (perhaps because of his title) is Bob Ojiri who was Chief of Logistics in the Registry Division. But everything originally redacted was just names and places and the names were knowable and the places easy enough to figure out.

[Paul Trejo]

On 11/18/2017 at 2:55 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

Ha!  I'm sure the CIA did have intensive interest in Oswald before the assassination. He was, after all, one of their agents.

BTW, this has been proved. (The proof is in Douglass's book, pages 144 thru 146. Though Douglass refers to the proof as an "implication.") Plus there's a whole lot of supporting evidence, which Jim Hargrove keeps track of.

Sandy,

First, in no way has it ever been proved that Lee Harvey Oswald was a CIA agent.   Do you really imagine that the majority of readers would doubt proof if they saw it?

People call their CT "proved" when they are tired of defending it, and they just want to be accepted as dogma, because they can't think of any more defenses for it.  Everybody senses that.

I've already dealt with Jim Hargrove's so-called 21 so-called "facts," but I guess I'll have to repeat myself -- again.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited November 21, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Paul Trejo]

On 11/19/2017 at 9:49 AM, Jim Hargrove said:

20 Facts Indicating the Oswald Project Was Run by the CIA

<snip>

 BUMP for Sandy Larsen on 11/21/2017:

Edited November 22, 2017 by Paul Trejo
BUMP for Sandy Larson 11/21/2017

[Rob Couteau]

 

On 11/20/2017 at 2:17 PM, James DiEugenio said:

Also, there was an SR division in the Tokyo station

Does any of that seem to tie up in any way with all the Japanese (and Asian) connections that Dick Russell explores in his book on Richard Case Nagell? And has anyone come across any new info in the files on Nagell?

 

[James DiEugenio]

Wilcott hints around at that issue in his testimony.

He thinks that is why there was a crypt for him and that is why he was being paid out of Tokyo.

BTW, what happened to Wilcott was really kind of horrible.  I don't have first hand knowledge about it, but its from what I heard from someone who knew him

[Mathias Baumann]

9 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

 

3.  Bill Simpich's 2014 book offers the best explanation about why Oswald was impersonated in telephone calls from the Cuban Consulate to the Soviet Embassy in Mexico City on October 1, 1963.  The reason is that this very telephone was the single most wire-tapped telephone on the planet in the time.  The impersonator wanted to ensure that the name of Oswald would be linked with the name of Kostikov, the KGB assassin.   THE IMPERSONATOR FAILED TO ATTAIN THIS GOAL.  THE CIA KNEW RIGHT AWAY THAT THE CALL WAS AN IMPERSONATION.  That is why the CIA altered the Oswald 201 File and started a top secret CIA Mole Hunt.

Paul,

that doesn't make sense. During the first phone call Oswald's name is never mentioned. And neither is Kostikov's. The most plausible explanation is that the impostors didn't even know Oswald's name at that point in time. They were trying to gather information on the visitor to the Soviet embassy. Everything else is just speculation. I've yet to see a reasonable explanation why the plotters would trigger a potentially dangerous "mole hunt" at a time when Oswald was nowhere near a place where he could be set up to be a patsy in the JFK assassination. It defies logic in my opinion.

[Paul Brancato]

What proof of a 'mole hunt' exists that could not be explained by Angleton himself instructing his subordinates to create a paper trail that appeared to show that they didn't know who the impersonator was? 

[Jim Hargrove]

Here are my responses to Paul Trejo’s attempted rebuttal of my recent post showing that  the Oswald Project was run by the CIA. 

Mr. Trejo failed to respond to the most recent of my facts. Here is what he ignored….

20. CIA's Ann Egerter, who worked for J.J. Angleton's Counterintelligence Special Interest Group (CI/SIG), opened a "201" file on Oswald on December 9, 1960. Egerter testified to the HSCA: "We were charged with the investigation of Agency personnel....”  When asked if the purpose was to "investigate Agency employees," she answered, "That is correct."  When asked, "Would there be any other reason for opening up a file?" she answered, "No, I can't think of one."

Now, on to the statements Mr. Trejo did make. His comments in black; my responses in red.

1. CIA accountant James Wilcott only said that some CIA agent "told him" that he was making payments to an encrypted account for the Oswald Project.  Sheer hearsay and rumor; more likely, mocking Wilcott to his face.

Mr. Wilcott said otherwise:
 
Mr. Preyer. That was shop talk, speculation, I gather;
people were saying that the CIA is somehow connected with it.
 
Mr. Wilcott. Well, I believed it to be a little more
than speculation, that the source at least of this kind of
talk was, I believe, to be something more serious than
speculation.
 
Mr. Preyer. It was your conclusion from that talk that
some of these people might have knowledge that he was a CIA
agent rather than that they were speculating about it?
 
Mr. Wilcott. Yes, sir.
 
Mr. Preyer. And you did mention the case officer who
came in and told you that the money he had drawn out a few
weeks earlier was drawn out for Oswald?
 
Mr. Wilcott. Yes, sir.
 
Mr. Preyer. He stated that as a fact and not that he
believed it was drawn out for Oswald or it could have been or
something like that?
 
Mr. Wilcott. It was stated as a fact -- Oswald or the
Oswald project.

2.  Even if Antonio Veciana did see DAP and LHO together in the summer of 1963 in Dallas, it was most likely in the context of killing Fidel Castro (DAP's and Guy Banister's obsession) and not JFK. (Jim Garrison already proved LHO worked with Guy Banister).

You have no idea what was said at the meeting, but soon after it, the framing of the “Oswald” killed by Jack Ruby began in earnest in and around Dallas. The Phillips/Oswald meeting is further proof that Oswald was an agent regardless of what was said!

3. It's nonsense to imagine that no "CIA operations officer in the USSR met a Russian girl and eventually married,” so that you have to read LHO into that sentence.  Though former CIA agent Victor Marchetti confirmed that the CIA did have a “fake defector” program in the 1950s, that in-itself is no proof that LHO was part of it.  LHO could still have acted on his own.

I did not say what you put in quotes above, but the fact that there was a CIA “fake defector” program in the 1950s is hardly evidence that Harvey Oswald wasn’t part of it.  It clearly suggests that he WAS part of it.

4. The fact that Robert Webster and LHO "fake defected" a few months apart in 1959, claiming "sensitive" information, that is easily explained by coincidence.  What other reason would a young man give?  Marchetti said there were scores of such boys in the program, and the US State Department said there were scores of actual defectors during that time frame.  The fact that these two guys met Marina Prusakova in Minsk near the same time, also makes sense -- they were both there at the same time, and the USSR sent all "questionable defectors" to Minsk for observation.  As for Marina Prusakova, she hated the USSR and would do anything to move to the USA. So, she got around.

Robert Webster and LHO "defected" a few months apart in 1959, both tried to "defect" on a Saturday, both possessed "sensitive" information of possible value to the Russians, both were befriended by Marina Prusakova, and both returned to the United States in the spring of 1962.  You call this a coincidence?  Isn’t it another amazing coincidence that CIA officer David Atlee Phillips was so impressed by LHO that he decided to risk an open air meeting with him in Dallas in 1963.

5. Although Richard Sprague, Richard Schweiker, and CIA agents Donald Norton and Joseph Newbrough agreed that LHO was associated with the CIA, you could add hundreds of thousands of other names of people who *also* share the same *opinion* without any final proof.  These guys had no proof, either.

That’s your opinion.  The opinions of Sprague, Schweiker, Norton and Newbrough are worth more than yours or mine because they were far closer to the actual events being discussed here.

6. Again -- it is absurd to imagine that no CIA "contact" ever worked at a radio factory in Minsk and returned to the US with a Russian wife and child.  People get married under all sorts of conditions, and then they have babies.  Minsk was a Soviet observation town for "questionable defectors."  There were far too many "fake defectors" and "real defectors" and "double agent defectors" in the USSR in those days to justify a claim that LHO was that "contact."

Donald Deneslya said he read reports of a CIA “contact” who had worked at a radio factory in Minsk and returned to the US with a Russian wife and child. Are you suggesting there was a different CIA “contact” who had worked at a radio factory in Minsk and returned to the US with a Russian wife and child?  Name him please!

7. It is nonsense that Kenneth Porter fell in love with young, beautiful Marina Oswald in 1964, and left his family to marry her -- for the sole purpose of monitoring Marina for the CIA!   Actually, men leave their wives for younger women all the time.

Sure, but Mr. Porter was an employee of Collins Radio….

Collins Radio was located at 1200 North Alma Road in Richardson, Texas and held major communications contracts for the military and CIA, including the installation of communications towers in Vietnam. On November 1, 1963 the New York Times published a photo of a ship named the "Rex"and a story involving commandos that were sent ashore from the ship in Cuba on October 22-23, 1963. The Commandos were captured on a Cuban beach with high-powered sniper rifles and admitted they had been trained by the CIA to kill Cuban leaders. The "Rex" was leased to Collins Radio of Richardson, Texas. (Harvey and Lee, pp. 872-873.)

One of this years new releases indicated an ongoing relationship between Collins Radio employees and the CIA in the 1970s as well.

8. George Joannides was a CIA agent, so naturally he lied about his CIA cases, as well as the CIA cases of other CIA officers.  It's what CIA agents are paid to do.  Didn't you know?  In 1978, for the HSCA, the President's order of secrecy in the JFK Records was still in force.  So, nothing the HSCA could say or do would release those FBI and CIA secrets.  PERIOD.

The fact remains that the CIA put a fellow in charge of lying to the HSCA who had specialized knowledge—that he kept to himself—about “Lee Harvey Oswald.”  The fact that CIA agents are paid to lie for their governments is irrelevant.  CIA personnel deliberately lied to a House committee about their relationships  to a man accused of assassinating JFK.  I thought the CIA was supposed to work for our country!

9. The CIA often gave medals to CIA agents, like Joannides, who kept CIA secrets under pressure.

Apparently the Agency rewards its employees who lie to Congress about their relationship with alleged presidential assassins.  Good Works, eh?

10. The FBI and the CIA do not coordinate actions, but compete with each other.  The FBI has the duty of Domestic crime.  The CIA has the duty of International crime.  The clash occurs when criminals travel inside and outside of the USA.  Then who owns the criminal's file?  To this very day the FBI and CIA cannot agree.  The case of Lee Harvey Oswald was an FBI matter from June, 1962, until November, 1963.  The CIA (as carefully proved by Bill Simpich) was clueless about the Mexico City telephone impersonation of LHO.  This is because the JFK plot was Domestic.  The FBI knew.  We should first scour the released FBI Records, and leave the CIA Records as secondary.  It seems to me that most CTers are doing the opposite.

The fact remains that the FBI and the CIA—at exactly the same time just weeks before the assassination—made clear efforts to diminish Federal monitoring of “Lee Harvey Oswald.” And you, apparently, find nothing suspicious about this.

11. Oswald’s lengthy “Lives of Russian Workers” essay reads like a high-school dropout's idea (or some biased CTers idea) of a pretty good intelligence report.

Really?  Let’s look at the first few paragraphs of that lengthy document….

    The lives of Russian workers is governed, first and foremost, by the "collective," the smallest unit of authority in any given factory, plant, or enterprise. Sectional and shop cells form a highly organized and well supported political organization. These shop committees are in turn governed by the shop and section party chiefs who are directed by the factory or plant party secretary. This post carries officially the same amount of authority as the production director or president of the plant, but in reality it is the controlling organ of all activities at any industrial enterprise, whether political, industrial, or otherwise personal relations. The party secretary is responsible for political indoctrination of the workers, the discipline of members of the Communist party working at the plant, and the general conduct and appearance of all members.
 
    The Minsk Radio and Television plant is known throughout the Union as a major producer of electronics parts and sets. In this vast enterprise created in the early 50's, the party secretary is a 6'4" man in his early 40's -- has a long history of service to the party. He controls the activities of the 1,000 communist party members here and otherwise supervises the activities of the other 5,000 people employed at this major enterprise in Minsk, the capital of the 3rd ranking Republic Belorussia.
 
    This factory manufactures 87,000 large and powerful radio and 60,000 television sets in various sizes and ranges, excluding pocket radios, which are not mass produced anywhere in the U.S.S.R. It is this plant which manufactured several console model combination radiophonograph television sets which were shown as mass produced items of commerce before several hundreds of thousands of Americans at the Soviet Exposition in New York in 1959. After the Exhibition these sets were duly shipped back to Minsk and are now stored in a special storage room on the first floor of the Administrative Building -- at this factory, ready for the next international Exhibit. 

12. Oswald’s possessions were searched for microdots, because Oswald foolishly used the word, "microdots" in his address book.  Ask yourself -- what competent US Agent uses the secret word, "microdots" in his personal address book?   Answer: NONE.

So, the use of microdots shows that you are NOT a spy?  Sheesh.  Why were some individual letters cut out of some of Oswald’s so-called writings.  To remove microdots, perhaps?

13. Oswald owned no Minox spy camera -- that was the property of the wealthy, young Michael Paine, who could afford three cars, two domiciles as well as such expensive toys.

Now you think, once again, the Paines came to the rescue?  A few months ago attempting to rebut my list, you wrote this:

11. Oswald owned an expensive Minox spy camera; like many Private Detectives and other spy wannabes. The FBI mucked with all JFK evidence, starting on 11/22/1963, because of J. Edgar Hoover's order that everything must fit a "Lone Nut" scenario. This was for National Security purposes. Nobody denies that anymore.

Why do you keep changing your story?

14. The official WC story of the radar operator near U-2 planes defecting to Russia and returning home without a penalty smells like a spy story to a Hollywood hopeful.  The US State Department explained it realistically: Oswald never defected -- he never surrendered his US Passport.  He never applied for Russian citizenship.  He never joined the Communist Party in Russia.  He was 19 years old when he was first admitted into Russia.  He was an intellectually bright and emotionally retarded young man, having fun.  His pals in Russia were the 'naughty' kids, including Marina Prusakova, who hated the USSR, and couldn't wait to get to the USA.  LHO laughed all the way through the fun and games. (Actually, he never had it so good.  When he arrived back in the USA, he fell into the depths of minimum-wage poverty.  Marina was shocked, because LHO was relatively well-to-do in Russia.)

Isn’t it amazing then that both Oswald and Robert Webster tried to defect on a Saturday, when their “defections” couldn’t be “processed!”  At the height of the Cold War, an American soldier who had allegedly worked in a radar installation near top-secret U-2 flights, who said at the American embassy in Moscow he would tell the Soviets everything he knew, was, according to the CIA, never even interviewed by the CIA?  You’re kidding, right?

The minute Harvey Oswald told Richard Snyder that he intended to disclose military secrets to the Soviets, he was violating U.S. law.  He should have been detained at the embassy and returned to the U.S. for trial.  But he wasn’t because he was a spy and his speech was an act to fool the Soviets who had the U.S. embassy in Moscow bugged.

15. CIA double agent Richard Case Nagell knew about some plot to assassinate some world leader -- it could have been Fidel Castro.  Nagell warned LHO that if he succeeded in getting a Visa to Cuba as he was seeking -- then Nagell would have to shoot LHO dead, just in order to keep his own cover as a double-agent.  LHO sat in his kitchen and wept about that.  He worried about the Mexico City trip, and instead tried to make a plan to hijack some airplane or other to Cuba.  The CIA didn't ignore anything Nagel said.

That’s not what Nagel said.  He said that BOTH the CIA and the FBI ignored his warnings.  

16. LHO did save all his US Marine's money to splurge on a European holiday.  His Marine buddies testified that he rarely went off the El Toro base.  He was tight with money.  He gave his ailing mother $100 and then went to Europe to splurge for the first time in his life.  When he was nearly out of money, he asked his mother to send him more, so he could apply to Albert Schweitzer college -- and he did apply and sent the money -- but he changed his mind and "fake defected" to the USSR instead.  He was bright -- but not bright enough.  He didn't have the Right Stuff.

Oh, please.  Harvey Oswald had the right stuff to complete successfully a two and a half year assignment in the Soviet Union even though the Russians suspected he was a spy.  He had to fake a suicide attempt in order to stay in country.  He married a Russian woman whose family had Russian intel connections.  At the start of his assignment he stayed at first class hotels on the way to Moscow and during his first days in Moscow. He also hired expensive private tourist guides at the very beginning of his stay.  James Bond couldn’t have done it a whole lot better.

17. When LHO returned to the USA, it was the FBI who debriefed him, because he was now a US Domestic problem. Actually, however, the CIA did admit that they considered interviewing Oswald. But in the long run they decided not to.  (Particularly after the Walker shooting.)

The CIA did everything it’s power to distance itself from Oswald because Oswald was a CIA employee.  They “considered” debriefing LHO?  LOL!

18. The US State Department investigated LHO very carefully.  They worked with LHO to ensure that he never surrendered his passport.  He was 19 years old, for goodness sake!  The US State Department had seen *many* cases like this by 1959.  Many of the boys changed their minds after only a few months.  None lasted much more than two years.  They would wait it out.  When LHO changed his mind in about two years, the US State Department reached out to help him, and lent him money.
You are mistaken, Jim, about LHO getting an OK to travel to Cuba.  That never happened.

The so-called ex-Marine traitor who left the Marine corps under false circumstances and “defected” to Russia to give away U.S. military secrets was granted a new passport in 1963 allowing travel to communist nations.  That DID happen. 

19. It wasn't just Allen Dulles and Earl Warren who wanted the JFK Truth hidden for 75 years -- it was also FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover and LBJ as well as a dozen other powerful people in Washington DC.  National Security was the reason they cited -- and history will show they told the truth.  Which is to say, they told us the Truth about why they had to withhold the Truth for so long: "National Security.”

Harvey Oswald’s ties to both the FBI and the CIA made G-men, especially J. Edgar Hoover, all too happy to enter full scale cover-up mode.  Oswald had demonstrated that he would follow even difficult orders, critical in the days and hours before and immediately after the assassination. (He absolutely had to be in the right places at the right times to become a successful patsy.  And a patsy was absolutely critical for the plot to succeed.  Without one, the search for the plotters would have been relentless.)

20. JFK and the CIA were not at war with each other.  Despite angry feelings on both sides, as shown in the NY Times, and even after JFK shouted that he wanted to rip up the CIA to pieces and toss them to the wind -- those words were said in anger over the Bay of Pigs.  Anybody would be angry.  But afterwards, JFK actually *increased* the funding for the CIA.

Oh yeah?   President Kennedy and the CIA clearly were at war with each other in the weeks immediately before his assassination, as evidenced by Arthur Krock's infamous defense of the Agency in the Oct. 3, 1963 New York Times. “Oswald” was the CIA’s pawn.

 

[George Sawtelle]

There was no love lost between the CIA and FBI also. 

Hoover wouldn't support the CIA on Mexico City in the beginning but quickly fell into line when info surfaced that Oswald worked for the FBI. 

[Paul Trejo]

On 11/21/2017 at 6:00 AM, Mathias Baumann said:

Paul,

....During the first phone call Oswald's name is never mentioned. And neither is Kostikov's.

The most plausible explanation is that the impostors didn't even know Oswald's name at that point in time. They were trying to gather information on the visitor to the Soviet embassy.

Everything else is just speculation.

I've yet to see a reasonable explanation why the plotters would trigger a potentially dangerous "mole hunt" at a time when Oswald was nowhere near a place where he could be set up to be a patsy in the JFK assassination. It defies logic in my opinion.

Mathias,

Evidently you have not read the Lopez Report (2003).  It is not speculation that Lee Harvey Oswald was in Mexico City during the final week of September, 1963.

Evidently, you have not read Bill Simpich's, State Secret: Wiretapping in Mexico City (2014).  It is not speculation that the CIA started a top secret Mole Hunt on 10/01/1963, only HOURS after the telephone impersonation of Lee Harvey Oswald.  They knew it was an impersonation -- but who did it?

We have already covered the fact that the first phone call was preparatory.  That's been asked and answered.

If you still need a reasonable explanation why the CIA started a Mole Hunt, then read Bill Simpich's eBook on the Mary Ferrell web site.  It's FREE.

But you're very mistaken to suggest that the CIA were "the plotters" of the JFK Assassination.   After 54 years of guesswork, the CIA-did-it CTers still have no consensus.  

READ THE LOPEZ REPORT, Mathias.  It connects New Orleans with Mexico City in a tangible way, with tangible evidence.  It's UNDENIABLE.

READ BILL SIMPICH'S eBook, Mathias.  It demonstrates using FOIA releases of CIA documents that the Mole Hunt really happened.   It's UNDENIABLE.

That is, if you accept hard evidence and are finally tired of guesswork. 

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited November 24, 2017 by Paul Trejo
typos

[Sandy Larsen]

17 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Sandy,

First, in no way has it ever been proved that Lee Harvey Oswald was a CIA agent.   Do you really imagine that the majority of readers would doubt proof if they saw it?

Paul,

Of course it has been proved that Oswald was a CIA agent.

A 201 file on Oswald was opened in James Angleton's Counterintelligence Special Interest Group (CI/SIG) in 1960. Ann Egerter testified before the HSCA that the only reason such a file would be opened up in that division was if the CIA was suspicious of the activities of an Agency employee.

Therefore we know that Oswald was a CIA employee. And that he was under suspicion. (Maybe because of Marina?)

Oswald was not working in Langley or at any CIA station. He therefore must have been a CIA field agent.

What part of that do you not understand?

 

Edited November 21, 2017 by Sandy Larsen

[Sandy Larsen]

20 hours ago, Michael Walton said:

So Jim.  How is all of this going to fit into the HardlyLee story (OK, OK, I'm stealing Greg Parker's hilarious name for the Harvey and Lee fairy tale)?

I've not seen this guy's report that JD mentions above - that he names names and says "...deposition of people who he talked to about Oswald being a CIA agent." So if Witten's report is true and he says all of this, it's going to be very, very difficult to fit the HardlyLee round peg into the real-life square hole that is the Oswald story.

You and all believers of HardlyLee will then have to ask yourself "How could this guy Witten - saying all that he is saying in this report and not a one time mentioning that another CIA agent - the clone called Harvey - was also involved?"

At this point, it's going to be extremely far-fetched that no one would mention it and he (Witten) would then hear from someone about it.

 

Mike,

It's called "compartmentalization." The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. Unless there is a "need to know." The plotters saw no need for Witten to know about the two Oswalds. It's as simple as that.

 

[W. Tracy Parnell]

48 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Paul,

Of course it has been proved that Oswald was a CIA agent.

A 201 file on Oswald was opened in James Angleton's Counterintelligence Special Interest Group (CI/SIG) in 1960. Ann Egerter testified before the HSCA that the only reason such a file would be opened up in that division was if the CIA was suspicious of the activities of an Agency employee.

Therefore we know that Oswald was a CIA employee. And that he was under suspicion. (Maybe because of Marina?)

Oswald was not working in Langley or at any CIA station. He therefore must have been a CIA field agent.

What part of that do you not understand?

 

The H&L crowd is again spreading misinformation. According to the CIA’s Clandestine Services Handbook, a 201 file was opened on “subjects of extensive reporting and CI (counterintelligence) investigation, prospective agents and sources, and members of groups and organizations of continuing interest.” So, it was simply someone they had an interest in. For example according to Helms, all defectors had a 201 file opened on them.