Mark Zaid, JFK and Trump

[Jeff Carter]

45 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said:

Several posters on this thread have reiterated without basis in fact that the Steele Dossier was not only a Democratic Party Operation, it was also largely false, fake information. Repeating that falsehood doesn’t make it true.  

The Horowitz IG Report frequently refers to the Steele dossier in terms of its unverified and false attributes, and makes note that the FBI was specifically warned its status as a DNC/Clinton funded opp research exercise would create exactly the compromised disaster it created.

[Bob Ness]

21 hours ago, Jeff Carter said:

The Horowitz IG Report frequently refers to the Steele dossier in terms of its unverified and false attributes, and makes note that the FBI was specifically warned its status as a DNC/Clinton funded opp research exercise would create exactly the compromised disaster it created.

Horowitz also agreed that the Russians interfered in a systematic and sweeping campaign to interfere in the 2016 elections which you dispute. Does the IG report confirm that for you or just the bits and pieces that you're inclined to agree with?

The Page FISA fiasco and Steele's report is only part of the investigation which also included four now convicted felons and some pretty serious obstruction allegations. As provably ridiculous as the FBI'S behavior was regarding Page my opinion is that the FBIs anti Clinton performance was actually worse in effect and now the DOJ (Barr) is doubling down on it.

[Jeff Carter]

14 hours ago, Bob Ness said:

Horowitz also agreed that the Russians interfered in a systematic and sweeping campaign to interfere in the 2016 elections which you dispute. Does the IG report confirm that for you or just the bits and pieces that you're inclined to agree with?

Horowitz’s mandate was to investigate the FISA issues, and did no independent review of alleged Russian election interference. The extent he expressed “agreement” was limited to referral to conclusions made by other bodies - conclusions which are not supported by the evidence in the record and which therefore consist of opinion or belief. To the extent such opinions have appeared in legal proceedings, they have withered, as well described by Craig Murray:

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/08/in-the-world-of-truth-and-fact-russiagate-is-dead-in-the-world-of-the-political-establishment-it-is-still-the-new-42/

[Bob Ness]

26 minutes ago, Jeff Carter said:

Horowitz’s mandate was to investigate the FISA issues, and did no independent review of alleged Russian election interference. The extent he expressed “agreement” was limited to referral to conclusions made by other bodies - conclusions which are not supported by the evidence in the record and which therefore consist of opinion or belief. To the extent such opinions have appeared in legal proceedings, they have withered, as well described by Craig Murray:

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/08/in-the-world-of-truth-and-fact-russiagate-is-dead-in-the-world-of-the-political-establishment-it-is-still-the-new-42/

Koetl's decision is that Trump, WikiLeaks et al we're not shown by the plaintiffs to be conspiring with Russia and in fact has nothing to do with whether Russia did engage in an effort to help Trump and or engaged in the effort.

Your and Murray's "belief" in the "opinion" of a retired NSA employee who hasn't worked in that capacity for twenty years over the combined expertise of both private and government experts with authoritative and classified technical and physical resources is what I was referring to.

[James DiEugenio]

As everyone can see by his performance, if there had been anything to Russia Gate, Adam Schiff would have jumped on it like a mad dog.

There wasn't.

So he jumped on Ukraine Gate. And he got Pelosi to go along.

[W. Niederhut]

15 hours ago, Bob Ness said:

Horowitz also agreed that the Russians interfered in a systematic and sweeping campaign to interfere in the 2016 elections which you dispute. Does the IG report confirm that for you or just the bits and pieces that you're inclined to agree with?

The Page FISA fiasco and Steele's report is only part of the investigation which also included four now convicted felons and some pretty serious obstruction allegations. As provably ridiculous as the FBI'S behavior was regarding Page my opinion is that the FBIs anti Clinton performance was actually worse in effect and now the DOJ (Barr) is doubling down on it.

I wonder if Jeff Carter has taken 30 minutes yet to read through the truly damning Mueller Report Illustrated.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/politics/mueller-report-illustrated/chapter-one/

The felonious Russiagate conduct of Trump, Manafort, Dowd, Sekulow, Cohen, and Giuliani is so glaringly obvious in the chronological sequence of the Report that a person would have to bury their head in the Fox News/Trumpaganda sand to avoid seeing it.

As an example, after Dowd, Sekulow, Giuliani, et.al., had repeatedly floated pardons for Flynn, Manafort, Gates, and Cohen to obstruct the Mueller investigation, Trump actually denounced Michael Cohen, publicly, for "flipping," instead of "staying strong" and committing perjury, as Manafort did!

(Manafort told Gates early on, "We'll be taken care of," and he lied persistently, even after cutting a plea deal to cooperate with Mueller.)

In other words, Trump publicly advertised his campaign of obstruction of justice and witness tampering in the Russiagate scandal!

Hello, Trumptopia...  🙄

Meanwhile, Jeff's hero, Vlad-the-Journalist-Impaler, has continued his relentless attacks on "liberal" democracy, at home and abroad.

https://themediatimes.com/russian-authorities-storm-kremlin-critics-moscow-office/

[Cliff Varnell]

9 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

As everyone can see by his performance, if there had been anything to Russia Gate, Adam Schiff would have jumped on it like a mad dog.

There wasn't.

DiEugenio appears oblivious to former White House Counsel Don McGahn’s refusal to testify before the House on Trump’s extensive obstruction of justice, and the protracted court battle over that refusal.

It’s been in all the papers — how could DiEugenio miss it?

9 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

So he jumped on Ukraine Gate. And he got Pelosi to go along.

Almost the entire Dem caucus reacted with instantaneous revulsion to Trump’s extortion of an ally to meddle in our elections. No one had to get anyone to “go along”

DiEugenio has photos of Martin Luther King Jr and Malcolm X on his website, but not once has he denounced Trump’s blatant racism.

I wonder what AOC would think of such fecklessness?

[Kirk Gallaway]

Cliff said: It’s been in all the papers — how could DiEugenio miss it?

That's fundamentally Jim's investigative style , he never follows the evidence, he follows only narrow lines of evidence that support some preconceived conclusion he has. People who have watched him blunder his way through the last few years should start considering that there could be fundamental errors in his investigation of the JFKA as well. as always, seek confirmation of other sources.

Not only would AOC or Sanders be revulsed by Jim , Cliff.  Imagine if Joe Kennedy or any of the Kennedy clan found out  Jim's little secret life. They'd abandon him like the plague.  Jim knows that, that's why I couldn't get a straight answer from Jim about any Trump culpability about anything  for 3 years, and he's been one of America's undecided  about  Trump's own admissions about  withholding taxpayer money to bribe a foreign power to interfere in  our elections. Similarly , he'll stonewall any new revelations from the OMB, because it doesn't  fit into his knuckleheaded story line. Just wait and see.

Edited December 30, 2019 by Kirk Gallaway

[James DiEugenio]

Kirk is really funny sometimes.  I mean really.

I had dinner with Bobby Kennedy Jr. in September.  I won't say what exactly  was discussed but, as a lawyer, he did not have kind words for Adam Schiff. 

And man, the idea we should trust the MSM on this🤣

Yeah,  just like I trust them on the assassinations of the sixties, and the CIA and drug running.

As James Agee wrote about people who would not see Zero for Conduct, go  back to sleep Lucky Pierre.

Edited December 30, 2019 by James DiEugenio

[Kirk Gallaway]

Oh yeah?,  and what did Bobby say??                                                                            heh heh

Edited December 30, 2019 by Kirk Gallaway

[Joe Bauer]

Bobby Kennedy Jr. saying negative things about Adam Schiff?

And not about Donald Trump?

I would be shocked to find that RFK Jr. didn't feel that Trump is 100 X worse for the country than Schiff.

Or, maybe I and many others have a really misinformed and naive view of RFK Jr. and his true moral and political beliefs and principles?

Edited December 30, 2019 by Joe Bauer

[Douglas Caddy]

Robert Kennedy, Jr. does not have kind words for Trump:

https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/politics/2018/04/18/robert-f-kennedy-jr-trump-administration-discrediting-democracy/483628002/

[Douglas Caddy]

Robert Kennedy, Jr. and Adam Schiff have different opinions about whether children should be vaccinated. They are united in their opposition to Trump.

 

[W. Niederhut]

22 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

As everyone can see by his performance, if there had been anything to Russia Gate, Adam Schiff would have jumped on it like a mad dog.

There wasn't.

So he jumped on Ukraine Gate. And he got Pelosi to go along.

Jim,

     Have you read the Mueller Report yet?

     The case against Trump for serious, recurrent obstruction of justice and witness tampering in Russiagate is overwhelming!

     I'm, frankly, amazed that Trump was not promptly impeached last summer for serial obstruction of justice in the Russiagate scandal.  (Mueller indicated that he didn't indict Trump on ten counts of obstruction of justice because he was expressly forbidden by DOJ guidelines from indicting a sitting POTUS.)

    It was Congress's job to finish what Mueller was not permitted to do in the Russiagate case-- remove a criminal from the White House.   One reason for the delay in a Russiagate-related impeachment is that Bill Barr has aggressively blocked the release of the unredacted Mueller Report to Congress-- which is still tied up in the courts.   The other is that the Trump/Barr/Fox/GOP disinformation campaign about the Mueller Report has undermined public awareness and appropriate outrage about Trump's serial felonies in the Russiagate scandal.

    But the evidence of Trump's obstruction of justice in the Russiagate scandal is obvious, and the persistent GOP denial about Trump's Russiagate crimes is nothing less than bizarre.

     Whatever happened to the true narrative about Russiagate?

     It's a classic case of repeating the lie until gullible people believe it's the truth.

Republican attempts to defend Trump and Barr’s 'no obstruction' decree are pathetic

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/06/12/republicans-pathetic-defense-donald-trump-obstruction-of-justice-column/1432533001/

June 12, 2019

[James DiEugenio]

William:

Why do you keep on harping on  this obstruction of justice charge?

Don't you see?  Trump has an out on that.  And after the Horowitz Report its not just an excuse.  The FBI abused the FISA process.

And it was happening before the election.  Even Comey admitted that. 

Something like 12000 applications and 12 rejections?  Give me a break.  A judge ordered a review of the whole process, which should have been done a long time ago.  It was clearly being used as a fishing expedition for  spying on Americans.

When looked upon that way, then Trump was justified in firing Comey.    But as Bannon said, that was a political mistake.  Because it gave the Justice Department and the FBI the alternative of appointing a special prosecutor.  Plus, it gave the liberal blogosphere the idea--Well heck, where there is smoke there must be fire. And Mueller went on for two years.  And it ended up in smoke.

Even Strzok said there was no there there. And he was in counter terrorism!