The inevitable end result of our last 56 years

[Steve Thomas]

State Department: White House gift records for Trump, Pence missing

“The department says the Executive Office of the President did not submit information about gifts received by Trump and his family from foreign leaders in 2020.”

By Associated Press 04/09/2022

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/04/09/state-department-white-house-gift-records-trump-pence-00024253

“The State Department says it is unable to compile a complete and accurate accounting of gifts presented to former President Donald Trump and other U.S. officials by foreign governments during Trump’s final year in office, citing missing data from the White House.”

“In a report to be published in the Federal Register next week, the department says the Executive Office of the President did not submit information about gifts received by Trump and his family from foreign leaders in 2020. It also says the General Services Administration didn’t submit information about gifts given to former Vice President Mike Pence and White House staffers that year.”

“The report notes that the lack of gift information could be related to internal oversights as the protocol office neglected to “submit the request for data to all reporting agencies prior to January 20, 2021,” when the Trump administration ended and the Biden administration began. However, it also noted that there had been a “lack of adequate recordkeeping pertaining to diplomatic gifts” between Jan. 20, 2017, when Trump took office, and his departure from the White House four years later.”

 

Nice work if you can get it.

Steve Thomas

[Benjamin Cole]

9 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Ben,

     You seem to be drawing precisely the wrong conclusions about this case, and seem to lack awareness of the facts about the more general issue of right wing domestic terrorism in the U.S.

     Are you aware that two of the ring leaders in the Whitmer kidnapping plot already entered guilty pleas?

     Meanwhile, it sounds like these recent acquittals were based on the premature timing of the FBI arrests, questions about FBI entrapment, and a lack of unanimity in the juries about the specificity of the plots.  But the kidnappers clearly discussed plans to abduct and murder a U.S. governor-- in retaliation for her COVID public health mandates!  Trump openly encouraged this kind of loony resistance at the time.

     As for the broader issue of the rise of right wing domestic terrorism in the U.S., it is real, and serious.  Are you familiar with the cases of Cesar Sayoc, the Coast Guard bomber, and the numerous right wing provocateurs who set fires and attacked police while posing as George Floyd protesters?  Like the Whitmer kidnap conspirators, their goal was to foment a civil war. 

     I'm re-printing a year-old article on the subject for WaPo non-subscribers.*

     Did you happen to hear in your "news" sources about the recent four year prison sentence for Lonnie Coffman, the Alabama Trumplican who brought homemade napalm bombs to the U.S. Capitol on January 6th?

*The rise of white domestic terrorism in America

Data shows a surge in homegrown attacks not seen in a quarter-century
www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/interactive/2021/domestic-terrorism-data/?itid=hp_mr_1


April 12, 2021

Domestic terrorism incidents have soared to new highs in the United States, driven chiefly by white-supremacist, anti-Muslim and anti-government extremists on the far right, according to a Washington Post analysis of data compiled by the Center for Strategic and International Studies.

The surge reflects a growing threat from homegrown terrorism not seen in a quarter-century, with right-wing extremist attacks and plots greatly eclipsing those from the far left and causing more deaths, the analysis shows.

The number of all domestic terrorism incidents in the data peaked in 2020.

Since 2015, right-wing extremists have been involved in 267 plots or attacks and 91 fatalities, the data shows. At the same time, attacks and plots ascribed to far-left views accounted for 66 incidents leading to 19 deaths.

“What is most concerning is that the number of domestic terror plots and attacks are at the highest they have been in decades,” said Seth Jones, director of the database project at CSIS, a nonpartisan Washington-based nonprofit that specializes in national security issues. “It’s so important for Americans to understand the gravity of the threat before it gets worse.”

More than a quarter of right-wing incidents and just under half of the deaths in those incidents were caused by people who showed support for white supremacy or claimed to belong to groups espousing that ideology, the analysis shows.

Victims of all incidents in recent years represent a broad cross-section of American society, including Blacks, Jews, immigrants, LGBTQ individuals, Asians and other people of color who have been attacked by right-wing extremists wielding vehicles, guns, knives and fists.

Dozens of religious institutions — including mosques, synagogues and Black churches — as well as abortion clinics and government buildings, have been threatened, burned, bombed and hit with gunfire over the past six years.

Kenneth Robinson, pastor of Briar Creek Road Baptist Church in Charlotte — one of several predominantly Black churches attacked in the spring and summer of 2015 — said some members remain apprehensive.

“Trauma is a way of life for us,” Robinson said. “So we grieve, but we keep pushing forward.”

Both far-left and far-right attacks hit groundbreaking levels in 2020, the database shows, with far-right incidents still the much larger group.

The 73 far-right incidents were an all-time annual high in the CSIS database, which goes back to 1994.

Left-wing attacks reached 25 in 2020. Those incidents include multiple attempts by extremists to derail trains to hinder oil pipeline construction and at least seven incidents in which police and their facilities were targeted with guns, firebombs and graffiti. The incidents included the burning of a Minneapolis police precinct during protests over the death of George Floyd.

In August, a supporter of President Donald Trump was shot dead in Portland, Ore., by a suspected gunman who was a self-described antifa supporter. That killing was the only death last year attributed to far-left violence, the data shows. There were two deaths attributed to far-right attacks.

The Jan. 6 riot at the Capitol spurred renewed national attention on domestic terrorism and on hate-driven violence.

The Post focused its analysis primarily on far-right attacks since 2015 because they account for a clear majority of the rising domestic terrorism events and fatalities charted by the CSIS.

The far-right incidents last year broke into distinct waves emerging amid government shutdowns in the spring, widespread racial demonstrations in the summer and confrontations over the presidential election results in the late fall, The Post’s review of the CSIS data shows.

The CSIS database is one of the best public sources of information about domestic terrorism incidents, which the group’s analysts define as attacks or plots involving a deliberate use or threat of violence to achieve political goals, create a broad psychological impact or change government policy. That definition excludes many violent events, including incidents during nationwide unrest last year, because CSIS analysts could not determine whether attackers had a political or ideological motive.

Data released by the CSIS on Monday includes the Jan. 6 breach of the Capitol as one of 11 far-right terrorism incidents that month — the most for any January in the database. The new report highlights more involvement in far-right attacks and plots by military service members, veterans and current and former police officers, some of whom participated in the riot at the Capitol.

Following the Capitol incident, FBI Director Christopher A. Wray told federal lawmakers that confronting domestic terrorism is a top national security priority of the agency.

Nearly every state has seen at least one domestic terrorist attack or plot in recent years, The Post’s analysis of the database shows, a notable expansion of the communities afflicted by terrorism over prior decades.

“January 6 was not an isolated event,” Wray told the Senate Judiciary Committee on March 2. “The problem of domestic terrorism has been metastasizing across the country for a long time now and it’s not going away anytime soon.”

Domestic terrorism data

The database includes 980 incidents since 1994, the first year in the CSIS records.

Incidents do not have to be adjudicated in the court system to be included. Dozens of incidents have no identified perpetrator but have details about the attacks, including evidence of motive and the target that led to the case being categorized in the database.

The attacks and plots on U.S. soil are bucketed as far right, far left, religious or “ethnonationalist,” which supports nationalist goals that often include dividing society along ethnic lines. Under the CSIS system, the attacks on 9/11 are in the religious category because the perpetrators were Islamist terrorists.

The data shows that far-right attacks diminished following a federal crackdown in response to the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995. In the attack, Timothy McVeigh detonated a truck bomb outside a federal building, killing 168 people. It remains the deadliest homegrown terrorist attack in American history.

Right-wing extremism began gathering fresh momentum after the election of Barack Obama, the nation’s first Black president, according to an April 2009 Department of Homeland Security intelligence assessment. “Right-wing extremists have capitalized on the election of the first African American president, and are focusing their efforts to recruit new members, mobilize existing supporters, and broaden their scope and appeal through propaganda,” the assessment said.

Some attacks do not have an easily discerned motive or a single ideological thread. To refine the types of extremism involved in each case, The Post compiled court records, social media postings, news accounts and other material from local, state and federal law enforcement authorities.

For example, the extended review enabled the The Post to determine that at least 15 attacks or plots involved predominantly Black churches over the past six years. One of them was New Shiloh Christian Center in Melbourne, Fla. Three times in early 2015 fires were set at the church and cars vandalized. No suspect was caught.

Some members left the congregation and others remain fearful, said New Shiloh Bishop Jacquelyn Gordon.

“We all felt threatened,” she said. “I’m always on high alert, because I had no idea who did this.”

Over the past six years, 16 mosques and 13 synagogues also were attacked or threatened by extremists on the far right, The Post’s analysis of the database found.

One of those, Anshe Sholom B’nai Israel in Chicago, was hit with molotov cocktails in 2019. The perpetrators remain unidentified.

Rabbi David Wolkenfeld said worshipers began to fret about security even as they gave thanks that the building was not destroyed.

“It’s really hard. Shocking, shocking to see,” he said. “I’m at a loss when I think about that. Violence toward innocent people is just something I can’t get my head around.”

Pastor Ernest Richards said he had the same sense of disbelief as he watched his church burning in July 2018, an incident that the CSIS includes as a far-left attack. The attackers set the church in Vale, N.C., afire and spray-painted the words “ANTI-GAY HATE GROUP” on a wall, apparently thinking it was a church with a similar name where a pastor was critical of homosexuality. A suspect was never identified.

“I was just angry at a person who could do this,” said Richards, 88, who no longer leads the church. “My anger turned into a state of pity. How can you do that?”

‘Just because they’re mad’

Members of militias and other extremist groups — such as the KKK, Aryan Cowboys and the Base — had roles in at least 67 attacks since 2015, according to The Post’s examination.

But a large majority of perpetrators appear from the data to be operating independently, a defining characteristic of many recent attacks, counterterrorism researchers have said. Some of those loners are prolific users of social media out of which they assemble a jumble of personal beliefs or ideologies, researchers said.

The beliefs have included a tangle of white supremacy, antisemitism, misogyny, homophobia and a host of baseless and debunked claims.

One of the prevailing theories among far-right conservatives is about a “Great Replacement,” the belief that the White race is being replaced by people of color, according to a nationally representative survey of 1,000 American adults last month by the Chicago Project on Security and Threats at the University of Chicago.

The Post’s review of the database found 30 attacks or plots attributed to right-wing violence against Black Lives Matter since 2015, a large majority of them last year.

Perpetrators beat BLM activists in the streets and attacked them with mace, knives, guns or explosives, records show. Right-wing extremists used their vehicles as weapons against activists, plowing into crowds of racial justice demonstrators on at least nine occasions over the past six years, according to The Post’s analysis.

Businesses affiliated with racial justice protests were vandalized and torched, among them a Black-owned coffee shop in Shoreline, Wash. It was pelted with molotov cocktails after midnight on Sept. 30 last year.

Darnesha Weary, co-owner of Black Coffee Northwest and a Black Lives Matter coordinator in Shoreline, said the shop later was vandalized with neo-poopoo graffiti. Weary expressed outrage about the attacks and the fact that no one has been caught.

“No one should feel like they have the audacity to go try and burn someone’s building,” she said. “And just because they’re mad.”

Social media and terrorism

Bruce Hoffman, a professor and counter-terrorism specialist at Georgetown University, said extremists have exploited social media and the Internet in recent years to share theories, along with grievances, tactics and potential targets.

“It’s the propellant,” Hoffman said about social media. “That’s what’s giving the reach.”

From 2015 to 2020, the use of websites or social media such as Facebook and encrypted chat services by right-wing extremists rose in five of the six years, The Post’s analysis found.

The Post review included a case if the social media engagement was mentioned by investigators in incidents or cited in news accounts.

The trend peaked in 2020, with 24 incidents that The Post could identify. That represents about one out of five incidents of right-wing violence in that year.

Extremists who lurk online and are unaffiliated with a group pose special challenges for law enforcement because they leave few clues about their intentions and targets, counterterrorism officials and researchers said in interviews.

“Social media has afforded absolutely everything that’s bad out there in the world the ability to come inside your home,” one federal counterterrorism official told The Post, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss law enforcement matters. “And so that makes it hard for law enforcement to see potential tripwires and indicators.”

Among the extremists drawing inspiration online was Taylor Michael Wilson, a 26-year-old from Missouri. Before and after Wilson attended a deadly 2017 right-wing rally in Charlottesville, he immersed himself in right-wing propaganda, court records showed later.

On Oct. 22, 2017, Wilson slipped into the engine compartment of an Amtrak train and pulled the brakes in a remote stretch of Nebraska. At the time, he was carrying a .38-caliber handgun, ammunition speed-loaders and a knife. He also had with him a business card for the neo-poopoo National Socialist Movement, court records show.

After a struggle, a train conductor pinned him down until authorities arrived. Wilson later told a deputy: “I was going to save the train from the black people,” records state.

Federal authorities later confiscated more than a dozen firearms, including an automatic rifle and hundreds of rounds of ammunition, tactical gear and white-supremacist literature, documents show. A roommate told investigators Wilson joined a neo-poopoo group after meeting members online. Wilson expressed interest in “killing black people,” court records show.

Wilson pleaded guilty in 2018 to a count of terrorism attacks and other violence against railroad carriers and mass transportation systems. He was sentenced to 14 years in federal prison.

Growing threats

Attacks on immigrants have been recurring in recent years. So have attacks on people of color assumed to be immigrants or Muslim, according to statements by perpetrators during the episodes as recounted by the victims.

There have been 15 anti-immigrant-related incidents since 2015, resulting in 27 fatalities and dozens of injuries, a review of the CSIS cases shows. Some of those attacks drew national attention, including an Aug. 3, 2019, massacre at a Walmart in El Paso, by a gunman who authorities say posted a manifesto railing against a “Hispanic invasion” of Texas. The shootings left 23 people, including eight Mexican nationals, dead and two dozen others wounded.

But there also were local incidents, such as the shootings in Wisconsin by now-convicted killer Dan J. Popp of his neighbors. On March 6, 2016, Popp, then 39, approached a father and son in the hallway of the apartment complex where he lived, court records show. Popp demanded to know where they were from.

When they told him they were from Puerto Rico, Popp said, “Oh, that’s why you don’t speak English.”

Popp retrieved a rifle from his room, told them, “You guys got to go,” and shot dead Jesus R. Manso-Perez, 40. He kicked down the door to another unit that belonged to a Hmong family. Popp found them hiding in a bedroom and killed Phia Vue, 36, and Mai Vue, 32.

During his trial for homicide, a jury rejected a claim by Popp that he was insane. A judge sentenced him in February 2018 to life in prison.

Among emerging trends is the number of military service members and veterans involved in attacks and plots in recent years.

The Post found 36 instances in the CSIS data from 2015 through January 2021, including the Jan. 6 Capitol riot.

In that incident alone, more than 40 people charged with conspiracy and other crimes had served in the military, according to another, separate Post analysis of arrests related to the riot. More than a dozen were current or former law enforcement officers, including police and corrections officers.

Police officers, government officials and politicians also were targets in 2020 in at least 15 right-wing domestic terrorism attacks or plots, a review of the CSIS data shows.

In Monday’s CSIS report, the security group warned that right-wing extremists are increasingly attempting to recruit military service members and veterans.

The report, titled “The Military, Police, and the Rise of Terrorism in the United States,” cited a Department of Defense report sent to the House and Senate Armed Services Committees last month. That report said that DOD “is facing a threat from domestic extremists (DE), particularly those who espouse white supremacy or white nationalist ideologies.”

One of the right-wing terrorism incidents in 2020 involved Navy veteran Timothy Wilson, 36. He had been planning for months to commit some kind of attack that was based on his hatred of Black people, Jewish people, the federal government, refugees and other potential targets, according to a federal affidavit.

Wilson, a father of four who worked for a time at a charitable organization after his Navy stint, communicated with other extremists through an encrypted chat app, the affidavit shows. He shared bombmaking techniques, boasted about his arsenal of guns and ammunition, and talked about recruiting potential collaborators, according to the affidavit.

His contacts included Jarrett William Smith, a 24-year-old Army infantry soldier stationed at Fort Riley, Kan., who offered information online about how to make improvised explosive devices, according to federal investigators. On Facebook, Smith wrote about traveling to Ukraine to fight with a far-right paramilitary group, investigators said.

Smith was arrested and in February 2020 pleaded guilty to unlawfully distributing instructions for making explosive devices. He was sentenced in August to 30 months in prison.

For his part, Wilson began meeting an undercover FBI agent who was posing as an extremist collaborator. Wilson plotted to bomb a public building, and in March 2020, as coronavirus shutdowns were taking hold, Wilson decided to accelerate his plans and blow up a hospital treating covid-19 patients, according to investigators.

Wilson accepted an offer from an undercover agent of a truck he was told contained explosives. When authorities tried to take him into custody, Wilson fatally shot himself.

In congressional hearings in recent years, counterterrorism specialists and other witnesses told lawmakers the federal government needs more data on domestic terrorism to understand how to address the rising violence.

“Any expert is going to tell you that this is the most serious security threat to the American people today,” said Rep. Jamie B. Raskin (D-Md.), who held oversight hearings in 2019 that questioned the federal response to rising white-supremacist violence. “And yet we don’t have any good description of the magnitude and the dimensions of the problem.”

    

W.-

I disapprove of any type of violence, and believe resort only is justified in dire self-defense, clear and present-danger.  

But try to remember the US is a nation of 330 million people.

There have been 15 anti-immigrant-related incidents since 2015, resulting in 27 fatalities and dozens of injuries, a review of the CSIS cases shows. -report cited by W. highlighting "white terrorism".

Of course, such episodes are horrible, inexcusable, and perps should be prosecuted, and if found guilty in a court of law, then imprisoned. However, federal agents should not attempt to instigate such episodes. 

Moreover, according to CDC data there were 24,576 homicides in a recent year.

In other words, since 2015 about 175,000 plain-vanilla homicides. 

So, 175,000 ordinary murders since 2015, and 26 immigrants murdered due to their perceived immigrant status (mostly in one horrific episode, btw). 

The study/paper you cite above strikes me as fear-mongering, to justify an expanded police state, the same tactic that used be done when the public was told to fear anti-war activists (some small fraction of whom were violent), or black activists (ditto), or Islamics (ditto). 

These studies also help to divide various groups, often racial and ethnic, against each other. 

I lived in L.A. for nearly 60 years, usually in lower-income areas. I never met a white terrorist (granted, I moved in HIspanic or artsy-fartsy circles), but I met hundreds of petty criminals, and there were several murders in my small Elysian Valley (Frogtown) neighborhood. 

So why is the government not taking care of crime, but is highlighting minute racial/ethnic threats from fringe whackos? 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Benjamin Cole

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

So why is the government not taking care of crime, but is highlighting minute racial/ethnic threats from fringe whackos? 

Very simple; it serves a political purpose. Divide and rule. 

[W. Niederhut]

55 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

W.-

I disapprove of any type of violence, and believe resort only is justified in dire self-defense, clear and present-danger.  

But try to remember the US is a nation of 330 million people.

There have been 15 anti-immigrant-related incidents since 2015, resulting in 27 fatalities and dozens of injuries, a review of the CSIS cases shows. -report cited by W. highlighting "white terrorism".

 

Ben,

      Your above post is a highly misleading distortion of the data. 

      Right wing domestic terrorist attacks in the U.S. have not been limited to the murders of immigrants. 

     The recent surge in right wing domestic terrorism has also targeted racial and religious minority groups in the country-- blacks, Hispanics, Asians, Muslims, Jews, and LGBT citizens-- journalists, and "liberals," including Democratic members of Congress and other public officials, like Governor Whitmer.

      How many mosques, synagogues, and black churches in the U.S. have been attacked in recent years?

       It's a very serious problem.

      From the reference I posted above:

Since 2015, right-wing extremists have been involved in 267 plots or attacks and 91 fatalities, the data shows.

“What is most concerning is that the number of domestic terror plots and attacks are at the highest they have been in decades,” said Seth Jones, director of the database project at CSIS, a nonpartisan Washington-based nonprofit that specializes in national security issues. “It’s so important for Americans to understand the gravity of the threat before it gets worse.”

More than a quarter of right-wing incidents and just under half of the deaths in those incidents were caused by people who showed support for white supremacy or claimed to belong to groups espousing that ideology, the analysis shows.

Victims of all incidents in recent years represent a broad cross-section of American society, including Blacks, Jews, immigrants, LGBTQ individuals, Asians and other people of color who have been attacked by right-wing extremists wielding vehicles, guns, knives and fists.

Dozens of religious institutions — including mosques, synagogues and Black churches — as well as abortion clinics and government buildings, have been threatened, burned, bombed and hit with gunfire over the past six years.

 

     

     

[Benjamin Cole]

5 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Ben,

      Your above post is a highly misleading distortion of the data. 

      Right wing domestic terrorist attacks in the U.S. have not been limited to the murders of immigrants. 

     The recent surge in right wing domestic terrorism has also targeted racial and religious minority groups in the country-- blacks, Hispanics, Asians, Muslims, Jews, and LGBT citizens-- journalists, and "liberals," including Democratic members of Congress and other public officials, like Governor Whitmer.

      How many mosques, synagogues, and black churches in the U.S. have been attacked in recent years?

       It's a very serious problem.

      From the reference I posted above:

Since 2015, right-wing extremists have been involved in 267 plots or attacks and 91 fatalities, the data shows.

“What is most concerning is that the number of domestic terror plots and attacks are at the highest they have been in decades,” said Seth Jones, director of the database project at CSIS, a nonpartisan Washington-based nonprofit that specializes in national security issues. “It’s so important for Americans to understand the gravity of the threat before it gets worse.”

More than a quarter of right-wing incidents and just under half of the deaths in those incidents were caused by people who showed support for white supremacy or claimed to belong to groups espousing that ideology, the analysis shows.

Victims of all incidents in recent years represent a broad cross-section of American society, including Blacks, Jews, immigrants, LGBTQ individuals, Asians and other people of color who have been attacked by right-wing extremists wielding vehicles, guns, knives and fists.

Dozens of religious institutions — including mosques, synagogues and Black churches — as well as abortion clinics and government buildings, have been threatened, burned, bombed and hit with gunfire over the past six years.

 

     

     

Since 2015, right-wing extremists have been involved in 267 plots or attacks and 91 fatalities, the data shows.-W. study/paper.

91 fatalities? (And that is if you accept government record-keeping and definitions). 

During which time there were 175,000 plain-vanilla murders?  

 

Lightning strike - Wikipedia

In the United States, the average annual death toll from lightning is around 51 deaths per year, although more recently, in the period 2009 to 2018, ...

In other words, you are far more likely to be struck dead by lightening than by a white terrorist in America. 

[Benjamin Cole]

1 hour ago, Chris Barnard said:

Very simple; it serves a political purpose. Divide and rule. 

Chris-

I suspect as much.

Also, every government agency is aways angling for larger budgets. 

Never did the Department of Defense ever say, "You know, there are less threats this year than last year. We can save taxpayers money and have submitted a smaller budget." 

Threats are always mounting, the mission is always expanded. Long ago, the Department of Defense eschewed "national security," and moved to a much larger standard of "global security." 

So it is with domestic police agencies. 

In America, you are far, far more likely to be struck dead by lightening than a white terrorist. 

Yet Americans now fear white terrorists, and will give up liberties in exchange for perceived security.  But as Ben Franklin said....

There is also the cynical political narrative of conflating populism with racism, a useful plank for  elite elements. 

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Benjamin Cole

[W. Niederhut]

1 hour ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Chris-

I suspect as much.

Also, every government agency is aways angling for larger budgets. 

Never did the Department of Defense ever say, "You know, there are less threats this year than last year. We can save taxpayers money and have submitted a smaller budget." 

Threats are always mounting, the mission is always expanded. Long ago, the Department of Defense eschewed "national security," and moved to a much larger standard of "global security." 

So it is with domestic police agencies. 

In America, you are far, far more likely to be struck dead by lightening than a white terrorist. 

Yet Americans now fear white terrorists, and will give up liberties in exchange for perceived security.  But as Ben Franklin said....

There is also the cynical political narrative of conflating populism with racism, a useful plank for  elite elements. 

 

What utter bunk.   Your narrow focus on mortality stats alone is a misrepresentation of the numerous right wing domestic terror plots and non-fatal attacks on institutions and individuals in the U.S. since 2015 -- including the right wing January 6th attack on the U.S. Congress.

As for "division," the entire Trump movement since 2015 has been predicated on ethnic demagoguery and division of society by racist appeals to white supremacy in the U.S. 

Trump's division of U.S. society along racial and cultural fault lines has proceeded in parallel with the Kremlin's cyber warfare promoting social division in the U.S. and the promotion of Trump's election in 2016 -- including Russian hacking of voter registration bases in multiple U.S. states prior to the election.

Trump's popularity in the 2016 Republican primaries surged when he called for a ban on Muslim immigration and started attacking Mexican immigrants as "rapists" and "drug dealers."   Simultaneously, the U.S. experienced a marked increase in white hate crimes, which was not limited to fatalities.

In fact, Trump's persistent racist rhetoric since 2015, and his refusal to condemn right wing white supremacists has normalized the kind of right wing violence that we all witnessed at the U.S. Capitol on January 6th.

Trump has been accurately characterized as a "stochastic terrorist"-- a demagogue who has directly incited violence in the U.S.

And let's not forget about the epidemic of Trumplican threats and violence against U.S. election and public health officials, businesses, airline hostesses, and citizens tasked with enforcing mask mandates during a deadly pandemic!

http://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/7033.jpeg

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[Benjamin Cole]

30 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

What utter bunk.   Your narrow focus on mortality stats alone is a misrepresentation of the numerous right wing domestic terror plots and non-fatal attacks on institutions and individuals in the U.S. since 2015 -- including the right wing January 6th attack on the U.S. Congress.

As for "division," the entire Trump movement since 2015 has been predicated on ethnic demagoguery and division of society by racist appeals to white supremacy in the U.S. 

Trump's division of U.S. society along racial and cultural fault lines has proceeded in parallel with the Kremlin's cyber warfare promoting social division in the U.S. and the promotion of Trump's election in 2016 -- including Russian hacking of voter registration bases in multiple U.S. states prior to the election.

Trump's popularity in the 2016 Republican primaries surged when he called for a ban on Muslim immigration and started attacking Mexican immigrants as "rapists" and "drug dealers."   Simultaneously, the U.S. experienced a marked increase in white hate crimes, which was not limited to fatalities.

In fact, Trump's persistent racist rhetoric since 2015, and his refusal to condemn right wing white supremacists has normalized the kind of right wing violence that we all witnessed at the U.S. Capitol on January 6th.

Trump has been accurately characterized as a "stochastic terrorist"-- a demagogue who has directly incited violence in the U.S.

And let's not forget about the epidemic of Trumplican threats and violence against U.S. election and public health officials, businesses, airline hostesses, and citizens tasked with enforcing mask mandates during a deadly pandemic!

http://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/7033.jpeg

 

W.-

Obviously, we have different viewpoints on this one. That's fine. 

But remember, the vast, institutionalized apparatus of the state, its archipelago of spy agencies, its powers of subpoena and incarceration, its ability to track all digitized communications, the widening use of face-recognition technologies, and license-plate tracking systems---that all represents perhaps 10,000 times the power of the flagging, bombastic, and regrettable Trump. 

Trump will pass from the scene, with mercy, this year (in political terms). If not, soon enough. He is no spring chicken. 

The bulked-up police state you worship...may never leave. Government police states tend to have staying power. The merging of the police state and M$M is another genuine concern. 

Meanwhile, keep an eye skywards. Lightening is very dangerous. 

[Guest]

5 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Threats are always mounting,

They are in Orwell’s “1984“, MSM and government briefings. Fear is one of the most powerful tools. 

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

The bulked-up police state you worship...may never leave. Government police states tend to have staying power. The merging of the police state and M$M is another genuine concern. 

Meanwhile, keep an eye skywards. Lightening is very dangerous. 

It’s like “Stockholm Syndrome” or someone in an abusive relationship with a partner, it doesn’t matter how much a third party tells them it's bad for them, or how many bruises they accumulate or how destructive the mental abuse is, they continue, making excuses and defending the tyrant of a partner. 

I wonder at what stage people would consider themselves in an abusive relationship with their leaders? What is interesting is that the Dems would consider themselves as in an abusive relationship with their leader whilst it was Trump. The Republicans would consider themselves in an abusive relationship when its Biden leading. It seems obvious that the common denominator is media networks. People sit glued to narratives and networks that they are conditioned to worship and trust. Supporters of both parties equally convinced that their networks are 100% correct. Of course, the prestige is that it’s all continuity for a ruling class, with the majority of the populous so districtacted and consumed by propaganda that they can’t see it. The saddest thing is that people outsource their critical thinking and prefer to follow others unquestioningly. I do understand why it's more comfortable to do that, it means you don't have to confront the deceit in your own safe space. 
 

Yep, watch out for that lightning. ⚡️ 

[Benjamin Cole]

1 hour ago, Chris Barnard said:

It’s like “Stockholm Syndrome” or someone in an abusive relationship with a partner, it doesn’t matter how much a third party tells them it's bad for them, or how many bruises they accumulate or how destructive the mental abuse is, they continue, making excuses and defending the tyrant of a partner. 

I wonder at what stage people would consider themselves in an abusive relationship with their leaders? What is interesting is that the Dems would consider themselves as in an abusive relationship with their leader whilst it was Trump. The Republicans would consider themselves in an abusive relationship when its Biden leading. It seems obvious that the common denominator is media networks. People sit glued to narratives and networks that they are conditioned to worship and trust. Supporters of both parties equally convinced that their networks are 100% correct. Of course, the prestige is that it’s all continuity for a ruling class, with the majority of the populous so districtacted and consumed by propaganda that they can’t see it. The saddest thing is that people outsource their critical thinking and prefer to follow others unquestioningly. I do understand why it's more comfortable to do that, it means you don't have to confront the deceit in your own safe space. 
 

Yep, watch out for that lightning. ⚡️ 

The numbers are dumbfounding.

People in America are afraid of terrorists, whether Islamic or white (it was black terrorists a generation ago). 

So, 175,000 Americans have been murdered since 2015, maybe 100 of those by white terrorists. 

The M$M runs repeated op-eds and editorials that the US may soon have a civil war, led by white terrorists. 

More than half of the Whitmer loonies were federal informants and plants. 

(The old joke in the Gus Hall days was that the Communist Party USA only survived due to federal informants, who actually paid their party dues). 

So...the feds instigate a never-hatched kidnap plot with some halfwits, and then say white terrorists are planning a civil war, and the M$M plays it up big. 

BTW, this is a variation of the same playbook used everywhere to instigate hatreds between ethnic and religious groups the world over. 

 

 

 

[Joe Bauer]

9 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

What utter bunk.   Your narrow focus on mortality stats alone is a misrepresentation of the numerous right wing domestic terror plots and non-fatal attacks on institutions and individuals in the U.S. since 2015 -- including the right wing January 6th attack on the U.S. Congress.

As for "division," the entire Trump movement since 2015 has been predicated on ethnic demagoguery and division of society by racist appeals to white supremacy in the U.S. 

Trump's division of U.S. society along racial and cultural fault lines has proceeded in parallel with the Kremlin's cyber warfare promoting social division in the U.S. and the promotion of Trump's election in 2016 -- including Russian hacking of voter registration bases in multiple U.S. states prior to the election.

Trump's popularity in the 2016 Republican primaries surged when he called for a ban on Muslim immigration and started attacking Mexican immigrants as "rapists" and "drug dealers."   Simultaneously, the U.S. experienced a marked increase in white hate crimes, which was not limited to fatalities.

In fact, Trump's persistent racist rhetoric since 2015, and his refusal to condemn right wing white supremacists has normalized the kind of right wing violence that we all witnessed at the U.S. Capitol on January 6th.

Trump has been accurately characterized as a "stochastic terrorist"-- a demagogue who has directly incited violence in the U.S.

And let's not forget about the epidemic of Trumplican threats and violence against U.S. election and public health officials, businesses, airline hostesses, and citizens tasked with enforcing mask mandates during a deadly pandemic!

http://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/7033.jpeg

 

Exactly.

Even in our mostly Democratic state of California, there has always been a real perceived sense of fear of some type of violent act retribution towards you if you dared speak out too much against Donald Trump publicly. 

You imagined someone in loud engine, highly lifted, big tires pick up trucks with Confederate banners, flags and bumper stickers driving by and throwing something at you ... or worse!

Seriously, right here in my home town I remember seeing a convoy of trucks like this parading through our main streets one day during the Presidential campaign period with rough edged cowboy hat wearing fellows and their Marjorie Taylor Greene look-alike type women sticking their pumped fists and heads out the windows and yelling pro-Trump / Biden hate slogans along with honking horns and loudest dial turned on country music blaring from their radios as well. I think with even a Pit Bull dog or two riding in the open back truck beds.

The whole super loud and aggressive Trump promoting scene was intimidatingly scary.

Fear of aggressive Trump followers is real. And it's a fear felt all across America.

Edited April 10, 2022 by Joe Bauer

[W. Niederhut]

30 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

Exactly.

Even in our mostly Democratic state of California, there has always been a real perceived sense of fear of some type of violent act retribution towards you if you dared speak out too much against Donald Trump publicly. 

You imagined someone in loud engine, highly lifted, big tires pick up trucks with Confederate banners, flags and bumper stickers driving by and throwing something at you ... or worse!

Seriously, right here in my home town I remember seeing a convoy of trucks like this parading through our main streets one day during the Presidential campaign period with rough edged cowboy hat wearing fellows and their Marjorie Taylor Greene look-alike type women sticking their pumped fists and heads out the windows and yelling pro-Trump / Biden hate slogans along with honking horns and loudest dial turned on country music blaring from their radios as well. I think with even a Pit Bull dog or two riding in the open back truck beds.

The whole super loud and aggressive Trump promoting scene was intimidatingly scary.

Fear of aggressive Trump followers is real. And it's a fear felt all across America.

Joe,

      This kind of menacing, violent Trumplican behavior has been a worsening problem in the U.S. during the Trump era.

      My hunch is that we have all witnessed this Trumpian phenomenon in recent years-- people threatening clerks and employees about mask mandates, driving their trucks into crowds of George Floyd protesters, etc.

      It's part of a general breakdown in rational, constructive conviviality in American society, triggered by the Trump GOP's cynical exploitation of bigotry, misogyny, xenophobia, homophobia, and hostility to science.

     Ben has consistently been on the wrong side of the eight ball on this issue-- e.g., denying the seriousness of the unprecedented, violent January 6th attack on the Congress by Trump's right wing mob, and minimizing the gravity of the Whitmer kidnap plot.

     What's equally absurd is watching people evoke George Orwell and 1984 in the context of criticizing the basic rule of law-- including attempts to investigate and prosecute right wing threats and violence in the U.S.

     The tide of Trump/GOP right wing violence in the U.S. isn't accurately measured by body counts alone, as Ben is claiming.

     Think of the Nashville bomber as an example.  He blew up half of a city block without killing anyone except himself.

[Kirk Gallaway]

18 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

When Jim D spoke out here against the censorship of Donald Trump, pointing out the slippery slope between that censorship and the censoring of other alternative voices he was right. Of course censorship of alternative voices in mainstream media is nothing new, but it continues to get worse. Think Assange, Greenwald, Scheer, Nairn, Moyers, Hedges, Rogan, many others. Is Rachel Maddow truth, and Tucker Carlson lies? Nope. Politics of division, coming from both sides, keeping the average citizen down, too busy or too poor to exercise their franchise. 

Paul ,  I agree with you about Steve Schmidt. He's an anti Trump Republican hawk, whose been given a platform by Msnbc because he's more articulate at bashing Trump than most Democrats.

Specifically Jim Di speaking out against censorship of Trump? I think of 2 possibilities. Jim started a "Trump was right" thread, that's now I believe in the Trump thread category where he quickly defended Trump from the press because of  Trump statement he made with Putin at Helsinki where he said "Putin didn't  have  reason to meddle in the 2016 election". But then he reversed himself 24 hours later and said he misspoke and meant to say Putin " did have reason to meddle".

Or possibility 2. Jim may have been outraged that Trump got kicked off Twitter. Of course, Twitter is a private company, and I personally think there are a lot more worthy private business areas that the government could get involved with than Twitter Like the oil, pharmaceuticals and banks for starters. JMO.

And you're mentioning Greenwald, and I hope I'm not considered unfair for bashing him now. 

As W. has appointed out,  I remember  in the Gretchen Whitmer kidnapping case the second of the 2 ringleaders plead guilty a couple of months ago.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/09/second-man-pleads-guilty-plot-kidnap-michigan-governor-gretchen-whitmer

 

Ben;s been talking about it for a year. It's no wonder why Ben has glomed on to this acquittal. Here's Glenn's Greenwald twitter feed yesterday.

Greenwald: The DOJ completely failed to convict anyone in the "Gretchen Whitmer kidnapping plot" that the FBI concocted, paid for, directed and orchestrated.

Completely wrong! Then today! Remember when countless journalists, pundits, and politicians screeched with such righteous certitude about the Governor Whitmer kidnapping plot, as though it were established fact,

He's still at it! Obviously Greenwald, like Ben hasn't put that much effort into following it. I might add, 2 of these charges of the acquitted were hung juries! Does Glen Greenwald bear any responsibility for things he's saying?

I have some more of this about Greenwald's victimization  I'm working on.

 

[Kirk Gallaway]

News flash! Get this, My the tables have turned!  Previous Putinites (and Ben idols) Tucker Carlson and Glenn Greenwald are now claiming that Ukraine hawks (like Ben) are calling them "treasonists and traitors" because they don't want the U.S. to get directly involved in a "hot war" with Russia in Ukraine!

 

I'm more  or less in the same "restraint mode" about U.S. involvement in Ukraine as them. And that's actually the majority point of view! So bottom line is even though Carlson and Greenwald  are now actually in the majority, they are crying wolf that they're being persecuted as "traitors". Am I old school?  Or are these guys just 2 whiny little privileged wimps! Listen to them commiserate!

 

 

 

 

I can understand where people don't want to get in involved with these Greenwald bottom feeding twitter wars. But there's more to this. Both Carlson and Greenwald urged restraint on the reports of civilian killings in Bucha. And what Greenwald is reacting to is one twitter comment from Rick Wilson, (who he calls a Liberal icon,but Glenn didn't know in reality, he's a Republican media strategist). who  responded satirically .\

 

Wilson tweets:

 

Greenwald: See they tied their hands behind their backs, and shot themselves in the  backs of their heads. Vladimir Putin's brave, strong, morally upright men were merely trying to liberate them.In fact, I'm sure it's a neocon plot to make Putin look bad.

To this Glenn responds!

 

Liberal icon

@TheRickWilson

fabricated a quote, attributed it to me, and now his drooling Dem fans are saying this is proof I'm a traitor! They should transfer more of their paycheck to his account to satiate their rage. *Fake quotes are fine with Twitter if for the right cause!

 

It's called satire! The fact that people fall for satire and parody — even when it’s obvious — doesn’t make it not satire or parody. That’s the point. Someone said all satire is a joke between the writer and reader at the expense of a hypothetical third party who takes it seriously.

 

Only the most humorless, self absorbed person like Greenwald couldn't see that, as the only Glenn I've seen is a guy whose hair is perpetually on fire and has never uttered anything near what I would consider a joke in anything I've read from him.

Bottom line, don't fall for Greenwald's self victimization!

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Kirk Gallaway