Oswald wasn't paid for his last quarter in the military before his defection?

[Micah Mileto]

Doug Horne says this 8 minutes in to part 4 of JFK: Destiny Betrayed. According to some kind of earnings records with the Social Security office, Oswald was not paid any money for the last quarter year before he defected to the Soviet Union. Any more info on this? Jim DiEugenio said that Doug Horne was partially afraid of being arrested if he gave out some information for the documentary - is this that info?

[James DiEugenio]

That was not what he meant by that.

What he meant was that the Navy did not pay him the last quarter.

Doug's context on this was the whole thing about the fake defector program.  And yes Oliver had to pull this out of him, he was afraid of getting arrested. 

What got cut out was this other piece of info: Truly was not being paid through the TSBD.

That is interesting because it was he who was the guy who turned over Oswald's name to the DPD.

Edited March 6, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Ron Bulman]

Aye yai yai.  Oswald's supervisor at the TSBD, "out front with Shelly", was paid by???

I thought this didn't come out until the 8th?

[James DiEugenio]

True Ron.  Somehow Micah got a bootleg view of the 4 hour version. 

DId someone take it from Sky and give it to him?  (Or maybe he just bluffed me?)

I would like to know who was paying Oswald in that final quarter.  Because when you add that factor to the incredible work by Betsy Wolf--which was also cut out--it would appear that Oswald was an intel project before he got to Russia.

And Newman talks about that through Pete Bagley's analysis of Betsy's work in the four hour version.

I cannot stress how important that is.  And of course, the whole Truly thing stinks to high heaven. 

Edited March 6, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[James DiEugenio]

Just think, on the afternoon of the assassination:

1. You have Truly turning over Oswald's name while working for someone outside of the TSBD

2. You have someone telling Perry to shut up about that anterior neck wound after his press conference 

3.  You have LeMay secretly flying in from Canada to Washington

Poor Oswald did not have a snowball's chance in Hades.

Edited March 6, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Paul Bacon]

Very interesting!  Does Doug Horne's fear of arrest mean he has knowledge of still classified information?  Why would he be arrested?

[James DiEugenio]

Those kinds of financial records were supposed to be held in camera by the Board.

Only for internal use, not for the public at large.

[Steve Thomas]

7 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

-it would appear that Oswald was an intel project before he got to Russia.

Jim,

You know, I've always wondered why Oswald was still carrying a ticket to the Ga-Jo-Enkanko Hotel in Japan in his wallet, five or six years later.

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=59622#relPageId=38&search=Ga-Jo-3nkanko_Hotel

Steve Thomas

[John Butler]

17 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

I would like to know who was paying Oswald in that final quarter.  Because when you add that factor to the incredible work by Betsy Wolf--which was also cut out--it would appear that Oswald was an intel project before he got to Russia.

If he wasn't paid, how did he save money for the trip to Russia?  The Marines and the Army pay the same in that time.  1966 I was a private with $90 per month.  Oswald could not have been getting that much in the late 50s.  He never rose above the rank PFC/E2.  Whatever money he had from pay would not generally cover expenses.  It's the same as when Oswald was spending lots of money on high priced Japanese prostitutes.  It was speculated he was in the black market making money to pay for the high price call girl.  But, his money could have easily been provided as part of an intel project.  

Oswald's whole military career involved radar and the U2 program.  One of the fingerprints of intelligence.  He visited several top secret radar and U2 bases just before he left the service.  That is one Oswald did.  The other not so much.  

 

[Ron Bulman]

So maybe Shelly was Oswald's handler at the TSBD?

[James DiEugenio]

Two comments from the above.

First, its not that he was not being paid by the Navy.  He was being paid by some other group which Doug's source could not reveal.

 

Secondly, I made an error which I have corrected above. It was Truly not Shelly.  It was Truly who gave Oswald's name to the DPD.

[Stu Wexler]

Was it Truly or Shelly who had outside payment?

[John Butler]

21 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:

You know, I've always wondered why Oswald was still carrying a ticket to the Ga-Jo-Enkanko Hotel in Japan in his wallet, five or six years later.

This was found in Oswald's wallet.  The question is which wallet?  And, whose wallet? 

I would speculate that the ticket would identify him to certain people or groups that knew he was in Japan.  I would further speculate this makes little sense since the Oswald captured at the Texas Theater was the Harvey part of Harvey and Lee.  Harvey was not at Atsugi, Japan at all.  Lee was.

In the Missing Chapter, Jack R. Swike the Ga-Jo-Enkanko Hotel, said the hotel was in Tokyo.  Harvey Oswald was in Japan after a brief trip to Taiwan.  He spent some time at another military base, Iwakuni, hundreds of miles from Atsugi and Tokyo.  Here's a note I made in researching this for a timeline of Oswalds in the Marines:

Note:  Harvey Oswald arrives at Iwakuni, Japan on October 6, 1958.  He leaves there some time in October to be at Santa Ana, CA on October 29, 1958.  Did he fly or take ship?  From Yokosuka, it is at least a 2-week trip by ship to the US.  If we assume his trip was as lengthy as Lee’s trip on the USS Barrett, then Harvey could have left Iwakuni, Japan on the 16^th of October making his stay at Iwakuni about 10 days. 

Swike in his book denies that Oswald was ever in Taiwan.  But, another note says this:

"Following his "defection" to the Soviet Union, HARVEY Oswald discussed his assignment in Taiwan with reporter Priscilla Johnson, who wrote news articles about Oswald and his "defection." A naval message of November 4, 1959 reported that Oswald served with Marine Air Control Squadrons in Taiwan. In 1964 The Warren Commission received a memorandum from the Assistant General Counsel for the Department of Defense that stated Oswald had been stationed in Ping Tung, Taiwan.” 

Since Harvey Oswald was in Japan for a short period of time he may have gotten to Tokyo.  He probably shipped out of Yokohoma in Oct. on his way to the US.  Tokyo is 22 miles from Yokohoma, Japan.  Yokohoma was the main naval base in Japan.  Moving from Iwakuni military base to Yokohoma he may have made a side trip to Tokyo.  Who knows? 

Hope this gives a little extra information.

PS

I believe I said earlier that Oswald's military career was all about radar and the U2.  Since reviewing Swike's book there is something to add to that I picked up which I had missed earlier.  Nuclear intelligence.  Iwakuni and Atsugi were nuclear attack bases.  Atomic weapons were not stored there at either base.  But, just off shore in naval vessels were nuclear weapons which could be activated at these bases and launched from Iwakuni and Atsugi in an attack on various Asian targets.

So, Oswald had 3 types of intelligence that the Soviet would have been desperate to have.  Radar secrets and operations, U2 intelligence and mechanics.  Oswald's quarters were the same as the repair crews for the U2 at Atsugi.  And, nuclear secrets gathered from at least 3 locations. 

Before Oswald left the Marines he also visited S2 sites in Nevada where nuclear experimentation and testing was done.  

Edited March 6, 2022 by John Butler

[John Butler]

9 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

So maybe Shelly was Oswald's handler at the TSBD?

Good point.  I believe Shelley was with Oswald in New Orleans in front of the trade center.  If that connection is correct, then Shelley has a more important role in the JFKA than most folks think.

[Steve Thomas]

5 hours ago, John Butler said:

This was found in Oswald's wallet.  The question is which wallet?  And, whose wallet? 

I would speculate that the ticket would identify him to certain people or groups that knew he was in Japan.  I would further speculate this makes little sense since the Oswald captured at the Texas Theater was the Harvey part of Harvey and Lee.  Harvey was not at Atsugi, Japan at all.  Lee was.

In the Missing Chapter, Jack R. Swike the Ga-Jo-Enkanko Hotel, said the hotel was in Tokyo.  Harvey Oswald was in Japan after a brief trip to Taiwan.  He spent some time at another military base, Iwakuni, hundreds of miles from Atsugi and Tokyo. entation and testing was done.  

John,

In an earlier post, Jim DiEugenio said, "...it would appear that Oswald was an intel project before he got to Russia."

Wasn't one of the Oswald's supposed to have had an affair with an Oriental woman while he was in Japan?

I've wondered if the hotel in Tokyo was connected, and if Oswald was being briefed on his upcoming "defection" to Russia at that hotel, and on whose behalf was that woman acting? Was she a Soviet agent? Did the Russians grease the skids for Oswald's defection?

Did Oswald keep the ticket for sentimental reasons, pining over a "lost love that could never be", or did it have some kind of intelligence function?

I don't know, I'm just seeing what sticks to the wall.

Steve Thomas