W. Niederhut Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 It's depressing to see that Ron Johnson is only U.S. Senator openly acknowledging that JFK was assassinated in a U.S. government conspiracy. He's right for once, of course, but, unfortunately, no one takes anything RoJo says seriously. Where are Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, Chuck Schumer, et.al., when we need them to step up? Ron Johnson Floats JFK Conspiracy Theory July 19, 2023 at 3:46 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 96 Comments Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI) said it is “certainly possible” government agencies were involved in the assassination of former President John F. Kennedy, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports. Said Johnson: “I think it’s certainly possible, yeah. The American public deserves the truth, and we haven’t gotten it.” He added: “There’s so many unanswered questions, so many witnesses that just died, so many leads that weren’t followed up on, so much evidence that obviously should have been collected that people have been prevented from collecting.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Brancato Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 Yes William - where are those Democrats? And why aren’t they speaking up? Can we just look at that as some form of ignorance? I can’t. I think it’s par for the 60 years course. It’s the Democrats fault that we never got to the bottom of this. And we know the CIA targeted the left or liberal media for their infiltration a la whatever that operation was (is) called. I heard someone from Ukraine today on the radio expressing total consternation about how much in lockstep the US media was when discussing the neo Nazi element in the Ukraine military, unlike before the invasion.o And in lockstep against RFK Jr. CA even has a petition floating around to ban him from running as a Democrat in the Ca primaries. Imagine that? What has the Democratic Party become? Well, given your point, to some extent what they always were, referring to the holders of power within that establishment . Remember when the League of Women Voters ran Democratic election debates? Until the D party took it away? Remember the lock step around the Iraq war, Donahue being fired from his most popular tv talk show? This is no Democracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted July 19, 2023 Author Share Posted July 19, 2023 5 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said: Yes William - where are those Democrats? And why aren’t they speaking up? Can we just look at that as some form of ignorance? I can’t. I think it’s par for the 60 years course. It’s the Democrats fault that we never got to the bottom of this. And we know the CIA targeted the left or liberal media for their infiltration a la whatever that operation was (is) called. I heard someone from Ukraine today on the radio expressing total consternation about how much in lockstep the US media was when discussing the neo Nazi element in the Ukraine military, unlike before the invasion.o And in lockstep against RFK Jr. CA even has a petition floating around to ban him from running as a Democrat in the Ca primaries. Imagine that? What has the Democratic Party become? Well, given your point, to some extent what they always were, referring to the holders of power within that establishment . Remember when the League of Women Voters ran Democratic election debates? Until the D party took it away? Remember the lock step around the Iraq war, Donahue being fired from his most popular tv talk show? This is no Democracy. Yes, Paul, I am truly disappointed with Democrats for kowtowing to the military industrial complex since 1964. I was shocked and disappointed when Obama retained Gates at the DOD in 2009, and continued to prosecute the Bush/Cheney "War on Terror"-- albeit somewhat half-heartedly, according to Gates' memoir. At least Bernie Sanders voted against the Iraq invasion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Varnell Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said: Remember the lock step around the Iraq war 126 House Democrats voted NAY in 2002. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bauer Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 It makes perfect sense why federal politicians since November, 1963 have not wanted to put themselves out there knocking the Warren Commission or worse, suggesting our own government may have been involved. I take you back to the film JFK and the scene where Jim Garrison (Kevin Costner ) asked Beverly Oliver ( Lolita Davidovich ) to come to New Orleans to testify in the Clay Shaw trial. She sighs and says fearfully " If they can kill the President of the United States, you think they couldn't get to little ole me?" I think that exact thought truly existed in the minds of most people in elected office. And in the least a fear that "they" were powerful enough to ruin their political careers if they created some real problems for the true perpetrators. Most career politicians will do and say ( or not do and say ) whatever they need to to stay in office. Just like today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Brancato Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 22 minutes ago, Cliff Varnell said: 126 House Democrats voted NAY in 2002. Small consolation. NYT, WAPO, CNN, Senate, most of the House, am I leaving anything out? Remember the UN weapons inspectors asking the coalition not to proceed because they were finally making very good progress, enough so that anyone looking closely behind the propaganda could see there were no wmd’s? Remember the mobilization against the war, largest in US history? We we right, they were wrong, the results have been devastating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Varnell Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said: Small consolation. Biden voted against the first Iraq War, opposed the NATO operation in Libya, pulled US troops out of Afghanistan, curtailed the Bush/Obama/Trump drone bombing campaign. I find the blanket demonization of Democrats ahistorical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 7 hours ago, Cliff Varnell said: Biden voted against the first Iraq War, opposed the NATO operation in Libya, pulled US troops out of Afghanistan, curtailed the Bush/Obama/Trump drone bombing campaign. I find the blanket demonization of Democrats ahistorical. On March 9, 2023, the Biden-Harris Administration submitted to Congress a proposed Fiscal Year (FY) 2024 Budget request of $842 billion for the Department of Defense (DoD), an increase of $26 billion over FY 2023 levels and $100 billion more than FY 2022. --- The FY24 bill prioritizes our nation's heroes by providing $319.763 billion for the VA, which matches the President's Budget Request and is $16.481 billion above the enacted level. Other VA programs like the electronic health record modernization initiative are FULLY funded. --- The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) projects that interest payments will total $663 billion in fiscal year 2023 (lets assign half of that to war spending) Add on $100 billion black budget Oh, maybe $1.6 trillion for the intel-military. Or, $4,800 for every man woman and child in the US. $19,200 for every family of four. Every year. Every year and rising. Biden? Trump? Obama? Bushes? Clintons? Do you suspect voters are actually mired in purple-pissing circle? At centerpoint? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Griffith Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 14 hours ago, W. Niederhut said: It's depressing to see that Ron Johnson is only U.S. Senator openly acknowledging that JFK was assassinated in a U.S. government conspiracy. He's right for once, of course, but, unfortunately, no one takes anything RoJo says seriously. Where are Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, Chuck Schumer, et.al., when we need them to step up? Ron Johnson Floats JFK Conspiracy Theory July 19, 2023 at 3:46 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 96 Comments Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI) said it is “certainly possible” government agencies were involved in the assassination of former President John F. Kennedy, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports. Said Johnson: “I think it’s certainly possible, yeah. The American public deserves the truth, and we haven’t gotten it.” He added: “There’s so many unanswered questions, so many witnesses that just died, so many leads that weren’t followed up on, so much evidence that obviously should have been collected that people have been prevented from collecting.” Why in the world would you make such disparaging comments about Senator Ron Johnson while quoting his defense of the conspiracy view on the JFK case? I know why: because Senator Johnson is a conservative Republican. Blind, rabid partisans such as yourself may not take anything Senator Johnson says seriously, but plenty of other people do. Once again, we see the rabidly partisan and harmful attitude that if someone supports the view that JFK was killed by a conspiracy, his arguments can only be taken seriously if he is a liberal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted July 20, 2023 Author Share Posted July 20, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Michael Griffith said: Why in the world would you make such disparaging comments about Senator Ron Johnson while quoting his defense of the conspiracy view on the JFK case? RoJo? Are you serious, Michael? He's the screwball who voted against the COVID relief bill and told people to gargle with Listerine to prevent COVID. Edited July 20, 2023 by W. Niederhut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Gallaway Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 6 hours ago, Michael Griffith said: Why in the world would you make such disparaging comments about Senator Ron Johnson I think what W. posted pretty much settles the issue, Michael. All the Republicans above are just intimidated cowards, who have put their own political fortunes ahead of their country, and have perpetuated a myth of a stolen election, and it doesn't take a "rabid, blind partisans" to able to see that. But I'll try to address their deeper motivation in answering Paul's post. 18 hours ago, Paul Brancato said: where are those Democrats? And why aren’t they speaking up? Can we just look at that as some form of ignorance? I There's probably some ignorance. I mean the entire Kennedy family which included 13 siblings of JFK and RFK are pretty damn ignorant and either said they believed in the WC findings or were silent about it for 50 years! But I agree with you. It's probably because there's no votes in it from people who weren't going to vote for them anyway. But this is really a Republican "weaponization of government" message. The government illegally killed a U.S. President and now they're legally trying to take out President Trump's campaign from winning back his presidency, and some will tell you he was removed from office by the government stealing the election in the first place. The ultimate purpose is to defund the government and make the relative size it was in the 50's or to some even before the New Deal. I can't emphasize enough and I think Leslie is making that point in another thread with Andrew Tate and Tucker Carlson, that we shouldn't be running after politicians or talk show people, like we did 6 months ago who will end up only discrediting us. But of course we do need politicians and influential people. 18 hours ago, Paul Brancato said: It’s the Democrats fault that we never got to the bottom of this. That's right, but after 20 years, people and their lives moved on, and the political reality is that it wasn't an effective issue to get votes. Most people now are 100 times more concerned with getting decent health care, and not having to go to the poor house if something should happen to them and their kids. And they are concerned about whether they'll be able to save up enough to put their kids through college, or just get a wage good enough to live on. Now if ever there was a candidate who had the right to bring it up as a campaign issue it was RK who lived through the death of his Father and Uncle the President and it still isn't enough to get him anywhere. It would have been interesting to see how far he got if he didn't have so many other issues. But my guess is he wouldn't have gotten out of the low 20's, even with the dissatisfaction with Biden's age, which I share. Something unusual will have to happen, probably to the economy or his health, to make him not win. 18 hours ago, Paul Brancato said: Remember when the League of Women Voters ran Democratic election debates? U Yeah, trying to avoid the Republican label of "identity politics"? The Democrats messaging is terrible! 18 hours ago, Paul Brancato said: CA even has a petition floating around to ban him from running as a Democrat in the Ca primaries. Imagine that? Of course that would be awful, but I wouldn't worry too much about it. Anybody can start a petition. So they'd actually stop RK , but not Trump? heh heh 18 hours ago, Paul Brancato said: I heard someone from Ukraine today on the radio expressing total consternation about how much in lockstep the US media was when discussing the neo Nazi element in the Ukraine military, unlike before the invasion. Since you've brought this up. Yes, I don't think it's the issue you make it, but it's true, it's never been given much air time. That's for sure. But I know the truth because I've seen Oliver Stones, Ukraine on Fire! Paul, I really like what you wrote in the Prouty thread about being open to narratives that may step on a few forum member's toes. I've criticized others for recommending clips that are over an hour. But have you ever watched a film called "Winter on fire" not coincidentally named I suspect in response to Oliver Stones historical depiction of Ukraine Nazism in "Ukraine on fire", which was a post Putin interview film made by Stone with a newly converted zeal. (or was it?) that Putin could now use as a pre justification for his brutal invasion. Ok, maybe speculative? Anyway in fairness, it was made by a Brit, an American and a Ukrainian. One should be warned it's a lot more "human" as it's not so much a historic lecture as was Stone's film, but actually interviews people on the ground at the time of the uprising. Obviously, Nobody should make up their mind about something so important , by watching a movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Prutsok Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 No Democrat is going to take up the JFK assassination banner. I'm sure the issue is seen by them as boosting RFK Jr's campaign , and playing to Trump's Deep State rhetoric. It's a non-starter for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Brancato Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 10 hours ago, Michael Griffith said: Why in the world would you make such disparaging comments about Senator Ron Johnson while quoting his defense of the conspiracy view on the JFK case? I know why: because Senator Johnson is a conservative Republican. Blind, rabid partisans such as yourself may not take anything Senator Johnson says seriously, but plenty of other people do. Once again, we see the rabidly partisan and harmful attitude that if someone supports the view that JFK was killed by a conspiracy, his arguments can only be taken seriously if he is a liberal. I think you are at least partly right. Certainly the last sentence. But also the notion widely held on either side that the other is so entrenched and so wrong about everything that the only strategy left is winner take all. I happen to think that the strategy of Trump and the current Republicans on his team, and in general the Republican battle plan since Newt Gingrich, is to restrict as much as possible multiculturalism by going after voting rights, and to gain control of local governments and school boards towards the same ends, and towards restricting what kids are taught in school, and what rights women have towards their pregnancies. There is more to it of course - I’m summarizing. But to your point, this does not justify a tit for tat response. It would be far more productive to get out of the liberal/progressive bubble and talk to the people who vote for the other party. This is what RFK Jr has been up to for many years, and he gets criticized for it unjustly. People who vote for Trump, or other Republican candidates, are not deplorable. Racists, antisemites - misled and undereducated for the most part. Same for people who fall for illogical and too all encompassing conspiracy theories. By not trying to engage with them, meaning listening with open minds and hearts to their complaints, Democrats shoot themselves in their collective feet, and become the elite snobs they say we are. And look at the gang up against RFK Jr? I presume it was Republicans that asked him to testify today? Todays Democrats are making me sick, and this is while agreeing with their platform in almost all instances. If they think they are strengthening their electoral position by promoting censorship and partisanship in the extreme I think they are in for an incredible shock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted July 21, 2023 Author Share Posted July 21, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said: I think you are at least partly right. Certainly the last sentence. But also the notion widely held on either side that the other is so entrenched and so wrong about everything that the only strategy left is winner take all. I happen to think that the strategy of Trump and the current Republicans on his team, and in general the Republican battle plan since Newt Gingrich, is to restrict as much as possible multiculturalism by going after voting rights, and to gain control of local governments and school boards towards the same ends, and towards restricting what kids are taught in school, and what rights women have towards their pregnancies. There is more to it of course - I’m summarizing. But to your point, this does not justify a tit for tat response. It would be far more productive to get out of the liberal/progressive bubble and talk to the people who vote for the other party. This is what RFK Jr has been up to for many years, and he gets criticized for it unjustly. People who vote for Trump, or other Republican candidates, are not deplorable. Racists, antisemites - misled and undereducated for the most part. Same for people who fall for illogical and too all encompassing conspiracy theories. By not trying to engage with them, meaning listening with open minds and hearts to their complaints, Democrats shoot themselves in their collective feet, and become the elite snobs they say we are. And look at the gang up against RFK Jr? I presume it was Republicans that asked him to testify today? Todays Democrats are making me sick, and this is while agreeing with their platform in almost all instances. If they think they are strengthening their electoral position by promoting censorship and partisanship in the extreme I think they are in for an incredible shock. Paul, C'mon, man. You can't "both sides" these issues with a sociopathic, white supremacist Trump/GOP party that is trying to subvert American democracy-- suppressing voting rights, denying election results, appointing slates of false Electors, and even denying that Trump and his Willard Hotel goon squad orchestrated a violent attack on the U.S. Congress. On the contrary, people of conscience need to stand up and tell the truth about the GOP under Donald Trump's "leadership." RoJo was one of the Trump/GOP clowns who approached Pence on J6 about recognizing a slate of false Electors from Wisconsin. When dealing with sociopaths like Trump and RoJo, both siderism is toxic, and, certainly, intellectually dishonest-- however well-intentioned. Edited July 21, 2023 by W. Niederhut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Koch Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 On 7/19/2023 at 3:01 PM, W. Niederhut said: It's depressing to see that Ron Johnson is only U.S. Senator openly acknowledging that JFK was assassinated in a U.S. government conspiracy. He's right for once, of course, but, unfortunately, no one takes anything RoJo says seriously. Where are Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, Chuck Schumer, et.al., when we need them to step up? Ron Johnson Floats JFK Conspiracy Theory July 19, 2023 at 3:46 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 96 Comments Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI) said it is “certainly possible” government agencies were involved in the assassination of former President John F. Kennedy, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports. Said Johnson: “I think it’s certainly possible, yeah. The American public deserves the truth, and we haven’t gotten it.” He added: “There’s so many unanswered questions, so many witnesses that just died, so many leads that weren’t followed up on, so much evidence that obviously should have been collected that people have been prevented from collecting.” Wow, such a scholarly post (sarcasm added) William (Harvard Class of 1984) thanks for posting the link that's behind a paywall, very informative!! 19 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said: ..with a sociopathic, white supremacist Trump/GOP party that is trying to subvert American democracy-- suppressing voting rights, denying election results, appointing slates of false Electors, and even denying that Trump and his Willard Hotel goon squad orchestrated a violent attack on the U.S. Congress. On the contrary, people of conscience need to stand up and tell the truth about the GOP under Donald Trump's "leadership." RoJo was one of the Trump/GOP clowns who approached Pence on J6 about recognizing a slate of false Electors from Wisconsin. When dealing with sociopaths like Trump and RoJo, both siderism is toxic, and, certainly, intellectually dishonest-- however well-intentioned Luckily for you that we're not the extremists you make conservatives out to be with your hyperbole😉. Thankfully Tucker, Ron Johnson, David Schweikert, and Paulina Luna are taking up the slack now that the left has forgotten JFK and the JFKA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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