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James Jesus Angleton


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The Baltimore Intel service was officially the International Services of Information founded by Ulius Amoss who had served in Cairo and ran some unfriendly types around North Africa for assassination and the like.

In early 1961, Amoss recruited one Robert Emmett Johnson who has been implicated in the JFK hit (by me) and also implicated in the MLK hit (by Gerry Hemming).

I checked my notes and the three observers for the Tobruk seige were William Donovan, Bonner Fellers and a man named Colonel Brower.

James

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The Baltimore Intel service was officially the International Services of Information founded by Ulius Amoss who had served in Cairo and ran some unfriendly types around North Africa for assassination and the like.

In early 1961, Amoss recruited one Robert Emmett Johnson who has been implicated in the JFK hit (by me) and also implicated in the MLK hit (by Gerry Hemming).

I checked my notes and the three observers for the Tobruk seige were William Donovan, Bonner Fellers and a man named Colonel Brower.

James

Then you are in fact onto something <b> Very Important </b> here. For Roy Hargraves, Hemming's close friend and an advisor

to Oliver Stone on JFK also named Robert Emmett Johnson (Fish is Red? Right?) when he blabbed to Mary Ferrell before her

death about his Top Five participants in the actual triangulation of fire in Dealey Plaza. Col. Robert F. Baird, Capt. Medric

Johnson of Walker's AVG, Homer Echevarria, Sr., and a couple of others were on her original list due to the inability to

understand the names that Hargraves mumbled semi-coherently while in a state of semi-inebriation. She wrote as fast

as she could and never bothered to ask Roy to spell anything at the risk of having him stop naming names. Some of the

names were purely phoenetic which we both sort of worked out together later. You are the best, dude!

Congratulations! I just forgot where the full list of Hargraves suspects was saved. Now I have to scratch Capt. Medric Johnson

from the list because Mary Ferrell vacillated between Medric Johnson and Emmett Johnson when I gave her the 2-3 different options of

possible close matches. I had no other choices in my database at that time. Emmett it is, then. You should be congratulated!

William Turner wrote Fish is Red. Anyone have the citation to Robert Emmett Johnson in Fish is Red? This is fun, no? I will

try books.google.com to see if that book is there.

Congratulations! Tell us more if you can or send me a private message if you do not want this to go over the Net.

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John,

Regarding Bonner Fellers, do you have any information concerning his position of being an official observer of the seige of Tobruk? One of the other observers supposedly being William J. Donovan.

Also do you have anything regarding Fellers' connections to Ulius Amoss and the private Baltimore intelligence service? I do think this aspect does indeed have tentacles to the operation in Dealey Plaza.

Bonner Fellers below.

James

Here is some other info about the "intercepted" communications which were essentially transmitted

knowing that the Nazis had the cryptographic keys. To protect our respective copyright interests

and safety interests in this thread, I suggest we take the Baltimore Intel connections into a private thread.

Sorry gang, but this one is just too hot to handle right now in public. Fellers is OK cause he is dust to dust,

but some of the others may still be alive.

This article was written by Wil Deac and originally appeared World War II magazine.

Intercepted Communications for Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

The intercepted communications of an American in Cairo provided a secret ear for Field Marshal Erwin Rommel -- the Desert Fox.

By Wil Deac

During the 1941-1942 tug of war for North Africa, the British benefited from radio-intercept-derived Ultra information. Despite that Allied advantage, however, for six months and 11 days the Germans enjoyed an even speedier, more across-the-board intelligence source. It was what Field Marshal Erwin Rommel, the legendary Desert Fox, called die gute Quelle (the good source). It also was known as "the little fellows" or "the little fellers," a play on the name of its unwitting provider, Brevet Colonel Bonner Frank Fellers. Fellers, a 1918 West Point graduate who previously had served in America's embassy in Madrid, Spain, was the U.S. military attaché in the Egyptian capital of Cairo.

General Cesare Amè, head of the Servizio Informazione Militari (SIM, Italy's military intelligence), approved a break-in of the still neutral American embassy in Rome in September 1941. Since Amè had keys to all the embassies in Rome, except for the Russian, it was a simple matter to gain entry at night. The burglary team consisted of two Carabinieri (national paramilitary police) specialists and two Italians employed by the embassy. One of the latter, messenger Loris Gherardi, opened the safe in the military attaché's office.

Among the items inside were the Black Code (named after the color of its binding) and its super-encipherment tables. The material, used by U.S. military attachés and ambassadors worldwide, was taken to SIM headquarters, photographed and returned. The Italians now could read everything that the U.S. Ambassador telegraphed. Although they were allied with Germany, the Italians only gave their Axis partner sanitized versions of the American messages, not the code.

While the Nazis appreciated the Italian largess, they did not tell their ally that they had cracked the Black Code in the meantime. By the fall of 1941, the German Chiffrierabteilung (military cipher branch) intercept stations were snatching the dots and dashes of the Black Code from the airwaves. The intercept station specifically assigned to cover Egypt (Britain's North African headquarters) and the United States, among others, was situated in medieval Lauf, just northeast of the Bavarian city of Nuremburg. There, on a 24-hour basis, 150 radiomen tuned receivers linked to six tall towers. The Lauf facility was backed up by a listening post near Berlin. Since the Mediterranean theater was then the war's most active battleground, it was only natural that Lauf concentrated on Cairo. It was just as natural that attention focused on the American military attaché there. His reports were the most thorough.

Fellers was as dedicated as he was ambitious. Although it soon became apparent that he disliked the British, they needed American support and went out of their way to give Fellers what he wanted. As Fellers said, he knew that "if I was going to be a good observer and write good reports I'd better report what I saw myself." He talked to British military and civilian headquarters officials, read documents and visited the battlefront, where "it wasn't difficult to learn a great deal."

Fellers composed long, usually pessimistic radiograms describing virtually everything he learned, encoded them and filed them with the Egyptian Telegraph Company for transmission across the Atlantic to Washington. Within an hour of their transmission from Cairo, the colonel's Black Code messages found their way to German cryptanalysts' desks. Another hour or two and they would be broken into readable text, ready to be retransmitted in a German code. Thus, a few hours after Fellers' messages were sent, the data would be in Rommel's hands. Chiffrierabteilung archivist Dr. Herbert Schaedel said that military headquarters "went crazy...to get all the telegrams from Cairo." He pointed out that the most revealing, Fellers' reports, were easily pulled from the hundreds of coded intercepts received daily. They were flagged MILID WASH (Military Intelligence Division, Washington) or AGWAR WASH (Adjutant General, War Department, Washington), and signed FELLERS. Schaedel recalled that the Desert Fox "each day at lunch, knew exactly where the Allied troops were standing the evening before."

On December 7, 1941, Rommel's Panzergruppe Afrika followed initial successes with a long retreat from near Tobruk west and south across Libya's Cyrenaica to Tripolitania. There, the German and Italian units regrouped. There, also, beginning on December 18, the Desert Fox studied Fellers' detailed reports, along with local intercepts. The latter came from his second secret ear in the enemy's communications, his own 621st Signals Battalion mobile monitoring element commanded by Hauptmann Alfred Seeböhm. The British not only failed to frequently change their codes during this period but also displayed an unbelievable lack of battlefield radio discipline. According to Rommel's chief of staff, they "were quite broad-minded in making speeches during combat, and we had the possibility of making important conclusions from their speeches." On January 21, 1942, aided by intercepts telling him he had temporary front-line armored superiority, the Desert Fox launched an offensive--advancing an impressive 300 miles in just 17 days.

Die gute Quelle kept pace with the advance of Rommel's forces, now elevated to Panzerarmee status, along Libya's northeastern shore. On January 29, for example, Rommel received a full summary of British armored strength. Then he learned that more effective American-made M3 medium tanks would enter combat after mid-February. On February 6 the intercepts detailed, in addition to unit locations, the establishment of a heavily mined British defense line stretching from Gazala on the sea to the oasis at Bir Hacheim. From that line, the British intended to launch a decisive counteroffensive. With his 560 tanks (including 240 obsolete Italian ones) against his opponent's 700, Rommel pre-empted the Allies by unleashing a daring assault on May 26. His main force swept south parallel to the defense line, swung east around its Free French­held anchor at Bir Hacheim and then pivoted back north against the British positions.

Axis momentum slowed as supplies dwindled, due mainly to an overextended and inadequate logistical system. The key to British success in interdicting the Axis' Mediterranean convoys was the island of Malta, situated just west of the principal Axis sea lane. German and Italian aircraft pounded the little island, dropping some 9,000 tons of bombs during a two-month period. Fellers' cables made only too clear the island's perilous position and predicted its surrender if the bombardment continued and supply convoys failed to reach it.

In June, the British decided to sail two convoys simultaneously from Alexandria in the east and Gibraltar in the west, respectively code-named Vigorious and Harpoon, in a full-scale attempt to relieve Malta. A vital part of the operation was the neutralization of Axis ships and aircraft. Toward this end, air raids were scheduled against key enemy bases. In addition, numerous airfields would be attacked by parachute and ground elements to destroy bombers before they could be flown against the convoys. Fellers efficiently reported this. His cable, No. 11119 dated June 11, was intercepted in both Rome and Lauf. It read, in part: "NIGHTS OF JUNE 12TH JUNE 13TH BRITISH SABOTAGE UNITS PLAN SIMULTANEOUS STICKER BOMB ATTACKS AGAINST AIRCRAFT ON 9 AXIS AIRDROMES. PLANS TO REACH OBJECTIVES BY PARACHUTES AND LONG RANGE DESERT PATROL." British and Free French raiders went into action behind the lines in Libya and on the island of Crete. At most bases, they were slaughtered. There was success only where Fellers' unwitting early warning was not received, was ignored or was ineptly handled.

Operation Harpoon's six merchantmen and their escorts were continually beset by Axis air and surface attacks between June 14 and 16. Only two cargo ships reached Malta. Vigorous, the larger eastern convoy, including 11 merchant ships, incurred serious losses before turning back to Egypt.

On land, meanwhile, superior leadership, communication and use of intelligence enabled Rommel's Afrika Korps to drive the British Eighth Army out of Libya into Egypt. By the end of June, Rommel's juggernaut was about 90 miles from Alexandria. Just beyond lay Cairo, the Suez Canal and Palestine.

Intercepted Communications for Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

...continued

< Previous Page 1 2

The opposing war machines, like boxers pausing for a breath, stopped to face each other along parallel lines running southwestward just outside the town of El Alamein. Adolf Hitler, optimistically discussing the expected capture of Alexandria, said, "It is only to be hoped that the American [Fellers] in Cairo continues to inform us so well over the English military planning through his badly enciphered cables."

Inevitably, the British came to realize that sensitive information was leaking to the enemy. The Afrika Korps was still blitzkrieging the Cyrenaican coastline when security officers approached Fellers to, in his words, "see my security measures for the [black] code." Fellers, however, apparently allayed any suspicions the British might have had about his being the source of the suspected leaks because they directed their investigation elsewhere. At least five suspicious-looking Axis signals had been picked up by Allied stations beginning on January 25. One actually cited "a source in Egypt."

Then, on June 26, a German radio station broadcast an evening drama offering "scenes from the British or American information bureau." Nazis listened aghast as the radio play featured an actor portraying the U.S. military attaché in Cairo and described his gathering of information to relay to Washington. Thirty-six hours later, on June 29, Rommel lost his "gute Quelle."

Whether or not the incredible radio broadcast alone had allowed the Allies to pinpoint the cause of the leak, Colonel Fellers left Cairo in July after a tour of nearly 21 months. Assigned to the Office of Strategic Services (OSS) in Washington, he was, recalled a colleague, "the most violent Anglophobe I have encountered." Fellers was awarded the Distinguished Service Medal, the citation recognizing his reports as "models of clarity and accuracy." Given the temporary rank of brigadier general, he next was assigned to the Southwest Pacific theater. After V-J Day, Fellers became military secretary to General Douglas MacArthur, with whom he had been friends since serving under him in the prewar Philippines. Fellers died of a heart attack in Washington, D.C., in 1973 at the age of 77.

Fellers' successor at the Cairo embassy encoded reports to Washington in the M-138 strip cipher, which Axis cryptanalysts had not broken. Rommel nevertheless could take heart from one of Fellers' last radiograms. It described "considerable British panic" in Cairo because of the Axis presence at the capital's doorstep. On July 10, however, with Rommel's main forces lured well inland in the ninth day of a new offensive, the Australian 9th Division charged his Tel el Eisa salient overlooking the sea.The defending Italian Sabratha Division was mauled in the attack, and the 621st Signal Battalion's tents, radio vans and antennas were overrun.

Seeböhm was mortally wounded in the fighting. The papers in his camp told the Allies just how much tactical information they had lost due to poor radio security since early 1941. Captured documents also confirmed the part played by Fellers' reports in the Axis strategy.

As a sidebar to the North African intelligence war, controversy still exists over whether or not intercepted communications resulted in the death of the officer Winston Churchill selected to head the Eighth Army's forthcoming counteroffensive against Rommel. On August 7, Lt. Gen. William Gott, who had been involved in the earlier Gazala defeat, was flying in a Bristol Bombay aircraft to take up his new command. As it prepared to land at El Alamein, the unescorted transport was ambushed and destroyed by six Messerschmitt Bf-109Fs. Gott's place was taken by General Bernard Montgomery, who, though controversial, was considered a far abler officer.

The Desert Fox's change of fortune came with the double loss of Fellers' cables and Seeböhm's expertise. The Axis divisions, virtually ignorant of what was transpiring on the other side of the lines, threw themselves against the Allied defenses from July to early September without success. Then on October 23, 1942, to the thunder of a thousand cannons, Montgomery, aided by information from an improved and more efficient Ultra staff, began the offensive that pushed the surprised Afrika Korps back for the last time. As one historian noted, the Fellers intercepts had "provided Rommel with undoubtedly the broadest and clearest picture of enemy forces and intentions available to any Axis commander throughout the war."

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John,

Of course you see no evidence contrary to YOUR theory, just as you claim adherents of other theories refuse to consider evidence to the contrary of their own theories.

I do indeed acknowledge that there were indeed people on the "far right", if that is a correct way to characterize them, who were rather kooky.

But what evidence do you have linking any of the names you have mentioned to the assassination?

And IMO far from being discredited, the only evidence that exists re possible conspirators is linked to the mafia dons I mentioned above, to Casto and to Michael Mertz, whose ultimate sponsor of course is unfortunately elusive.

Tim,

Not to take this personally but we should just agree to disagree and go our separate ways. Pursuing

a discussion when we are both locked into disparate arenas is frustrating, fruitless and pointless. Good

luck with your research. I hope someday your work proves satisfying, rewarding and conclusive. Mine

already does.

John B

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Guest David Guyatt
Yadda. Yadda. I am not here to argue "Gnat XXXX vs. Peppah" as some of you have done for decades. The issue

of legitimacy vs. illegitimacy does not concern me here. Do a DNA test if you have issues here. The expert on The

Shickshinny Knights of Malta is Kevin Coogan and he has confirmed for everyone that there was indeed a Military Affairs

Committee for that group. You stand corrected. Again. At least you were half right on this one.

"The DAC’s involvement with the White Russian community led many of its members to join

a far right pseudo-chivalric order known as the “Sovereign Order of Saint John of

Jerusalem, Knights of Malta,” which was headquartered in the small town of Shickshinny,

Pennsylvania. The Military Affairs Committee of the Knights at one point included an

astonishing list of former generals and admirals, including del Valle, Gen. Lemuel

Shepherd, Lt. Gen. George Stratemeyer, Maj. Gen. Charles Willoughby, Brig. Gen.

Bonner Fellers, Admiral Charles M. Cooke and Rear Admiral Francis T. Spellman

among others. The “Shickshinny Knights” were led by Charles Pichel, a Nazi sympathizer

in the 1930s who maintained murky ties to the White Russian community. Pichel

claimed that his Knights represented a branch of the Order that had survived in

Russia under the Emperor Paul I after Napoleon had suppressed the main group.

He further said he derived his order’s legitimacy from “Czar” Cyril himself."

Citation from: http://www.iisg.nl/research/coogan.doc

Download it and read it for yourself. It is a long download however. So don't bail out.

Now can you read "The Myth of Hitler's Pope" or "Vatican Assassins" and get THAT ONE right, finally?

Your credibility on these issues is shrinking down to nothingness IMHO. If you can't get Pope Paul XII

right after all this time, how can you get the JFK thingy down pat?

John, My apologies for causing you upset when correcting your error of understanding about SMOM/Shickshinny. It may seem a small gnat XXXX point to you but to the lovely gentle peace-loving people at SMOM and the Vatican it is regarded as a big issue. It's sort of like misidentifying the Bank of Mickey Mouse as the US Federal Reserve. All undobtedly crooks, I know, but as they say, the devil is in the detail... But since you don't seem to worry much about accuracy that's fine by me. Personally, I care not for SMOM or Shickshinny or the other crooks in the Vatican.

Forgive me for not bothering to download Coogan, but I already covered much of the Shickshinny ground several years ago.

Mind you, Francis Spellman was lovely wasn't he. He used to simply love dressing up in frocks and stuff. Very avant garde behaviour for the Grand protector of SMOM and the Archbishop of New York, who was later named Cardinal by Pope Pius XII. Since he was the Grand Protector of SMOM I was, at first, mightily suprised to see him listed as being a Shickshinny. But, of course, that was a different Francis Spellman. Rear Admiral no less. Or maybe it really was our Francis in drag -- as a Rear Cardinal?

Yet again I must step in and correct another falsehood you have presented as fact. I have not said that there wasn't a Military Affairs Committee for the Shickshinny Knights. Indeed, I have written about them myself. What I did say is that there isn't (so far as I am aware) a "Military Affairs Committee" of SMOM. Since you do not appear to understand that these are two different organisations and since "the issue of legitimacy vs. illegitimacy does not concern" you, then such a misunderstanding is understandable. Do you understand?

References to this are as follows:

Post # 106:

“John, are you referring to "the Military Affairs Committee" of the Shickshinny Knights rather than SMOM?”

AND

Post # 108:

“So far as I am aware the authorised SMOM do not have a "Military Affairs Committee" as stated by John above. To the best of my knowledge, this peculiarity is only a Shickshinny Knights structure.”

On Pope Pius that you continue to keep batting on about, I have just posted another correction of your misunderstanding (it's getting to be a habit, no?) for you here:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...st&p=123516

To correct yet another misunderstanding, I have no real interest in getting the "JFK thingy down pat". JFK is not an area that is especially important for me. I have made this clear here previously and freely admit that almost every other poster here is far more knowledgeable about that subject than I. That doesn't mean I can't ocassionally contribute.

David

EDITED by moderator due to language.

Edited by Antti Hynonen
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Claudio,

Can you share with us some of the conclusions you reached or information you discovered about Angleton's activities

(Hugh and James) while in Rome? Did you ever come across Gen Bonner F. Fellers

Also if you take a look at the Coogan del Valle article at http://www.iisg.nl/research/coogan.doc you might

find some interesting items related to del Valle and Mussolini and the Ethiopia campaigns which will stir some

reactions from you. del Valle also was tied into the Franco advocates as well as that del Chaie character.

General Pedro del Valle was right! Way Far Right.

Hi, I need to read Coogan: then I'll say if the are some reactions or not :D

JJA:

my method is "classical": I consider books, biographies and so on a third floor. The official documents on the first one.

On the X-2 activity you can find (If still online) a number of still classified docs at foia.cia.gov

Rome was considered a sort of "base" to recruit double agents in continental Europe. You'll find also biographical notes on this people (names=classified).

In Italy and Germany, any agent was involved in his past with Mussolini, Rsi, Ss, Wermacht.

Most of them, near the end of nazism, helped resistance groups to save the life.

The conclusion is easy: Us built a spy network - for the first time in history - in Europe to oppose Urss.

So, in this anti-communist League, you will find ex-nazi, ex-fascists, liberals, resistance people of the non-communist groups (in italy there were 3 large partizan groups, one catholic, one socialist, the other communist).

(edit: it is a case you find Nagy in the board of Permindex...or not?)

Pio XII also gave his support to the creation of associations and groups with anti-communist goals.

On a more official level, you have the creation of Stay behind net, Gladio, supersecret network under Nato with counterinsurcengy goals (in Italy project started in 1952).

Angleton had 14 agents into the SIS (italian secret service in '44-'53(?)): something like he had the control of the italian service.

Recently, Parlamentary commissions inscribed the relationship OSS-SIS and later CIA-SIFAR in "one of the 14 cases in wich italian intelligence "deviated" to his scope, serve italian govt (...) in this period the italian service was "Us-adddicted" (in italian is "stretta dipendenza dal servizio Usa", under Usa control).

The base of Gladio, to say, was built with a direct agreement CIA-SIFAR without informing italian government. (Gladio remained a secret in italy until 1991!!!)

The dossiers on politicians, people (157.000) was a direct order of Cia by Karamessines. I dont have a complete list of Cia chief in Rome, but I think youll find just a certain kind of people....

JHA: nothing to report on Angleton father. He was in Milan, not Rome. He was linked to Mussolini?

To answer this, I suggest to make a short search on these 2 names: "Generose Pope SR" and "Carlo Sforza".

suggest these:

gp http://www.niaf.org/milestones/year_1928.asp

the son: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generoso_Pope_Jr.

cs http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlo_Sforza

The first is a pro-fascist italo-american allegedly linked to crime figures like Costello that supported with the Us Democrats.

The other one is a critic of Mussolini that left Italy and worked actively in Usa to support italian political resistance.

In short, he wanted Washington to accept and recognise an "italian exile government".

But, the president in charge, Roosevelt (forsure not a fascist :D), decided not to decide, becouse, in Sforza words, "he needed the electoral support of Generoso Pope".

At the end, italian resistance had never recognized an exile govt. nor an official govt.

Edited by Accogli Claudio
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Claudio,

Can you share with us some of the conclusions you reached or information you discovered about Angleton's activities

(Hugh and James) while in Rome? Did you ever come across Gen Bonner F. Fellers

Also if you take a look at the Coogan del Valle article at http://www.iisg.nl/research/coogan.doc you might

find some interesting items related to del Valle and Mussolini and the Ethiopia campaigns which will stir some

reactions from you. del Valle also was tied into the Franco advocates as well as that del Chaie character.

General Pedro del Valle was right! Way Far Right.

Hi, I need to read Coogan: then I'll say if the are some reactions or not :secret

JJA: my method is "classical": I consider books, biographies and so on a third floor. The official documents on the first one.

Coogan worked from del Valle papers at a University. Would like to hear what you think of him and his projects.

On the X-2 activity you can find (If still online) a number of still classified docs at foia.cia.gov

Rome was considered a sort of "base" to recruit double agents in continental Europe. You'll find also biographical notes on this people (names=classified).

In Italy and Germany, any agent was involved in his past with Mussolini, Rsi, Ss, Wermacht.

Most of them, near the end of nazism, helped resistance groups to save the life.

The conclusion is easy: Us built a spy network - for the first time in history - in Europe to oppose Urss.

So, in this anti-communist League, you will find ex-nazi, ex-fascists, liberals, resistance people of the non-communist groups (in italy there were 3 large partizan groups, one catholic, one socialist, the other communist).

(edit: it is a case you find Nagy in the board of Permindex...or not?)

Pio XII also gave his support to the creation of associations and groups with anti-communist goals.

On a more official level, you have the creation of Stay behind net, Gladio, supersecret network under Nato with counterinsurcengy goals (in Italy project started in 1952).

Angleton had 14 agents into the SIS (italian secret service in '44-'53(?)): something like he had the control of the italian service.

Recently, Parlamentary commissions inscribed the relationship OSS-SIS and later CIA-SIFAR in "one of the 14 cases in wich italian intelligence "deviated" to his scope, serve italian govt (...) in this period the italian service was "Us-adddicted" (in italian is "stretta dipendenza dal servizio Usa", under Usa control).

The base of Gladio, to say, was built with a direct agreement CIA-SIFAR without informing italian government. (Gladio remained a secret in italy until 1991!!!)

The dossiers on politicians, people (157.000) was a direct order of Cia by Karamessines. I dont have a complete list of Cia chief in Rome, but I think youll find just a certain kind of people....

JHA: nothing to report on Angleton father. He was in Milan, not Rome. He was linked to Mussolini?

Yes, Tom Mangold, Jim Angleton's biographer, reached this conclusion. Something to the effect of:

"Hugh Angleton was not unfriendly with the Mussolini forces during his tenure with NCR in Italy before and during the War. As a

matter of fact you could say he was quite close with them. He had to protect the NCR franchise from a takeover."

As to Jim Angleton: "At the end of his life Angleton was a paranoid, almost schizophrenic personality. He would spout the

kind of statements you would only expect to hear at a John Birch Society meeting as if there were Commies everywhere,

even under his bed. It was quite sad really. The CIA had to get rid of him. Quickly and quietly. At the end on his

deathbed he apologized for the harm he caused and admitted he had made many, many mistakes in his career regarding

accusations he made about Communist sympathizers and collaborators."

When asked "Who struck John?" He answered "I am not privvy to that information."

I talked with Max Corvo's son a few years back shortly after his father's death but he could not offer anything of substance

regarding insights into Jim or his father. He was not even able to relay comments his father might have made about

Jim and his politics which he said were never discussed with him.

To answer this, I suggest to make a short search on these 2 names: "Generose Pope SR (this is the son: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generoso_Pope_Jr.) and "Carlo Sforza".

The first is an italo-american allegedly linked to crime figures that supported with his family the Us Democrats.

The other one is a critic of Mussolini (he started as minister in the first fascist govt.) that left Italy and worked actively in Usa to support italian political resistance.

In short, he wanted Washington to accept and recognise an "italian exile government".

But, the president in charge, Roosevelt (forsure not a fascist :D), decided not to decide, becouse, in Sforza words, "he needed the electoral support of Generoso Pope".

At the end, italian resistance had never recognized an exile govt. nor an official govt.

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  • 10 months later...

John Newman has just published a second edition of Oswald and the CIA.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Oswald-CIA-Documen...9758&sr=1-1

It includes a new chapter entitled "The Plot to Murder President Kennedy": Here is a quote from pages 636-637:

It is now apparent that the World War III pretext for a national security cover-up was built into the fabric of the plot to assassinate President Kennedy. The plot required that Oswald be maneuvered into place in Mexico City and his activities there carefully monitored, controlled, and, if necessary, embellished and choreographed. the plot required that, prior to 22 November, Oswald's profile at CIA HQS and the Mexico station be lowered; his 201 file had to be manipulated and restricted from incoming traffic on his Cuban activities. The plot required that, when the story from Mexico City arrived at HQS, its significance would not be understood by those responsible for reacting to it. Finally, the plot required that, on 22 November, Oswald's CIA files would establish his connection to Castro and the Kremlin.

The person who designed this plot had to have access to all of the information on Oswald at CIA HQS. The person who designed this plot had to have the authority to alter how information on Oswald was kept at CIA HQS. The person who designed this plot had the authority to alter how information on Oswald was kept at CIA HQS. The person who designed this plot had to have access to project TUMBLEWEED, the sensitive joint agency operation against the KGB assassin, Valery Kosikov. The person who designed this plot had the authority to instigate a counterintelligence operation in the Cuban affairs staff (SAS) at CIA HQS. In my view, there is only one person whose hands fit into these gloves: James Jesus Angleton, Chief of CIA's Counterintelligence Staff.

Angleton and his molehunters had always held Oswald's files very close to the vest - from the time of the young Marine's defection in October 1959 and his offer to provide classified radar information to the Soviets. That offer had lit up the counterintelligence circuits in Washington, D.C. like a Christmas tree. Angleton was the only person who knew - except for perhaps one of his direct subordinates - both the Cuban and Soviet parts of Oswald's story. He was the only one in the Counterintelligence Staff with enough authority to instigate a counterintelligence operation in the SAS against the FPCC.

In my view, whoever Oswald's direct handler or handlers were, we must now seriously consider the possibility that Angleton was probably their general manager. No one else in the Agency had the access, the authority, and the diabolically ingenious mind to manage this sophisticated plot. No one else had the means necessary to plant the WWIII virus in Oswald's files and keep it dormant for six weeks until the president's assassination. Whoever those who were ultimately responsible for the decision to kill Kennedy were, their reach extended into the national intelligence apparatus to such a degree that they could call upon a person who knew its inner secrets and workings so well that he could design a failsafe mechanism into the fabric of the plot. The only person who could ensure that a national security cover-up of an apparent counterintelligence nightmare was the head of counterintelligence.

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John Newman has just published a second edition of Oswald and the CIA.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Oswald-CIA-Documen...9758&sr=1-1

It includes a new chapter entitled "The Plot to Murder President Kennedy": Here is a quote from pages 636-637:

It is now apparent that the World War III pretext for a national security cover-up was built into the fabric of the plot to assassinate President Kennedy. The plot required that Oswald be maneuvered into place in Mexico City and his activities there carefully monitored, controlled, and, if necessary, embellished and choreographed. the plot required that, prior to 22 November, Oswald's profile at CIA HQS and the Mexico station be lowered; his 201 file had to be manipulated and restricted from incoming traffic on his Cuban activities. The plot required that, when the story from Mexico City arrived at HQS, its significance would not be understood by those responsible for reacting to it. Finally, the plot required that, on 22 November, Oswald's CIA files would establish his connection to Castro and the Kremlin.

The person who designed this plot had to have access to all of the information on Oswald at CIA HQS. The person who designed this plot had to have the authority to alter how information on Oswald was kept at CIA HQS. The person who designed this plot had the authority to alter how information on Oswald was kept at CIA HQS. The person who designed this plot had to have access to project TUMBLEWEED, the sensitive joint agency operation against the KGB assassin, Valery Kosikov. The person who designed this plot had the authority to instigate a counterintelligence operation in the Cuban affairs staff (SAS) at CIA HQS. In my view, there is only one person whose hands fit into these gloves: James Jesus Angleton, Chief of CIA's Counterintelligence Staff.

Angleton and his molehunters had always held Oswald's files very close to the vest - from the time of the young Marine's defection in October 1959 and his offer to provide classified radar information to the Soviets. That offer had lit up the counterintelligence circuits in Washington, D.C. like a Christmas tree. Angleton was the only person who knew - except for perhaps one of his direct subordinates - both the Cuban and Soviet parts of Oswald's story. He was the only one in the Counterintelligence Staff with enough authority to instigate a counterintelligence operation in the SAS against the FPCC.

In my view, whoever Oswald's direct handler or handlers were, we must now seriously consider the possibility that Angleton was probably their general manager. No one else in the Agency had the access, the authority, and the diabolically ingenious mind to manage this sophisticated plot. No one else had the means necessary to plant the WWIII virus in Oswald's files and keep it dormant for six weeks until the president's assassination. Whoever those who were ultimately responsible for the decision to kill Kennedy were, their reach extended into the national intelligence apparatus to such a degree that they could call upon a person who knew its inner secrets and workings so well that he could design a failsafe mechanism into the fabric of the plot. The only person who could ensure that a national security cover-up of an apparent counterintelligence nightmare was the head of counterintelligence.

Well I agree with that. Newman's analysis fits for me.

JJA was Mossad.

I'm not certain how many trips he made to Israel but I've read it was close to fifty.

Does anyone know?

The first page of this thread makes fascinating reading, imo.

Edited by Mark Stapleton
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After a prolonged absence from the forum I shall add my two cents.

I think Dr Newman may be quite close to the mark. What he says makes some sense to me, and his deduction sounds logical. The fact that Angleton investigated the assassination internally for the CIA also tends to point to a 'handling' of information and its control.

I held suspicions about Angleton, he seemed to be 'the man who kept the secrets', despite what Richard Helms biography may say. Angleton really does personify the agency, having been there for all the major operations, paperclip and the Bay of Pigs.

Like Newman, I can only really speculate, but logic suggests that something like an assassination of this nature was not going to get passed Angleton.

We also know from David Talbot's work that Angleton was no admirer of Kennedys, both in personal and political terms. Angleton most likely held the dossier on Kennedy, something that could have been used to get Johnson as VP. I would be interested to know who Angleton was affiliated with in military intelligence, as I think the operation was carried out from within that organisation rather than the CIA. Oswald was, after all, ONI.

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John Geraghty

"Oswald was, after all, ONI."

According to an email that I received in the past from Gerry Hemming, Oswald's "trip" to Russia was "tagged" ONI but was in reality controlled by a higher source.

My research seems to support that line of thought.

Let me suggest, just a suggestion, that within US Intelligence, by nature, the right hand seldom knew what the left hand was doing. Somewhere above there may well have been the marionette master, as I believe, but there may also have been people on the "outside" of the operation that would, by the nature of their job, catch wind of operations that were not being handled by their particular organization. Angleton's position required that he do exactly that!

Having made the above suggestion I will repeat my oft stated position that the Paris Summit was an event that persons responsible for the highest levels of US security did not want to see happen. It did not occur! It is not a far stretch to suggest that Oswald played a role in that failure, placing his "trip" to Russia at the top levels of National Security. This by its nature would be tightly held and I do not believe that Oswald was even aware (Angelton's Orchid Man) of the part he was playing.

To a person such as Angleton it would be important for him to "figure out" who this Oswald guy was. Perhaps nothing more sinister than that....except that if Angelton did figure it out, Angleton himself may have become a liabilty to those who handled Oswald.

By the way, at the end of WWII we find Angleton in the midst of people associated with "The Pond."

Just thoughts

Jim Root

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I certainly do believe that the WW III cover story was used like a bludgeon on many people (including the autopsy pathologists and those managing the autopsy photographs and x-rays) to get them to institute a massive coverup by inserting fraud into the evidence, so Newman’s hypothesis is very “simpatico” with this certainty of mine.

And since LBJ very effectively used the WW III cover story on Earl Warren to get him to chair the W.C. (and thereby effectively cause all other suggested inquiries to be stillborn), it suggests that the plot crossed agency lines and included people at the very highest levels of government.

Without rereading his book (and without examining the new material) I can’t really say what this will do to the most commonly held assumption---that David Atlee Phillips was a major player in the plot, and that David Sanchez Morales was involved with the wet end of the affair. I don’t know if Newman’s hypothesis precludes Phillip’s involvement or not. It may not be incompatible with his hypothesis at all. It may simply mean that Angleton was the puppetmaster at the top of the operational chain of command.

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In general, I not only agree with the role he gives to Angleton as assassination mastermind, I have just, quite independently, made much the same argument myself.

I too have a new book out, The War Conspiracy: JFK, 9/11, and the Deep Politics of War (for details see my website, http://socrates.berkeley.edu/~pdscott/q.html). I raised a more tentative argument there about how CI/SIG’s lies about Oswald in October 1962 enabled him to be a patsy on 11/22 (pp. 387-91) but mentioned Angleton only in passing for his subsequent lies to the HSCA. But ten days ago I finished a long article, which in the course of discussing Angleton’s underworld contacts, has this to say:

Moreover CI/SIG, the “inner sanctum” of Angleton’s “alternative CIA,” affected U.S. history significantly in 1963. Its so-called 201 or “personality” file on “Lee Henry Oswald” (the man known to the world as Lee Harvey Oswald), had been filled with false and falsified information since it was opened in December 1960. And two messages in the 201 file were falsified again in October 1963, in such a way as to allow Oswald to be a credible “designated suspect” in the assassination of John F. Kennedy one month later.[1]

The falsification of Oswald’s 201 file may have originated as a legitimate counterintelligence operation. I have argued that the uniquely falsified messages were part of a so-called “marked card” or “barium meal” test to determine if and where leaks of sensitive information were occurring. This was a familiar technique, and was the responsibility of the CI/SIG, which was responsible for the 201 file.[2]

But by October 1963 we see signs that CIA messages on Oswald were also being manipulated, in order to enable him to become a designated suspect in the November 22 assassination of President Kennedy. A CIA teletype to the FBI in October 1963 (drafted by a CI/SIG officer) withheld the obviously significant information that Oswald had reportedly met in Mexico City with a Soviet Vice-Consul, Valeriy Kostikov, believed by CIA officers to be an officer of the KGB. [3] This withholding helped ensure that Oswald would not be subjected to surveillance by the FBI after the alleged encounter, surveillance which presumably could have limited his ability to become a designated suspect by his presence at a particularly sensitive corner in Kennedy’s Dallas parade route. I have argued that similar CIA withholding from the FBI of information about two alleged 9/11 hijackers, Nawaz al-Hamzi and Khalid al-Mihdar, likewise made it possible for them to play the role of designated suspects by preventing FBI surveillance, as well. [4]

I don’t agree with every word of what Newman writes. Our different approaches surface in his second sentence: “The plot required that Oswald be maneuvered into place in Mexico City.” I myself am not at all convinced that Oswald went to Mexico City; it is I think more likely that he was impersonated there. What really mattered was not what Oswald did, but what CIA documents said he did; and here I totally agree that the man in charge of controlling the information flow was Angleton.

[1] For details see Scott, War Conspiracy, 387; Peter Dale Scott, Deep Politics II: The New Revelations in U.S. Government Files, 1994-1995 (Ipswich, MA: Mary Ferrell Foundation Press, 2007), 30-33.

[2] See Scott, Deep Politics II, 17-18, 92; also Peter Dale Scott, “Oswald and the Hunt for Popov's Mole,” The Fourth Decade, III, 3 (March 1996), 3; www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?absPageId=519798.

[3] Peter Dale Scott, Deep Politics II, 30-33.

[4] See discussion in Peter Dale Scott, "The JFK Assassination and 9/11: the Designated Suspects in Both Cases," Global Research, July 5, 2008, http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...va&aid=9511.

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