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Attorney's file on Roger Stone, LaRouche and Russia influencing the 2016 presidential election


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On 2/18/2019 at 8:19 AM, James DiEugenio said:

Well, Mr. Wheeler this is sure as heck interesting isn't it, the Bureau was trying to get rid of Trump.

And the guy said it on national TV:

https://consortiumnews.com/2019/02/16/the-fbi-came-close-to-staging-a-coup/

But then Wheeler responding to Cliff:

On 2/18/2019 at 9:17 AM, Cliff Varnell said:

The FBI Came Close to Staging a Coup

For the 25th Amendment to remove a President the Vice President, a majority of the cabinet Secretaries, two-thirds of the House, and two-thirds of the Senate all have to agree the Prez is unable to continue his duties.

Damn, the FBI got sooooo close...ūüßź

Robert Wheeler said: Actually, they were not close at all, but that's a longer story.

Cliff replied; Sarcasm ain't yer strong suit?

No I haven't seen a trace of humor from Robert yet much less sarcasm. Actually Robert, Cliff wasn't begging you to go into your "longer story" though I'm sure it might be exciting enough to make you, Jim, and Jeff quake in your boots.

He was trying to give  you and Jim a basic civics lesson,  which is so lacking in the American populace, about the 25th Amendment, The FBI can do nothing to that end but gather information and that will be scrutinized by Trump's cabinet, 2/3 of the House and Senate, that are currently controlled by different parties.

As for Trump's fitness for office, I don't think it's a stretch at all. I subscribe to a lot of the things Joe has said. But that would be very divisive, at least at this point.Though  I do understand that in order for changes I'd like to see happen in the U.S.,  it will be a disruptive process.  But I'm much more aware of policy direction than Jim, Robert and Jeff, and the direction that this disruption is taken is going in the very opposite direction that they seem to believe.

To assume that Mc Cabe and Rosenstein talking about the constitution  and the 25th Amendment is some evidence of a "coup" is just more excited bed wetting from the same sources here. The best point Jim can make is about the discussion of the wire, but ultimately  that's all they did, they discussed it. They ran it by their counsel and didn't do it, thankfully.

Robert Wheeler said

Every assertion of Trump's idiocy is an Insider attempt to protect the Franchise they have been building since 1963.

I know Robert, I'm sure it can be bewildering, in a world where we unwitting traitors are all around you. I might juxtapose that slightly Robert,

Every assertion of Trump's propriety  and fitness for office is an Insider attempt to protect, not only  his 90% Republican support, but the interests of the super wealthy, who how ever they may object to Trump's behavior have never had a more business friendly President in history. 

 

Edited by Kirk Gallaway
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Geez Kirk, what took you so long?  

But you came out firing on all pistons as usual, with that civics lesson stuff and predictably dividing Wheeler and Carter and Jim/me off to one side.

Clearly, there is a segment of the FBI that wants to get rid of Trump.  Especially after Comey was canned. I would even say that this extended over to the Justice Department with Sally Yates who also had deep reservations if Flynn was "compromised" by the Russians.

There is little doubt that the Power Elite wanted: 1.) War with Syria, and 2.) Cold War II.(That whole thing in Ukraine was so misrepresented by both the MSM and Washington it was sick.)

For whatever reasons--whether he was compromised or he just was not interested-- Trump did not do it.  

The real irony here that no one wants to address is this: I think HRC would have done both.

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I think the insider/outsider perspective is of some value in assisting to see the current moment clearly. It is one reason why this discussion is not entirely off-topic on this board.

To say the FBI ‚Äúthrew‚ÄĚ the election to Trump is implying intent - I.e. Comey wanted Trump to win. That is obviously not accurate, and continuing to frame discussion that way leads to faulty premises. Comey implied in the Colbert interview that his hand was forced and officially releasing the information was the least worst option available. Unfortunately, the Democratic candidate had plenty of skeletons in the closet and huge negatives among the voters, and so was vulnerable to exactly what happened.

The anti-Russia propaganda is cooked up in think tanks like the Atlantic Council, Brookings, Chatham House, etc,  then repeated uncritically in the major media outlets, combined with very nasty ad hominem attacks. It is a proven demonization strategy which has played out in much the same fashion at least five times in the past quarter century. The focus on Russia is promoting paranoid delusions similar to Cold War theories of Soviet conspiracies, and is being used in efforts to censor or marginalize certain political viewpoints, particularly in social media.

The Steele information, generally agreed to have been unverified opposition research, was improperly used to secure a FISA warrant in October 2016 which, in effect, put the entire Trump campaign subject to the full dragnet of NSA capabilities. That is probably the most serious violation of Constitutional rights and the integrity of the electoral system in this situation, and it follows on the Snowden revelations of the massive illegal spying programs themselves.

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4 minutes ago, Jeff Carter said:

I think the insider/outsider perspective is of some value in assisting to see the current moment clearly. It is one reason why this discussion is not entirely off-topic on this board.

To say the FBI ‚Äúthrew‚ÄĚ the election to Trump is implying intent - I.e. Comey wanted Trump to win. That is obviously not accurate, and continuing to frame discussion that way leads to faulty premises. Comey implied in the Colbert interview that his hand was forced and officially releasing the information was the least worst option available. Unfortunately, the Democratic candidate had plenty of skeletons in the closet and huge negatives among the voters, and so was vulnerable to exactly what happened.

The anti-Russia propaganda is cooked up in think tanks like the Atlantic Council, Brookings, Chatham House, etc,  then repeated uncritically in the major media outlets, combined with very nasty ad hominem attacks. It is a proven demonization strategy which has played out in much the same fashion at least five times in the past quarter century. The focus on Russia is promoting paranoid delusions similar to Cold War theories of Soviet conspiracies, and is being used in efforts to censor or marginalize certain political viewpoints, particularly in social media.

The Steele information, generally agreed to have been unverified opposition research, was improperly used to secure a FISA warrant in October 2016 which, in effect, put the entire Trump campaign subject to the full dragnet of NSA capabilities. That is probably the most serious violation of Constitutional rights and the integrity of the electoral system in this situation, and it follows on the Snowden revelations of the massive illegal spying programs themselves.

Interesting, though mostly nonsense.

Jim Jordan claims the Steele dossier was used to get a FISA warrant. Nobody has confirmed this and it has been denied.

Nothing in the Steele dossier has been discredited, though the president does say it is discredited.

The investigation started because Trump campaign officials started cavorting secretly with Russians as early as 2015 and have lied about it every step of the way. Manafort lied, Sessions lied, Kushner lied, Trump Jr. lied, Trump Sr. lied about these interactions. Some of them even drunkenly bragged about it their Russian connections to diplomats.

I'm no fan of the intelligence community, but these guys are willing to risk jail and financial ruin to lie about whatever it is they were up to. My guess is it's not because they want to pursue peace with Russia.

I've not seen any evidence yet that Trump isn't an asset of a foreign government.

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Hi Andrew

I don’t know who Jim Jordan is, but information concerning the use of the Steele dossier to secure a FISA warrant has been covered in some detail. Here are reports on the FISA process from both sides of the political spectrum:

https://consortiumnews.com/2018/02/02/nunes-memo-reports-crimes-at-top-of-fbi-doj/

https://www.nationalreview.com/2018/07/carter-page-fisa-applications-fbi-steele-dossier/

As I understand the process, it is the job of the FBI to verify information before using it for judicial warrants,  particularly when it is known that the source of information is being paid by partisan interests.

There are also divergent points-of-view as to whether Trump campaign officials triggered an investigation through secret cavorting, or whether an investigation was triggered because Trump was so-far successful in his campaign. Well-known journalist Daniel Lazare believes the latter: “The intelligence agencies initiated reports that Donald Trump was colluding with Russia, they nurtured them and helped them grow, and then they spread the word to the press and key government officials. “

https://consortiumnews.com/2018/05/31/spooks-spooking-themselves/

Douglas, the Lawfare blog entry does not address the information above, it merely shoots down the idea that the warrant process involves some kind of hearing, a premise which does not feature in the above critiques.

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8 hours ago, Robert Wheeler said:

Of all the places on the Internet to argue, one would think that on a JFK Assassination Forum, that has a pretty engaged and erudite group of participants, the MSM narrative with respect to current events would be viewed more suspiciously. People here are still viewing events through an (R) and (D) paradigm.

The most important thing I have learned on this forum, and diving deep into the research of the other Assassinations, Resignations, Attempted Assassinations, and other attempts to bypass the Democratic process is the realization that the (R) and (D) paradigm is largely a distraction from the reality that the balance of power is a function of the degree of control a minuscule sliver of Insiders have relative to Outsiders. We can call the Insiders the Deep State as a simple label, though I don't know if that should be the defining term.

JFK and RFK's political policies never jived with mine (in retrospect, I was born in 1970.) Now that I realize they were Outsiders, and were trying to regain control from the Insiders and reimpose the Democratic process, their political policies actually make sense. JFK was not being weak on communism when he decided he was going to pull out of Vietnam, he was cutting off a financial spigot to the Insiders in order to reduce their control and influence.

Obviously the Insiders were able to remove the Outsiders. The surprising part though, especially on this forum, is the belief that the Insiders 1960's successes would not be built upon, power grips strengthened and enemies eliminated. Up until 2017, JFK seems to have been the last real outsider. Every other President has been an Insider (Bush I & II, Clinton, Obama, Johnson, Ford) or were forced out (Nixon) weakened (Carter) or threatened(?)/managed (Reagan.) To me, it is easy to see that Bush 1, has been the primary influence on every President from Nixon forward. Bush has had the backing of the Insiders, whose functional abilities today formed from the 1963 coup plotters, but whose birth likely originated before World War 2.

No one has to agree with Trumps policies to appreciate that he is the First President since JFK who is not an Insider, or effectively under their control. Every assertion of Trump's idiocy is an Insider attempt to protect the Franchise they have been building since 1963, or a function of the Institutions co-opted along the way to influence the masses to do their bidding. 

Trump is not unilaterally trying to dismantle the Deep State. There are un-corrupted institutions helping. He may only be a figurehead for all I know. I also know that if the 1963 Coup plotters are capable of pulling off a Presidential Assassination and are able to manipulate institutions for the next 50 years to keep the cover-up going,  then un-corrupted institutions are capable of organizing and unwinding the Insider's achievements via the same sort of subterfuge.  Go find the very first story about Anthony Weiner sexting a 15 year old, it was first in the Daily Mail. It won't mean much if you still think every time Trump tweet's a miss-spelled word, it is because he is a bad speller, or an idiot.

LARP or not, someone (or something) with a few hundred thousand followers might be watching this thread.

See screen capture below. (My last edit was 8:48 AM EST. Timestamp on Screen Cap is also EST.) 

https://imgur.com/VRMvpbX

Or its a coincidence, and no sarcasm intended.

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On 2/19/2019 at 2:54 PM, James DiEugenio said:

Fusion GPS was being paid by a firm that worked for the Democratic Party, right, Lincoln Coles or something like that if I recall.

Therefore, Christopher Steels was working for Lincoln Coles.

Since you seem to know a lot about this Mr. Wheeler, is there any truth to the rumor that Steele was originally paid by Jeb Bush or a proxy to begin his trashy dossier?

The chart below seems to capture most of the major players. Paul Singer made legitimate donations to Bush & Rubio and I have not seen any indications that Bush Paid Singer to pass along the Dossier. It's not like Bush would have to cut a check anyway when a simple wink would do.

Also I doubt The Washington Free Beacon would be looking for a lot of money. Their mast head looks like the Freshmen Section of a High School Yearbook so a 12-pack of Natural Light was probably all that was needed to have someone their take the dossier.

A few people not shown on the chart are Ben Carson, whom I believe had George Papadopoulos on his election staff before dropping out.

George P is also not shown, and neither is Stefan Halper (Ray Cline son-in-law) of Ollie North and Palmer Bank Fame.

George P. also had an interesting tweet today.

Quote

Once the Italian government shares exactly what it knows about the months between March-July 2016, for the sake of their relationship with the United States, the word ‚Äúcoup‚ÄĚ will actually be a euphemism for what really transpired. An astonishing story yet to be revealed.

  • He seems to be hinting at some CIA spy school in Rome. (Link University) (He is also trying to get a book out.)
  • His wife is adamant that she is 100% Italian, born and raised, but she has a Russian accent. Smarter people than me says its Romanian.
  • He is also apparently not related to the George P. that led the '67 CIA sponsored Junta in Greece. I'll take him at his word for now.
  • George¬†Papadopoulos is the John Smith name of Greece, so I'll assume no relation.

Carter Page

  • Carter Page belongs somewhere down there. The FBI forgot to tell the DOJ and/or the DOJ Forgot to tell the FISA court that Carter Page was an informant for the FBI when the FISA warrants were applied for.
  • That failure to disclose is probably more devastating to McCabe's case than some of the GPS Fusion stuff.

Nellie & Bruce Ohr

  • Other curiosities not mentioned in the MSM. Nellie Ohr (Wife of¬† Bruce Ohr who dealt with the FISA process at DOJ worked for Fusion GPS.)
  • She also conveniently took up the Hobby of Ham Radio Operator in the Spring of 2016, acquiring a license on May 23.¬†¬†¬†

 

 

Fusion-GPS-connections-11.png

Edited by Robert Wheeler
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4 minutes ago, Andrew Prutsok said:

It boggles my mind that anyone would take a life-long, mobbed up grifter like our commander in chief and not only compare him to JFK but to presume to assign noble intentions to anything he does or says. On what evidence could such  a claim be based? 

It boggles the mind that someone would look at the evidence and allegations against the FBI and DOJ, or even choose to ignore the allegations and evidence, and offer a counter argument that is essentially the equivalent of saying "Trump Bad."

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Andrew,

The comparison with JFK is not the point.

As I tried to say earlier, it does not matter who the president is, be it Nixon, JFK or Trump.  

Our side is supposed to be about universal standards and evidence.  

Even Adam Schiff admitted that the Steele dossier was used for the FISA, but his argument is it was not the only thing used.

As per the dossier, have you read it?  Talk about a shoddy piece of work.  It really does read like oppo research, which it was. (I misspoke, the name of the firm is Perkins Cole.) If I had to compare it to anything as far as amateur night it would be the first FBI report on the JFK case of December 9th.  Which was so bad the WC would not print it in the volumes.  Buzzfeed should have never printed it.

BTW Robert, how did Buzzfeed get it?  Through Steele or the FBI or Perkins?

Edited by James DiEugenio
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6 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Geez Kirk, what took you so long?  

But you came out firing on all pistons as usual, with that civics lesson stuff and predictably dividing Wheeler and Carter and Jim/me off to one side.

Clearly, there is a segment of the FBI that wants to get rid of Trump.

More than half the country wants to get rid of Trump. 

Members of his own administration want to get rid of him.

I Am Part of the Resistance Inside the Trump Administration

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/05/opinion/trump-white-house-anonymous-resistance.html

6 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Especially after Comey was canned. I would even say that this extended over to the Justice Department with Sally Yates who also had deep reservations if Flynn was "compromised" by the Russians.

There is little doubt that the Power Elite wanted: 1.) War with Syria, and 2.) Cold War II.(That whole thing in Ukraine was so misrepresented by both the MSM and Washington it was sick.)

Moving the US Embassy to Jerusalem was sick.  Dropping out of the Iran nuke deal was sick.  Making the neo-con's neo-con John Bolton national security advisor was sick.

Preparing to go to war with Iran is sick.  And that is exactly what Trump is trying to do.

6 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

For whatever reasons--whether he was compromised or he just was not interested-- Trump did not do it.  

The real irony here that no one wants to address is this: I think HRC would have done both.

No one wants to address what Jim DiEugenio thinks?

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