Oliver Stone and Judyth Baker

[S.T. Patrick]

Its my understanding from those interviewed that the interviews for the doc were done a few months ago. The JVB isnt in the project. From what Ive been told, there was never plans to have her in. This seems like a non-issue, the possibility of her being involved. She isn't. I still contend that the appearance was good-natured PR to the other half of the community-at-large. In that hallway, there were at least 50 people watching closely, maybe 75. Stone knew he was being watched the entire time. And everyone was snapping pics. I'm sure there was an understanding that every movement was being recorded by someone - to be posted on Facebook later. Whether many here like it or not, that half of the community is a chunk of the core audience. If Stone believes her - and maybe he does, maybe he doesn't - this is an honest move. If he doesnt believe her but thinks these years-long bloodsport battles over Baker, Files, Z-film alteration, Doorway man, etc., are just dividers and not uniters (which would be a typical big picture Hollywood view), then he was just looking to do some uniting in preparation for the doc. I knew when it happened that this would be a huge event in the community (for lack of a better word), one that causes both an overreaction of elation, while also driving some to a near-nervous breakdown. I just dont think Stone saw it that way. He may not understand the daily squabbles within this field, and for his sanity, that's probably a good thing. I still think he saw this as a good gesture, good PR, and no big deal. I think Jim is on the right side on a LOT of issues. He and I have some of the same enemies right now (some who have been banned from here). But, in his defense, I dont think he needs to be a part of this story. These were Oliver's decisions. Jim did nothing wrong here.

For the record, The JVB has asked multiple times to be on the show. She asks me why I don't want to ever ask her any questions and why her story hasn't been a part of the magazine. The truth is that, for personal reasons and beliefs, I can't do a support show with softballs. But I also detest feeling like I'm doing an intentional hit piece. I hate feeling like there are enemies within. Granted, I KNOW there are. But we have so much work to do to fight the mainstream media, the historical establishment, and the textbook conglomerates.... I hate always feeling like the internal is attacking itself as the external sits back, smiles, and smokes a cigar. Maybe this is the cowardly response. And if it is, I'm sorry.               

[Vince Palamara]

1 hour ago, S.T. Patrick said:

Its my understanding from those interviewed that the interviews for the doc were done a few months ago. The JVB isnt in the project. From what Ive been told, there was never plans to have her in. This seems like a non-issue, the possibility of her being involved. She isn't. I still contend that the appearance was good-natured PR to the other half of the community-at-large. In that hallway, there were at least 50 people watching closely, maybe 75. Stone knew he was being watched the entire time. And everyone was snapping pics. I'm sure there was an understanding that every movement was being recorded by someone - to be posted on Facebook later. Whether many here like it or not, that half of the community is a chunk of the core audience. If Stone believes her - and maybe he does, maybe he doesn't - this is an honest move. If he doesnt believe her but thinks these years-long bloodsport battles over Baker, Files, Z-film alteration, Doorway man, etc., are just dividers and not uniters (which would be a typical big picture Hollywood view), then he was just looking to do some uniting in preparation for the doc. I knew when it happened that this would be a huge event in the community (for lack of a better word), one that causes both an overreaction of elation, while also driving some to a near-nervous breakdown. I just dont think Stone saw it that way. He may not understand the daily squabbles within this field, and for his sanity, that's probably a good thing. I still think he saw this as a good gesture, good PR, and no big deal. I think Jim is on the right side on a LOT of issues. He and I have some of the same enemies right now (some who have been banned from here). But, in his defense, I dont think he needs to be a part of this story. These were Oliver's decisions. Jim did nothing wrong here.

For the record, The JVB has asked multiple times to be on the show. She asks me why I don't want to ever ask her any questions and why her story hasn't been a part of the magazine. The truth is that, for personal reasons and beliefs, I can't do a support show with softballs. But I also detest feeling like I'm doing an intentional hit piece. I hate feeling like there are enemies within. Granted, I KNOW there are. But we have so much work to do to fight the mainstream media, the historical establishment, and the textbook conglomerates.... I hate always feeling like the internal is attacking itself as the external sits back, smiles, and smokes a cigar. Maybe this is the cowardly response. And if it is, I'm sorry.               

Good  points, S.T.

I can confirm (from all I have heard): THE OLIVER STONE DOCUMENTARY IS DONE AND JVB--among others--IS NOT IN IT. Dr. Cyril Wecht spoke at both conferences, Robert Groden spoke at JVB's conference and Oliver Stone was very much aware of all the iPhones going crazy on him.

HISTORY LESSON: 22 years ago, I committed the "sin" of speaking at the JFK Lancer conference. You might say to yourself "Vince, what's the problem? No harm, no foul." If you think that, then you don't remember: Debra Conway was viewed as a CIA spy or worse at that time and there was a major rivalry between LANCER and COPA! 

MORAL TO THE STORY: United we stand, divided we fall. Every Trine Day author I spoke to [I am a Trine Day author, as well] view "JVB's" conferences as OUR conferences; TRINE DAY PUBLISHING conferences; JFK ASSASSINATION conferences...another venue to speak, etc. I have spoken at Lancer, COPA, and "Judyth's"/ Trine Day's conferences and this silliness has been going on for years ("Ewwwww- Vince, how could you speak at COPA?!??! John Judge is a spy!!"; "EWWWWWWWWWWW- How could you speak at LANCER?!?!? Debra is CIA!"; "eWWWWWWW- how could you speak at Judyth's conference? [fill in the blank]")

Both conferences had about 150 people and A DECENT AMOUNT of attendees----and even some speakers---were at both events...what's the problem?

It is 2019 going on 2020. It is time to let it go.

 

TRINE DAY PUBLISHER KRIS MILLEGAN and their table at the conference:

Edited December 1, 2019 by Vince Palamara

[Guest]

You are missing the point Vince.

DC cannot be compared to JVB nor can any of the organisations be compared. We are dealing with a whole different kettle of fish here.

The one of credibility you either hand it to her or not. That is what Stone did. Or anyone else who talks at her conference.

The people who are with CAPA, like Wecht ditto.

 

You know you stand in front of a vid camera and upload it will get the same amount of views like one day at a conference on the first day or two and then all these years after it will supersede it big time. There is no excuse to stand there at #JudyCon.

Edited December 2, 2019 by Bart Kamp

[Vince Palamara]

5 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:

You are missing the point Vince.

I get the point. The outside world of non-researchers doesn't know or frankly care about the in-fighting; it is counter-productive. When I speak at conferences, the only person I am representing is myself. Back in the day, I endured a lot of "how could you speak at Lancer" backlash (1997-2002ish). I think everyone realized how stupid that was because, nowadays, there is zero "stigma" to having spoken at Lancer. It's all silliness. 

EVERY conference I have ever been to, there are authors and speakers I do not endorse, to put it mildly. I am NOT a fan of the current president, yet I would never NOT attend a conference if someone was a fan...all this stuff is getting old.

Edited December 1, 2019 by Vince Palamara

[Vince Palamara]

15 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:

You are missing the point Vince.

DC cannot be compared to JVB nor can any of the organisations be compared. We are dealing with a whole different ettle of fish here.

The one of credibility you either hand it to her or not. That is what Stone did. Or anyone else who talks at her conference.

The people who are with CAPA, especially the ones in the 'council' and then speak at her show as well also make this mistake.

Bart, I respectfully disagree on one point: my God, back in the day, Debra was viewed worse than JVB!! I had swaths of people "disown" me for speaking at her conference. NOT saying it is true, but she was widely viewed as a spy or disinformation specialist. She came out of nowhere and was direct competition to COPA (sound familiar?!?!?!?).

Olive Stone is done with his documentary, Jim DiEugenio is not a fan of JVB, and JVB is not in his documentary...nothing to see here.

Dr. Wecht is universally adored and admired in the community--is he now pond scum for speaking at both conferences? Robert Groden was there, too...will people be throwing out their "JFK" movie DVDs now that Stone showed up to talk to JVB?

ANOTHER thing: who made CAPA gods? They don't speak for me. Like I said, I am my own person. One fellow TRINE DAY author said it best: "I was invited by Kris Millegan. I am here to give a talk on my research. That is all."

Edited December 1, 2019 by Vince Palamara

[Vince Palamara]

28 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:

You know you stand in front of a vid camera and upload it will get the same amount of views like one day at a conference on the first day or two and then all these years after it will supersede it big time. There is no excuse to stand there at #JudyCon.

The exact same sentiments were echoed by many about Lancer circa 1995-2002ish...just saying

 

[Vince Palamara]

I think we need to view this from another perspective.

COPA (now known as CAPA), Lancer, and JVB's conferences have all had--or still have---real or imagined stigmas attached to them. The hard cold reality is this: there are billions of people on this planet and only two conferences (with about 150 people each, if you are generous to NOT include folks who attended BOTH conferences) for JFK assassination authors/ researchers.

MSM has ignored us and, frankly, has won: opinion polls are down to 61 percent in favor of a conspiracy (and that was the 50th anniversary: are they even lower now, especially since the 9/11 and Sandy Hook crackpots have made the word conspiracy a dirty term to use?)

I wasn't invited to COPA/CAPA this time...I was invited by my publisher to speak at the conference I attended. I don't espouse or endorse anyone (ok, that is a lie haha: I am a huge fan of Jim DiEugenio, Flip de Mey, and Barry Ernest)...but you get my point.

I am a Trine Day author. Numerous Trine Day authors were there speaking, as well. JVB is a very nice lady and I am grateful for the opportunity to have spoken (my presentation was recorded for DVD, was very well received, was streamed live and, what's more, Japanese television were there to make a documentary!).

I hate the current president, yet I was surrounded by many who adore him...some people endorse Fetzer, Roger Stone, JVB, David Lifton, Robert Groden, Sylvia Meagher, Harold Weisberg, etc. etc. etc. TO EACH HIS OWN---none are central or mean anything to MY research on the Secret Service. I am not writing about Oswald in New Orleans;  not my thing at all. I am writing about Behn, Rowley, Boring, etc. etc. etc.

I think we must, at this very (very) late day, respect diversity and look at the big picture. 

Note: I spoke at COPA 1995, COPA 1996, Lancer 1997, was invited to both LANCER AND COPA in 2013 but had to respectfully turn them down due to schedule, and I spoke at JVB's conferences in both 2016 and 2019.

 

Edited December 1, 2019 by Vince Palamara

[Vince Palamara]

POSTSCRIPT: author Walt Brown, not a fan of JVB (he wrote an anti-JVB book), is ALSO a Trine Day author and is even in another Trine Day book!

• 
•  

• Paperback: 296 pages
• Publisher: TrineDay (July 1, 2015)
• Language: English
• ISBN-10: 1634240316
• ISBN-13: 978-1634240314

-----------------

• Paperback: 384 pages
• Publisher: Trine Day (April 15, 2020)
• Language: English
• ISBN-10: 1634242807
• ISBN-13: 978-1634242806

 

[Andrej Stancak]

The JFK conferences are useful and I would love to attend any of the two conferences. I would have some hard time talking to Mrs Baker but I would surely manage because one always can view the other person as  a human in the first place. If she asked me if I read her book I would answer I did. If she asked me if I believe her story, I would say that an essesntial part of her story could not be achieved.

However, there are risks in taking part in a conference, co-organised by Mrs Baker, as a presenter. Here is a screenshot of Mrs Baker post on her Facebook dated November 12. It is a very clever post. It connects the possibility of being killed by being injected with cancer cells with the name of Dr Wecht which, if people are not attentive enough, makes an impression that Dr Wecht would be speaking about Ruby's death in context of being killed by live cancer cells and that was the main premise in Mrs Baker's bioweapon story. I am sure Dr Wecht did not seriously consider such a possibility, however, not being at the conference, I am left only with a combined effect of: Ruby believed he was killed by cancer cells+Dr Wecht will speak about Jack Ruby's death + Dr Wecht is a remarkable authority in the area of forensic pathology + Mrs Baker and Dr Wecht are friends + Lee and Judyth were working on the bioweapon based on injecting Castro with live cancer cells. 

Thus, there is a risk of presenting at TrineDay conference owing to the presenter's name being used for a purpose of supporting one of the organiser's false story. 

 

 

Edited December 2, 2019 by Andrej Stancak

[Pat Speer]

Dr. Wecht did the same presentation at the CAPA conference. As i recall he said Jack Ruby could not have been killed via a cancer cell injection.

 

As far as the Judyth conference...I suspect few would have a problem with the conference if Judyth was just one of a number of presenters. But, to my understanding, this isn't true. It's HER conference, with everyone else treated as her supporting cast. That's the way it was presented to the community the first few years, anyhow. If things have changed, Vince, let us know. 

[Cory Santos]

So why do so many seem to dislike her as a person?  I understand many people do not believe her but the comments here seem to show more dislike ranging to anger with her. Why?  Also I somehow came across a post where Rich Pope had a connection to her being the secret phone line between her and LHO.  He verified her story.  Has she ever discussed him or his info?  Maybe she had DVPs secret number.  Maybe it does not matter but feel free to comment.  

Edited December 2, 2019 by Cory Santos

[Pat Speer]

11 minutes ago, Cory Santos said:

So why do so many seem to dislike her as a person?  I understand many people do not believe her but the comments here seem to show more dislike ranging to anger with her. Why?  Also I somehow came across a post where Rich Pope had a connection to her being the secret phone line between her and LHO.  He verified her story.  Has she ever discussed him or his info?  Maybe she had DVPs secret number.  Maybe it does not matter but feel free to comment.  

A number of people feel that Judyth has been playing a game for her own purposes...that jeopardizes their own efforts at getting the research community taken seriously. 

 

[Andrej Stancak]

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

Dr. Wecht did the same presentation at the CAPA conference. As i recall he said Jack Ruby could not have been killed via a cancer cell injection.

Thanks, Pat, for confirming Dr Wecht's opinion on the possibility of Ruby (or anyone else) being be killed by being injected cancer cells. This eliminates one whole  part in Mrs Baker's story, including the devilish testing of cancer cells' killing ability on two Angola prisoners, the purpose of Lee Oswald's visit to Mexico City (to hand over the thermos with cancer cells to a medical student), spending time with Lee in Ferrie's kitchen and many other components. 

Edited December 2, 2019 by Andrej Stancak

[Guest]

Vince,

again I think you are missing the point that, I think, was clearly conveyed here by me. As to your replies.

What you described between Conway's show and COPA/CAPA is nowhere near as to what is happening now. There is a massive difference as to someone (DC) who is being called a CIA plant or spook which by all means is just malicious drivel, against someone (JVB) whose honesty is being seriously questioned with proof by Greg Parker, Walt Brown, Jim DiEugenio and a few others and holds a conference and tries to have as many 'researchers' align with her as possible. I have to say she is good at this particular part. She has people on her FB who follow her that would make any fascist jealous and now also has various researchers joining her puppet show. You seem to have joined those researchers.  Would you speeak at a conference run by Ralph Cinque or Brian Doyle for that matter?

An invite by Kris Milligan is not an excuse either. It is JudyCon.....not TrineDayCon. 

You could easily decline. So could Wecht. The fact that he decided to speak there as well meant he gave more cred to them as well. He did not have to speak there but he did for whatever reason(s). Probably did not consider the consequences of his actions or simply did not give a h00t. CAPA was already accused of giving too much credit to JudyCon in 2018. They did not listen and let this happen again.

Same with Stone. Two visits and a 3 hour private meeting etc.

I probably will never understand this circus and its methods. Nor will I ever want to be part of this clique, nor will you ever see me speaking at either event. 

Thanks to Stan Dane for the meme below.

Edited December 3, 2019 by Bart Kamp

[Stu Wexler]

To compare completely baseless arguments against Debra Conway to documented and fundamental flaws with Judyth Baker borders on intellectual dishonesty. There are people who say all sorts of nuts things in this case.  No one should be legitimizing what Judyth represents-- no one.