Oliver Stone and Judyth Baker

[Ron Bulman]

14 hours ago, Bart Kamp said:

Geez Ron, let me join in the speculating.

Stone is not convinced as she explains how long it was.

Thank you for a true belly laugh regarding cousin It.  I like to think most of the speculation on my part is at least factually based but understand I lack the knowledge of many.  It's partially based on your work which I appreciate greatly, but can't fully appreciate simply for a lack of time to read it all.  I still maintain hope Stone won't be distracted from pursuit of the Truth in the documentary.  His Movie is in essence how/why we got to Here.  I think all I can do is hope for progress, based on the past, myself.  Best Regards, Ron.

[Douglas Caddy]

Pete Hymans who took this photo reported on Facebook:

Oliver Stone discusses events in/around New Orleans in 1963 with Judyth Vary Baker and Edward Haslam at the Double Tree by Hilton, Market Center, Dallas, TX.

[Douglas Caddy]

Peter Hyman posted this on Facebook today:

RA Kris Millegan (Trine Day Publisher) looks on (left) as Oliver Stone bids Judyth Baker farewell after two long meetings at the Double Tree at Market Center Hotel, during the JFK Assassination Conference. The content of the conversation was not released but the photo demonstrates that Stone has respect and amity with Ms. Baker. What does the future hold for us in Stone's next production?

 

[David Andrews]

Hopefully some shampoo and a stylist.

[Ron Bulman]

On 11/25/2019 at 7:42 AM, Bart Kamp said:

Hand in hand?

 

Maybe an appropriate t shirt for her?

[Ron Bulman]

On 11/27/2019 at 12:21 PM, David Josephs said:

https://kennedysandking.com/images/pdf/JudythBaker-DJ.pdf

With JVB in the room, her friend ANNA LEWIS states not once, but after the camera is off and on again.. twice that she and JVB and husband and Lee went
out together between Jan - April 1962 when Oswald was in Russia.

At 1:45 of this video she states: "In February 1962 I met Lee Harvey Oswald in the park..."  the park by 544 Camp and again 19:05...
"First time I seen LHO was in 1962, after Jan and before April"

When they leave New Orleans and then return she sees LHO at the restaurant she worked in... he would not acknowledge her at all... 3:50

Problem is that even if she meant 1963, in February, March and April of 1963 Oswald was in Texas. He does not get to New Orleans until the end of April 1963.

 

By Jove David that last sentence makes the previous part a bit perplexing.  I hope Mr. Sone is aware of this.

[Ron Bulman]

On 11/27/2019 at 12:42 PM, James DiEugenio said:

Debra Conway says this was even worse than that.

I think this was when that goof Platzman was promoting her.  Debra said it  was pretty clear that it was scripted, and every once in awhile Anna lost her lines.

The whole thing is that Baker had nothing to corroborate her story at first.  But her so-called Team at that time, I think it was Shackleford and Platzman and one other person, went out and tried to find something--anything. So this embarrassment was one of the results.

If I recall, this was before Haslam changed his mind about her.  Carol Hewett was surprised that he did that.  Carol, a good lawyer, worked on her case for Sixth Minutes. She recommended against it.  But then somehow, some way, Haslam changed his mind on her.

If Ms. Conway thought it was clear Judy was scripted, I wonder by Who?

I wonder if Who might have helped her with her book?  No prior experience as a novelist.

https://seuss.fandom.com/wiki/Euchariah_Who

[Ron Bulman]

1 hour ago, David Andrews said:

Hopefully some shampoo and a stylist.

Ugh.  Why didn't he just kiss her on the cheek?

I think Larry's earlier link needs re posting.  Read the full Amazon review.  Ozzie withstood KGB torture, he was needed to help fly Ferrie's plane, the SS sought him out to help ward off possible ambush sites in Dallas.  No where in many years of reading have I seen these claims anywhere else much less any substantiation for them.  Read the buyers reviews.  Between these and posts on here, this is why I've never wasted my time or money on her and the Mockingbird's book.

https://www.amazon.com/Judyth-Vary-Baker-Edited-Commentary-ebook/dp/B07RH9FXBG/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=In+her+own+words+Walt+Brown&qid=1574885601&s=books&sr=1-1

[Larry Hancock]

Pamela may provide more detail but there is also the point that Judyth's story is quite iterative, as I recall she is actually in her third version of her book and ended up disavowing the earlier versions when issues and inconsistencies were identified.  No doubt Walt's book goes into that - its just important to know that she had been very adept at collecting information from other parties and weaving it into or reworking it as her on.  I honestly gave up on even trying to follow the whole thing.

[Ron Bulman]

9 minutes ago, Larry Hancock said:

Pamela may provide more detail but there is also the point that Judyth's story is quite iterative, as I recall she is actually in her third version of her book and ended up disavowing the earlier versions when issues and inconsistencies were identified.  No doubt Walt's book goes into that - its just important to know that she had been very adept at collecting information from other parties and weaving it into or reworking it as her on.  I honestly gave up on even trying to follow the whole thing.

I think she has help on the weaving part.

[Andrej Stancak]

It is very likely that Oliver Stone will listen to what the expert advisers with detailed knowledge of Mrs Baker's story would certainly tell him before making a decision to incorporate Me&Lee into his new film. It would be unusually damaging to the whole JFK research community if Mr Baker's story would appear in Mr Stone's new film as  something explaining all major aspect of JFK assassination.   

[Cory Santos]

Does anyone have a connection to Marina?  It would be nice if she would address this.

[Kirk Gallaway]

19 hours ago, Douglas Caddy said:

Peter Hyman posted this on Facebook today:

RA Kris Millegan (Trine Day Publisher) looks on (left) as Oliver Stone bids Judyth Baker farewell after two long meetings at the Double Tree at Market Center Hotel, during the JFK Assassination Conference. The content of the conversation was not released but the photo demonstrates that Stone has respect and amity with Ms. Baker. What does the future hold for us in Stone's next production?

 

Lights! Camera!----------Wow! it's as if JVB has been anointed by God Himself!  Ollie is at last comforting JVB for her long painful years keeping her secret! And  the torment of years of the poo pooing her story from jokers like us!

All along this thread there's been  a denial that this could be. But for Ollie to completely renounce her now after publicly making a show of this would reveal Stone to be somewhat duplicitous, and from what I've seen, he's not that kind of person.

All you have to do is look at his public statements of the last few years.His inability to see the current paradigm  ,living in a bubble and  being more concerned about a deep state than the everyday reality of the Trump Presidency,  His  embracing of the theory that the Secret service was behind the JFKA. His son is even more conspiracy  prone, didn't discriminate  and appeared  many times with Alex Jones. Some here think Alex Jones was a necessary evil one time to get the assassination conspiracy message out, but how has that worked out now?

Because he  made a movie that was largely on target as to the general direction of  the JFKA conspiracy, doesn't mean he should always be seen as a perpetual JFK conspiracy expert. What is difficult for people to understand is that people who seem uncannily on  target in certain prognostications, whether it's financial markets, political outcomes or down to even  some sporting events are usually not successful using the same theories for an extended period of time.  They foresaw the paradigm at a given point in time. But they often keep employing that paradigm well after the paradigm shifts.

All this doesn't matter, as long as Stone chooses to not include his Trump Deep State theories and Judith Baker in his newest endeavor.  Even though Jim subscribes to Stone's and Trump's Deep State theories, we know  he doesn't subscribe to Baker. The inclusion of either of these is a disaster. I tend to think Jim knows that and having seen many of Stones more recent political documentaries and interviews, I'm trusting right now, that Stone will stay focused on the immediate topic and not stray, and maybe Jim can dissuade him from any temptation to include JVB's story.

 

[David Andrews]

On 11/28/2019 at 3:11 PM, David Andrews said:

BTW: When you dump JVB you dump Haslam too. They are in the same boat. 

Karl - That's fine with me.

Haslam has had years to research and establish the identity and find the photograph of the Tulane visiting professor who inveigled her way into his life under the name "Judyth Vary Baker," and he has not.

I've worked at universities and attended a few, and I know very well that schools go out of their way to photograph their visiting faculty and use their CVs as publicity to attract students and funding, and even future faculty job candidates.  It's not stretching the truth to say that publicity is what visiting faculty are all about, including their role in working with other faculty . 

Even if this femme fatale of Haslam's largely escaped the ritual because she was some deep cover job trolling for impressionable students, there has to be some institutional record of her to trace at Tulane.  Nobody's doing that, including Haslam.

Any takers for this research task in the NOLA area?

Again, let's not ignore Ed Haslam's claims to have been beckoned into God-knows-what by a visiting professor at Tulane calling herself "Judyth Vary Baker."  Is there any lead on this woman to be found in the Tulane University Archives?  Nobody's fact-checking.

Edited December 1, 2019 by David Andrews

[Douglas Caddy]

     So how will Oliver Stone’s revisitation to the JFK assassination through a television series turn out?

 

      It is hard to say because every aspect connected to it seems to be in flux at the present time in the wake of Stone’s recent appearances at the two JFK assassination conferences in Dallas.

 

      Stone has chosen our distinguished resident scholar, Jim DiEugenio, to write the script.  There is an art to writing such a script and I would suggest that Jim talk to Joseph McBride who last week on Facebook wrote about his frustrating experiences that arose after he finished writing scripts and turned them in.  Has there ever been a film or TV script that was not subject to re-write by others, sometimes strangers, whether the re-writes be minor or major?

 

     Then there is the matter of Judyth Baker. Stone seems to be enamored with Judyth’s story with Oswald, which Jim refuses to embrace as being credible. Why is Stone so taken on this? Could it be that what Judyth told him about what Oswald in turn  told her in 1963 in New Orleans dovetails with documents from the Russian archives on Oswald compiled before, during and after his living in the Soviet Union if such documents are already in Stone’s possession?  Maybe Judyth told Stone new information about Oswald’s time in Russia, whether he was actually an American spy or a genuine defector who later decided he wanted to return home. In any event Judyth’s love story, whether or not embellished by Russian Intelligence, presents a new angle to the Kennedy assassination that viewers of the series will find intriguing.  A majority of these viewers were born after 1963 and have only slight knowledge of the assassination and so the series will shape their view of history.

 

      Another potential controversy is Stone himself who may be viewed by the U.S. Intelligence Community as being a Russian asset because of his close relationship and that of his son, Sean, with Putin through RT, Russia Today. Stone is akin to Oswald in this regard because the motivations of both regarding Russia are not clear. Then again Stone may instead be an American asset who was recruited by our intelligence community to cultivate Putin. Or he may be what he appears to be, a brilliant and patriotic screen director in search of the truth.

 

      The rubber will meet the road so to speak if Putin provides Stone with real or fake information on Kennedy’s assassination from Russia’s archives and in doing so indicates that he expects Stone to incorporate this into the series’ script. Such an event would present Jim as the principal script writer with a dilemma although in this forum Jim has consistently espoused the Republican/Russian view on President Trump, which may be one of the reasons Stone chose him to write the script. Putin may view the impending series on the Kennedy assassination as am extremely useful tool to confuse and divide Americans even more than they are today as a result of past Russian Intelligence operations. Putin has publicly hinted that he knows who killed Kennedy. What will be the effect if he injects such alleged knowledge, true or fake, into Stone's proposed series?

 

     Recent research by John Newman and Bill Simpich point to the U.S. Army playing the decisive role in JFK’s assassination with members of U.S. Army Reserve being officers in the Dallas Police Department’s Intelligence Division while at the same time being members of the KKK and the John Birch Society.

 

      If that is the enhanced conclusion of Stone’s revisitation to the Kennedy assassination, it would indeed result in fracturing American society with our armed forces today being blamed for something that happened 56 years ago. Once our military is severely diminished or virtually destroyed, our enemies abroad would join to finish us off, ending the American experiment of 243 years in democracy and liberty.

 

     Russia for a century has had as a goal the destruction of the United States. The Bolsheviks drafted a plan soon after the Russian revolution to do this.  Another example is its spy network that during World War II worked successfully to steal the secrets to our development of the Atomic bomb. Russia influenced the outcome of the 2016 presidential election and is working on doing so in 2020.

 

     So how will Oliver Stone’s revisitation to the JFK assassination through a television series turn out?

Edited December 2, 2019 by Douglas Caddy