The Beckley Bunch

[Steve Roe]

On 2/5/2020 at 4:03 PM, Bart Kamp said:

Better yet, I am throwing you on ignore. Life's too short to waste it on clowns like you and Doyle.

Great!  and here's some evidence for you to take back to the ROKC Clubhouse, that all you guys ignored.

Go ahead, tell us it's fake. 

 

 

 

Edited May 10, 2021 by Steve Roe
Freeing up space

[Steve Roe]

Folks this has been an heated exchange between myself and ROKC members Bart Kamp and Ed LeDoux. We have fundamental differences. So in all fairness, I ask the following, who (other than ROKC members) believe yes,  Ed LeDoux has made a substantial or rock solid case that Oswald never lived at 1026 North Beckley. There will be no comment from me on your belief. Rather just a show of hands supporting this theory. Thanks. 

[Ed LeDoux]

Steve, How could anyone who destroyed crucial evidence far more valuable than a scrap of paper they sold for a pittance, be described as "money-grubbing"? No, I'd call that plain stupid. Not to mention, criminal!

How could anyone trying to sell a house for 10 times it's value based on false information be described as "money-grubbing"?

That should be a no-brainer.

Pat Hall may well recall a Mr Lee - because there was indeed a Mr Lee who lived there. A young slim white male who had arrived from Louisiana in late September or early October.   His first name was Herbert.



The endless parlor games are self evident at Beckley 

Ghost of Conspiracies Past wrote:

 

Robert, you have been sorely missed...!

Ah yes, he has.

He just needs to step into the real world where real people were and are constantly framed in real ways.

 

So many things once held as established facts have been demolished.

Oswald living at the North Beckley house.

Lunchroom Encounter

Cab and Bus rides

Odio encounter.

 

A Common element runs through them. 

Steve \"No GO" Roe feeling right at home wrote:

 

Boy that holster is oure bothering you guys. Maybe you should take that up with the DPD or FBI and quit pestering me and everyone else. I’m sure the FBI has a cough cough high success rate lifting print off rough leather, right? And those 1/4” snap or rivet beveled  buttons will yield a usable print, right?

Pestering YOU?? LOL.

Roe is funny. You are the one who joined the forum in order to teach those ROKC varmints a lesson, dagnabit!.... by... LOL NOT answering 99% of the evidence presented, cherry-picking the other 1% and generally throwing mud and misdirection. 

Let's see what a former cop says about it...

 -----------------------------
R. Justin Freeman, Former Patrol Officer

Answered Sep 8, 2011 · Upvoted by Justin Liu, Attorney and George Kellerman, Former corporate counsel at Yahoo, attorney at Venture Law Group

Originally Answered: What can fingerprints be lifted and not lifted from?
Print lifting capability isn't binary regarding various surface types - there is somewhat of a spectrum of suitability for lifting fingerprints. Knowing my answers tend to wax prosaic, here's the TLDR as a public service:

•  
• Easy: Glass, glossy tile, porcelain, lacquered furniture, smooth metal.
• Involved: Paper, painted surfaces, drywall, cardboard, leather, most dashboards.
• Difficult: Organic surfaces (tree leaves, fruit peels, feathers).
• Formidable: Fabrics, human skin, and rough or textured surfaces (checkered handgun grips come to mind).
• Virtually Impossible: Oily, rusty, or extremely dirty surfaces; high traffic surfaces with multiple overlapping prints; prints smeared by movement.

----------------------------
So "leather" is no more difficult than paper... and we know the FBI fingerprinted lots of paper and cardboard.

But you said "rough" leather. So that "may" shift it from "involved" to "formidable". Cant be more formidable than feathers I guess....and Roe distorts how a snap works to claim its not possible to get a print from them.

Psst...Steve you dust the snaps smooth "cap"not the snaps post....

Yes the overwhelmed FBI just wouldn't bother with a formidable task. After all, this was just the biggest case they'd had. DPD likewise was too busy dusting boxes Oswald would naturally have touched.

But I wonder on what basis you claim the leather was "rough"?

This is the holster.


Even enlarged and fuzzy it doesn't look "rough"... because its smooth leather.

-----------------------

I just need to know now Stephen, how Lee made it invisible to the ladies of the house and all the other nosy people who might want to wander into that "unlocked"* room.

(Im just calling it unlocked because no key was found on Oswald for that room, which did lock and the landlady had spare keys with which she let the cops into "the tiny room")

Roe cant actually back up his life long belief that Oswald lived in XYZ apt. because that's exactly where the cops wanted him, andvthe Warren Commission said so.... even though a cursory read of the reports and investigations discount wholly the idea it was Oswald.

It was Herbert Leon Lee or Floyd de Graffenreid 
 

But what really bothers you and ROKC is the backyard photos with Oswald wearing a holster. Isn’t that the end-game for this fantasy theory?

There is only one goal. The clue to that is in the title of Reopenkennedycase.
 

Bart, listen you guys at ROKC are not going to fool long time researchers on both sides of the argument.

Would that be the long-time researchers who believe in Two Oswalds and Two Marguerites?

The long-time researchers who believe he was killed to keep the UFO secret from leaking out?

Or maybe the long time researchers who don't actually do any research because they believe the Warren Commission? Those researchers? 

Do I look worried? 
 

Maybe you can hoodwink some Newbies, that could be your audience that will praise you guys. As exhibited here, nobody believes this theory.

I'd be worried if any of those folk did buy into it judging from the daily seeping from its nodes.

 

It’s DOA.

 

As proven by you with your non-sequiturs, cherry picking and one-liners?

Sure, if that was the best he come up with.

I think not Steve. I think you are verbalizing your mental magic-thinking. 
 

Now you guys go back and hunt for keys, ashtrays, yourselves. And one more thought, you darn well know this was discussed before. Does June 8th ring a bell? I presented that Oswald notebook entry to you, LeDoux and Parker. Parker even commented he never saw it before and in the span of 5-10 minutes became a handwriting expert and denounced it as “fakery”. Of course this never shows up in Ed LeDoux’s essay......I wonder why?

I did cover it. Your answer is posted.

Oh and please and obtain a direct quote about what I said about it being "fakery"

Those BYPs are undeniable fakery... thanks to the Powerline Shadow Study done by ROKC among many accomplishments.

A scientific paper establishing this is underway. 

Now you have an even bigger problem Steve Roe!
How does that holster found at Beckley reconcile worn by Lee in the BYP'S 

Where's the belt that was threaded through that holster at Beckley so it could hang on the door knob? The one Alexander saw? The one that's not in the inventory for Beckley...

So Roe,

No fingerprints from a smooth metal snap buttons of the holster... or leather as it was just too hard to even try. Roe calls smooth leather rough. He needs to stretch his own credibility thin here.

And if Roe is saying the cops knew this to be 100% true then why no other means of documenting this evidence and tie it to Oswald.
Photos of it in the room, etc...

No belt to hang the holster is included.

The Warren Commission denounced their own evidence, the slip of paper, as fake.
Roe just cant accept the proof shown him.

Roe has no answer for why Oswald had numbers and did not call even when it was necessary.
Instead we are told by Ruth a story about the numbers and her calling and of course there was no Lee Oswald there, we are told. 

Roe has no key to a room for which he claims Oswald rented but can not show a single receipt or any physical evidence Oswald was the roomer or even a roomer.

My evidence trumps your flimsy phone numbers.
Direct witness statements contradict the idea the persons thought to be Oswald. Those persons were in fact other roomers. 
Phone calls investigated by the FBI support this fact.
There were no roomer witnesses of Oswald. 
Proven.

The management has been caught in various conflicting statements.
Their credibility is now shot. 
The new management has too blown their own credibility based on their own statements.

So Steve has a mile to go and is mad he didnt check the map.
You are here [1964]

June 8th and Ruth's calendar canards.
Roe falls for everything but whats rubbed in his nose. 

Roe asks why everything is not in the essay, first because that doesnt prove anything. Second as stated there is a limit to how long I was wiling to beat a dead horse once I shot it 3 blocks from Beckley getting out of a cab.... 

 

Why is FR 5 5591 in the book?
What relatives did the numbers owner have, Cody's... crikeys!!

So a bus driver on the Shreveport run and Roe wants to know about numbers in a book?
What answer did he give for why his number is in the book twice?

What does refute Roe is the 50 pages of evidence, including another 9 of photos, documents, and I tell the listener its not for me to find everything.

Guess Roe has a listening deficit... check the tape.

 So Roe has two trival concerns that were "addressed", no pun intended. 
Roe refutes it all by a page in a book?
No no Roe.
That is not sufficient for even a weak analysis to conclude as you have. 
He has almost reached circumstantial level.
Hint for Roe, better find something solid soon as your audience is turning on you.

 

We are close to seeing how silly Roe is willing to look for the sake of trying to find a "gotcha" - which he idiotically hopes readers will buy as some implosion of 50 pages of evidence.

Steve \"No Go" Roe feeling right at home wrote:

 

I have that as well. Now as you can see they are mad as hell in damage control mode trying to dig themselves out of yet another boneheaded blunder.

Damage control over what? You are trying to spin that entry in Oswald's book and any opinion that it was not in Oswald's handwriting as some monumental turning point in this debate. You are delusional, desperate, or both. 

Firstly, let me address your claim that Greg became an "instant" expert in handwriting analysis -- a call you made without knowing if it had any validity or not. Because that is how you roll.

Greg Parker worked for the Department of Social Security. One of the positions he held in that department was the investigation of things like maladministration and fraud by members of the public or staff. As part of the training for that job, he did learn basics on what to look for in fraudulent signatures. He is not an "expert", but HE does have experience. What's your excuse?

The thing about experts is that, like me, the best they can do is offer an OPINION. For every qualified expert that you can find to say the writing is Oswald's, I'll find one that says it isn't. Happens every day in court. Even the WC and HSCA experts sometimes offered differing opinions on the same writing samples. The counselors were warned to get the guest register and that the slip is inadequate.

So where in all of that, is your "gotcha"? There isn't one. Your bluff and bluster is merely trying to make people believe that the pimple is really Mt Everest.

Sorry even your pimple has popped Steve, but you probably hear that a lot.

Let's assume my opinion is wrong and it is Oswald's writing. Does it prove he lived there? Not at all.



Dallas Rooming House
Mrs Bledsoe
WH 219857 / WH 38993

---------------------
You would hardly call Bledsoe's home a "rooming house". It was a normal 4 bedroom house and she occasionally rented spare rooms out - mainly to friends of her son judging from FBI reports... and her son Poter was there thus only two bedrooms could be rented... and no one else seemed to be there while Oswald stayed a week.

Did she even advertise? Apart from the sign she says she had in her window, I mean? Did she give out her number, or was it in the phone book.

Pray tell dont google it and ROKC or Ed Ledoux as you wont like what you'll find.

In any case, of the two places, only the N Beckley building could rightly be described as a "rooming house". 

As I believe I've pointed out already, the lack of a name to go with the second phone number does not bode well for Steve Roe.

Why write Bledsoe's name down and not Johnson's? Especially when there are three people to remember, Earlene Roberts, Gladys Johnson and Mr AC Johnson. No names in six weeks... 

Or

Merely a number like FR 5-5591, right Steve?

 The simple explanation is that he never had a name. He got the number from a directory as listed under "rooming houses", or was given the number by someone, like Ruth, but did not take a room there...

8 bucks for that closet? 

Yep frugal money saving Oswald is blowing the Warren Commission budget they mocked up for him.

Eating out and an extra dollar a week for a more comfortable room doesn't sound frugal or conservative 

As for Pat Hall... I have called out her errors directly to her on the Lone Gunman podcast.

She is quite aware of me and my requests, Its her game to play as she sees fit. I though am not under any obligation to support the fable any longer. 

Besides. What's your point?

If she remembers a Mr Lee it is because there was a Mr Lee.

She refuses to acknowledge Herbert and continues to claim that Mr Lee was Oswald because it is in her financial interests to do so.

So far your rebuttals have been...

-the weakest "gotcha" in history
-calling a smooth leather holster a rough leather holster
-claiming the FBI would not have bothered attempting to fingerprint said holster because it was "too difficult"
-name-calling (which can be fun, but should never be attempted by a rank amateur, especially if that is all he has in his debating bag)
-a lot of hot air, bluster and misdirection

--------------
I have to assume that the bulk of the points made are ones you cannot answer.

And not even with a patented "non-answer" that you supplied for everything else.  

How about you try to least address this, since it is YOUR evidence




Notice that it lists "living room and television" privileges... but not kitchen and refrigerator privileges?

No Board, no food, no refrigerator mentioned.

It would have to have been a massive industrial sized fridge to accommodate food for 12 or more guests on top of owners and staff.

But note that "cafes" are listed.

Why would that be Steve? 

A gentle way of saying that's where you have to eat? A fact confirmed by Hugh Slough.

Yet of all the guests, the only one who refused to speak to anyone and spoke on the phone in a European language, for reasons never explained, the ONLY one given fridge privileges? Odd or a story so far off it goes over Roe's head like a home run.

Must be true. None of those cafe employees recalled Oswald.

Suck it up buttercup. You have nothing.

 

So Roe did we get your answer yet as to why Oswald did not call ahead...

Especially  given he had the numbers according to Roe and yet no call to Beckley 3 weeks prior to Oct 14th, then again no call to Beckley on Oct 14th either.
Roe wants us to believe simply having numbers equates to residency.

Psst...
Receipts do that.
Guest books do that.
Unaltered sign in sheets do that.
Witnesses, and other corroborating evidence does that.
Writing down a phone number and never calling it, no name to go with it... useless even as circumstantial evidence.
Roe is inept or just champions a concerted campaign of ignorance of real world events.

Keys to locked rooms...

Receipts for rent paid...

Witnesses.

Oswald sure could have saved himself a trip all the way to Beckley to find out what he could have called about.... twice. I dont think so Roe. 
That's a no go.

Cheers, Ed

Edited February 6, 2020 by Ed LeDoux

[Steve Thomas]

On 1/18/2020 at 4:55 AM, Steve Thomas said:

On January 29, 1964 George Bouhe is interviewed by SA Joe Abernathy.

Oswald 201 File, Vol 25 Part 2 of 2 page 28

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=111186&search=YMCA#relPageId=28&tab=page

“Bouhe, in thinking back, recalled that at some time or other, possibly after Oswald left the YMCA, Oswald may have mentioned that he had obtained a room possibly on Madison Street from someone named Carlton. Bouhe checked the current Dallas Telephone Directory and noted that the Madison-Carlton Hotel was listed at 1159 North Madison, Dallas, Texas. Bouhe could furnish no further information concerning the period of Oswald's residence from October 19, 1962 to November 2, 1962.”

WC testimony of George Bouhe March 23, 1964

http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/bouhe.htm

Mr. LIEBELER - Do you know where he moved when he checked out of the YMCA?
Mr. BOUHE - At some point thereabouts he threw at me when I asked, "Where do you live now?" He gave me, if I recall correctly, a name of the Carlton boarding house on Madison Avenue, but it proved to be wrong.
Mr. LIEBELER - Did you tell the FBI that he told you he lived at the Carlton boarding house?
Mr. BOUHE - Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER - The FBI checked it out and told you subsequently that he had not lived there?
Mr. BOUHE - That's correct. The FBI men went there, and it developed that Oswald told me a lie to send me on a wild goose chase, but the name strikes me somehow; and FBI rechecked this place and said it was a bum steer.
Mr. LIEBELER - As far as you know, the next place that Oswald lived after he moved out of the YMCA was in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas?
Mr. BOUHE - Madison is around the corner from somewhere he ultimately lived.

Lee Harvey Oswald went to work at Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall on October 12^{, 1962.} On October 15^th, 1962, Oswald would move from a home in Fort Worth, Texas to room 415 at the YMCA in downtown Dallas where he would live from the 15^th to the 19^th of October. He vacated the YMCA and aside from his employment at Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall, he was incommunicado from the 19^th of October, until the 3^rd of November, 1962. Through the Warren Commission testimonies of the Taylors and the de Mohrenschildts, indications are that he was living in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas. On November 3, 1962, Oswald moved his wife and child from a home in Fort Worth into Apartment# 2 at 604 Elsbeth St.

 

He would repeat this process in 1963. On October 3, 1963 Oswald supposedly returned from Mexico and checked into room 601 of the YMCA. He would move from the YMCA to a rooming house at 1026 N. Beckley on October 15^th.

Question: How does Lee Oswald know Oak Cliff so well? How would he know about the rooming house on Carlton that he gave to George Bouhe?

 

Steve Thomas

Now I think I know. It was just something he pulled out of the paper.

 

 

Steve Thomas

[Ed LeDoux]

Nicely done Steve Thomas!

Yes wasn't there a N. Madison resident or two working at the TSBD?


Here is the list of dates Oswald was confirmed at Irving 17 days in 6 weeks, (Roe has trouble with possibility Oswald spent more time there )  

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by Ed LeDoux

[Steve Roe]

On 2/5/2020 at 10:57 PM, Ed LeDoux said:

Steve, How could anyone who destroyed crucial evidence far more valuable than a scrap of paper they sold for a pittance, be described as "money-grubbing"? No, I'd call that plain stupid. Not to mention, criminal!

How could anyone trying to sell a house for 10 times it's value based on false information be described as "money-grubbing"?

That should be a no-brainer.

Pat Hall may well recall a Mr Lee - because there was indeed a Mr Lee who lived there. A young slim white male who had arrived from Louisiana in late September or early October.   His first name was Herbert.



The endless parlor games are self evident at Beckley 

Ghost of Conspiracies Past wrote:

 

Robert, you have been sorely missed...!

Ah yes, he has.

He just needs to step into the real world where real people were and are constantly framed in real ways.

 

So many things once held as established facts have been demolished.

Oswald living at the North Beckley house.

Lunchroom Encounter

Cab and Bus rides

Odio encounter.

 

A Common element runs through them. 

Steve \"No GO" Roe feeling right at home wrote:

 

Boy that holster is oure bothering you guys. Maybe you should take that up with the DPD or FBI and quit pestering me and everyone else. I’m sure the FBI has a cough cough high success rate lifting print off rough leather, right? And those 1/4” snap or rivet beveled  buttons will yield a usable print, right?

Pestering YOU?? LOL.

Roe is funny. You are the one who joined the forum in order to teach those ROKC varmints a lesson, dagnabit!.... by... LOL NOT answering 99% of the evidence presented, cherry-picking the other 1% and generally throwing mud and misdirection. 

Let's see what a former cop says about it...

 -----------------------------
R. Justin Freeman, Former Patrol Officer

Answered Sep 8, 2011 · Upvoted by Justin Liu, Attorney and George Kellerman, Former corporate counsel at Yahoo, attorney at Venture Law Group

Originally Answered: What can fingerprints be lifted and not lifted from?
Print lifting capability isn't binary regarding various surface types - there is somewhat of a spectrum of suitability for lifting fingerprints. Knowing my answers tend to wax prosaic, here's the TLDR as a public service:

•  
• Easy: Glass, glossy tile, porcelain, lacquered furniture, smooth metal.
• Involved: Paper, painted surfaces, drywall, cardboard, leather, most dashboards.
• Difficult: Organic surfaces (tree leaves, fruit peels, feathers).
• Formidable: Fabrics, human skin, and rough or textured surfaces (checkered handgun grips come to mind).
• Virtually Impossible: Oily, rusty, or extremely dirty surfaces; high traffic surfaces with multiple overlapping prints; prints smeared by movement.

----------------------------
So "leather" is no more difficult than paper... and we know the FBI fingerprinted lots of paper and cardboard.

But you said "rough" leather. So that "may" shift it from "involved" to "formidable". Cant be more formidable than feathers I guess....and Roe distorts how a snap works to claim its not possible to get a print from them.

Psst...Steve you dust the snaps smooth "cap"not the snaps post....

Yes the overwhelmed FBI just wouldn't bother with a formidable task. After all, this was just the biggest case they'd had. DPD likewise was too busy dusting boxes Oswald would naturally have touched.

But I wonder on what basis you claim the leather was "rough"?

This is the holster.


Even enlarged and fuzzy it doesn't look "rough"... because its smooth leather.

-----------------------

I just need to know now Stephen, how Lee made it invisible to the ladies of the house and all the other nosy people who might want to wander into that "unlocked"* room.

(Im just calling it unlocked because no key was found on Oswald for that room, which did lock and the landlady had spare keys with which she let the cops into "the tiny room")

Roe cant actually back up his life long belief that Oswald lived in XYZ apt. because that's exactly where the cops wanted him, andvthe Warren Commission said so.... even though a cursory read of the reports and investigations discount wholly the idea it was Oswald.

It was Herbert Leon Lee or Floyd de Graffenreid 
 

But what really bothers you and ROKC is the backyard photos with Oswald wearing a holster. Isn’t that the end-game for this fantasy theory?

There is only one goal. The clue to that is in the title of Reopenkennedycase.
 

Bart, listen you guys at ROKC are not going to fool long time researchers on both sides of the argument.

Would that be the long-time researchers who believe in Two Oswalds and Two Marguerites?

The long-time researchers who believe he was killed to keep the UFO secret from leaking out?

Or maybe the long time researchers who don't actually do any research because they believe the Warren Commission? Those researchers? 

Do I look worried? 
 

Maybe you can hoodwink some Newbies, that could be your audience that will praise you guys. As exhibited here, nobody believes this theory.

I'd be worried if any of those folk did buy into it judging from the daily seeping from its nodes.

 

It’s DOA.

 

As proven by you with your non-sequiturs, cherry picking and one-liners?

Sure, if that was the best he come up with.

I think not Steve. I think you are verbalizing your mental magic-thinking. 
 

Now you guys go back and hunt for keys, ashtrays, yourselves. And one more thought, you darn well know this was discussed before. Does June 8th ring a bell? I presented that Oswald notebook entry to you, LeDoux and Parker. Parker even commented he never saw it before and in the span of 5-10 minutes became a handwriting expert and denounced it as “fakery”. Of course this never shows up in Ed LeDoux’s essay......I wonder why?

I did cover it. Your answer is posted.

Oh and please and obtain a direct quote about what I said about it being "fakery"

Those BYPs are undeniable fakery... thanks to the Powerline Shadow Study done by ROKC among many accomplishments.

A scientific paper establishing this is underway. 

Now you have an even bigger problem Steve Roe!
How does that holster found at Beckley reconcile worn by Lee in the BYP'S 

Where's the belt that was threaded through that holster at Beckley so it could hang on the door knob? The one Alexander saw? The one that's not in the inventory for Beckley...

So Roe,

No fingerprints from a smooth metal snap buttons of the holster... or leather as it was just too hard to even try. Roe calls smooth leather rough. He needs to stretch his own credibility thin here.

And if Roe is saying the cops knew this to be 100% true then why no other means of documenting this evidence and tie it to Oswald.
Photos of it in the room, etc...

No belt to hang the holster is included.

The Warren Commission denounced their own evidence, the slip of paper, as fake.
Roe just cant accept the proof shown him.

Roe has no answer for why Oswald had numbers and did not call even when it was necessary.
Instead we are told by Ruth a story about the numbers and her calling and of course there was no Lee Oswald there, we are told. 

Roe has no key to a room for which he claims Oswald rented but can not show a single receipt or any physical evidence Oswald was the roomer or even a roomer.

My evidence trumps your flimsy phone numbers.
Direct witness statements contradict the idea the persons thought to be Oswald. Those persons were in fact other roomers. 
Phone calls investigated by the FBI support this fact.
There were no roomer witnesses of Oswald. 
Proven.

The management has been caught in various conflicting statements.
Their credibility is now shot. 
The new management has too blown their own credibility based on their own statements.

So Steve has a mile to go and is mad he didnt check the map.
You are here [1964]

June 8th and Ruth's calendar canards.
Roe falls for everything but whats rubbed in his nose. 

Roe asks why everything is not in the essay, first because that doesnt prove anything. Second as stated there is a limit to how long I was wiling to beat a dead horse once I shot it 3 blocks from Beckley getting out of a cab.... 

 

Why is FR 5 5591 in the book?
What relatives did the numbers owner have, Cody's... crikeys!!

So a bus driver on the Shreveport run and Roe wants to know about numbers in a book?
What answer did he give for why his number is in the book twice?

What does refute Roe is the 50 pages of evidence, including another 9 of photos, documents, and I tell the listener its not for me to find everything.

Guess Roe has a listening deficit... check the tape.

 So Roe has two trival concerns that were "addressed", no pun intended. 
Roe refutes it all by a page in a book?
No no Roe.
That is not sufficient for even a weak analysis to conclude as you have. 
He has almost reached circumstantial level.
Hint for Roe, better find something solid soon as your audience is turning on you.

 

We are close to seeing how silly Roe is willing to look for the sake of trying to find a "gotcha" - which he idiotically hopes readers will buy as some implosion of 50 pages of evidence.

Steve \"No Go" Roe feeling right at home wrote:

 

I have that as well. Now as you can see they are mad as hell in damage control mode trying to dig themselves out of yet another boneheaded blunder.

Damage control over what? You are trying to spin that entry in Oswald's book and any opinion that it was not in Oswald's handwriting as some monumental turning point in this debate. You are delusional, desperate, or both. 

Firstly, let me address your claim that Greg became an "instant" expert in handwriting analysis -- a call you made without knowing if it had any validity or not. Because that is how you roll.

Greg Parker worked for the Department of Social Security. One of the positions he held in that department was the investigation of things like maladministration and fraud by members of the public or staff. As part of the training for that job, he did learn basics on what to look for in fraudulent signatures. He is not an "expert", but HE does have experience. What's your excuse?

The thing about experts is that, like me, the best they can do is offer an OPINION. For every qualified expert that you can find to say the writing is Oswald's, I'll find one that says it isn't. Happens every day in court. Even the WC and HSCA experts sometimes offered differing opinions on the same writing samples. The counselors were warned to get the guest register and that the slip is inadequate.

So where in all of that, is your "gotcha"? There isn't one. Your bluff and bluster is merely trying to make people believe that the pimple is really Mt Everest.

Sorry even your pimple has popped Steve, but you probably hear that a lot.

Let's assume my opinion is wrong and it is Oswald's writing. Does it prove he lived there? Not at all.



Dallas Rooming House
Mrs Bledsoe
WH 219857 / WH 38993

---------------------
You would hardly call Bledsoe's home a "rooming house". It was a normal 4 bedroom house and she occasionally rented spare rooms out - mainly to friends of her son judging from FBI reports... and her son Poter was there thus only two bedrooms could be rented... and no one else seemed to be there while Oswald stayed a week.

Did she even advertise? Apart from the sign she says she had in her window, I mean? Did she give out her number, or was it in the phone book.

Pray tell dont google it and ROKC or Ed Ledoux as you wont like what you'll find.

In any case, of the two places, only the N Beckley building could rightly be described as a "rooming house". 

As I believe I've pointed out already, the lack of a name to go with the second phone number does not bode well for Steve Roe.

Why write Bledsoe's name down and not Johnson's? Especially when there are three people to remember, Earlene Roberts, Gladys Johnson and Mr AC Johnson. No names in six weeks... 

Or

Merely a number like FR 5-5591, right Steve?

 The simple explanation is that he never had a name. He got the number from a directory as listed under "rooming houses", or was given the number by someone, like Ruth, but did not take a room there...

8 bucks for that closet? 

Yep frugal money saving Oswald is blowing the Warren Commission budget they mocked up for him.

Eating out and an extra dollar a week for a more comfortable room doesn't sound frugal or conservative 

As for Pat Hall... I have called out her errors directly to her on the Lone Gunman podcast.

She is quite aware of me and my requests, Its her game to play as she sees fit. I though am not under any obligation to support the fable any longer. 

Besides. What's your point?

If she remembers a Mr Lee it is because there was a Mr Lee.

She refuses to acknowledge Herbert and continues to claim that Mr Lee was Oswald because it is in her financial interests to do so.

So far your rebuttals have been...

-the weakest "gotcha" in history
-calling a smooth leather holster a rough leather holster
-claiming the FBI would not have bothered attempting to fingerprint said holster because it was "too difficult"
-name-calling (which can be fun, but should never be attempted by a rank amateur, especially if that is all he has in his debating bag)
-a lot of hot air, bluster and misdirection

--------------
I have to assume that the bulk of the points made are ones you cannot answer.

And not even with a patented "non-answer" that you supplied for everything else.  

How about you try to least address this, since it is YOUR evidence




Notice that it lists "living room and television" privileges... but not kitchen and refrigerator privileges?

No Board, no food, no refrigerator mentioned.

It would have to have been a massive industrial sized fridge to accommodate food for 12 or more guests on top of owners and staff.

But note that "cafes" are listed.

Why would that be Steve? 

A gentle way of saying that's where you have to eat? A fact confirmed by Hugh Slough.

Yet of all the guests, the only one who refused to speak to anyone and spoke on the phone in a European language, for reasons never explained, the ONLY one given fridge privileges? Odd or a story so far off it goes over Roe's head like a home run.

Must be true. None of those cafe employees recalled Oswald.

Suck it up buttercup. You have nothing.

 

So Roe did we get your answer yet as to why Oswald did not call ahead...

Especially  given he had the numbers according to Roe and yet no call to Beckley 3 weeks prior to Oct 14th, then again no call to Beckley on Oct 14th either.
Roe wants us to believe simply having numbers equates to residency.

Psst...
Receipts do that.
Guest books do that.
Unaltered sign in sheets do that.
Witnesses, and other corroborating evidence does that.
Writing down a phone number and never calling it, no name to go with it... useless even as circumstantial evidence.
Roe is inept or just champions a concerted campaign of ignorance of real world events.

Keys to locked rooms...

Receipts for rent paid...

Witnesses.

Oswald sure could have saved himself a trip all the way to Beckley to find out what he could have called about.... twice. I dont think so Roe. 
That's a no go.

Cheers, Ed

So Greg Parker is doing your script writing now, Ed?

Why don't you credit him for writing this? 

So if I'm now arguing with Greg Parker, just state it. Don't try to deceive everyone that this is your personal written reply. 

As you can see, Greg Parker is admitting that he has seen the notebook and this exchange was already discussed months ago, despite your denial that it never happen.

It's Ok to make a mistake Ed, we're all human. It takes a bigger person to admit a mistake. Will you? The choice is yours.

You asked for evidence that Oswald lived there, I gave it to you and Bart. Now take this back to Greg Parker at the ROKC clubhouse and hash out an answer.

You are now dodging the fact that Oswald's personal papers, letters, passport and even a birth certificate were found at 1026 North Beckley. 

That sinks your whole argument right there. 

 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by Steve Roe
Correct spelling

[Ed LeDoux]

Steve, 

With all due respect.

The typed up inventory is not done at Beckley.

Along with the Irving items, its done later. Later at the DPD those guys who framed 21 other innocent people with alibis.

You put a lot of faith, in the DPD, and that those are the items from the tiny room.

As a point of error are one of the pairs of binoculars jumping locations.

Plus everything you highlighted was supposedly in a blue valise, very portable, and contents not inventoried at the scene,.... and you have not addressed the Sea Bag or its Oswald stenciling.

Mighty convenient Herbert was Navy veteran and would have a Lee stenciled sea bag.

So your posting a late arriving inventory is your proof Roe?

Thats it.... mk

BTW, If you want to debate Greg go to ROKC and do that.

If you want to answer the evidence I have provided in the 50 pages or lack of naturally occurring evidence then please start.

Cheers, Ed 

[John Butler]

On ‎2‎/‎5‎/‎2020 at 5:29 PM, Steve Roe said:

Great!  and here's some evidence for you to take back to the ROKC Clubhouse, that all you guys ignored.

Go ahead, tell us it's fake. 

 

Steve,

There are letters in this mentioning Gus Hall and Louis Weinstock.  Do you know where someone can get a copy of these letters.

1.  Gus Hall involving photography

2. Louis Weinstock involving a letter from the Worker.

[Steve Roe]

22 minutes ago, John Butler said:

Steve,

There are letters in this mentioning Gus Hall and Louis Weinstock.  Do you know where someone can get a copy of these letters.

1.  Gus Hall involving photography

2. Louis Weinstock involving a letter from the Worker.

John, here are the letters you requested found in Oswald's Possessions. 

[Steve Roe]

12 hours ago, Ed LeDoux said:

Steve, 

With all due respect.

The typed up inventory is not done at Beckley.

Along with the Irving items, its done later. Later at the DPD those guys who framed 21 other innocent people with alibis.

You put a lot of faith, in the DPD, and that those are the items from the tiny room.

As a point of error are one of the pairs of binoculars jumping locations.

Plus everything you highlighted was supposedly in a blue valise, very portable, and contents not inventoried at the scene,.... and you have not addressed the Sea Bag or its Oswald stenciling.

Mighty convenient Herbert was Navy veteran and would have a Lee stenciled sea bag.

So your posting a late arriving inventory is your proof Roe?

Thats it.... mk

BTW, If you want to debate Greg go to ROKC and do that.

If you want to answer the evidence I have provided in the 50 pages or lack of naturally occurring evidence then please start.

Cheers, Ed 

Ed, it's very apparent you and ROKC believe the Dallas Police Department intentionally planted or moved evidence around to frame Oswald. Your argument now includes the DPD planting same to make it appear that Oswald lived at 1026 North Beckley. For what reason would they do that? Makes zero sense.

Having being called names, insulted and trashed by Mr. Parker in the past, why would I want to join your clubhouse and get more of the same? You guys have no rules on civil discourse, at least here on this forum, there are rules to govern that. That's why I joined and to address my name getting mocked here by you and Bart.

So, let's sum it up here.

Of course I am not naïve enough to think I can change you and Bart's mind on this "Oswald never lived at Beckley" theory. It boils down to who has the most reasonable argument so other Ed. Forum members can consider both sides. 

Every piece of evidence that I presented was rejected by you and ROKC. 

In the end, we will just have to disagree. 

If you want to claim victory, go right ahead. But it's very obvious here on this thread, no one is buying this theory at all. 

I'll give you the last word.

[Gene Kelly]

Ed

FWIW, I think you've laid out a compelling set of facts that show the N. Beckley legend is just that ... invented for purposes of obfuscation.  Whenever I see squabbles about fact versus opinion, it creates a red flag.  Further,  I wouldn't much trust anything written on the part of the DPD (or FBI) ... in fact, for the gravity of what had happened, the DPD paper trail is extraordinary for it's poorly-documented interrogation of Oswald and initial investigation.  More prominent for what's left out than what's included.  And labored over by a multitude of earnest serious researchers for 50 years. Then, there is this odd pattern of LHO going on trips, coming back to stay at YMCA's (with a wife and child), and then renting rooming houses.  And you've pointed out something that wasn't obvious to me ... that Mary Bledsoe's house was hardly a "rooming house". Your description of Oswald's initial movements is priceless:

They take away Oswald's movie alibi and insert a ridiculous dash to buses, cabs, rooming houses, yet moments of time suspended while Mr Lee waits at an inbound bus stop, then a dash through Oak Cliff to again, slowly stroll the wrong way whilst being stopped by a policeman, a shooting, more dashing through alleys or was it down Jefferson. Anyways, the suspect dashes all the way down a major thoroughfare only to duck into a alcove, where the store manager gets suspicious and dashes after this man, who ducks into a theater unseen by the ticket seller or ticket taker. Calls to police about the malicious movie goer make cops dash into the theater and go straight up to the balcony, all the while the shoe store manager is hiding behind the curtains watching the cops in the balcony... nothing is said by the shoe store manager - as one suspect is being questioned up on the balcony steps - he stays hidden and quiet . When cops enter the stage door the shoe store manager still doesn't say who is the man ... the cops start frisking everyone. Only when Oswald gets his crotch grabbed by a policeman and knocks his hat off does a melee ensue. Later the policemen says a different man in the front row, and not the overpaid shoe salesman as whom pointed out Oswald as the man they wanted.

Cheers,

Gene

 

[John Butler]

Thanks much Steve,

I'll make a copy of those for future reference.

[Steve Thomas]

1 hour ago, Steve Roe said:

John, here are the letters you requested found in Oswald's Possessions. 

These letters are pretty interesting.

Thanking Oswald for "this type of photographic work", and for the "poster-like blowups"...

Where is Oswald getting this type of photographic work done?

This is December, 1962 when he is living on Elsbeth and working at JCS.

What kinds of photographs did he send them?

I don't remember anyone at JCS mentioning this enlargement work.

Did Ofstein?

 

Steve Thomas

[Steve Roe]

6 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:

These letters are pretty interesting.

Thanking Oswald for "this type of photographic work", and for the "poster-like blowups"...

Where is Oswald getting this type of photographic work done?

This is December, 1962 when he is living on Elsbeth and working at JCS.

What kinds of photographs did he send them?

I don't remember anyone at JCS mentioning this enlargement work.

Did Ofstein?

 

Steve Thomas

Steve, Oswald was trained by Dennis Ofstein to perform Photo Enlargements at JCS. The company also made commercial type posters. That’s in Ofstein’s WC testimony. 

[Steve Thomas]

9 hours ago, Steve Roe said:

Steve, Oswald was trained by Dennis Ofstein to perform Photo Enlargements at JCS. The company also made commercial type posters. That’s in Ofstein’s WC testimony. 

Steve,

Yes. Thank you. Ofstein goes into this quite a bit.

I had looked at Ofstein once before, but it was in connection with his background in the Army Security Agency. I hadn't really thought about the photographic aspect too much.

 

Steve Thomas