Sandy Larsen Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 41 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said: The underlying problem is that right-wing lies get low-income white people to vote Republican, and thus against their own economic interests. That is also the reason progressives can't win the presidency. The DNC knows this and so won't let a progressive candidate win the primary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Gallaway Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 (edited) 6 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said: Kirk- I largely agree with you, although who are the new "authoritarians" is debatable. The left seems very interested in censorship these days, and building up police-state apparatus---we need a bigger panopticon to beat down rivals. The Wuhan lab leak has been debunked! And you will be censored if you talk about it! A bigger Defense Department to bomb Libya is good! China is good! Ask Disney, Apple or the NBA. The right-wing, the old allies of the police-state, is curiously skeptical of the new police state--and more skeptical of the world's largest and most powerful authoritarian state, China. Fascinating times. But in the end, I say the US needs to "do a France." Toss out the establishment parties. Ben:The left seems very interested in censorship This is going to be one of those boring tit for tat arguments.The right wants to be involved in personal privacy issues issues and take away a woman's right to choose, They are also, straight down the line in Scotus voted to give corporations rights as people in Citizen's United, hence censoring the economic rights of people.. Ben:and building up police-state apparatus- You've always been opposed to that Ben, because they want to prosecute neo fascist criminals who are plotting against the peaceful transition of government. This may shock you, but I think they're being too deliberate and soft! You may remain unconvinced despite these new revelations. but your own hero, who you probably don't know the name of, who, as you see it triumphed for Trump against Mueller in Russiagate. ( and what a joke that perception is!)Ty Cobb has said there's enough evidence there to probably cook Trump! Ben:The Wuhan lab leak has been debunked! This is the 20th time you've said this. You have no positive info one way or the other, and that has never really been a legitimate" Ben soapbox issue" here, because most people here realize they don't have the information to make a judgment and wouldn't trust the Chinese beyond that possibility anyway. Ben:A bigger Defense Department to bomb Libya is good! This from knee jerk NFZ in Ukraine Ben? I've already told you this. What the Democrat administration did in Libya, would have been done and done in in spades by the Republicans. You may not know this Ben, but the Senate hearings on Benghazi where they grilled HC for 11 hours were not a Republican cry for "Peace in Libya". It was because of perceived laxness that allowed Libyan terrorists to invade an American compound and kill 4 Americans. Ben:A bigger Defense Department We all agree in less Defense spending.. But these matters can be seen in simple numbers. As I said before. In this century, every year Republicans have given the Defense Dept. what they requested, and more. Trump was the biggest increase in his first years in office .And Democrats have consistently given a little less .Obama gave less than requested in 7 out of his 8 years with one exception in 2014. Edited July 11, 2022 by Kirk Gallaway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Doudna Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said: The underlying problem is that right-wing lies get low-income white people to vote Republican, and thus against their own economic interests. True. I see it as a larger extension of an historical question that still baffles me: why were poor southern whites hostile to blacks (African Americans)? What had blacks ever done to them? Why weren't poor southern whites on the side of the poor blacks, against wealthy white landowners who were oppressing them both? Well the standard answer is "racism", but that both is and isn't a real explanation. And yet the racism was the mechanism. Similarly, I can imagine no fully convincing counternarrative counterhistory in which the Democratic Party could have made a choice to side on behalf of the marginalized such as blacks, Latinos, gays and transgendered-- without losing those low-income white voters to Republicans. But why is it obvious that that should necessarily have been the case? Yet it seems that it necessarily was the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 3 minutes ago, Greg Doudna said: True. I see it as a larger extension of an historical question that still baffles me: why were poor southern whites hostile to blacks (African Americans)? What had blacks ever done to them? Why weren't poor southern whites on the side of the poor blacks, against wealthy white landowners who were oppressing them both? Well the standard answer is "racism", but that both is and isn't a real explanation. And yet the racism was the mechanism. Similarly, I can imagine no fully convincing counternarrative counterhistory in which the Democratic Party could have made a choice to side on behalf of the marginalized such as blacks, Latinos, gays and transgendered-- without losing those low-income white voters to Republicans. But why is it obvious that that should necessarily have been the case? Yet it seems that it necessarily was the case. Initially the country, or the people running it needed the masses to see ethnic minorities as less than human, which justified such minorities working for free (serfs / slaves) in terrible conditions or for next to no money. That made the poor white folk feel better a out themselves, like they weren't the bottom rung of society. After abolition it was very easy for politicians to blame ethnic minorities for problems in society, taking anecdotal cases or problems and amplifying them as if they were nationwide issues. Latterly, for the US to justify their neo-colonialism and invasions of countless countries which were non-white, it required society to maintain racism in the masses, so that the public supporting wars and joining the military would see anyone not of their skin colour as a threat or enemy. The prolonging of racism in the USA comes right from the top, not from the dumb rednecks. They have been conditioned to be that way, as they are low education and have been convinced that ethnic minorities are taking something from them or are a threat to their way of life. This perpetually keeps the minds of the masses distracted and consumed, whilst the ruling class is unchallenged. What a sad period of history that has caused so much pain and suffering. The lyrics ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 (edited) 6 hours ago, Greg Doudna said: True. I see it as a larger extension of an historical question that still baffles me: why were poor southern whites hostile to blacks (African Americans)? What had blacks ever done to them? Why weren't poor southern whites on the side of the poor blacks, against wealthy white landowners who were oppressing them both? Well the standard answer is "racism", but that both is and isn't a real explanation. And yet the racism was the mechanism. Similarly, I can imagine no fully convincing counternarrative counterhistory in which the Democratic Party could have made a choice to side on behalf of the marginalized such as blacks, Latinos, gays and transgendered-- without losing those low-income white voters to Republicans. But why is it obvious that that should necessarily have been the case? Yet it seems that it necessarily was the case. IMO, it goes back to the Kennedy brothers, and LBJ, standing up for Civil Rights and (in RFK's case) Mexican migrant farm workers in the 60s. Previously, working class whites in the South had greatly appreciated FDR's New Deal policies, identifying strongly as Democrats. And after FDR's demise, Henry Wallace was practically tarred-and-feathered in the South for his advocacy of Civil Rights. The passage of the Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act was the Democrats' fateful crossing of the Rubicon that alienated white working class Southern Dixiecrats-- driving them into the Nixon-era Republican fold. Some may have voted for their fellow Southerners, Carter and Clinton, but the Republicans have continued to use Nixon's "Southern strategy" for the past 54 years. For example, GHWB used Lee Atwater's Willie Horton ads, and Trump's hardcore base has been rooted in the former Confederacy. I saw a study a few years ago showing that the most accurate predictor of counties voting heavily for Trump in 2016 was the density of their slave populations in 1860! (Incidentally, population demographics in Southern slave states changed dramatically after 1864, as Eric Foner and others have shown. Slaves comprised over half of the population of South Carolina in 1860, but, if I recall correctly, the proportion of blacks in S.C. today has fallen to around 30%-- as a result of (?) high death rates and Northern emigration by blacks.) Edited July 11, 2022 by W. Niederhut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Thomas Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 - Herschel Walker - “Since we don't control the air, our good air decided to float over to China's bad air so when China gets our good air, their bad air got to move. So it moves over to our good air space. Then now we got we to clean that back up." This man is the Republican candidate for U.S. Senator for the State of Georgia. Steve Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Allison Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 26 minutes ago, Steve Thomas said: This man is the Republican candidate for U.S. Senator for the State of Georgia. Because the GOP couldn't bring themselves to allow an intelligent Black man represent their party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Bulman Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 Parkland coming down. Plus, don't miss the rose at the end. The hospital where JFK died is coming down (msn.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Allison Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 5 hours ago, Robert Wheeler said: Feel free to speculate as to why Hunter Biden would give his dad the name "Peter Pedo." How about I speculate on how gullible a person has to be to think something that stupid is true. Did you also believe the election was stolen by Italian space satellites? Because we all know how the Italians are famous for their satellites. Especially the ones that steal elections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Davidson Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 5 hours ago, Kathy Beckett said: We missed you when ya ducked out when Trump didn't get to be Pres anymore, even though your sources were saying something different. All those graphs and stuff... Welcome back, Robert--you haven't changed a bit!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 8 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said: Ben:The left seems very interested in censorship This is going to be one of those boring tit for tat arguments.The right wants to be involved in personal privacy issues issues and take away a woman's right to choose, They are also, straight down the line in Scotus voted to give corporations rights as people in Citizen's United, hence censoring the economic rights of people.. Ben:and building up police-state apparatus- You've always been opposed to that Ben, because they want to prosecute neo fascist criminals who are plotting against the peaceful transition of government. This may shock you, but I think they're being too deliberate and soft! You may remain unconvinced despite these new revelations. but your own hero, who you probably don't know the name of, who, as you see it triumphed for Trump against Mueller in Russiagate. ( and what a joke that perception is!)Ty Cobb has said there's enough evidence there to probably cook Trump! Ben:The Wuhan lab leak has been debunked! This is the 20th time you've said this. You have no positive info one way or the other, and that has never really been a legitimate" Ben soapbox issue" here, because most people here realize they don't have the information to make a judgment and wouldn't trust the Chinese beyond that possibility anyway. Ben:A bigger Defense Department to bomb Libya is good! This from knee jerk NFZ in Ukraine Ben? I've already told you this. What the Democrat administration did in Libya, would have been done and done in in spades by the Republicans. You may not know this Ben, but the Senate hearings on Benghazi where they grilled HC for 11 hours were not a Republican cry for "Peace in Libya". It was because of perceived laxness that allowed Libyan terrorists to invade an American compound and kill 4 Americans. Ben:A bigger Defense Department We all agree in less Defense spending.. But these matters can be seen in simple numbers. As I said before. In this century, every year Republicans have given the Defense Dept. what they requested, and more. Trump was the biggest increase in his first years in office .And Democrats have consistently given a little less .Obama gave less than requested in 7 out of his 8 years with one exception in 2014. Thanks for you uplifting commentary. I still say, "Throw out both parties and start over." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 9 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: Really? That's odd given that the left are champions of the working class. See Robert Reich's column, posted in this space. The American "left" now represents the globalists and high-end professionals who benefit from globalism. The top 10%, essentially. When you look at Hillary Clinton, do you see someone who would have married a plumber? Play cards with those guys who drive pick-up trucks? Sheesh, even go to a football or baseball game? HRC is very comfortable with...Jen Psaki. Even Joe Biden is a cut below HRC's social-professional class.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 (edited) President Biden reveals the James Webb Space Telescope's stunning first image By Ashley Strickland, CNN Updated 2254 GMT (0654 HKT) July 11, 2022 I sleep better at night, knowing Biden is running the show. Along with CNN. Edited July 12, 2022 by Benjamin Cole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted July 12, 2022 Share Posted July 12, 2022 Senator Graham ordered to testify in front of grand jury in Trump election probe (msn.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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