Case Closed: 30 Years on-Even Worse

[Paul Brancato]

2 hours ago, Andrew Prutsok said:

Oswald's feat was unmatched for 38 years, until 19 hijackers who had had a few flying lessons, out-smarted and out-maneuvered the entire US Air Defense System for several hours.

Just as with Oswald, it’s too improbable to be true. 

 

[Pat Speer]

4 hours ago, Andrew Prutsok said:

Oswald's feat was unmatched for 38 years, until 19 hijackers who had had a few flying lessons, out-smarted and out-maneuvered the entire US Air Defense System for several hours.

My recollection is that they really didn't out-maneuver anybody. They realized they could bring box-cutters onboard and that box-cutters could be used as a weapon. This allowed them to get into the cockpit. Once in, they crashed the planes. Almost anyone with a week of flight training could have done the same. As someone once quipped, flying a plane is fairly easy, the challenge is landing the sucker.

[Ron Bulman]

18 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

What do you mean Ron?

I just quoted it and explained there but a post I made yesterday showed up in that thread but the thread and it did not show up at the top of the forum home page as they usually do.  Sorry to disrupt your thread.  I needed to test in a different thread to see if the feature was working there.  I need to go back now and read Martin's article; his stuff is always good.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Ron Bulman

[James DiEugenio]

For the record:  no one has ever duplicated what the WC said Oswald did without cheating.

For the Commission they fired at stationary targets from about half the height they said LHO was allegedly at.

With CBS they enlarged the target when they found their ace sniper could not do it according to rote.  This last piece of info was discovered by the late Roger Feinman who worked for CBS and pilfered their files.

[James DiEugenio]

BTW, you know who wrote a blurb for a reissue of Case Closed?

Geoffrey Ward.

The guy who writes so many of the scripts for Ken Burns, including The VIetnam War.

That, I think, tells one a lot about how power works in America.

[Pamela Brown]

12 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

For the record:  no one has ever duplicated what the WC said Oswald did without cheating.

For the Commission they fired at stationary targets from about half the height they said LHO was allegedly at.

With CBS they enlarged the target when they found their ace sniper could not do it according to rote.  This last piece of info was discovered by the late Roger Feinman who worked for CBS and pilfered their files.

And then there was the Discovery Channel program Beyond the Magic Bullet which the producer acknowledged to me was totally flawed...

[James DiEugenio]

Yes, I remember that one also Pamela.

And finally there was the late Carlos Hathcock, the greatest sniper of the Vietnam War.

[Joe Bauer]

On 5/14/2023 at 1:41 PM, James DiEugenio said:

Yes, I remember that one also Pamela.

And finally there was the late Carlos Hathcock, the greatest sniper of the Vietnam War.

What was Hathcock's finding?

Edited May 16, 2023 by Joe Bauer

[Joe Bauer]

Considering these other facts about Oswald's alleged shooting at and hitting JFK.

We've all mentioned how Oswald had to be highly stressed.

Especially with his 3rd and last chance shot.

Missing that JFK probably would have survived his upper back/chest wound.

It was a true life and death threat situation for Oswald.

Any second the cops might have seen him shooting that last shot and raced up to turn him into Swiss cheese.

But here is another weird thing.

Jackie Kennedy's head was just inches from JFK's when the shooter took that shot.

The shooter must have known that if that shot was just 10 to 12 inches off on the left side, he would have blown Jackie's head off instead of JFK's.

It was a risk only the most cold-blooded killer would have taken.

If it was Oswald, he really had to have been motivated with blind rage to ignore the risk of killing an innocent party like Jackie.

 

 

 

[W. Niederhut]

On 5/12/2023 at 5:57 PM, Pat Speer said:

My recollection is that they really didn't out-maneuver anybody. They realized they could bring box-cutters onboard and that box-cutters could be used as a weapon. This allowed them to get into the cockpit. Once in, they crashed the planes. Almost anyone with a week of flight training could have done the same. As someone once quipped, flying a plane is fairly easy, the challenge is landing the sucker.

Pat,

     Since you mentioned the subject, what is the actual evidence that "19 Muslim hijackers" with "box cutters" flew the planes into those buildings on 9/11?

     Are you aware that the alleged Barbara Olson phone calls from AA Flight 77, about "hijackers" with "boxcutters," never happened-- based on expert FBI testimony in the Moussaoui trial?

      That alleged phone call was foundational for the "Muslim hijackers with boxcutters" narrative.

Point PC-2: The Reported Phone Calls from Barbara Olson | Consensus 911

      There are also a number of inconsistencies with the alleged "Let's Roll" phone call from Todd Beamer on UA Flight 93.

Point PC-1: The Alleged Calls of Todd Beamer, Flight UA 93 | Consensus 911

Point PC-1A:  The Todd Beamer Call from UA Flight 93:  A Serious Problem in the Timeline | Consensus 911

     

Edited May 14, 2023 by W. Niederhut

[James DiEugenio]

Joe:

Craig Roberts wrote a book called Kill Zone.

He himself was a professional sniper.  And this is how he knew Carlos.

Hathcock held the record for the longest kill shot for about 24 years.  He hit a guy from a mile and half away.

He had 95 confirmed kills in Viet Nam.  He was so lethal that Hanoi put out a bounty on him.

After retirement, he set up a SWAT team training school in Virginia for police departments.

Craig asked him about what the WC said Oswald did:  What do you think Carlos?

Hathcock paused a minute and said, "Craig I cannot tell you how many times we tried it.  And we set up everything just like the WR said it was.  We could not

 do it."

Craig remembered that for his book, and he wrote it up and sent it to Carlos and he approved its publication.

That testimony is so devastating that Paul May made up some BS to try and negate  it on JFK Facts. It was all rubbish.

In my view, if Carlos was alive and i was running the trial, he would be my last witness. Oswald would be acquitted and I would buy Hathcock a filet mignon and a bottle of  wine of his choice, but not Dom Perignon.  Only if Oliver was there to pick up the tab on that one.

Edited May 14, 2023 by James DiEugenio

[Pat Speer]

26 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

Joe:

Craig Roberts wrote a book called Kill Zone.

He himself was a professional sniper.  And this is how he knew Carlos.

Hathcock held the record for the longest kill shot for about 24 years.  He hit a guy from a mile and half away.

He had 95 confirmed kills in Viet Nam.  He was so lethal that Hanoi put out a bounty on him.

After retirement, he set up a SWAT team training school in Virginia for police departments.

Craig asked him about what the WC said Oswald did:  What do you think Carlos?

Hathcock paused a minute and said, "Craig I cannot tell you how many times we tried it.  And we set up everything just like the WR said it was.  We could not

 do it."

Craig remembered that for his book, and he wrote it up and sent it to Carlos and he approved its publication.

That testimony is so devastating that Paul May made up some BS to try and negate  it on JFK Facts. It was all rubbish.

In my view, if Carlos was alive and i was running the trial, he would be my last witness. Oswald would be acquitted and I would buy Hathcock a filet mignon and a bottle of  wine of his choice, but not Dom Perignon.  Only if Oliver was there to pick up the tab on that one.

Yes, as I remember it, May tried to claim Roberts was a hack who didn't even know Hathcock. I was on that thread, however, and knew full well that Roberts had written a book about sniping years before he wrote a book about the JFK assassination, and that Hatchock had been a primary source for that book, and had actually contributed a chapter. 

[Michael Griffith]

On 5/12/2023 at 4:03 AM, David Von Pein said:

As per usual, James DiEugenio has everything backwards. Because Gerald Posner's "Case Closed" is actually a very very good book. It's easily one of the Top 5 books ever written concerning the events of 11/22/63.

Kudos go out to Mr. Posner for his book's 30th birthday here in 2023. It's a publication that has held up extremely well during these last thirty years. (The constant gripes of conspiracy theorists notwithstanding, of course.)

DVP Book Review -- "Case Closed"

More Interviews.....

Posner's book is one of the worst, most error-filled books ever written on the JFK case.

Hasty Judgment: Why the JFK Case In Not Closed--A Reply to Gerald Posner's Book Case Closed

[David Andrews]

Just a question to ponder, that occurred to me reading Martin Hay's articles:

If one admits a "second Oswald" ("second" to whatever degree of resemblance and preparation one prefers), why was the beta version not sent to Mexico City to attract attention at the Cuban and Russian embassies, and appear on surveillance footage later?

++++

Also, if Cuban embassy staff encountered an Oswald impersonator who resembled a blonde, Soviet intelligence agent - how does his provocation fit into the Mexico City op scenario?

Edited May 15, 2023 by David Andrews

[James DiEugenio]

David;

How long did it take to find out about the impersonator in Mexico City?  I mean with real data, not insinuations.

If the doppelganger Oswald had been captured on film, would not that have blown it wide open?