The three tramps mystery

[Steve Thomas]

Affidavit of jailer, J.L. Popplewell
CD 1444 page 20
https://maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=11839#relPageId=21

"... due to the large volume of prisoners that weekend, it was possible I missed writing Oswald's name down on the record sheet."

Daniel Wayne Douglas was in cell block F (See page 9)

Oswald was in cell F-2

It's interesting. All of the Joiners were put in the same cell: A-15. (See also p. 9).

Steve Thomas

 

[Paul Cummings]

15 minutes ago, Steve Thomas said:

Affidavit of jailer, J.L. Popplewell
CD 1444 page 20
https://maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=11839#relPageId=21

"... due to the large volume of prisoners that weekend, it was possible I missed writing Oswald's name down on the record sheet."

Daniel Wayne Douglas was in cell block F (See page 9)

Oswald was in cell F-2

It's interesting. All of the Joiners were put in the same cell: A-15. (See also p. 9).

Steve Thomas

 

Round up the usual suspects comes from a famous movie line.

[Ron Bulman]

Bumping in relation to the Cowboy/Angleton thread.  There is a lot more to this aspect yet to be re hashed if anyone wishes.

[Ron Bulman]

On 5/14/2023 at 11:37 PM, Ron Bulman said:

Six tramps if you believe AJ Weberman.  Two sets of three.  One set arrested around 1:00 in a box car behind the TSBD.  Then when RR operations resumed around 2:00 - 2:30 a train leaving the yard headed east over the triple underpass was observed by Lee Bowers to have three men climb on from the South Knoll of Dealy Plaza.  He alerted police, stopped the train.  They found three tramps hiding in grain cars.  They were walked back to the sheriff's office.  Officers complaint's of the long walk quoted.  Records of the arrest. 

Something developed about this regarding the shadows of those in the pictures at 1:00 vs 3:00.

All on a website advertising The Oswald Code.  But not in the book. 

ST mentioned the possibility of tramps arrested twice.  I wonder about Weberman.  If some part might be true or is it all BS.  Damn, I wish I'd printed this.  It was supposed to be in the book.  So, all false?

[David Andrews]

On 5/21/2023 at 7:43 AM, Joe Bauer said:

And as far as General Lansdale not wearing a ring...I'd like to look back at some of the other photos of him to verify that proposition.

 

 

Seeing the photo and film above, a question that we seldom consider rises.

Where is this man going?

Walking westward and beneath the TSBD, past the gates on Elm Street Extension (my term), later in the afternoon, here are some of his options:

The parking lot

The loading dock

The rail yard

A view of the rear of the pergola

Where to, and why?

Edited July 9, 2023 by David Andrews

[David Andrews]

Delete, duplicate post.  Damn.

Edited July 9, 2023 by David Andrews

[Paul Cummings]

I don't believe it's Lansdale. Granted the person is walking away from behind but it does look more like Cord Meyer than Lansdale.

[Joe Bauer]

4 hours ago, Paul Cummings said:

I don't believe it's Lansdale. Granted the person is walking away from behind but it does look more like Cord Meyer than Lansdale.

Cord Meyer?

Well, one thing I am sure you agree with me about.

The man walking in the grainy picture on the left, is the same person depicted on the right.

Same "everything!"

Height, build, head shape, haircut, gate ( leg movement exactly the same ) slightly stooped posture, suit type and color, distinctive white collar and even shoes etc.

Check the folds in the lower back right side pant leg when the two photos are shown side to side. Exactly the same!

Same with the indented fold in the upper back left thigh side of his pants.

No doubt at all these two pics are of the same person.

And I agree it is a worthy question, where the heck is this guy going?

In the tramp walk picture he is headed to the end of the Texas School Book Depository building where there is only an open parking lot.

I believe that lot had been closed off so he couldn't have been going back to get his car from there.

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Joe Bauer

[Paul Cummings]

1 hour ago, Joe Bauer said:

Cord Meyer?

Well, one thing I am sure you agree with me about.

The man walking in the grainy picture on the left, is the same person depicted on the right.

Same "everything!"

Height, build, head shape, hair cut, gate ( leg movement exactly the same ) suit type and color, white collar, shoes etc.

Check the folds in the lower back right side pant leg when the two photos are shown side to side. Exactly the same!

Same with the indented fold in the upper back left side of his pants.

No doubt at all these two pics are of the same person.

And I agree it is a worthy question, where the heck is this guy going?

In the tramp walk picture he is headed to the end of the Texas School Book Depository building where there is only an open parking lot.

I believe that lot had been closed off so he couldn't have been going back to get his car from there.

 

Not disagreeing but would like to see in context were this was taken.

[Leslie Sharp]

59 minutes ago, Paul Cummings said:

Not disagreeing but would like to see in context were this was taken.

Didn't Meyer wear thick corrective lens set in thick black rims due to his injury? Also, the shape of the head  and the hairstyle bear no resemblance to Meyer - at least not to my naked eye.

[Leslie Sharp]

@Robert Montenegro @Paul Brancato you're probably familiar with the photo of the tramps from various angles. I grabbed this one because it captures the uniformed guys, full body, to ask if they fit your understanding of support teams a.k.a. "kill squads" or "swamp groups" as referenced in Lafitte's record of Otto's strategy for Lancelot Project?  There must be other photos that better exemplify candidates for those teams who might have been provided a huge cache of rifles when they arrived in Dallas?

https://m.facebook.com/groups/702791629733219/posts/4521681414510869/
 

[Keyvan Shahrdar]

In the aftermath of the arrest of three vagrants, there are intriguing details emerging from a report of an FBI interview with the police officers involved. Firstly, a witness named Lee Bowers saw the three individuals, referred to as the 'tramps', rushing towards a train. Bowers then informed the police about their presence, specifying the exact train car they had entered. Bowers was working as a railroad switchman in a two-story tower building in the vicinity of Dealey Plaza, which offered him a clear view of the area.

Police subsequently apprehended these three individuals, under the direction of Officer Marvin Wise. Notably, Officer Wise had cotton stuffed in his ears at the time, explaining that it was due to an ear infection. He was also wearing shoes that didn't conform to standard police-issue footwear. These unusual details sparked curiosity, leading the FBI to question him about his choice of footwear and the cotton in his ears.

Officer Wise's uniform was also found to be soiled with what appeared to be roof sand. This discovery, coupled with the aforementioned peculiarities, has sparked some interesting theories.

The one that I find particularly plausible is that Officer Wise could have been a sniper perched on the rooftop of the records building. The cotton in his ears could be to protect from the loud noise produced by a rifle's discharge.

You can review the FBI interview note with Officer Wise here -> https://web.archive.org/web/20190909155847/http://jfkassassinationfiles.com/hsca_180-10112-10156

 

[Paul Cummings]

48 minutes ago, Keyvan Shahrdar said:

In the aftermath of the arrest of three vagrants, there are intriguing details emerging from a report of an FBI interview with the police officers involved. Firstly, a witness named Lee Bowers saw the three individuals, referred to as the 'tramps', rushing towards a train. Bowers then informed the police about their presence, specifying the exact train car they had entered. Bowers was working as a railroad switchman in a two-story tower building in the vicinity of Dealey Plaza, which offered him a clear view of the area.

Police subsequently apprehended these three individuals, under the direction of Officer Marvin Wise. Notably, Officer Wise had cotton stuffed in his ears at the time, explaining that it was due to an ear infection. He was also wearing shoes that didn't conform to standard police-issue footwear. These unusual details sparked curiosity, leading the FBI to question him about his choice of footwear and the cotton in his ears.

Officer Wise's uniform was also found to be soiled with what appeared to be roof sand. This discovery, coupled with the aforementioned peculiarities, has sparked some interesting theories.

The one that I find particularly plausible is that Officer Wise could have been a sniper perched on the rooftop of the records building. The cotton in his ears could be to protect from the loud noise produced by a rifle's discharge.

You can review the FBI interview note with Officer Wise here -> https://web.archive.org/web/20190909155847/http://jfkassassinationfiles.com/hsca_180-10112-10156

 

Self-Protrait of a Scoundrel: (Chauncey Holt) pg 177-178

"We were ordered out of the boxcar, without any opportunity to present our credentials, or explain that were engaged in an official investigaton for the ATF, at the time all the excitement started. Shortly thereafter, I arrogated myself to position of spokesman and explained our cover story to Sgt. D.V. Harness and he ordered the army of police officers to search the rest of the train. There were about six to eight other persons, who had been taken in previous searches, but they were separated from us.  He then turned us over to a pair of portly officers, who escorted us to the Dealey Plaza command post. 

Pg 179 "Shanklin turned us loose, at once and there was no record kept of our "detainment." The only record of this incident is the photographic record of us crossing the plaza. While we were in the criminal courts building, we saw Eugene Brading, aka Jim Braden, who acutally been arrested."

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Paul Cummings

[Leslie Sharp]

54 minutes ago, Keyvan Shahrdar said:

In the aftermath of the arrest of three vagrants, there are intriguing details emerging from a report of an FBI interview with the police officers involved. Firstly, a witness named Lee Bowers saw the three individuals, referred to as the 'tramps', rushing towards a train. Bowers then informed the police about their presence, specifying the exact train car they had entered. Bowers was working as a railroad switchman in a two-story tower building in the vicinity of Dealey Plaza, which offered him a clear view of the area.

Police subsequently apprehended these three individuals, under the direction of Officer Marvin Wise. Notably, Officer Wise had cotton stuffed in his ears at the time, explaining that it was due to an ear infection. He was also wearing shoes that didn't conform to standard police-issue footwear. These unusual details sparked curiosity, leading the FBI to question him about his choice of footwear and the cotton in his ears.

Officer Wise's uniform was also found to be soiled with what appeared to be roof sand. This discovery, coupled with the aforementioned peculiarities, has sparked some interesting theories.

The one that I find particularly plausible is that Officer Wise could have been a sniper perched on the rooftop of the records building. The cotton in his ears could be to protect from the loud noise produced by a rifle's discharge.

You can review the FBI interview note with Officer Wise here -> https://web.archive.org/web/20190909155847/http://jfkassassinationfiles.com/hsca_180-10112-10156

 

Thanks for this.  Wise was a legitimate officer, but your point is well taken.

 

The question posed here is whether certain support teams for the plot, independent of local law enforcement — identified by Lafitte as 'swamp groups' or 'kill squads' — were disguised in uniform and were those in uniform armed with rifles from the cache as identified in a document on another thread.

I didn't see to whom Wise reported but I may have missed it? Any ideas?

Edited July 9, 2023 by Leslie Sharp

[Keyvan Shahrdar]

The trio identified as the 'three tramps' — Harold Doyle, John Gedney, and Richard Abrams — all share a common background as Army veterans. This fact adds an additional layer of complexity to the story of their temporary detention on November 22, 1963, in the wake of the JFK assassination.

What might have motivated these three men to involve themselves in such a grave act? Did all three held deeply racist views and vehemently opposed school desegregation? The mere thought of their children attending school alongside Black students may have been unthinkable to them!

These guys were probably hired by Ed Lansdale to assassinate JFK.

You can delve into more details about their arrest via this link, which leads to an FBI interview note featuring Dallas Police Department officer R.C. Wagner:

FBI note of R.C. Wagner's Interview- https://web.archive.org/web/20191022151751/http://jfkassassinationfiles.com/fbi_124-10273-10448

 

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Keyvan Shahrdar