Joe Bauer

Bump.

Great points Paul. Your timelines are well proven by cross checking them with news broadcasts. And yes, if the FBI questioned Andy Armstrong about whether Ruby had mentioned to him that he ( Ruby ) had stopped by Parkland hospital, which appears to be the case with Armstrong actually answering he hadn't heard Ruby mention Parkland...we have even more evidence that Seth Kantor told the truth about his meet up with Ruby at Parkland.

NASA chief believes alien life exists

Ruby had ample time to drive from the DMN building to Parkland. Go in and see and converse with Kantor...and then leave again to make the 13 to 14 minute drive back to his club. JFK was shot at 12:30 pm. He was pronounced dead at 1:PM. Armstrong testified that Ruby came back at the club at about 1:30 pm or 1:45 PM. I'll have another look at Armstrong's WC testimony...but I think Armstrong wasn't 100% sure about Ruby's exact arrival times. I'll copy and past Armstrong's relevant WC testimony.

The major marketing campaign timing of this unprovable bomb shell story and it's ease at garnering absolute top tier main stream media coverage just before this fairly date significant 60th anniversary of the JFKA is suspect in several ways. Obviously, Landis's co-writer and publisher had to create and promote this dramatic story in a way that received national news coverage beyond anything any real top JFKA researcher could ever dream of. This kind of national media coverage is a book sellers dream! Imo someone has to have an awfully well connected inside track to the right people to swing such an improbable highest media level of coverage of what many would categorize as more a "National Enquirer" tabloid type article due to it's highly sensational yet impossible to prove claim. The aforementioned national medias are going Ga Ga over this highly debatable and impossible to prove 60 years old bomb-shell story of Landis's. And just months before this upcoming JFKA significant year anniversary date? Whether it is by design or just coincidence, Landis's national coverage story can't help but dominate or at least crowd out most other JFKA conversations and coverage of more meaningful research findings and questions during the entire JFKA anniversary news cycle. It would be journalistically responsible and ethical for honest news reporting to include contrary commentary on the Landis story from the most respected JFKA researchers in the country. Researchers who dispute Landis's story and can probably submit lots of more credible factual evidence to expose it's improbability. Which members of our forum are the most informed of the Parkland hospital JFK/John Connally treatment event including the time, place, handling and identification provenance of the so called "Magic Bullet?"

What? True? When, where, for what matters? I can't believe it.

Armstrong's timeline for Jack Ruby's appearance at the club on the afternoon of 11,22,1963 was confounding relative to high credibility news reporter Seth Kantor's WC testimony where he clearly states he saw Jack Ruby hanging around inside Parkland hospital and actually had a verbal exchange with him during the time of JFK's ER treatment there. I of course believe Seth Kantor's story. The WC could not allow Kantor's Jack Ruby Parkland hospital meetup story to be accepted as true in their report. Their published conclusion was that Kantor was hyper-ventilating from all the excitement of the day and simply imagined the Ruby encounter. Armstrong's timeline testimony regards the exact time of Ruby's appearance at the Carousel has been accepted as fact ... but not so imo. I will give Armstrong credit for honesty regards his back and forth runs to the toilet in his efforts to awaken Craford from his deep sleep at 12:30 PM on 11,22,1963.

The back and forth between Mark Lane and William F. Buckley on Buckley's TV show "Firing Line" was a classic. That fascinating high plane intellectual jousting exchange took place way back in 1966. Lane won the match...according to the audience's reaction imo. And Buckley himself admitted Lane was such a formidable debate opponent to the degree that he ( Buckley ) would be served well if Lane was his legal representative in such matters.

Another question I have about Landis's story regards the timeline of it. Did Landis find the bullet/fragment after Connolly and JFK were removed from the limo and both had been placed on stretchers and rushed into the ER trauma rooms 1 and 2? If so, at what point was he able to get close enough to either of their stretchers that had been used to get them into their treatment rooms to leave any such found bullet? Was JFK lifted off his initial ER entrance stretcher and placed on another existing table or gurney more permanently stationed in the trauma room? If so, I assume JFK's entrance stretcher was then wheeled out into some area of the ER hallways and left unattended enough that Landis was able to find it and place the bullet on it unnoticed? I guess I am also asking what was the movement record of JFK's entrance stretcher? When and where did it go if it was removed from trauma room 1 seconds after JFK was lifted off of it? Same with Governor Connally's initial entrance stretcher. Landis was obviously among the many Secret Service agents who stationed themselves throughout the ER area during the treatment of JFK and Connally. And many other people were in that area as well. Hospital personnel, JFK entourage, LBJ and his wife, and who knows who else. Mayor Cabell and his wife were also there. The entire scene was reported as a super high anxiety and at times confusing one. I imagine Landis will be asked to provide much more detail about his story from when he first arrived at Parkland...to the second he claims he placed a bullet on any stretcher. How did he know any stretcher he saw was Kennedy's versus Connally's? Where was the stretcher when he discovered it? I read that Landis may be appearing at some type of conference soon? He is over 80 years old. I don't think he will actually make that appearance. The questions presented to him would be so numerous and specific and high energy charged. But what else would he expect when he publishes his story that claims to totally disrupt the lone gunman finding of the Warren Report? And if true, would be one of the most major secret truth exposing events in America's history?

I second that.

The vast majority of people polled about this subject nowadays probably know maybe 5% of what we older Americans know about everything that was happening all around JFK and RFK before, during and after 11,22,1963. Especially the immensity and depths of enmity of JFK/RFK hating forces. Millions of Americans hated JFK for segregation reasons. Millions hated him for his peace ideology. That damn commie! The wealthiest men on Earth ( Texas oil ) hated JFK because they felt he was a threat to their wealth and power. Hot headed expatriated Cubans hated him. Our own military including our own Chiefs of Staff hated JFK/RFK. Our most violent covert action people hated JFK. Our secret agencies same thing. LBJ himself hated JFK/RFK. Young people have no clue as to the incredible corruption of LBJ. J. Edgar Hoover same thing. And finally organized crime ( with their massive wealth, power and influence back in 1963 ) hated JFK and RFK. To murderous wishing degrees. I believe all those other super powerful groups hated JFK to a murderous degrees as well. I would say the JFK and RFK assassinations were born out of this entire massive matrix of JFK hate. So deep and pervasive in our society at that time...JFK and RFK didn't stand a chance against them when they came together to achieve a common goal. I think JFK underestimated the size and power of this combined evil threat and what they were truly capable of and willing to do. JFK's and RFK's enemies played for keeps.

Marina has always been a fascinating character imo. So much to consider in that regards. In her short 22 year long life up to the JFKA she had living experiences that set her apart in so many interesting ways. Shuffled around with different adult caretaker figures. Reportedly exhibiting from a young age a strong willed and even rebellious nature. Of all the young men she could have chosen ( she was the cutest girl in Minsk ) she hooks up with the biggest oddball around...and an American! She takes the plunge and even decides to leave her Russian friends, family and upbringing to go to America? Marina wanted something more out of life than the typical Russian girl. Something risky. Something adventurous. And one of our posters here stated his view of Marina was that she was tough as f***. I agree and from a young age. She gets through the first year and a half with Lee, but things are often stressed due to Lee's low income and sporadic employment. Things are so bad in August of 1963 in New Orleans Marina chooses to accept Ruth Paine's offer to live with her back in Irvine, Texas. Here she is living in someone else's home for months and through giving birth for the 2nd time. She is there out of financial stress need. It's always humiliating to have to depend on others for such basics as shelter, food, medical care no matter what age you are. Even some shame I would imagine. I don't think Marina ever liked Ruth Paine. I do think she truly appreciated her help though. Marina completely stopped any correspondence with Ruth Paine soon after the JFKA and her life took such a drastic turn. She didn't need Ruth's help anymore. I've read where this cutoff hurt RP. But look at the stress reality that Marina was immersed in while she was living with RP and up to and after the JFKA itself - mind boggling. She was living with a person she would never choose to be close to if she was financially able to support herself. Her husband was always pressuring her to come back to him. She was dealing with the powerful physical and psychologic demands of late term pregnancy. And I couldn't have taken Lee Oswald's monstrous controlling mother for one day. She had to endure her too through this nightmare? During the Earth shaking whirlwind tornado of the JFKA and the crush of press and the frightening experience of constant police agency interrogation and control I don't know how breast feeding, dirt poor, no family to support her Marina didn't have a complete mental breakdown. Of course Marina at times didn't know what to say to anyone. She surely felt logical fear of what the authorities could do to her such as deportation? The one person it seems that Marina felt the most trusting and relaxed around was Jeannie De Mohrenschildt. Could you imagine Marina sharing her deepest private feelings about Lee to anyone else she encountered in her time here in the states like she did with Jeannie De M? With unexpected indiscreet openness she shared to Jeannie De M. how Lee didn't satisfy her sexual needs. And how stupid he was. Upon opening a closet door which revealed Lee's rifle to the De Mohrenschildts who had come to see their new apartment and bring a gift for Junie, Marina blurts out "Look at this idiot. He spends his money on toys/guns?" when they had other basic needs. Marina really trashes Lee. Jeanie De M was mortified that Marina would say such private personal things to her like this. Marina liked to smoke. And did so knowing her husband detested her doing so. That was another sign of her natural individual rebellious streak imo. Yes, her and Lee fought. I think Lee did get too rough with Marina from time to time. Paul Gregory, whose Russian language teaching father met Lee and Marina, related an incident he personally witnessed where he says Lee showed incredible callousness toward Marina. This happened just outside of their apartment. Marina was holding Junie in her arms. She took a missed first step on the porch and fell full weight on her back and Junie tumbled after. Oswald was instantly furious at Marina for missing the step. The only concern he showed was for his daughter Junie whom he picked up and held. Marina was left to gather herself on her own. Paul Gregory was appalled at Lee's lack of concern for Marina. George De Mohrenchildt stated he had a fatherly man-to-man talk with Lee about his suspected physical abuse of Marina. If I remember correctly, George DeM even implied that if Lee ever did that in his presence he would deal with Lee. I often can't imagine all the mind boggling heavy storm emotions and pressures Marina went through in her time with Lee, staying at other people's houses, dealing with her 2nd pregnancy, living under Ruth's roof and under her rules, dealing with a pressuring Lee, dealing with his overbearing nut case mother, dealing with her own health issues like her teeth and nutritional needs, dealing with the deadly serious agency people, worried about deportation, and then the ultimate nightmare of 11,22,1963 and beyond, just weeks after she gives birth? IMO it was remarkable how she kept it together. And at just 22 years of age and no family support at all? Marina a tough fiber young woman? That's an understatement imo.

All I know is that if JFK runs as a third party candidate he could easily get 5 to 10 million votes. And I believe that those votes would come from disaffected Democratic party minded and independent voters who weren't going to vote for the Republican candidate no matter who it would be. And maybe a minute percentage ( 1 to 3%? ) of Trump/Republican minded voters? With Trump and Republican voters remaining all in again, a 5 to 10 million loss of votes for the Democrats would give the Repubs the popular vote. Why do you think the Trump/Repub talking heads at Fox News and every other Repub promoting media venue have so enthusiastically embraced ( and even promoted ) the candidacy of RFK Jr? They have come up with the same numbers prediction I just stated regards which party a 3rd party RFK Jr. candidacy would pull 95+% of it's voters from. Celebrity and other wealthy donors dropping hundreds of millions on to RFK Jr. and his run would easily be enough to make it happen.

Just reviewed an interview video of Dr. Jim Carrico ( taken in 1997 ) who was the first attending physician to JFK when he was wheeled into Parkland's Trauma Room 1 in their ER department on 11,22,1963. Carrico related how he was desperately trying to secure JFK's breathing ability as a first priority. In his time with JFK he never once thought of turning JFK's body as this was antithetical to his first need treatment focus at hand. Soon, the room was filled with other top doctors who took over JFK's treatment. Carrico did however have a good look at the massive wound next to and just above JFK's right ear area. Carrico firmly stated that to him that this was a "blow out" wound. And that it was made by a missile exiting JFK's skull. Carrico mentioned the other back of JFK's skull wound but didn't see it himself, again because he never got in position to see it working on JFK's airwaves only and with JFK's body being in the facing up prone position at all times. According to several people who did see that back of the head JFK wound up close in those first second and minutes to one hour time ( Clint Hill and Dr. Robert McClelland) that wound was also a "blow out" one. With a chunk of JFK's skull simply "gone" to the size degree of at least 5 inches across. So, how can JFK's head have "two" blow out wounds several inches apart? One in the back of the head. The other on the upper right side next to and just above his right ear?

I can imagine the huge attendance attention and questioning barrage Landis's up coming conference appearance will draw.

Gerry, I would agree with you on that point. Marina would never say anything that she thought might harm or burden her children and grandchildren in anyway.

An end-of-life confession by Marina that would reveal hidden secrets would be marvelous.

True. It is very hard to even imagine RFK ordering the murder of another individual. Now...LBJ? Mac...this Henry Marshall fellow? Make it look like a suicide...okay?

If Lawford made this claim...I wonder who to? And whether he made this claim to more than one person? Lawford was married to one of the Kennedy sisters, right? Speaking of the LAPD and their reported political and social bias reputation back in the 50's and 60's, I think the general take from a current historical perspective was that they were very rightwing and anti-Kennedy and especially the Kennedy brother's more liberal racial policies. Of course not all but probably a majority of that entity ( especially their hierarchical part ) were of this ideology. One remembers chief Darrell Gates. Mayor Sam Yorty, etc. I heard an audio recording years ago of a manager of the Ambassador Hotel making a desperate first emergency call to an LAPD dispatcher...regards RFK being shot there the evening of June 6th, 1968 right after the shooting. The female manager was quite shook up and began her 911 message by first telling the dispatcher she was calling from the Ambassador hotel. She then told the dispatcher something very close to " Senator Robert Kennedy is staying here." Before the manager could say anything more, the police dispatcher interrupted her and practically yelling said in an angry and disgusted tone "BIG DEAL" in response to her mentioning that RFK was staying at her hotel. I was shocked at how brazen this officer was in his impulsive disrespecting anti-RFK personal feeling interjection and especially just into a 911 call asking for police help in RFK's shooting. To me, it was a reflection of how much the LAPD hated RFK. So much so, this dispatcher couldn't even contain his RFK hatred barely into a desperate help seeking call regards RFK's brutal shooting. I always felt the majority of America's police and other domestic security forces were much more anti-civil rights minded than the Kennedys and the liberal part of our society they represented. And much of that milieu to extreme degrees such as actually being KKK members. I feel certain that the Dallas PD in 1963 was of that ideology more so than most. LA too? Perhaps. At least more than was generally known. My point here being that both JFK and RFK were truly "hated" by those entities much more than the average American knew back then. The Kennedy's more liberal stance on the issue of black civil rights turned millions of Americans against them to a degree of hate that was enraging.

Wow! What a story!

But this incident took place in non-open carry California right? Squeaky Fromme country? And ominously right in the Ambassador Hotel city. I could see RFK Jr. feeling a little more creeped out paranoid thinking since his father was killed there. The profile given to suggest a possible nut case scenario though ( bankruptcy and Alien conspiracy buff ) could apply to millions. Heck, I wouldn't doubt one or two on this forum might even fit that profile bill.

Henry Wade himself went through the front entrance and up the stairs to pop into Ruby's club while it was open. This according to former Carousel employee Nancy Hamilton. Wade put on a lousy act of pretending he didn't personally know Jack Ruby during his Dallas PD building news conference late 11,22,1963 and two nights later after Ruby shot Oswald. To the world press regards the suspect who shot Oswald the late evening of 11,24,1963: "I believe his name is a "Jack Rubenstein?" A reporter who observed Ruby interacting with Wade the late evening of 11,22,1963 said to Wade..."It looked like you two ( Ruby and Wade) were good friends. To which Wade just smiled with a sheepish "hand caught in the cookie jar" guilty grin. He didn't deny the reporter's suggestion. Come on Wade...you knew Ruby well.

A nice man but mistaken or misremembering due to age? I would have asked him if he remembered Dr. Charles Crenshaw being present in the Lee Oswald shot wound treatment room. And if he remembered any conversation about a call to Crenshaw from LBJ that day as Crenshaw claimed. McClelland was a very close friend of Dr. Perry. Easily verified. Have you ever heard of any under oath testimony that contradicted McClelland's Trauma Room 1 claims? That he was where he stated he was? At the top of the treatment table just 18 inches from the top of JFK's head? And that brain tissue was oozing out of and falling out of the head back wound?

I would ask at least some of our members to watch this videotaped interview of Dr. Robert McClelland and share their thoughts about what he stated in it? Do you believe what he is proclaiming in this? If not...why not? In my mind McClelland's observation recollection is block buster stuff! He is the closest doctor in the entire Trauma Room 1 scene to the top of JFK's head. His observations about the size of the rear head wound blowout hole and how much brain tissue had dropped out of this wound just in the time he was next to it counters many other accounts of JFK's brain being more intact than such brain tissue loss he observed. Include Jackie's hand full of other blown out brain tissue and that which splattered the inside of the limo back seat, onto Jackie herself and the Dallas PD motorcycle officers immediately behind the limo at the time of impact. Proof the official brain weight finding of 1,400+ grams can't be even close to accurate. McClelland had an academic and medical achievement background that was stellar. You can't say he didn't have solid peer respect gravitas. He and Doctor Perry both believed that a bullet struck JFK on the upper right side of his skull. And Perry and McClelland never waivered about their shared belief until their dying day. McClelland cleared up the confusing account of the different trach work done first by Doctor Carrico ( breathing tube inserted down JFK's throat ) ...followed by the throat cut incision trach by Dr. Perry after. McClelland's account of the actions of Jackie Kennedy during the time they were treating JFK and the things he overheard others saying to her ring true to the accounts of others like Nurse Phyillis Hall. Dr. Kemp Clark to Jackie Kennedy... "Madam, your husband is dead." etc.