Marilyn Monroe & a new book which mentions JFK/RFK

[James DiEugenio]

Marilyn's' wild' weekend at Cal Neva began with the professional BSer David Heymann, one of the very worst writers on this or any other subject.  Please read this article, you will understand why no one should read his books.( https://www.newsweek.com/2014/09/05/c-david-heymanns-career-serial-fabulist-266876.html). This is the guy Lifton believed had an archive to back up his books at CSUNY.  Well, someone went there and discovered that was pure bluff.  His alleged archives are on made up people and things he manufactured about them after they died. If you can buy it, Janney was going to use this BSer before I warned him and SImkin.

In other words the Cal Neva story began with Heymann quicksand. As most all of these legends about MM do.  But Heymann adduced from his phony interviews with Lawford and SInatra that there were drugs being passed around, and call girls etc.  And MM got so zonked that SInatra had to return her to LA.  But that is just how it began.  Knowing the credibility of Heymann;s interviews, no one should trust any of it since he manufactured these.  For instance, Lawford was dead for 5 years before he wrote his book on Jackie where this baloney first appeared..

Knowing the low credibility of Heymann did not matter to others.  They built on his BS and this suddenly became the hell weekend.  In some stories she was passed around my mobsters.  In others she was drug addled to such an extent she had to be returned to LA.  In fact, some of the wild tales say she actually tried to kill herself. (Don MCGovern, Murder Orthodixes, p.417)

In Gary VItacco Robles' 2 volume bio, Icon, considered by many to the the best biography out there, or at least one of the top three, he has her attending with Joe DIMaggio, at the invitation of Dean Martin.  Marilyn wanted to go as a way of thanking Martin for supporting her during the studio crisis on Something's Got to Give.  Martin also wanted her to remarry DiMaggio.  Which she agreed to while there. (ibid, p. 417). But further, Martin and MM were also discussing a future project they might work on.  Buddy Greco recalled Marilyn coming out of a limousine and said she looked sensational.  He did not think she would recall him but she did and she hugged him. Alex D'Arcy, an internationally known actor, said MM was there with DIMaggio, and that was the purpose of the visit. (ibid p. 418)

But this isn't good enough for the whole fantasy  Double Cross crowd, in their incessant desire to create the lurid sensationalism that sells books,  it was about GIancana having his aides, like Sinatra, talk MM out of her press conference revealing her diary of secrets. 

That scenario, like all of this MM malarkey is patently nonsensical.  First, why would Giancana want to talk MM out of doing something like that?  By 1963, Giancana was almost off his rocker in his anger about what the White  House was doing to his business.  If he knew something like that was about to occur--which he did not-- why not just let it happen?  Only in the twisted logic of the word of that pulp fiction novel  Double Cross could something like this live. That some researchers buy it is just astonishing to me.

MCGovern also points out that MM did not schedule  her psychiatrist the day she got back.(ibid p. 419)  Would not one think so, if she had such a terrible experience in Tahoe?

But further, as I will show in my review, there was no Red Diary of Secrets, and there was no press conference scheduled for Monday the 6th. These are myths piled onto a small hillock of them designed to create a paradigm, instead they have created toxic sludge.

The whole MM with mobsters angle began with two BSers, Robert Slatzer and Jeane Carmen, who did not say anything about this until decades later and then Summers actually believed them and enabled them through his book.

 

 

[Joseph McBride]

Just a sideline -- when I interviewed Jim Leavelle about the Tippit and

Kennedy murders, he was largely forthcoming and gave me

some extraordinarily important insights (such as that Will

Fritz indicated to him the night of the assassination that they

didn't have a case on Oswald for killing Kennedy and so they

should get him on killing Tippit instead, dubious as that was), but sometimes he was cagey

and evasive and deceitful and clearly defensive. I had to sort out what was credible and

match it with other sources, documents, and data, which I did in INTO THE NIGHTMARE. At one

point he told me there were some things he knew but wouldn't tell

me. So I said, OK, like what? He said the death of Marilyn Monroe,

for instance. I could have pushed him further but didn't because

I was getting a lot from him and he seemed adamant. I also thought

maybe he would repeat some dubious story about the Kennedys

being involved in killing her, but in fact I don't know what he would have said.

Edited May 3, 2020 by Joseph McBride

[James DiEugenio]

Oh that's rich Joe.

The whole rightwing was alive with these stories.

[Pamela Brown]

8 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

 

In my twenties ( the 1970's ) I went to Tahoe's South Shore ( and/or Reno ) maybe once every 3 or 4 years and always in a car load of friends. It was a 300 mile one way commute. We were average low wage manual labor fellows and would have maybe $300 at most to play with.

When I finally went to North Shore in the late 1990's the Indian casinos had been up and running and like I said,  everyone knew that so many of the people who used to drive or take buses to Reno and even Tahoe from Northern California just said " to heck with that long commute" and would instead spend their gambling money closer to their homes.

I hadn't been to Reno since a visit there in about 1986 or 1987.

A friend asked me to go to a gathering on Eagle Lake near Susanville, CA in about 2005.

We had to drive through Reno to get to Highway 395 to Eagle Lake.

My friend had to stop in Reno because he wanted to play "21" at Harrahs.

I don't play cards so I just walked around waiting for him to finish losing his money. Several hours of bored waiting.

In that walk around I was stunned!

Harrah's was deserted! Just a couple of card tables going.

When I went there in the 1970's Harrahs and every other Reno casino was packed and the streets were packed with people too!

The streets of Reno were completely deserted. All I remember seeing were scattered newspapers being blown around like tumbleweed! Like an apocalyptic movie.

The Indian Casino's in California devastated Reno's gambling business base.

However, I have often read that the Nevada gambling industry big shots were partners in these Indian casinos, so they were still in the money.

Getting back to Cal Neva, Sinatra, M & M etc.

My lifetime observation is that organized crime ( Sicilian Mafia in particular) has never been fully and honestly acknowledged and exposed regards the amount of wealth, influence and power they truly had and exerted throughout our country since the end of WWII and in every level of government ( city, county, state and federal ) and all the way up to the presidency.

Hoover himself was compromised by them. JFK too to a certain degree with Judyth Campbell Exner and who knows who else.

LBJ and Nixon had ties.

There is no real debate about this level of mob influence anymore.

To doubt this reality is simply choosing to be naive.

And enough beautiful Hollywood starlets had affairs with these mobsters ( allegedly ) that one cannot say it could never have occurred with Monroe imo.

Lana Turner, Phyliss McGwire, Liza Minelli, Liz Hurley, etc.

Mickey Cohen had Candy Barr although she was a star of the strip club circuit only.

Less attractive starlets and female celebrities were safe from the advances of these mobsters because like almost everyone else, they wanted only the beautiful ones.

Think Ruth Buzzi, Totie Fields, Phyliss Diller, Dorothy Kilgallen, Bette Davis, etc.

 

 

 

 

Thank you for the wonderful timeline.  I was in Reno in 1986 and it was bustling. Hard to imagine those places barren...I agree, MM was so beautiful the mob could not help but want her...Judyth Exner's story is fascinating also...hard to imagine how those creeps looked to the lovely ones...

[James DiEugenio]

Everything Exner said after her book was utter BS.  (And I think some of what was in her book was BS.)

And ABC got caught holding the bag on her.

[Cliff Varnell]

America jolted by biography showing hero DiMaggio as cruel and mean
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2000/oct/20/books.booksnews

According to this Joltin’ Joe rubbed elbows with Sam Giancana.

[Cliff Varnell]

What was the first stop Joe & Marilyn made after their wedding at San Francisco City Hall on Jan 14, 1954?

666 Filbert St.

Saints Peter and Paul Church.

[Cory Santos]

8 hours ago, Cliff Varnell said:

What was the first stop Joe & Marilyn made after their wedding at San Francisco City Hall on Jan 14, 1954?

666 Filbert St.

Saints Peter and Paul Church.

But did they go to my favorite for dinner, the Tonga Room at the Fairmont on Nobb Hill?

[Cory Santos]

On 5/3/2020 at 11:59 AM, James DiEugenio said:

Marilyn's' wild' weekend at Cal Neva began with the professional BSer David Heymann, one of the very worst writers on this or any other subject.  Please read this article, you will understand why no one should read his books.( https://www.newsweek.com/2014/09/05/c-david-heymanns-career-serial-fabulist-266876.html). This is the guy Lifton believed had an archive to back up his books at CSUNY.  Well, someone went there and discovered that was pure bluff.  His alleged archives are on made up people and things he manufactured about them after they died. If you can buy it, Janney was going to use this BSer before I warned him and SImkin.

In other words the Cal Neva story began with Heymann quicksand. As most all of these legends about MM do.  But Heymann adduced from his phony interviews with Lawford and SInatra that there were drugs being passed around, and call girls etc.  And MM got so zonked that SInatra had to return her to LA.  But that is just how it began.  Knowing the credibility of Heymann;s interviews, no one should trust any of it since he manufactured these.  For instance, Lawford was dead for 5 years before he wrote his book on Jackie where this baloney first appeared..

Knowing the low credibility of Heymann did not matter to others.  They built on his BS and this suddenly became the hell weekend.  In some stories she was passed around my mobsters.  In others she was drug addled to such an extent she had to be returned to LA.  In fact, some of the wild tales say she actually tried to kill herself. (Don MCGovern, Murder Orthodixes, p.417)

In Gary VItacco Robles' 2 volume bio, Icon, considered by many to the the best biography out there, or at least one of the top three, he has her attending with Joe DIMaggio, at the invitation of Dean Martin.  Marilyn wanted to go as a way of thanking Martin for supporting her during the studio crisis on Something's Got to Give.  Martin also wanted her to remarry DiMaggio.  Which she agreed to while there. (ibid, p. 417). But further, Martin and MM were also discussing a future project they might work on.  Buddy Greco recalled Marilyn coming out of a limousine and said she looked sensational.  He did not think she would recall him but she did and she hugged him. Alex D'Arcy, an internationally known actor, said MM was there with DIMaggio, and that was the purpose of the visit. (ibid p. 418)

But this isn't good enough for the whole fantasy  Double Cross crowd, in their incessant desire to create the lurid sensationalism that sells books,  it was about GIancana having his aides, like Sinatra, talk MM out of her press conference revealing her diary of secrets. 

That scenario, like all of this MM malarkey is patently nonsensical.  First, why would Giancana want to talk MM out of doing something like that?  By 1963, Giancana was almost off his rocker in his anger about what the White  House was doing to his business.  If he knew something like that was about to occur--which he did not-- why not just let it happen?  Only in the twisted logic of the word of that pulp fiction novel  Double Cross could something like this live. That some researchers buy it is just astonishing to me.

MCGovern also points out that MM did not schedule  her psychiatrist the day she got back.(ibid p. 419)  Would not one think so, if she had such a terrible experience in Tahoe?

But further, as I will show in my review, there was no Red Diary of Secrets, and there was no press conference scheduled for Monday the 6th. These are myths piled onto a small hillock of them designed to create a paradigm, instead they have created toxic sludge.

The whole MM with mobsters angle began with two BSers, Robert Slatzer and Jeane Carmen, who did not say anything about this until decades later and then Summers actually believed them and enabled them through his book.

 

 

You said there was no press conference scheduled or diary?  You inferred no relationship between the two.  She knew about Mongoose, bases, aliens oh my.

Is this document fake?

Edited May 5, 2020 by Cory Santos

[James DiEugenio]

John Newman proved those were fakes a long time ago. (The Assassinations, edited by James DiEugenio and Lisa Pease, pp. 360-61)

And before you produce anything by Tim Cooper, read what Seamus Coogan wrote about him at K and K.

https://kennedysandking.com/john-f-kennedy-articles/jfk-and-the-majestic-papers-the-history-of-a-hoax-part-3

Sometimes I wonder:  Does anyone read my books?  Or web site?

And BTW, I consider Cory a good guy. 

Edited May 5, 2020 by James DiEugenio

[George Govus]

Quote

Does anyone read my books?  Or web site?

Shakin' it over here, boss!

 

[Joe Bauer]

On 5/4/2020 at 9:44 PM, Cory Santos said:

But did they go to my favorite for dinner, the Tonga Room at the Fairmont on Nobb Hill?

The Fairmont was "The Place" to go to and be seen back then.

I once stayed in one of the Penthouse suites at the Four Seasons Clift hotel back in 1985.

Courtesy of a wealthy, generous friend. The view was incredible. Big high windows all around.  Snacked/drank in the "Redwood Room" once but room service food was so outstanding didn't need to dine out. Also stayed at the "Miyako" in Japan Town.

This same friend took us down to the Beverly Hills Hotel as well. Had our own bungalow. I would take our little boy in his stroller through the grounds real early in the morning and around the grounds perimeter. I can still remember standing on the corner of Sunset Blvd. and one of the Drives on the side ( Beverly-Crescent?) and just watching cars come down from the higher residences. I saw Smokey Robinson in a Mercedes Coupe. Fernando Lamas Jr. came roaring down on a Harley.

Homes nearby were Milton Berle's, Lucille Ball's, etc.

Dined and drank in the Polo Lounge. Sat behind a birthday celebration for Cornel Wilde. Joseph Cotton was in the group. He spoke. His voice was mesmerizing.

Another late evening sitting with my friend, the Maitre D brought two younger gorgeous blonds to the table next to us occupied by a very elderly man and when they arrived he said..."Ladies, I'd like you to meet Mr. Max Factor."

Ran into Susanne Pleshette in a video store on Rodeo Drive. Got her autograph on a store business card. Sweet, kind looking lady. Dined at Spago's and watched many stars coming and going such as Sidney Portier. 

Stayed at the Kahala Hilton near Diamond Head in a suite next to one occupied by Sylvester Stallone and his new bride Brigitte Nielson ( again 1985-August .)

One day while sitting on the veranda of the Royal Hawaiian hotel drinking Blue Hawaiians my wife (who had stayed back at the Kahala) had our 1 year old boy on the little grass lawn outside our suite next to a trail that led to the hotel's private beach.

She said a large group of men came up from the beach and the person they were surrounding was a Chinese woman. When they got close to my wife and our son, she stopped and stared at our boy for a minute ( just feet away) and asked through an interpreter if my wife could bring him to her. She then lifted and held our son and studied his face. Our little one had lots of pink bite marks on his face ( from I guess mosquitos while we were staying at Plantation Gardens on Kauai just before arriving at the Kahala) 

The woman told my wife she was a doctor and was curious about the marks. Turned out this woman was the wife of China's leader ( President?) at the time - Li Xiannian?" He and she had stopped for a short layover in Honolulu on their way back from a visit to Washington D.C..

Unfortunately my wife didn't get a picture of the Republic Of China's First Lady holding our son.

Sorry for diverting so much here from the main topic. But, these were some interesting times.

If I am ordered I will remove the post.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 6, 2020 by Joe Bauer

[Pamela Brown]

1 hour ago, Joe Bauer said:

The Fairmont was "The Place" to go to and be seen back then.

I once stayed in one of the Penthouse suites at the Four Seasons Clift hotel back in 1985.

Courtesy of a wealthy, generous friend. The view was incredible. Big high windows all around. Ate in the "Redwood Room" once but room service food was so outstanding didn't need to dine out. Also stayed at the "Miyako" in Japan Town.

This same friend took us down to the Beverly Hills Hotel as well. Had our own bungalow. I would take our little boy in his stroller through the grounds real early in the morning and around the grounds perimeter. I can still remember standing on the corner of Sunset Blvd. and one of the Drives on the side ( Beverly-Crescent?) and just watching cars come down from the higher residences. I saw Smokey Robinson in a Mercedes Coupe. Fernando Lamas Jr. came roaring down on a Harley.

Homes nearby were Milton Berle's, Lucille Ball's, etc.

Dined and drank in the Polo Lounge. Sat behind a birthday celebration for Joseph Cotton who gave a brief thank you speech. His voice was mesmerizing. Cornel Wilde was a part of the group.

Another late evening sitting with my friend, the Maitre D brought two younger gorgeous blonds to the table next to us occupied by a very elderly man and when they arrived he said..."Ladies, I'd like you to meet Mr. Max Factor."

Ran into Susanne Pleshette in a video store on Rodeo Drive. Got her autograph on a store business card. Sweet, kind looking lady. Dined at Spago's and watched many stars coming and going such as Sidney Portier. 

Stayed at the Kahala Hilton near Diamond Head in a suite next to one occupied by Sylvester Stallone and his new bride Brigitte Nielson ( again 1985-August .)

One day while sitting on the veranda of the Royal Hawaiian hotel drinking Blue Hawaiian's my wife (who had stayed back at the Kahala) had our 1 year old boy on the little grass lawn outside our suite next to a trail that led to the hotel's private beach.

She said a large group of men came up from the beach and the person they were surrounding was a Chinese woman. When they got close to my wife and our son, she stopped and stared at our boy for a minute ( just feet away) and asked through an interpreter if my wife could bring him to her. She then lifted and held our son and studied his face. Our little one had lots of pink bite marks on his face ( from I guess mosquitos while we were staying at Plantation Gardens on Kauai just before arriving at the Kahala) 

The woman told my wife she was a doctor and was curious about the marks. Turned out this woman was the wife of China's leader ( President?) at the time - Li Xiannian?" He and she had stopped for a short layover in Honolulu on their way back from a visit to Washington D.C..

Unfortunately my wife didn't get a picture of the Republic Of China's First Lady holding our son.

Sorry for diverting so much here from the main topic. But, these were some interesting times.

If I am ordered I will remove the post.

 

 

 

 

Awesome memories.  I love the Cliff House in SF.  It has gone through so many changes.  I lived across the street from the Miyaka Hotel, at 66 Cleary Court...https://www.66cleary.com/

My first husband, Richard, and I went to the Miyako every week or so for tempura and sushi.  I loved living there.  He worked in the Wells Fargo building for MONY.  I worked at the Crocker Bank on 1 Montgomery.  My desk was in the portico, the windows on the third floor.  There was also a bar called the Domino club, in the little ally behind Montgomery.  They had the best martinis and shrimp and crab louis.  There were gorgeous paintings of nudes throughout.  

Edited May 5, 2020 by Pamela Brown

[Joe Bauer]

Pamela, you know the city, that's for sure.

Why did you ever leave?

I have mentioned earlier in another post how I never liked large cities and their crowded streets and big buildings.

That's absolutely true.

The events I have related here were an anomaly in this regards.

I was taken to these big city locations by a friend who really wanted me to accompany her to them.

I would never have gone to them on my own. Couldn't afford to and actually felt stressed, especially in the penthouse at the Clift, always mindful of the reality of large earthquakes in Calif. And I've never been back to Hawaii or stayed in large city hotels since.

Good memories? Of course. But I almost felt an obligation to visit these places with this friend as a token of my appreciation for her friendship and generosity. It was actually hard in some ways however, because my wife and I had our 1 year old son along with us, who we refused to leave with others at home here in Monterey. Too protective? Maybe.

Couple of other funny side stories. Don Ho show in Honolulu. The guy was so drunk the entire show he could hardly stand up. You could see he was sick of singing "Tiny Bubbles" after doing so 20,000 times. Also, Japan town in S.F. had a bowling alley! Called Japan Bowl. Two separate bowling alley's on two floors! Was told by the front desk person that the first floor alley was for LGTB bowlers and the second floor alley anyone else. I'm sure you could mix though. Only in S.F.!  I do love the liberalism of S.F. despite my feeling stressed when visiting there.

[David Andrews]

59 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

Couple of other funny side stories. Don Ho show in Honolulu. The guy was so drunk the entire show he could hardly stand up. You could see he was sick of singing "Tiny Bubbles" after doing so 20,000 times.

I saw Don Ho and his band as a child c.1970, at Duke Kahanamoku's club in Honolulu.  The whole show was done as a sort of drunken family night -- times were looser then, and I think I drank a chi-chi out of a pineapple shell and got smashed.  Was he putting it on in SF, Dean Martin-style?

After that night, I'm amazed that I could spell Kahanamoku right off the bat today,.  Incredibly, I also remember most of the words to "Lahaina Luna."

This makes me want to watch Diamond Head, starring Charlton Heston.

Edited May 5, 2020 by David Andrews