C.I.A. Man

[Guest]

I had to look at the map, it must have been.  I think I have some pictures from the last time I was there, they show part of the surrounding area and the airfield.   

[David G. Healy]

11 hours ago, Jean Paul Ceulemans said:

No problem, keep drifting, I love reading that stuff!

The first time I was in the same area was in the late 1970's, the last time was in the late 1990's.  

I also remember the first time I was really impressed with the Awacs taking off and landing 24/7.   Don't recall the name of the Military Airfield, it was rather "close" to the Bay and couldn't have been far from Sunnyvale either (were I stayed the first time).   I think it was the same were they stored this Russian helicopter (years before a Russian had defected with that).  All those years I stayed in a number of houses between Sunnyvale and Coyote.

 

 

 

 

 

Moffett Field, Mountain View (right next to Palo Alto westside of the SFBay... 

[W. Niederhut]

17 hours ago, Cliff Varnell said:

Chet Helms

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chet_Helms

Fascinating.  I continue to learn something new every day on this forum.

I never knew that Denver's legendary rock promoter, Barry Fey, had briefly opened a Family Dog rock venue here in Denver, with Chet Helms, back in 1967, and that the Grateful Dead, and other S.F. bands, had performed there in '67.

Unfortunately, I was too young to know what was happening over there on Evans Avenue at the time.

I once had an interesting phone conversation with the late Barry Fey, many years later, but that's another story.

In any case, it's interesting to hear these first hand stories from our California Boomers-- Joe, David, Cliff, and Kirk.

[Pete Mellor]

21 hours ago, Gene Kelly said:

Pete

The book is fascinating, and O'Neill (to his credit) stops short of making any dramatic conclusions.  I corresponded with him for a while, and he told me it took almost 20 years for him to finish his investigative reporting.  He began with the intent of simply by crafting an entertainment-related story that addressed how the Manson clan and Sharon Tate murder changed Hollywood ... but when he was done, he had uncovered unanticipated information about what really happened.  And this led him down the path of CIA and their CHAOS and MKUltra projects, Jack Ruby and Joelyn West, and other troubling facts.  Here is how he described his experience:

"I’d faced multiple threats on my life. I don’t consider myself credulous, but I’d discovered things I thought impossible about the Manson murders and California in the sixties—things that reek of duplicity and cover-up, implicating police departments up and down the state. Plus, the courts. Plus—though I have to take a deep breath before I let myself say it—the CIA."

Needless to say, there's a lot more to the Manson story than meets the eye.  Here are some additional references worth reading, once you get into this:

1. DiEugenio, J. (August 2019) “Vincent Bugliosi, Tom O’Neill, Quentin Tarantino and Tate/LaBianca”. Kennedys and King
2. Garber-Paul, E. (August 2019) “What Do We Really Know About the Manson Murders?”. Rolling Stone
3. Gilbert, Sophie (November 2017) “The Real Cult of Charles Manson”. The Atlantic
4. Hedegaard, E. (October 2019) “The Last Manson Mystery: 50 years ago, Beausoleil murdered Hinman”. Rolling Stone 
5. Lansing, H. Allegra (June 2019) “The Manson Family: More to the Story” 
6. Weston, W. (June 2020) “Linkletter, Whitson, and Manson: Agents Provocateur for the Helter-Skelter Plot”. Zodiac Doubles.  
7. Mathis, M. (July 2017) “Tate Murders were a False flag and the Greatest Unknown Success Story of Project CHAOS”.
8. Stimson, G. (October 2019) “Goodbye Helter Skelter: New Look at Tate-LaBianca Murders
9. Weston, W. (June 2020) “Linkletter, Whitson, and Manson: Agents Provocateur for the Helter-Skelter Plot”. Zodiac 

Gene

Thanks again Gene.  I must have read 'Helter Skelter' many moons ago.  I'm just through the first 100 pages of 'Chaos' and already it's becoming quite a profound read.

[Kirk Gallaway]

Some people think Obama was our coolest President. Yeah, he was pretty cool. But Jimmy Carter is a President I could sit down and have some acid with. Call me "old school" but that's still a meaningful barometer to me!

 

Queue to 2:00

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

On 11/12/2022 at 12:24 AM, David G. Healy said:

Moffett Field, Mountain View (right next to Palo Alto westside of the SFBay... 

Finally found some of my photo's.

Had to re-boot my brains...

The early years was indeed at Moffet Field

But later (and where the Kamov was  😃  was at Hayward(Alameda County) on the other side of the Bay.

Currently it's Air National Guard (I noticed they replaced the signs on the building), CAP, and some other small units 

When I was there it was still USMC.

Please note, the picture was taken from the other side of the fence

😃 Nusquam Latendum

Now, this was some 25 years ago... Moffet was +35 years ago, I'm sure I have some pictures from Moffet

 

 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans

[Gene Kelly]

17 hours ago, Pete Mellor said:

Thanks again Gene.  I must have read 'Helter Skelter' many moons ago.  I'm just through the first 100 pages of 'Chaos' and already it's becoming quite a profound read.

Not to add a spoiler alert, but O'Neill paints a very different picture of Vincent Bugliosi.  While Helter Skelter became a very successful crime novel, you will end up doubting the premise and official story.  Pay particular attention to the Susan Atkins persona, and the fact that she was essentially an "actor".  O'Neill interviewed Bugliosi, and had a relationship with Vince, who tried to convince O'Neill that he was wrong about him (i.e., Vince).  Bugliosi threatened to sue O'Neill, but died in 2015, before the book was finally published.  Once you consider what O'Neill shares about Bugliosi, it will put his fatuous tome Reclaiming History into better perspective.

Gene

[Robbie Robertson]

18 hours ago, Pete Mellor said:

Thanks again Gene.  I must have read 'Helter Skelter' many moons ago.  I'm just through the first 100 pages of 'Chaos' and already it's becoming quite a profound read.

It’s better to hear him talk about it 
 

https://open.spotify.com/episode/4OXGSwuHYf0gHtJxGWIbLL?si=nrdgvoJeS4SjPaycFFH1NA

and the documents here 

https://atwaatwar.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/the-vince-bugliosi-story-16-3-mb.pdf

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by Robbie Robertson

[Paul Bacon]

17 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Some people think Obama was our coolest President. Yeah, he was pretty cool. But Jimmy Carter is a President I could sit down and have some acid with. Call me "old school" but that's still a meaningful barometer to me!

 

Queue to 2:00

 

 

 

 

Ha! Orange Sunshine and the Allman Brothers ...I had that exact trip the summer after "Live at the Fillmore East" was released!  

[W. Niederhut]

2 hours ago, Paul Bacon said:

Ha! Orange Sunshine and the Allman Brothers ...I had that exact trip the summer after "Live at the Fillmore East" was released!  

The Allman Brothers Live at the Fillmore East...  What a phenomenal album that was in 1971, and is today.

In Memory of Elizabeth Reed remains my all-time favorite Allman Brothers opus-- a work of true rock 'n roll genius.

I confess that I voted for Jerry Brown in the 1976 Rhode Island Democratic primary, and I was less than enthused about Jimmy Carter's candidacy, but I was somewhat reassured by the reports at the time that Jimmy was a friend of the Allman Brothers.

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[Joe Bauer]

On 11/11/2022 at 3:22 AM, Jean Paul Ceulemans said:

 

 

 

The thing about living in such a natural beauty location like California's Monterey Peninsula with it's sweet smelling pine tree forests nestled right next to it's incredibly fresh ocean air shore line  ( with the added bonus of it's almost year round easy on the body climate ) is it's soothing effect on your spirit and soul.

I have heard so many people in my life here saying how their pain and worries were lessened simply by driving or walking through our Pine tree forests to the oceans shore.

Then sitting and looking out upon the removed from human worries natural beauty waters which most always distracts your heart and mind from them.

A lot of California's coast line is psychologically soothing in it's Highway 1 views. But most of the actual shoreline is inaccessible physically.

The thing about our Monterey Peninsula however is you can safely walk right through these Pine tree woods and right up to it's sandy beaches and even climb upon some of it's interspersed rocky outcroppings. The towns of Pacific Grove and Carmel are the best locations for this experience.

If our members here ever want to feel a soothing break from the sometimes heart and mind troubling angst of the JFK, RFK, MLK and Dorothy Kilgallen unsolved murders I highly recommend you come here and by yourself or with a beloved mate or friend , slowly drive or walk through our sweetly scented Pine tree forests to the nearest open view beach and find a stump or city provided bench or even in your shoreline parking space car sit and let this scene do it's spirit rejuvenating magic upon your righteous justice seeking soul.

Since I can't drive anymore and can barely walk, my wife drives me twice a week along our shoreline and we park and open the windows to smell the fresh ocean air and listen to the wave sounds ( sometimes soft sometimes crashing) and the seagulls squealing.

I am lucky in this regards. 

It's a great soothing balance to the heaviness of the world we live in.

There is a large parking turn out right next to a large rocky outcropping we usually park in. This is the exact place John Denver crashed in his small experimental plane on October 12, 1997.

There is a plaque enshrined into a large granite boulder there in memory of our beloved "Rocky Mountain High" American singer.

 

 

[Guest]

I couldn't agree more.  When we lodged a little more south I remember cruising up CA 1 to Half-Moon Bay and return, just to relax (and thinking by myself : I could live here for the rest of my life and never ever be bored).   

[Kirk Gallaway]

2 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

The Allman Brothers Live at the Fillmore East...  What a phenomenal album that was in 1971, and is today.

In Memory of Elizabeth Reed remains my all-time favorite Allman Brothers opus-- a work of true rock 'n roll genius.

I confess that I voted for Jerry Brown in the 1976 Rhode Island Democratic primary, and I was less than enthused about Jimmy Carter's candidacy, but I was somewhat reassured by the reports at the time that Jimmy was a friend of the Allman Brothers.

 

 

Yes, I was for Jerry Brown in 76, and again as the last hold out for the nomination against Bill Clinton in 92.

 

But Jimmy Carter had the same problem as Biden but inherited a much worse economy. But Carter  installed Paul Volcker at the Fed, who raised rates up to 17% as tough love and by 83, the rates started coming down for the next almost 40 years! , and Reagan ended up benefiting from the economy rebounding in his first term. A lot of that was just demographics as the boomers dropped back in and revitalized the economy.

 

 Of course no one can take away from Carter  his Middle East Peace Accords and it definitely was the least warmongering and the least war term for any  U.S. President in our lifetime! Of course at the end, Everyone talks about the hostages.

 

I actually interviewed Jerry Brown on my radio show during his political hiatus in the 90's. At the time he had sold his family home in San Francisco and moved from to Oakland to live with the disenfranchised. He had an  open invitation  discussion group in an industrial area in Oakland. I attended twice, and it was fascinating but it  is almost 50 miles away or I would have attended more. There was only about 8 people there each time, all of them pretty smart. There's no 2 sides to him. He is exactly as he appears as a politician.

[Pete Mellor]

7 hours ago, Robbie Robertson said:

It’s better to hear him talk about it 
 

https://open.spotify.com/episode/4OXGSwuHYf0gHtJxGWIbLL?si=nrdgvoJeS4SjPaycFFH1NA

and the documents here 

https://atwaatwar.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/the-vince-bugliosi-story-16-3-mb.pdf

 

Thank you, Robbie!  A 3 hour vid, I will get round to listening asap.

[W. Niederhut]

8 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

The Allman Brothers Live at the Fillmore East...  What a phenomenal album that was in 1971, and is today.

In Memory of Elizabeth Reed remains my all-time favorite Allman Brothers opus-- a work of true rock 'n roll genius.

Addendum:  I was listening to the deservedly famous Fillmore East live recording of In Memory of Elizabeth Reed today, and I saw an interesting comment at YouTube about the Allman Brothers Band using psilocybin. 

Martin Buck:   "Some fun facts for those not in the know: The Allman Brothers Band loved spending time in Rose Hill cemetery in Macon, drifting away on magic mushrooms and playing. Dickie wrote this after "entertaining" Boz Scaggs' wife on a tombstone, and the inscription on this tombstone is the title for this track-- In Memory of Elizabeth Reed. The other unsung hero in this drama is Tom Dowd, who recorded these tracks in a truck behind the venue. His absolute mastery of technique and musical knowledge enabled him to splice together the highlights of three nights of recording into one double album. I have heard all the other versions of this masterpiece, including the raw tracks in their entirety, but the original released in 1971 is still the best, and fills the heart with awe and gratitude for the grandeur and vision of this epitome of Southern Rock at its finest."