David Atlee Phillips: Oswald never went to Mexico!

[David Josephs]

HSCA interview with Odio:
When you looked at those pictures with Hosty,
what was your recollection, then, when you were
looking at those pictures then, as to the man that J came to your door in September, 1963?
The Witness. He was the same guy.
Mr. McDonald. Was there any doubt in your mind?
The Witness. No. I wish.
Mr. McDonald. Did you immediately recognize him?
The Witness. Immediately.
.....

there any changes?
The Witness. Well, the only thing was, he was wearing that baggy shirt that looked really baggy on him.
Mr. McDonald. He was wearing it when?
The Witness. When he came to see me, and he was wearing well-fitted shirts when I saw him in the picture.
Mr. McDonald. But the facial expression of the face itself?
The Witness. His face, and the little smile was there; everything was there.
Mr. McDonald. So, when Hosty showed you this (Dec 1963), what did you say to Hosty when he showed you the pictures?
The Witness. He said: "Do you recognize him?" He told me to — in several pictures, he asked me to pinpoint where I was seeing Oswald. So, I showed him.
Mr. McDonald. What did he say when you identified him?
The Witness. He did not say very much. He said they would be contacting me again.
Mr. McDonald. Did they?
The Witness. No; not until the summer.

HOSTY AND ODUM interviewed ODIO Dec 18, 1963 and with this information did not talk to her again until weeks before the report was published...  and of course I will be told that was just fine, no indication of anything nefarious on the FBI's part...  

 

"While the FBI had not yet completed its investigation into this matter at the time the report went to press,
the Commission has concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald was not at Mrs. Odio's apartment in September of 1963"

WCR Sept 1964

 

Miami, Florida October 2, 1964 (1 week after WCR presented to Johnson)
LEE HARVEY OSWALD

It is recalled that SYLVIA ODIO has advised that on an evening in the latter part of September, 1963, she
was visited at her apartment in Dallas„ Texas, by two Cubans or Mexicans, accompanied by an American whom she believed to be LEE HARVEY OSWALD.  Upon viewing the photographs of HALL, HOWARD, SEYMOUR and CASTRO, Mrs. ODIO stated that none of these individuals were identical with the three persons, including the individual she believed to be OSWALD,

[David Josephs]

12 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

DJ--

I am reading, and re-reading, your reports as posted on K&K. 

It surely looks like evidence was arranged or fabricated after the fact. 

You have done tremendous work. 

I have reservations about LHO meeting the three KGB'ers, due to---

1. The memo you posted herein (and for which I admire you, in a "full disclosure" vein). Do you have the date of that memo? We read that memo differently...so it goes. 

2. The three KGB'ers (including Kostikov) willing to be filmed and state on the record they met LHO at the Soviet Embassy (Frontline, 1993). If pecuniary interests were involved, my guess is they would have made more money by saying they never met LHO. 

3. The fact that the Russians never stated, never issued a statement, even through back-channels, that "This guy called LHO never visited the Soviet Embassy, certainly not in September-October 1963."  

I gather we hardly have full access to all Russian docs from the period. But none has surfaced suggesting the LHO-Kostikov meeting never happened. 

Side note: When my passport expired, I was sent back my old passport. LHO having his passport with the Russian stamps in it does not seem odd to me, if indeed he flashed that passport at the two Aussie women. 

PS I posted the NYT just for human interest. I place no faith in it. 

I was trying to find the earliest instance in the US media of LHO's purported visit to the Soviet Embassy. I can't seem to find out if the DRE released such info. Do you know? 

Obviously, even in the wake of the JFKA, David Atlee Phillips was spreading mal-information, about red-haired Negroes and whatnot. For Phillips, the JFKA was not an unimaginable horror, but another PR op. 

I hope you understand that while I contend LHO likely met Kostikov (a meeting likely arranged by the CIA) I hardly believe the official LHO story. 

 

Thanks Ben, very kind of you to say....

I'd like those reading it to remember it was based on the information at the time and my thoughts at the time...  While it starts out accepting much of the Armstrong theory of Lee going to Mexico while Harvey was at Odio & Dallas, I found thru the evidence that it being a real person was not a lock and I was fairly sure it was not Lee at all (search for Alice Texas in this forum for more on that).

1. I assume you are talking about the russian memos translated? This collection is a set of KGB documents given to President Bill Clinton in 1999 by Russian President Boris Yeltsin. The files date from 1959 when Lee Harvey Oswald sought defection to the Soviet Union. Each original Russian language KGB document is accompanied by a translation later made by the United States Department of State.
2. The entire point of KGB interference with the West was CounterIntel...  provide info that keeps them spinning in circles
3. Nor are we even given faked contemporaneous reports from the CIA stating they overheard the Russians they were spying on - including Kostikov - say anything about the American who visited them.

The Kostikov meeting never happened Ben... It was assumed from a very poor transcript

Helms states in a 7/2/64 memo to Rankin that while Oswald thought he spoke with Kostikov he actually spoke with Yatskov, Kostikov's superior...   It was Win Scott who pushed the Kostikov connection...  as stated, assumptions were made...

Memorandum to Mr. Sullivan

RE: LED HARVEY OSWALD

• Source FEDORA, we know that Brykin is in the 13th Department of KGB. Since Brykin is with this Department, CIA has suggested the possibility that Kostikov is also associated with the 13th Department. We have agreed that this is possible. Neither we nor CIA have absolutely established that Kostikov is specifically connected with the 13th Department.

I see the Aussies and MacFarland's like I see Bledsoe... information was provided to them which allowed them to make statements that betrays the validity of their testimony.  Describing the 1959 passport stamps is akin to Bledsoe describing the torn arrest shirt on a bus prior to his changing the shirt, getting into a fight and having the shirt buttons torn off and shirt ripped...  she could not have seen that shirt at any time prior to his going home.

Since Oswald was not there, he did not meet Kostikov.  DAP arrives in Mexico Oct 7th... All this begins to occur Oct 8th...  just sayin'

[David Josephs]

Please note Oswald’s letter of November 9, the text of which was transmitted to Moscow, over the line [?] of nearby neighbors.
This letter was clearly a provocation: it gives the impression we had close ties with Oswald and were using him for some purposes of our own. It was totally unlike any other letters the embassy had previously received from Oswald. Nor had he ever visited our embassy himself. The suspicion that the letter is a forgery is heightened by the fact that it was typed, whereas the

Having re-read this and looked again at the Nov letter... the embassy referred to here is the Russian Embassy in Washington DC, not the Mexican Russian Embassy...  so I'd have to conclude this is not evidence from the Russians denying his contacting the embassy in Mexico...  

Just like the other letter is simply addressing what the press is saying and not what actually happened.

If Oswald had been there in Sept, and DAP was already there when the Sept Summary reports are written, how do we explain the phone calls not being mentioned at all?  Worse yet, the Mystery Man photo is from Oct 2nd, not the 1st... FBI has him leaving the morning of the 2nd while the CIA has a transcript of the man on Oct 3rd...

Red Herring for breakfast? 

Edited January 10, 2023 by David Josephs

[Steve Roe]

On 1/8/2023 at 5:48 AM, David Josephs said:

The passport she talks about is the 1959 one not the one Harvey gets in June 1963 with no stamps whatsoever...  like she's been fed the info...

Reading through Mr. Josephs' denial statements that Oswald never went to Mexico City, here's one of his many huge blunders. 

Mr. Josephs implies that the Aussie girls, Mumford in particular, were fed false information regarding Oswald's passport. If you recall the Aussie girls said Oswald showed them his passport that he travelled in Russia. Mr. Josephs takes issue with that.

However, Oswald did show his 1959 passport, as well he had his 1963 new passport. Why/How? His original 1959 passport was cancelled and returned to him. This is nothing out of the ordinary. I have most of my cancelled passports over the years. 

Mr. Josephs has been debunked on this baseless claim trying to create another false mystery. 

Proof: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=197182#relPageId=14&search=Oswald_passport

[Greg Doudna]

5 hours ago, David Josephs said:

I realized that the FBI was fabricating the story of his journey.  And continued my writing from there...  as time went on and more information was released my initial hypothesis was proven and a new hypothesis emerged... no the FBI offered journey was not real but now I asked whether a person impersonated Oswald at all given the complete lack of evidence and the numerous fabricated stories the CIA offer to get him there... 

David--neither Oswald nor impersonator existed in Mexico City? That indeed would be a "iv" but I've never heard that proposed before. What do you do about Nechiporenko's book--the KGB official in the Soviet embassy who wrote a book telling of when Oswald came to the embassy and Nechiporenko describes it? 

On Price at the Sports Drome, in his Warren Commission testimony he says he saw Oswald three times at the Sports Drome Rifle Range: Sept 28, two weeks later at a turkey shoot in October, and then the last time one to three weeks after that the weekend after the assassination. But the turkey shoot was in November, as Price himself later says, not a couple weeks after Sept 28. Nobody else claimed there was a second turkey shoot a month earlier in October before the one in November, nor does Price claim he was at two turkey shoots. Price speaks of the turkey shoot two weeks after Sept 28 as the same turkey shoot in November. All the other Sports Drome claimed sightings of Oswald are in November. It looks like Price misspoke when saying Sept 28, perhaps meaning Oct 28, to have his 2 + 1-3 weeks later end up ca. time of assassination late Nov according to his account of his three sightings of Oswald. Liebeler asks Price when other times he saw Oswald other than Sept 28:

Mr. Price. "On two other occasions--one was 2 weeks later [after Sept 28] and it was a turkey shoot"

Later:

Mr. Liebeler. When was the next time you saw him, the next time? [= time #3]

Mr. Price. Well, I don't know just exactly when it was, but it was--it could be anywhere from 1 to 3 weeks later [= after the turkey shoot in Oct which was 2 weeks after Sept 28].

Then later:

Mr. Liebeler. Could you tell us approximately how long prior to the assassination this was that you saw the man [= time #3]?

Mr. Price. The last time I saw him was the week before Thanksgiving; Sunday before [= Nov 24, time #3].

Price's timeline memory roughly works from Oct 28, but not Sept 28. How else to interpret this than that the Sept 28 was some time confusion on the part of Price.

ATF agent Ellsworth said Thomas Masen was a spitting image of Oswald and that Ellsworth told him he was the man at the rifle range. Ellsworth concluded it was Masen that the Sports Drome witnesses saw, not Oswald. That is a sensible explanation, given that Masen was a gunshop operator and one of the few dealers for Mannlicher-Carcanos which would account for both the Oswald resemblance and being seen with that kind of rifle or similar, and understandably might be confused with Oswald retrospectively by witnesses. He never claimed to be Oswald. Witnesses only thought he was from appearance. And Price shows confusion on that date, such that his date of Sept 28 two weeks before the turkey shoot clearly is a mistake. Nothing to do with Oswald during the days in question re Mexico City on two counts: mistake on the Sept 28 date, and wasn't Oswald.

The high school photo of Masen looks a lot like Oswald. Another photo commonly claimed to be of Masen, showing a man at a gun store who does not look like Oswald, I tracked that down and it is not a photo of Masen but of Dial Ryder which someone at some early stage in JFK assassination research misidentified by mistake and the mistake has decades of afterlife and never dies.

Also on the Austin, Texas, visit of Oswald to the Selective Service office there which I believe you alluded to as another alternative presence of Oswald at the time he was supposed to be in Mexico City, I researched that one quite a bit a while ago and have notes backed up for an article if I ever get time to write it: my research found that that trip was real, Oswald really did go to Austin (contrary to what the Warren Commission supposed) but again it is an issue of getting the date right which I found was earlier and the trip taken by Oswald at a time when he was still in New Orleans, round trip to Austin and back from New Orleans. Nothing to do with the dates at issue with Mexico City.

On the Alice, Texas/south Texas Oswald sightings, I do not believe it is possible that was Oswald and I think that must have been some unrelated family with the man having some accidental resemblance and misstook for Oswald, and possibly a similar-sounding name, but who was not Oswald. 

[David Josephs]

3 minutes ago, Greg Doudna said:

David--neither Oswald nor impersonator existed in Mexico City? That indeed would be a "iv" but I've never heard that proposed before. What do you do about Nechiporenko's book--the KGB official in the Soviet embassy who wrote a book telling of when Oswald came to the embassy and Nechiporenko describes it? 

On Price at the Sports Drome, in his Warren Commission testimony he says he saw Oswald three times at the Sports Drome Rifle Range: Sept 28, two weeks later at a turkey shoot in October, and then the last time one to three weeks after that the weekend after the assassination. But the turkey shoot was in November, as Price himself later says, not a couple weeks after Sept 28. Nobody else claimed there was a second turkey shoot a month earlier in October before the one in November, nor does Price claim he was at two turkey shoots. Price speaks of the turkey shoot two weeks after Sept 28 as the same turkey shoot in November. All the other Sports Drome claimed sightings of Oswald are in November. It looks like Price misspoke when saying Sept 28, perhaps meaning Oct 28, to have his 2 + 1-3 weeks later end up ca. time of assassination late Nov according to his account of his three sightings of Oswald. Liebeler asks Price when other times he saw Oswald other than Sept 28:

Mr. Price. "On two other occasions--one was 2 weeks later [after Sept 28] and it was a turkey shoot"

Later:

Mr. Liebeler. When was the next time you saw him, the next time? [= time #3]

Mr. Price. Well, I don't know just exactly when it was, but it was--it could be anywhere from 1 to 3 weeks later [= after the turkey shoot in Oct which was 2 weeks after Sept 28].

Then later:

Mr. Liebeler. Could you tell us approximately how long prior to the assassination this was that you saw the man [= time #3]?

Mr. Price. The last time I saw him was the week before Thanksgiving; Sunday before [= Nov 24, time #3].

Price's timeline memory roughly works from Oct 28, but not Sept 28. How else to interpret this than that the Sept 28 was some time confusion on the part of Price.

ATF agent Ellsworth said Thomas Masen was a spitting image of Oswald and that Ellsworth told him he was the man at the rifle range. Ellsworth concluded it was Masen that the Sports Drome witnesses saw, not Oswald. That is a sensible explanation, given that Masen was a gunshop operator and one of the few dealers for Mannlicher-Carcanos which would account for both the Oswald resemblance and being seen with that kind of rifle or similar, and understandably might be confused with Oswald retrospectively by witnesses. He never claimed to be Oswald. Witnesses only thought he was from appearance. And Price shows confusion on that date, such that his date of Sept 28 two weeks before the turkey shoot clearly is a mistake. Nothing to do with Oswald during the days in question re Mexico City on two counts: mistake on the Sept 28 date, and wasn't Oswald.

The high school photo of Masen looks a lot like Oswald. Another photo commonly claimed to be of Masen, showing a man at a gun store who does not look like Oswald, I tracked that down and it is not a photo of Masen but of Dial Ryder which someone at some early stage in JFK assassination research misidentified by mistake and the mistake has decades of afterlife and never dies.

Also on the Austin, Texas, visit of Oswald to the Selective Service office there which I believe you alluded to as another alternative presence of Oswald at the time he was supposed to be in Mexico City, I researched that one quite a bit a while ago and have notes backed up for an article if I ever get time to write it: my research found that that trip was real, Oswald really did go to Austin (contrary to what the Warren Commission supposed) but again it is an issue of getting the date right which I found was earlier and the trip taken by Oswald at a time when he was still in New Orleans, round trip to Austin and back from New Orleans. Nothing to do with the dates at issue with Mexico City.

On the Alice, Texas/south Texas Oswald sightings, I do not believe it is possible that was Oswald and I think that must have been some unrelated family with the man having some accidental resemblance and misstook for Oswald, and possibly a similar-sounding name, but who was not Oswald. 

Thanks for your thoughts on the matter Greg...  

There were a number of people who were the "spitting image of Oswald" ... not sure if you are aware of the Vaganov situation...  but fits nicely with some of the other evidence offered that day in Nov.  Masen photo below that...

You obviously have given this plenty of thought and have done research and planning for an article... I would love to see it with the supporting documentation and your cross referencing of evidence to show that Odio was wrong about the 26th/27th, that the Tourist visa made out to
LEE, Harvey Oswald but signed Lee H Oswald matches the Lee, Harvey Oswald written on the Hotel Registry for day 1, and notice how the rest of the "LEE HARVEY" notations look nothing like the writing of the manager who claims he writes in the names of guests day-to-day after they sign in for the first time... (CE2123)

Any ideas why our Oswald would sign his name in a manner NEVER seen before when the document is signed with a more correct signature, or why his name appears different than all the other names on the list, every day?

Could it have been MASEN? Possibly Greg, but that's not what the witnesses say, and as you say Ellworth was keeping pretty close tabs on the man... no mention in his reports about his going to Mexico or those shooting ranges...  there is in fact quite a lot on Masen on this Forum... just search..   

And these responses is what I mean by pushback...  I can create 100's of "possible" scenarios that can be tweaked to fit a certain portion of the evidence...  The title for my work has always been: "The Evidence IS the Conspiracy" and I approached this research with the desire to use the evidence provided to determine whether the FBI lied about the journey to and from Mexico...

I find that they did. That buried in thousands of documents is the evidence he did not go or come as they told us.  Could David Ferrie have flown him from somewhere to Mexico City under cover of night and then the rest of the stuff happened?  Doesn't explain DURAN claiming this person was only there on Friday morning thru about 1pm...  She denies the after 4pm calls which makes sense since the office was closed by then.

Please tell me how you found out the trip to AUSTIN was earlier when everyone involved discussed the 25th and 26th of Sept.  I wrote:

There is nothing offered to deny the possibility of Oswald staying in Austin until the following day, when on the morning of Thursday the 26th Mrs. Norman could be serving Oswald coffee, alone. Given Harvey's cheap ways, milking a $.10 cup-a-joe while waiting for his comrades to get ready to leave for Dallas can explain the sighting and trip to Austin just as easily as the FBI dismissing it on such weak grounds.

 

And even if we move the dates back to Sept 25 for his visit to Odio... there is another mountain of evidence in Houston, Laredo, Nuevo Laredo, Monterrey and Mexico City that our man Oswald was not on any of the buses the FBI puts him on...  In fact, all thru March April and May 1964 they hash and rehash the details correcting themselves along the way.

I have added quite a bit to those articles right here on the forum in a variety of thread, easy to find, where I've tried to update my presentation of info based on the newer releases and the continued finding of info thru the general course of research.

Oswald did not order the Rifle, Oswald did not shoot JFK, and Oswald did not kill Tippit...

Oswald was a patsy... a person upon whom the blame for something falls; scapegoat; fall guy.

and this blame was backed by the full weigh of the US intelligence services, the US Military and closely related Depts/agencies like State and I&NS.

If you see it differently - as you continue to try and offer - so be it... Not a single document in the thousands I have seen specifically suggest Oswald was there without reference to the CIA's sources...  the FBI looked all month and did not find hide nor hair of the man having been in Mexico City...  You think the FBI would want to add proof that he was there to the CIA's, no?

Well as I posted, he tried and failed miserably...  if he wasn't in Mexico, and was at some point at Odio then Dallas...  what's the problem?

 

 

Edited January 10, 2023 by David Josephs

[Tom Gram]

1 hour ago, Steve Roe said:

Reading through Mr. Josephs' denial statements that Oswald never went to Mexico City, here's one of his many huge blunders. 

Mr. Josephs implies that the Aussie girls, Mumford in particular, were fed false information regarding Oswald's passport. If you recall the Aussie girls said Oswald showed them his passport that he travelled in Russia. Mr. Josephs takes issue with that.

However, Oswald did show his 1959 passport, as well he had his 1963 new passport. Why/How? His original 1959 passport was cancelled and returned to him. This is nothing out of the ordinary. I have most of my cancelled passports over the years. 

Mr. Josephs has been debunked on this baseless claim trying to create another false mystery. 

Proof: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=197182#relPageId=14&search=Oswald_passport

I’m not sure I’m really following you here, but I’m not even really sure what the allegation is so bear with me. 

The Aussie girls said that Oswald showed them the passport he travelled with in Russia.

Oswald had that passport returned to him when he applied for a new one in New Orleans. 

So the deduction is that Oswald brought his cancelled passport with him to Mexico City?

That kind of makes sense if he’d want to show the Russians he used to live in the Soviet Union or something, but is there any evidence Oswald was really carrying two passports other than the claims of the Aussie girls? 

[David Josephs]

3 minutes ago, Tom Gram said:

I’m not sure I’m really following you here, but I’m not even really sure what the allegation is so bear with me. 

The Aussie girls said that Oswald showed them the passport he travelled with in Russia.

Oswald had that passport returned to him when he applied for a new one in New Orleans. 

So the deduction is that Oswald brought his cancelled passport with him to Mexico City?

That kind of makes sense if he’d want to show the Russians he used to live in the Soviet Union or something, but is there any evidence Oswald was really carrying two passports other than the claims of the Aussie girls? 

I've proven that Oswald - put on the Flecha Rojas bus - could not have been on the same bus as the Aussies, MacFarlands or BOWEN as they were all on a DEL NORTE bus...  as I repeatedly state

Real events of real people are made into evidence against Oswald...  Even when a witness flat out claims OSwald was not on the bus, the FBI/CIA/WCR simply dismisses the witness as incorrect...  Odio is incorrect since Oswald was on a bus to Mexico.. verbatim from the WCR...  No shots came from the knoll because Oswald shot 3 times from behind, period, end of discussion and investigation.

Roe is going to be Roe... can't do anything about it.  but declaring victory without being familiar with a significant portion of the interlocking lies the FBI fed us is intellectually dishonest...   dig a little deeper Roe... I know it requires time and effort, you can do it...

This is a portion of the Baggage manifest.  It has been explained that the line under the name means that person was traveling with someone - like Mrs McFarland with Mr.   And I challenge Roe to produce anything with Mumford/Winston on the passenger list...

 

 

Mr. BALL. Well. you were shown pictures of a man later on by the Federal Bureau of Investigation agent, were you not?
Miss MUMFORD. Yes.
Mr. BALL. And they showed you pictures of Oswald, didn't they; Lee Harvey Oswald?
Miss MUMFORD. No.
Mr. BALL. You didn't ever see a picture of Oswald?
Miss MUMFORD. No.

[Gene Kelly]

13 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Jim-

Let me get back to you on these questions. 

As for the Selective Service card...how did LHO make his phony card? He drafted it up in a graphics shop. 

There were graphics shops in those days, and white-out.  

On the Hench memo, see comments above. 

Side note: Has anyone seem the actual Nagell-Oswald selective service card? I have looked online without avail....

 

 

Ben

The Military Intelligence report was written in May 1969 by special agent Thomas Hench ... it's not the September 1963 warning letter to the FBI.  It isn't yet clear to me how that Hench report was subsequently discredited.

Gene

[Matt Allison]

24 minutes ago, Gene Kelly said:

It isn't yet clear to me how that Hench report was subsequently discredited.

The Hench report is an interview with Nagell; of Nagell making claims, not the interviewer making a statement of facts about Nagell.

IOW, it doesn't prove any claim made to be true. So its value is next to nothing.

[David Josephs]

14 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Jim-

Let me get back to you on these questions. 

As for the Selective Service card...how did LHO make his phony card? He drafted it up in a graphics shop. 

There were graphics shops in those days, and white-out.  

On the Hench memo, see comments above. 

Side note: Has anyone seem the actual Nagell-Oswald selective service card? I have looked online without avail....

 

 

I do have the original Oswald card on the left, in full color and with the fingerprint ink stains...  just now starting to look for Nagell's... but I doubt the cards below right are anything but forgeries on blank cards... photocopied... but I'll take a look see...

DJ

 

[Steve Roe]

3 hours ago, Tom Gram said:

I’m not sure I’m really following you here, but I’m not even really sure what the allegation is so bear with me. 

The Aussie girls said that Oswald showed them the passport he travelled with in Russia.

Oswald had that passport returned to him when he applied for a new one in New Orleans. 

So the deduction is that Oswald brought his cancelled passport with him to Mexico City?

That kind of makes sense if he’d want to show the Russians he used to live in the Soviet Union or something, but is there any evidence Oswald was really carrying two passports other than the claims of the Aussie girls? 

Tom you are absolutely correct and good analysis. The other evidence is Silvia Duran. I'm running out of time today, but here's a document stating Oswald showed her his passport about his time in Russia, among other documents proving he was in Russia.

 https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=59595#relPageId=56&search=bus_manifest

[Benjamin Cole]

2 hours ago, David Josephs said:

 

I do have the original Oswald card on the left, in full color and with the fingerprint ink stains...  just now starting to look for Nagell's... but I doubt the cards below right are anything but forgeries on blank cards... photocopied... but I'll take a look see...

DJ

 

DJ--

I am sure you know, the key question is, at what date can we know for certainty that Nagell had such cards in his possession?

The cards looks amateurishly produced, but that would not be important if Nagell had the cards pre-Nov. 22. 

If the cards were found, undated, in a bundle of materials in Nagell's lawyer's office, then we have uncertainty. There were three books published with copies of LHO's phony cards after the JFKA. 

Nagell had an intense interest in the JFKA. We can assume he acquired books or went to a library to read about the JFKA.

There were copy machines, white-out and graphics shops, in 1963-1964. 

In addition, there is tension in this very thread about Nagell.

James D., don of the JFKA research community, has cited Nagell's claim that Nagell met LHO in Mexico.

You have provided extensive evidence that LHO's bus ride to MC is very dubious. You contend LHO was not in Mexico.

Can you rectify this conflict? 

 

[Jonathan Cohen]

58 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Nagell had an intense interest in the JFKA. We can assume he acquired books or went to a library to read about the JFKA.

There were copy machines, white-out and graphics shops, in 1963-1964. 

In addition, there is tension in this very thread about Nagell.

James D., don of the JFKA research community, has cited Nagell's claim that Nagell met LHO in Mexico.

You have provided extensive evidence that LHO's bus ride to MC is very dubious. You contend LHO was not in Mexico.

Can you rectify this conflict? 

Based on my research, the totality of the evidence shows that Nagell is not credible.

[Ron Bulman]

Thanks in large part to DJ's work, available on K&K, I don't think Oswald ever went to Mexico, in addition to others work.  I do wonder if he ever went to Spain, or Oklahoma.

 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Ron Bulman