YOUR TAKE ON GEORGE H.W. BUSH RELATIVE TO HIS PLACE IN THE JFK EVENT STORY?

[Joe Bauer]

I seldom start any new threads on this forum myself. 

However, we all know that G.H.W.B. is not going to be around much longer and I thought that now,  before he actually moves on from this mortal coil,  might be a more interestingly relevant time to reflect and share our collective thoughts about this extremely influential and highest government position involved U.S. historical figure and his place in the JFK assassination story.

Obviously there will be plenty of this kind of discourse soon after Bush passes. But by then, for sure, there will also be so many of the expected heavily brushed with white paint Bush "good guy" commentary pieces presented in every form of media that it will make the whole eulogy show boringly trite and overcrowded to a distracting degree.

Perhaps it'd be more interesting for us to look at and talk about any historically important aspects of G.H.W.B. that relate to our own forum context now,  before all the contrived white paint applied ones muddle up most of the rest of them throughout the media and internet.  

I myself do not have any substantially interesting introductory commentary about G.H.W.B. to kick-start the discussion simply because I am not as informed as 95% of the members of this forum on him. 

However, I know that many here "will" have some really interesting and relevant thoughts and findings to share that we can all appreciate and enjoy and that will add to JFK event historical truth we endeavor to reveal.

Of course, I must first mention the two most commonly known G.H.W. Bush weirdisms that he is on record stating:

1.  "I don't remember where I was when JFK was shot."

2.  " after a deluded gunman assassinated President Kennedy" ... with a smile? Part of Bush's eulogy speech at Gerald Ford's memorial service.

Why would Bush think that using the specific words "deluded gunman" was important to mention in a Gerald Ford memorial context? Couldn't he have said simply "after JFK was struck down?"  Adding the words "deluded gunman" to that part of his eulogy was so inconsequentially out of place, it was as weird and begs as much suspicion as his JFK assassination location memory lapse statement.

Bush's connection to George DeMohrenschilds  ( both socially and professionally ) is one of the most intriguing Bush/JFK links ( possibly ) to me.

Please members, join in with what thoughts you may have regards G.H.W. Bush and his place in this realm.

 

 

Edited September 2, 2017 by Joe Bauer

[Paul Trejo]

Joe,

The following is my opinion.  George Herbert Walker Bush had no part or inkling of any kind whatsoever in the JFK assassination.  The urban myth that the 39-year old businessman was a leader in the murder of JFK depends first of all on a CIA-did-it scenario.  

(1) If (and only if) the CIA killed JFK, then we might ask how the young, Dallas oil-millionaire GHW Bush became the head of the CIA in 1976.   The CIA-did-it CTers ask: Was this a reward for his role in the JFK murder?   (What a lame question.)

(2) Next, there is the November 29, 1963 memo by J. Edgar Hoover that "Mr. George Bush of the CIA" offered his reaction of Cuban exiles in Miami to the JFK assassination.   Of course there are many people named George Bush, but this fueled speculation in 1976 that the new CIA Director had really been working for the CIA way back in 1963, instead of for the Zapata Off-Shore Oil Company as everybody else said.

If a person is convinced of the CIA-did-it CT, they will hold onto this memo like a bull-dog, and refuse to let go.  That seems to me to be the only evidence anybody has that our 41st US President was involved in the JFK assassination.   It is REACHING -- actually grasping for straws.

It's the frustration of CIA-did-it CTers that after 50 years they still can't prove the CIA-did-it.  So, they go for sensationalism.  It's pitiful.  Instead of investigating the Dallas leads, they will do everything else except that.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 1, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[David Andrews]

You really ought to be reading more Gaeton Fonzi, Paul.  His HSCA investigation implicates GHWB and David Atlee Phillips in the bombing assassination of Orlando Letelier, 1976.

Edited September 1, 2017 by David Andrews

[Paul Trejo]

25 minutes ago, David Andrews said:

You really ought to be reading more Gaeton Fonzi, Paul.  His HSCA investigation implicates GHWB and David Atlee Phillips in the bombing assassination of Orlando Letelier, 1976.

David,

I respect Gaeton Fonzi.  Yet even if the CIA was involved in some 1976 intrigue, I see no connection to the 1963 JFK assassination. But, as we have seen for 50 years, for the CIA-did-it CT, anything = anything.

It's time to finally scrutinize the Dallas Radical Right.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 1, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Martin Blank]

onsite facilitator

[Jason Ward]

8 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

I seldom start any new threads on this forum myself. 

However, we all know that G.H.W.B. is not going to be around much longer and I thought that now,  before he actually moves on from this mortal coil,  might be a more interestingly relevant time to reflect and share our collective thoughts about this extremely influential and highest government position involved U.S. historical figure and his place in the JFK assassination story.

Obviously there will be plenty of this kind of discourse soon after Bush passes. But by then, for sure, there will also be so many of the expected heavily brushed with white paint Bush "good guy" commentary pieces presented in every form of media that it will make the whole eulogy show boringly trite and overcrowded to a distracting degree.

Perhaps it'd be more interesting for us to look at and talk about any historically important aspects of G.H.W.B. that relate to our own forum context now,  before all the contrived white paint applied ones muddle up most of the rest of them throughout the media and internet.  

I myself do not have any substantially interesting introductory commentary about G.H.W.B. to kick-start the discussion simply because I am not as informed as 95% of the members of this forum on him. 

However, I know that many here "will" have some really interesting and relevant thoughts and findings to share that we can all appreciate and enjoy and that will add to JFK event historical truth we endeavor to reveal.

Of course, I must first mention the two most commonly known G.H.W. Bush weirdisms that he is on record stating:

1.  "I don't remember where I was when JFK was shot."

2.  " after a deluded gunman assassinated President Kennedy" ... with a smile? Part of Bush's eulogy speech at Gerald Ford's memorial service.

Why would Bush think that using the specific words " deluded gunman" was important to mention in a Gerald Ford memorial context?  Couldn't he have simply said "after JFK was struck down?"  Adding the words "deluded gunman" to that part of his eulogy statement was so inconsequentially out of place, it was as weird and begs as much suspicioun as his JFK assassination location memory lapse one.

And Bush's connection to George DeMohrenschilds  ( both socially and professionally ) is a most intriguing Bush/JFK link ( possibly ) to me.

Please members, join in with what thoughts you may have regards G.H.W. Bush and his place in this realm.

 

 

 

Joe,

In my view Bush was involved in the coverup insofar as his growing prominence beginning in the Nixon years demanded more and more public fealty to the WR.

Bush was interested in raising his own political standing and you can't do that by challenging Hoover, exposing CIA shenanigans and burning down the Washington Establishment - all of whom wanted the assassination safely and forever in the past and only in the past.   Bush is well placed to know the truth of the matter and he knows he has nothing whatsoever to fear - no one can blackmail him because he wasn't involved.  In fact, it's the reverse IMO - one reason Bush meteorically rises to the top is because he knows so much about everyone else.  He's kind of bullet proof; sick humor intended.

Covering up the crime is too often claimed to "prove" guilt of the crime.    

 

Jason

Edited September 2, 2017 by Jason Ward

[Michael Clark]

3 hours ago, Martin Blank said:

onsite facilitator

Agreed, and a unique nexus between the NE money, minds, and Bonesmen; and the Texas money and power brokers; and only an arms-length from the Cubans and their CIA contacts.

[Michael Walton]

My take - there was a letter by the FBI published of a "George Bush" who made a statement about knowing such and such a character who may have talked about the assassination.  He reported it to the FBI and that's how the memo was generated. The real Bush denied it was him, that there was a clerk named "Bush" who did this reporting.  I do find that hard to believe.

The real Bush was involved in the oil business and owned a boat called Zapata (or Barbara J).  It may have been used as a gun-running or some such monkey business (training anti-Castro Cubans). I'm going by memory here.

Was Bush in Dealey? IMO - no, just like I don't believe Hoover, Nixon, Hunt, Lansdale, Ford, Lincoln, and Marilyn Monroe were in Dealey.

Bush then of course goes on to direct the CIA (of all places), becomes VP, then President.  Just like Ford - who wrote in the WR that  JFK's back wound was in the "neck" - became President. Ford writing that was just his way of making sure everything was really really accurate.  You know, to insure that there was only one assassin (LHO) and no confederates.

So what does it all mean?  Who knows. Like DiEugenio would say - it's all speculation and supposition.

Edited September 2, 2017 by Michael Walton

[Paul Brancato]

4 hours ago, Michael Walton said:

My take - there was a letter by the FBI published of a "George Bush" who made a statement about knowing such and such a character who may have talked about the assassination.  He reported it to the FBI and that's how the memo was generated. The real Bush denied it was him, that there was a clerk named "Bush" who did this reporting.  I do find that hard to believe.

The real Bush was involved in the oil business and owned a boat called Zapata (or Barbara J).  It may have been used as a gun-running or some such monkey business (training anti-Castro Cubans). I'm going by memory here.

Was Bush in Dealey? IMO - no, just like I don't believe Hoover, Nixon, Hunt, Lansdale, Ford, Lincoln, and Marilyn Monroe were in Dealey.

Bush then of course goes on to direct the CIA (of all places), becomes VP, then President.  Just like Ford - who wrote in the WR that  JFK's back wound was in the "neck" - became President. Ford writing that was just his way of making sure everything was really really accurate.  You know, to insure that there was only one assassin (LHO) and no confederates.

So what does it all mean?  Who knows. Like DiEugenio would say - it's all speculation and supposition.

All of that, plus....

family hustory, close ties between Prescott Bush and Allen Dulles and the rest of the eastern establishment and the Yale Bonesman, and to Richard Nixon, who got a leg up in his early Congressional races from Prescott, and who later returned the favor in spades by promoting Bush in many ways. While VP ran the Iran - Contra operation, where his close ties to the anti-Castro Cubans were on full display, guys like Felix Rodriguez and Rafael Quintero, who famously made a statement to the effect that were he ever compelled to testify under oath the xxxx would hit the fan. Flash back to the Bay of Pigs - same group of Cubans. Escalante had no doubt that Bush and his partner in crime Jack Crichton were off the shelf financial backers of Operation 40, one of whose members later became head of the CIA - Porter Goss. Seems obvious to me that Bush was CIA starting in the late 1950's. Btw, it was Nixon as VP who ran what became the Bay of Pigs, to which effort Bush also helped by supplying boats and oil platforms.

there is a lot of 'there' there. Circumstantial perhaps, but I agree with Russ Baker when he opines that George Bush senior was one of the greatest criminal masterminds of the 20th century. Whether by intent or accident, it was the Bush family that gained the most from the elimination of the Kennedy clan. 

[Paul Trejo]

On 9/2/2017 at 7:20 AM, Michael Walton said:

My take - there was a letter by the FBI published of a "George Bush" who made a statement about knowing such and such a character who may have talked about the assassination.  He reported it to the FBI and that's how the memo was generated. The real Bush denied it was him, that there was a clerk named "Bush" who did this reporting.  I do find that hard to believe.

The real Bush was involved in the oil business and owned a boat called Zapata (or Barbara J).  It may have been used as a gun-running or some such monkey business (training anti-Castro Cubans). I'm going by memory here.

Was Bush in Dealey? IMO - no, just like I don't believe Hoover, Nixon, Hunt, Lansdale, Ford, Lincoln, and Marilyn Monroe were in Dealey.

Bush then of course goes on to direct the CIA (of all places), becomes VP, then President.  Just like Ford - who wrote in the WR that  JFK's back wound was in the "neck" - became President. Ford writing that was just his way of making sure everything was really really accurate.  You know, to insure that there was only one assassin (LHO) and no confederates.

So what does it all mean?  Who knows. Like DiEugenio would say - it's all speculation and supposition.

Michael,

The following is my opinion.

While it is not impossible that Zapata Oil (run by GHW Bush) cooperated with the CIA to run guns to rebels against Fidel Castro -- that is a long way from plotting to kill JFK.

With the death of JFK, the center of US Government power shifted from the East Coast (where it had been since 1776) to the Southwest (where it has remained, pretty much, ever since).  This was not "planned", it was going to happen anyway.   The East Coast is older, and the Southwest is younger.

GHW Bush had no clue who killed JFK until he became head of the CIA in 1976 -- and then he had access to all the records that Earl Warren had withheld from NARA for 75 years (i.e. until 2039).

GHW Bush knew the truth in 1976 -- and when he became US President in 1990, he took steps to release these hidden JFK records earlier, with the JFK Records Act (1992) which moved the date of full release to the American people by Thursday 26 October 2017.   This date is only seven weeks away now.  And we have former President GHW Bush to thank.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 4, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Chris Newton]

On 9/1/2017 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauer said:

Please members, join in with what thoughts you may have regards G.H.W. Bush and his place in this realm.

 

You have to add the phone call to the FBI post-assassination from "George Bush of the CIA" detailing exactly where he's been, what his plans are and that he heard a young man disparaging JFK. So rather than admit that this CYA call was from the real "George Bush of the CIA", the CIA responded that it might have been the guy in accounting named "George Bush". Problem with that was that the accounting guy said "not me" rather adamantly.

[Ron Bulman]

A GHWB and DeM connection is intriguing but nothing other than both being in the Dallas Petroleum Club I've read.  Anyone please educate me on more.

Ehh.  Him in the Dealy Plaza picture is a likely rabbit hole.  Preface, he did stay the night before 11/21/63  in Dallas and speak to a Oil field tool companies convention as part of his unsuccessful Congressional campaign. 

It's not impossible he went from DP to Redbird airport and flew to Tyler to have the opening remarks of his campaign speech there interrupted by news of JFK's death.

Then again there is Hoovers brief of "Bush".   And he did go on to become head of the CIA, as well as POTUS. 

[Joseph McBride]

A lot of this back-and-forth is erroneous. I am the one who found the FBI memo about George H. W. Bush

revealing and discussing his early CIA ties and interviewed the "other" George Bush the CIA falsely claimed

was the one referred to in that memo and wrote about these matters for The Nation in 1988, etc. I have 35 pages in my book INTO THE NIGHTMARE on the G. H. W. Bush connections to the assassination. In it I discuss the third article I wrote for The Nation in 1988, in which

I went deeply into Bush's involvement with James Parrott and his rightwing cronies, who were

investigated for six months by the FBI after the assassination. The Nation refused to run that

well-documented article, which I submitted in time to run before the 1988 election.

Edited September 4, 2017 by Joseph McBride

[Andrew Prutsok]

It wouldn't be like a member of the Bush family to be involved in a coup, or anything like that.

[Mathias Baumann]

Quote

Bush’s tip to FBI

A second recently disclosed memo supports the conclusion that George H. W. Bush was in Dallas the day JFK was assassinated.

FBI Special Agent Graham Kitchel wrote the memo to the FBI’s Houston bureau, dated Nov. 22, 1963, the day of the assassination.

The memo reads in the first paragraph: “At 1:45 p.m. Mr. GEORGE H. W. BUSH, President of the Zapata Off-Shore Drilling Company, Houston, Texas, residence 5525 Briar, Houston, telephonically furnished this following information to writer by a long distance telephone call from Tyler, Texas.”

Tyler is a small town about 100 miles east of Dallas.

In the second and third paragraphs, Graham discloses, “Bush stated that he wanted to be kept confidential but wanted to furnish hearsay that he recalled hearing in recount weeks, the day and source unknown.”

Graham then relates that Bush suspected a James Parrott, a student at the University of Texas, had been talking of assassinating JFK when the president came to Houston. The lead turned out to be inconsequential.

But in the last paragraph, Graham confirmed that Bush was going to be at the Sheraton-Dallas Hotel in Dallas on the day of the assassination, returning to his residence in Houston the next day.

Some researchers – noting the discrepancy that the Dallas Morning News claimed Bush would be at the Sheraton-Dallas on Thursday night, Nov. 21, 1963, while the Kitchel memo suggests Bush would be at the hotel on the night of the assassination – have speculated that Bush made the call to establish an alibi.

Russ Baker, author of the 2009 book “Family of Secrets,” observed: “In summary, then, Bush called in a pointless tip about an innocent fellow to an FBI agent whom he knew, and whom he knew could be counted on to file a report on this trip – out of what may have been hundreds of calls, some of them not even worthy of documenting, and, after a cursory investigation, the tip was confirmed as useless.”

Baker has argued the real point of the call was “to establish for the record, if anyone asked, that Poppy Bush was not in Dallas when Kennedy was shot. By pointing to a seemingly harmless man who lived with his mother, Bush appeared to establish his own Pollyannaish ignorance of the larger plot.”

Baker argued the truth was Bush had already stayed at the Sheraton in Dallas on Thursday, as the Dallas Morning News ad stated.

A phone call to the FBI stating he was planning to go to Dallas would create a misleading paper trail suggesting that his stay in Dallas was many hours after the assassination, rather than the night before, since the phone call could have come from anywhere.

Perhaps Bush called the FBI because he became concerned he had been photographed in front of the Texas School Book Depository in the moments immediately after the JFK shooting.

Bush has been vague about where he was when he first learned JFK had been shot, a moment virtually every American old enough to remember has fixed in their minds.

When asked where he was when Kennedy was shot, Bush has said vaguely that he was “somewhere in Texas.”

--> http://www.wnd.com/2013/09/did-george-h-w-bush-witness-jfk-assassination/