W. Niederhut Posted June 18, 2022 Share Posted June 18, 2022 3 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: Maybe what twitter should do is warn people that they are reading the tweet of a person known to spread lies. Bingo. Especially toxic lies-- e.g., falsehoods that foment violence against the citizenry, and/or against our democracy. We are witnessing a crisis in our democracy, not unlike what happened to the Weimar Republic during the rise of militant fascism and the toxic propaganda of Goebbels and the Austrian corporal. Someone needs to explain this to Ben and the right wing libertarians. At what point does unrestricted freedom of speech, (and unrestricted freedom to purchase guns!) undermine our essential human rights in a liberal democracy-- like the right to have our votes counted and to go to schools, stores, movie theaters, etc., without being shot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 Benjamin Franklin put it best: If you trade liberty for security, soon you will have neither. I am more concerned about a Deep State-controlled M$M, than what some lulus say on the Internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Allison Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 Ben- Are you familiar with the term/acronym FUD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 14 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said: Benjamin Franklin put it best: If you trade liberty for security, soon you will have neither. I am more concerned about a Deep State-controlled M$M, than what some lulus say on the Internet. Ben, If you're truly concerned about liberty, you need to start paying attention to the real news about right wing Trumplican fascists in the U.S., and their war against liberal democracy. Have you watched the Congressional J6 hearings yet, or are you still spending all of your time in the MAGA-verse, listening to Glenn Greenwald and Tucker Carlson? 🤥 NEW POLL: Whopping 59% of Fox News Viewers Believe Trump ‘Behaved Appropriately’ on January 6th www.mediaite.com/news/new-poll-whopping-59-of-fox-news-viewers-believe-trump-behaved-appropriately-on-jan-6/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bauer Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 (edited) 19 hours ago, W. Niederhut said: NEW POLL: Whopping 59% of Fox News Viewers Believe Trump ‘Behaved Appropriately’ on January 6th When half our society abandons rational thinking and allows themselves to accept and even promote ( often violently ) the delusionary world Trump has been continually creating and incessantly barking ...we are in very dangerous times. Cognitive dissonance/weakness? Yes, but it's also an act of personal grievance vengeance imo. I compare it to the jury in the 1995 O.J. Simpson trial. Those jurors knew O.J. Simpson butchered his wife and her friend Ronald Goldman. They simply dismissed the scientific forensic facts ( bloody footprints perfectly matching O.J.'s own Bruno Maglio shoes, bloody socks, hand wounds, etc. ) incriminating eye witness testimony ( Kato Kaelin disputing O.J.'s time gap movements throughout the time of the murders ) and loads of circumstantial evidence such as Simpson's running and suicide threatening actions when first charged with the murders, his violent beatings of Nicole throughout their marriage and graphic threats when she left him and on and on, in their after trial comments to the press. The Simpson trial jury could not even articulate what part of the strongly incriminating O.J. evidential fact findings and witness testimony swayed them into unanimously reaching a not guilty verdict except an outrage over what they perceived to be racist cops and their deep hatred for them. In my opinion, they let Simpson off on murder charges simply as an act of vengeance against the police system which they felt had been abusing them for generations because of their race. I think the huge majority of Trump followers are doing the same thing in their blind support of a man "they know" is not just extremely corrupt, a pathological l***, laughably sinful in the Christian sense, supremely insecure in his exaggerated self-aggrandizing to a delusional and even mentally ill degree and a dangerous demagogue who incites divisive violence. Because Trump loudly "trumpets" their generational hatreds, angers, fears, frustrations and resentments regards issues such as blacks, illegal immigration, gay lifestyle pushing, feminist movements, you name it... it doesn't matter to them whether he is incredibly corrupt, mentally delusional or even a threat to our over-all democracy. If our electorate was made up of just white Americans, Trump would have been elected by a big margin. Check the official 2020 election figures based on racial lines. Trump won the white male vote by 12%. Trump also won the white female vote by 8%. Blacks and Latino men and women voted so overwhelmingly for Biden, it swung the election. The Republicans know what beat them in 2020. Hence the massive financial commitment and effort to cut down the black vote once and for all. Edited June 20, 2022 by Joe Bauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 When James Risen speaks, people should listen. In the Shadow of Jan. 6 Hearings, Right-Wing Militancy Is on the Rise (theintercept.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 7 hours ago, W. Niederhut said: Ben, If you're truly concerned about liberty, you need to start paying attention to the real news about right wing Trumplican fascists in the U.S., and their war against liberal democracy. Have you watched the Congressional J6 hearings yet, or are you still spending all of your time in the MAGA-verse, listening to Glenn Greenwald and Tucker Carlson? 🤥 NEW POLL: Whopping 59% of Fox News Viewers Believe Trump ‘Behaved Appropriately’ on January 6th www.mediaite.com/news/new-poll-whopping-59-of-fox-news-viewers-believe-trump-behaved-appropriately-on-jan-6/ W- The Trumpers were unsuccessful in their harebrained plots, which had about as much chance at success as a spit at the moon. In sharp and defined contrast-- The Deep State has been entirely successful in controlling US foreign, trade and military policies, and helping crush the US middle class, and Detroitify America. According to you, the Deep State planned the 9/11 WTC destruction, and entangled the US into the endless Iraqistan wars. According to me, the Deep State axed JFK, and got the US into SE Asian wars that killed six million. IMHO, you are barking up a Trump bonsai tree in a Deep State redwood forest---inflamed by M$M "news." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela Brown Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 In order to keep things in perspective about the Trump supporters and the Jan 6 uprising, we need to keep in mind that almost everyone thought W stole the 2000 election from Al Gore. Remember the hanging chads? And his brother just happened to be the Gov. of Florida? But Al Gore was a politician. He was savvy and wise. He did not complain, throw tantrums, or throw his family members under the bus. He remained a gentleman throughout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Allison Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 That 2000 election was actually legitimately close, for real. Trump lost in 2020 fair and square, and is just too much of mentally ill monster to accept it. A rich conman who decided he'd burn the Constitution if the Oval Office couldn't be his playpen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 7 hours ago, Pamela Brown said: In order to keep things in perspective about the Trump supporters and the Jan 6 uprising, we need to keep in mind that almost everyone thought W stole the 2000 election from Al Gore. Remember the hanging chads? And his brother just happened to be the Gov. of Florida? But Al Gore was a politician. He was savvy and wise. He did not complain, throw tantrums, or throw his family members under the bus. He remained a gentleman throughout. Not only. The Rolling Stone, June 15, 2006 ran a long well-documented piece by Robert F. Kennedy Jr. that the absentee ballot system in Ohio had been gamed, throwing the election to "W" a second time. "Open Thread: 'Was the 2004 Election Stolen?'” https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/open-thread-was-the-2004-election-stolen-81730/ Then in 2018, The New York Times ran a cover story that the US election machinery was in a "crisis" as it was so hackable. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/26/magazine/election-security-crisis-midterms.html After 2020, such topics were no longer PC. This does not mean the 2020 election was hacked. It does mean the concerns and the weaknesses discussed in 2004 and 2018 are still valid. Indeed, with C19 and mass mailing of ballots, and 24-hour drop off boxes for ballots, conditions were even better in 2020 for gaming the election than in 2018 or other earlier years. I agree with you. Trump should done a Gore and walked away. Get over it. That is not Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 https://people.csail.mit.edu/rivest/voting/press/WasThe2004ElectionStolen.pdf This is the complete 2006 Rolling Stone article, in PDF format. Even 16 years later, fascinating reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Speer Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 10 hours ago, Pamela Brown said: In order to keep things in perspective about the Trump supporters and the Jan 6 uprising, we need to keep in mind that almost everyone thought W stole the 2000 election from Al Gore. Remember the hanging chads? And his brother just happened to be the Gov. of Florida? But Al Gore was a politician. He was savvy and wise. He did not complain, throw tantrums, or throw his family members under the bus. He remained a gentleman throughout. In the eyes of Trump and his ilk, Gore was weak, and should have threatened revolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Thomas Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 Internal Trump campaign emails show fake electors gambit was a 'concerted strategy': Washington Post by Brad Reed June 20, 2022 https://www.rawstory.com/trump-fake-electors-2657534115/ “Internal Trump campaign emails obtained by the Post show that campaign officials pressed Pence to accept the validity of the fake pro-Trump electors, even as lawyers working for the campaign acknowledged "they did not have legal validity and the gatherings had not been in compliance with state laws." One email highlighted by the Post was written by notorious "coup memo" author John Eastman, who on December 19th, 2020 argued that the plan to send the electors to Congress was "dead on arrival" from a legal perspective because no state legislatures had certified them. Nonetheless, Eastman said that Pence should accept them as valid in another email written days later, as doing so would create the impression that the results of the election were still in dispute. "The fact that we have multiple slates of electors demonstrate the uncertainty of either," he wrote. "That should be enough."” Steve Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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